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OfflineCrystal G
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Registered: 06/05/07
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Loc: outer space
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I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless * 3
    #19301279 - 12/20/13 04:09 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I really truly don't understand this mentality. Millions, BILLIONS of people worldwide pay TONS of money to go to rock concerts, music festivals, the opera, the orchestra, art galleries, Broadway, museums, etc. People pay good money for art and music, since people have to entertain themselves somehow.

I really honestly wish I had studied music instead of going into finance. Had I done that, I would be a piano teacher making $50-$100 an hour, getting paid IN CASH. Or I would probably be getting paid $500 a night just to play for a couple hours in the lounge of the Ritz Carlton or something. Apparently I believed everybody who said that music wouldn't make a good career. LOL. Fuck man, I am so fucking dumb! :lol:

Plus, sometimes music and art is the only thing truly keeping us alive... when you one day realize that you feel worthless even with all your money and your career and your possessions, art and music is what gives you meaning.

Without tragedy, pain, or joy, there would be no good art or music. Which means, without art or music, there would be no meaning in life.

Alright that's it, after watching this video, I'm going to start practicing piano again.



Edited by Crystal G (12/20/13 04:16 AM)


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
Proud 'Shitbird'. ®

Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 326
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G] * 1
    #19301284 - 12/20/13 04:12 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

+ the much misaligned 'cultural studies.'


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19301286 - 12/20/13 04:14 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
+ the much misaligned 'cultural studies.'




Oh I think cultural studies is one of the most important studies there is. For starters, it teaches history from a completely different perspective. It teaches you to think about the world in an entirely different way.


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 326
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301292 - 12/20/13 04:18 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I totally agree.

Am reading, 'How Literature Works" by John Sutherland.

A really great book.


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OfflineViveka
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G] * 2
    #19301302 - 12/20/13 04:22 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

When people express this sentiment, like, "A degree in music, that's so worthless :nut:", it's just because deep down they are horrified that they and all their ilk have bought into the empty bullshit of careerism and material luxury and have neglected their own creative impulse. Or they might not have any abstract creative impulse and this is equally horrifying and damning.


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Offlineg00ru
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Registered: 08/09/07
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301306 - 12/20/13 04:24 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

thats true if you have a music degree you can definitely give lessons. but if you practice an instrument for like 5 years that's plenty of time to get good enough to give lessons provided you know how to wing it


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
Proud 'Shitbird'. ®

Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 326
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: g00ru]
    #19301310 - 12/20/13 04:27 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

MMM, there's something to be said about truly 'useful' degrees. And, this is from someone with a degree in...


There's an article somewhere about a Russian fellow, has a degree in Lit, working at a coal mine....


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19301316 - 12/20/13 04:29 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
I totally agree.

Am reading, 'How Literature Works" by John Sutherland.

A really great book.




Am downloading PDF sheet music of Schubert impromptu's, Chopin Nocturne's, and Beethoven Sonata's so I can catch up. IDK why but I've been really itching to play piano again recently.

I still have yet to take a trip out to Ft. Worth just to see the Van Cliburn international piano competition. It's world-famous competition, only happens every 4 years, and people fly from all over the country to compete, it's like the piano Olympics. Unfortunately they just had a winner in 2013 so it looks like their next one is not until 2017.


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OfflineConstantine
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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Registered: 05/01/11
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs] * 2
    #19301317 - 12/20/13 04:29 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

*waiting for zappa*


--------------------


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Constantine]
    #19301319 - 12/20/13 04:30 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i will take that to mean the actual frank zappa :psychsplit:


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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Invisiblerulesq
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Registered: 05/10/13
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301321 - 12/20/13 04:31 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I have this one friend, whose grandpa is a highly respected conductor/conducting teacher.

I mean really, he goes around the world teaching conducting&talking in seminars etc. I have nothing but humble respect towards the guy, in his case studying music really paid off :thumbup:

E: apparently he's also a Rolf Shock Prize laureate, and he's been listed by the BBC's Music Magazine league-table as one of the "60 most powerful people in music"


--------------------



Edited by rulesq (12/20/13 04:46 AM)


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InvisibleCosmic_Flame
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: rulesq]
    #19301325 - 12/20/13 04:33 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Happy to say I'm pursuing my dream of a career in music! :awesome:


--------------------
Pull the blinds and change their minds....


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OfflineCrystal G
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Registered: 06/05/07
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: g00ru] * 1
    #19301334 - 12/20/13 04:35 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

g00ru said:
thats true if you have a music degree you can definitely give lessons. but if you practice an instrument for like 5 years that's plenty of time to get good enough to give lessons provided you know how to wing it




Not true at all. If you play for 5 years, you might be able to teach for $30 an hour at some guitar shop or something. But parents who are paying $100 an hour expect you to be able to be good enough to get their kids into Julliard. (Both my piano teachers graduated from Julliard by the way.)

Second of all, if you plan to have a music performance degree, you have to pass an AUDITION. Most people who simply learned an instrument on their own for 5 years, will not even pass this audition.

I received a scholarship and got into college despite my horrible high school grades due to how I played during my audition. Literally, the school sent me a rejection letter at first because my grades were so bad, and the only reason they changed their minds was because the music department pushed to have me in.

By age 15, I was playing Schubert's "Impromptu Op. 90 No. 2." How many people do you know who self-taught themselves for 5 years who could even come close to play a piece like this?



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OfflineSuperSillyUs
Proud 'Shitbird'. ®

Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 326
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301342 - 12/20/13 04:40 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
I totally agree.

Am reading, 'How Literature Works" by John Sutherland.

A really great book.




Am downloading PDF sheet music of Schubert impromptu's, Chopin Nocturne's, and Beethoven Sonata's so I can catch up. IDK why but I've been really itching to play piano again recently.

I still have yet to take a trip out to Ft. Worth just to see the Van Cliburn international piano competition. It's world-famous competition, only happens every 4 years, and people fly from all over the country to compete, it's like the piano Olympics. Unfortunately they just had a winner in 2013 so it looks like their next one is not until 2017.




I assume you are saying this because you know I am 'from' the Dallas, Houston, Sam Antonio area. Let me assure you, you are not missing out on much and are in fact supplying a very backward facing part of the country with very real cultural hegemony, in relation to San Francisco, and California. Blah blah as relates to the experiments of the states. California farts, and all that. A real race to the bottom...etc etc . you know the deal...


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Invisiblebadchad
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Posts: 13,372
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs] * 4
    #19301352 - 12/20/13 04:47 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Is it really just as simple as starting lessons or getting a quick gig after graduation?

I mean, if it were as simple as just walking into a six figure salary after graduating, I think there would be a lot more music majors.


--------------------
...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436


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InvisibleApollyphelion
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs] * 2
    #19301356 - 12/20/13 04:48 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

It is not worthless,
but, regardless, tricky to create value
unless already backed be value
and the value it is backed by is
usually a combination of
skill, talent, money and rarity
Sometimes spending tons of money on art
is like putting makeup on the pig
which is a beautiful enough girl for a lot of people.


--------------------

"I'm looking at you looking at it"

SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion



Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #19301379 - 12/20/13 04:56 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Blah blah red herring,
there are jobs. Mainly in colleges.
Thanks be to God. But even those are drying up...


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OfflineCrystal G
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Registered: 06/05/07
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: badchad]
    #19301386 - 12/20/13 04:57 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

badchad said:
I mean, if it were as simple as just walking into a six figure salary after graduating, I think there would be a lot more music majors.




Well, I guess I don't really know how it is for other music majors... I can only imagine that there isn't too much money if you study music theory... and I personally don't know how much jazz musicians, or wind instrumentalists would make.

But I do know that if you study the classical arts, particularly in voice or violin or cello or piano, people would pay a LOT of money for your lessons.

Unfortunately, I don't believe there would be a lot more music majors. For starters, not many people play instruments while they are young. As I mentioned before previously, you have to pass an audition to study music in college. Unless you are close to professional level by the time you apply for college, you won't be able to study music at the university level. So, most people wouldn't be able to suddenly "begin" studying music in college or change their major, it's just not that simple.

And yes, it really is as simple as starting lessons. I taught music while I was in school. I started by putting up flyers in places that children go with their parents. Places like Baskin Robbins, or the grocery store. I got 4 calls within a week, and they became my students. Then they started spreading word of mouth about me, which usually happens when parents are talking about their kids and are like, "Oh, my daughter started taking piano lessons... this teacher is really good, she got a music scholarship at bla bla bla..." and then this gets the other parents to start wanting to get their kids lessons from me too.

So after the parents brag about their kids, I would usually double the number of students I had. And I wasn't even trying to get anymore students so I actually had to turn them away, because I was already a full-time student and required to practice 3 hours a day on top of doing my GE classes.

My piano teacher from Julliard works from 9am to 9pm making $100 a day, IN CASH. 6 days a week. No taxes, man. You do the math on that one. She loves music too, even if she isn't working she's playing it or listening to it for 10 hours a day.


Edited by Crystal G (12/20/13 05:03 AM)


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InvisibleApollyphelion
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19301393 - 12/20/13 05:01 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I will say though
the safest, easiest, least riskiest way to make money from art is
Youtube and the Internet and general.
Although this is an entirely different realm most of the time
than 'Fine Art' (not: I am not a fine artist, I am technically an Outsider artist: I.E. Untrained) you can still make a nice living and on occasion
make more than fine artists.

There are so many spheres of art though
So i can't tell you about the Dance sphere for instance
but even then, you best be online someway.


--------------------

"I'm looking at you looking at it"

SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion



Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book


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OfflineBeanhead
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #19301418 - 12/20/13 05:15 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Because it's a one in a million chance you'll get by.

^Unless you count streaming, mishima is good moolah, you'll have no life though.


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InvisibleApollyphelion
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Beanhead]
    #19301433 - 12/20/13 05:19 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

What job gives you a life, anyway;-)

I don't think it is 1 a million to get by
maybe to get famous,
However, fame is becoming more fragmented, evenso.


--------------------

"I'm looking at you looking at it"

SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion



Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Beanhead]
    #19301435 - 12/20/13 05:20 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Beanhead said:
Because it's a one in a million chance you'll get by.

^Unless you count streaming, mishima is good moolah, you'll have no life though.




Yea I agree. Relying on Youtube is..... really flimsy, you're better off having a real day job. You can always make Youtube videos in your spare time.

Best ways to make Youtube money is, if you accidentally happen to stumble onto something crazy (like a horrific accident or footage of cops beating a man), or if you are a good comedian with an entire crew and happen to make a really funny viral video. Or get a video of yourself saying or doing something really fucking stupid or offensive, that usually tends to get a lot of views.


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OfflineBassfreak
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301437 - 12/20/13 05:22 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

it kind of is pointless

i always took art history classes in college for easy credits and it really was complete bullshit

i had the same prof 3 times and by the 3rd time having him he hated me cuz he knew i didnt try at all lol. Cs get degrees tho


--------------------
Tom Brady is a God

Free Tom Brady


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301438 - 12/20/13 05:23 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

My uncle has a degree in art.. Has had it for 20+ years now and has never used it. He's a car salesman.. :lol: He could have the same job without the degree and wouldn't have had to bear the financial burden of getting the degree.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Registered: 12/14/13
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Shroomslip]
    #19301447 - 12/20/13 05:28 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I don't understand arguing with idiots... endlessly.


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InvisibleApollyphelion
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301509 - 12/20/13 06:01 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

Beanhead said:
Because it's a one in a million chance you'll get by.

^Unless you count streaming, mishima is good moolah, you'll have no life though.




Yea I agree. Relying on Youtube is..... really flimsy, you're better off having a real day job. You can always make Youtube videos in your spare time.

Best ways to make Youtube money is, if you accidentally happen to stumble onto something crazy (like a horrific accident or footage of cops beating a man), or if you are a good comedian with an entire crew and happen to make a really funny viral video. Or get a video of yourself saying or doing something really fucking stupid or offensive, that usually tends to get a lot of views.




I think it is less flimsier or at least just as flimsy than any other method. There is a popular Youtuber for just about anything you can think of.


--------------------

"I'm looking at you looking at it"

SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion



Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #19301570 - 12/20/13 06:31 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

it's hard to get into the music field professionally. people are looking for performers generally, not for composers and well, people who in general have a lust for music past the inherent skill to practice an instrument for years on end to pass a stuffy audition.

performing art/music is not the same as conceiving it yourself. anyone can practice a whole lot, and deal with that aggravation... if you're willing...

but alot of these people will not make an original piece of music in their life, that gets any attention; only some will; and of course it helps to be able to play an instrument, but mostly it's the performers in major orchestrated pieces that are attracting the crowds, even if THEY don't WRITE the music.

:snub:

oh well, i guess there'll always be that disconnect.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301613 - 12/20/13 06:49 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
My piano teacher from Julliard works from 9am to 9pm making $100 a day, IN CASH. 6 days a week. No taxes, man. You do the math on that one. She loves music too, even if she isn't working she's playing it or listening to it for 10 hours a day.




Are you trying to say she just doesn't pay her taxes? I would guess she probably does.


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19301891 - 12/20/13 08:39 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

badchad said:
I mean, if it were as simple as just walking into a six figure salary after graduating, I think there would be a lot more music majors.




Well, I guess I don't really know how it is for other music majors... I can only imagine that there isn't too much money if you study music theory... and I personally don't know how much jazz musicians, or wind instrumentalists would make.

But I do know that if you study the classical arts, particularly in voice or violin or cello or piano, people would pay a LOT of money for your lessons.

Unfortunately, I don't believe there would be a lot more music majors. For starters, not many people play instruments while they are young. As I mentioned before previously, you have to pass an audition to study music in college. Unless you are close to professional level by the time you apply for college, you won't be able to study music at the university level. So, most people wouldn't be able to suddenly "begin" studying music in college or change their major, it's just not that simple.

And yes, it really is as simple as starting lessons. I taught music while I was in school. I started by putting up flyers in places that children go with their parents. Places like Baskin Robbins, or the grocery store. I got 4 calls within a week, and they became my students. Then they started spreading word of mouth about me, which usually happens when parents are talking about their kids and are like, "Oh, my daughter started taking piano lessons... this teacher is really good, she got a music scholarship at bla bla bla..." and then this gets the other parents to start wanting to get their kids lessons from me too.

So after the parents brag about their kids, I would usually double the number of students I had. And I wasn't even trying to get anymore students so I actually had to turn them away, because I was already a full-time student and required to practice 3 hours a day on top of doing my GE classes.

My piano teacher from Julliard works from 9am to 9pm making $100 a day, IN CASH. 6 days a week. No taxes, man. You do the math on that one. She loves music too, even if she isn't working she's playing it or listening to it for 10 hours a day.





i hope you realize this all depends on where you live

no one in downtown detroit is paying 100$ an hour for music lessons from some lady they found at baskin robbins

these ideas are nice and cute, but IMO unrealistic.


i think all degrees are worthless

im climbing the finance ladder with no degree. seems to be working just fine.


--------------------
AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!


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Invisiblepwnasaurus
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: k00laid]
    #19302001 - 12/20/13 09:19 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

k00laid said:
i hope you realize this all depends on where you live

no one in downtown detroit is paying 100$ an hour for music lessons from some lady they found at baskin robbins

these ideas are nice and cute, but IMO unrealistic.


i think all degrees are worthless

im climbing the finance ladder with no degree. seems to be working just fine.



Well of course it's relative to where you live - I don't think many people in Detroit are making $100/hr period.

I find it hard to believe that you could "climb the finance ladder" without any degree.  What is your position right now and how much do you make?  I have several friends in finance/consulting and they would never even look twice at you without a degree.  Most firms only hire 1-2 people out of hundreds of applicants, most of whom are either engineering or commerce graduates at the top of their class.


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Invisibleunam sanctum
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19302031 - 12/20/13 09:29 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

don't ever let anyone talk you out of something you have a passion for.  if money's a big deal and the starving part of being an artist bothers you then think beyond lessons or the Ritz and let your imagination free.  it only takes an idea and the dedication.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kathycaprino/2012/05/23/10-lessons-i-learned-from-sara-blakely-that-you-wont-hear-in-business-school/


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #19302043 - 12/20/13 09:34 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

k00laid said:
i hope you realize this all depends on where you live

no one in downtown detroit is paying 100$ an hour for music lessons from some lady they found at baskin robbins

these ideas are nice and cute, but IMO unrealistic.


i think all degrees are worthless

im climbing the finance ladder with no degree. seems to be working just fine.



Well of course it's relative to where you live - I don't think many people in Detroit are making $100/hr period.

I find it hard to believe that you could "climb the finance ladder" without any degree.  What is your position right now and how much do you make?  I have several friends in finance/consulting and they would never even look twice at you without a degree.  Most firms only hire 1-2 people out of hundreds of applicants, most of whom are either engineering or commerce graduates at the top of their class.




youre thinking a different finance.

i give loans to people who don't really need them

also: i started 5 months ago with no experience. now im training off and on still doing customer service occasionally for 30 a year.


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Edited by k00laid (12/20/13 09:39 AM)


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: k00laid]
    #19302099 - 12/20/13 09:50 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

music degrees i've always thought are a bit of a waste because you can learn whatever it is from lessons/internet/meeting people/tons of practice.....I would think the most valuable thing you'd get from school would be the people you meet


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19302112 - 12/20/13 09:54 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Nobody says that really. Art and music are two of the greatest things in the world!


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Moonshoe] * 1
    #19302118 - 12/20/13 09:56 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Studying art and music is worthless.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: koods]
    #19302124 - 12/20/13 09:57 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Studying art and music is worthless.




:yesnod:

Unless you have a seriously business orientated mind and know what you're gonna do with the degree and how you're gonna do it... worthless.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Uzziel]
    #19302146 - 12/20/13 10:05 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Well now there is a difference between studying art and music and getting a degree in art and music. You could easily study art and music on the side while getting a degree in something career applicable, and that would probably be wiser.

That said do what you love. Education will enrich your life and stimulate your mind, and that is never worthless.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Moonshoe]
    #19302255 - 12/20/13 10:41 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Studying something you are passionate about and enjoy is worthless


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Moonshoe]
    #19302302 - 12/20/13 10:53 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Moonshoe said:
Well now there is a difference between studying art and music and getting a degree in art and music. You could easily study art and music on the side while getting a degree in something career applicable, and that would probably be wiser.

That said do what you love. Education will enrich your life and stimulate your mind, and that is never worthless.




I agree with this wholeheartedly, I'm a musician but am studying Biochemistry at the moment. Especially in the current financial climate, it would be ballsy to try getting a degree in music.

Honestly a music or art degree is virtually worthless in each respective field, the highest paying jobs in both require no degree whatsoever (ex: studio exec, gallery owner) and the ones available with a degree are so low paying you'd have to be a trustafarian to get through student loan payments without a second job. A possible  exception would be receiving an ass ton of scholarships but that doesn't tend to happen often.

I'm not saying it's worthless to study music and art, but it is in-debting yourself to get a piece of paper saying you studied in a prestigious location.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Yukon Cornelius]
    #19302314 - 12/20/13 10:57 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah I generally say that you should only get a degree strictly based on interest and passion in the subject if you are getting it fully paid for through parents or a scholarship. If you have to pay for the degree yourself or go into student debt you should get something with a career in it. If your education is free you can afford to do something just for love, but you don't want to go into debt and not get a good job out of it.

My field fortunately is both very interesting to me and relatively job applicable. Its not the most career applicable field but its far from the least either. Its a nice balance for me, social sciences/sociology is super interesting and cool but also has a fair number of job applications, although far less than something like engineering or applied mathematics or medicine or whatever.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Moonshoe]
    #19302399 - 12/20/13 11:20 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

"making money" being the sole reason for people doing anything, is worthless.

also stupid.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19302403 - 12/20/13 11:21 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i had a friend who used to tease me for going to art school. that fucker never even went to college. never really threw that one back in his face, kind of wanted to though. at least i have a degree :shrug: and it's already gotten me a full time job. not the career i want, though.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: claraclairvoyant]
    #19302463 - 12/20/13 11:34 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

A lot of people who dont go to university and get a degree end up regretting it later.

It gives me a major feeling of pride and satisfaction and self confidence, even if it doesn't get me a job it lets me hold my head high and have self respect.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Moonshoe]
    #19302469 - 12/20/13 11:35 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Moonshoe said:
It gives me a major feeling of pride and satisfaction and self confidence, even if it doesn't get me a job it lets me hold my head high and have self respect.




that seems so irrational to me

i mean i guess if it's a degree that you are passionate about


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: k00laid]
    #19302479 - 12/20/13 11:37 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

How is it irrational to take pride in a major accomplishment and feel self respect for having achieved a goal you set for yourself, gaining knowledge in the process?


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Moonshoe]
    #19302493 - 12/20/13 11:40 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

if youre passionate about it sure

but i think college degrees are a major waste of resources

but i guess being a tall white man maybe my perspective is skewed. i seem to get jobs easily


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: k00laid]
    #19302533 - 12/20/13 11:50 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

k00laid said:
if youre passionate about it sure

but i think college degrees are a major waste of resources

but i guess being a tall white man maybe my perspective is skewed. i seem to get jobs easily




LOL tell me about it

we have two seperate forms of education here: Adult education and "middle-jury". Basically you can do 2-3 years in one year.

I always hated school because it left me dumbfounded, such a waste of time and yeaaarrrss that pass for something that could easily be done in a year (even less) unless specalization ofcourse.

and yes there are college/uni degrees in adult education.

Also getting treated as a person instead of as a kid is so nice. AKA cut the bullshit and move on, teachers realize you have a life other then school :thumbup:.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Beanhead]
    #19302718 - 12/20/13 12:30 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I had the pleasure of being in arts magnet schools for the entirety of my public education while growing up. Quite a few of my school mates have gone on to make successful livings in music. There are a lot more gigs out there than just being one in a million and becoming a rock star, guys. They play on cruise ships, they get hired to play on touring musicals, get a steady gig as the house band... Someone I know recently signed with a major label simply as a songwriter. Many of them get by teaching lessons, or get a 'real' job teaching band at a school. There is plenty of money out there for good musicians. Hell, I work with a wedding dj and he easily makes a grand every weekend.

SO no, arts education is not worthless. Did all of those kids go on to get a music degree? No.  But the ones traveling the world playing piano did.

There is a big difference between learning on youtube and going to CalArts or Julliard. And there is a big difference between someone who chooses a degree based on the money they think they'll make and one who chooses a degree based on their passion.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19302786 - 12/20/13 12:49 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Never to late! Reminds me of a quote,  "I can't define success but failure is trying to please everyone". Do what you believe in and give it your all. There will be people turning it down left and right especially those with 9 to 5's but if you want something enough, you can have it! Period! No argument could take that belief from me.

Without music and art and of course mushrooms:) there's nothing!


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: subliciouscompost]
    #19302950 - 12/20/13 01:34 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I wish I had learned music earlier, now I'm stuck trying to learn it at 24 with much less time on my hands and lesser resources. Although I still have the Internet, my time to use it is limited to when people are buggin me or I don't have work to do. Basically, usually when I'm worn out and mentally fatigued. There's always hope that. You don't really appreciate music until you've began playing it.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: psi]
    #19302956 - 12/20/13 01:36 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psi said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
My piano teacher from Julliard works from 9am to 9pm making $100 a day, IN CASH. 6 days a week. No taxes, man. You do the math on that one. She loves music too, even if she isn't working she's playing it or listening to it for 10 hours a day.




Are you trying to say she just doesn't pay her taxes? I would guess she probably does.




I'm sure she does, to get social security benefits later on in life. I just personally wouldn't pay nearly as much as she probably does.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: k00laid]
    #19302984 - 12/20/13 01:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

k00laid said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

k00laid said:
i hope you realize this all depends on where you live

no one in downtown detroit is paying 100$ an hour for music lessons from some lady they found at baskin robbins

these ideas are nice and cute, but IMO unrealistic.


i think all degrees are worthless

im climbing the finance ladder with no degree. seems to be working just fine.



Well of course it's relative to where you live - I don't think many people in Detroit are making $100/hr period.

I find it hard to believe that you could "climb the finance ladder" without any degree.  What is your position right now and how much do you make?  I have several friends in finance/consulting and they would never even look twice at you without a degree.  Most firms only hire 1-2 people out of hundreds of applicants, most of whom are either engineering or commerce graduates at the top of their class.




youre thinking a different finance.

i give loans to people who don't really need them

also: i started 5 months ago with no experience. now im training off and on still doing customer service occasionally for 30 a year.




LOL. Things like loan-sharking, and tax consulting, you don't need a degree for. I've met ghetto kids straight out of rehab that were doing what you do. Try going into hedge funds or stockbroking with no degree.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19302992 - 12/20/13 01:43 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

you should check out Mark Feldman - Music for Violin and Music for Violin and Piano with Sylvie Courvoisier, Crystal G.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19302994 - 12/20/13 01:43 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Each one of us have priorities and other views deciding what is important and not. Each one of us have different views, a different understanding of reality.. and I would go as far to say even different realities..

And so, atleast I think, it ends in all being relative.. as one reality may hold one truth, it may be the greatest of blasphemy in the next..


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Yukon Cornelius]
    #19303031 - 12/20/13 01:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Yukon Cornelius said:
Quote:

Moonshoe said:
Well now there is a difference between studying art and music and getting a degree in art and music. You could easily study art and music on the side while getting a degree in something career applicable, and that would probably be wiser.

That said do what you love. Education will enrich your life and stimulate your mind, and that is never worthless.




I agree with this wholeheartedly, I'm a musician but am studying Biochemistry at the moment. Especially in the current financial climate, it would be ballsy to try getting a degree in music.




Know what's interesting? I have a friend with a BS in biochemistry. According to her, her degree didn't help her find a job. She recommends going to trade school instead. :lol:


Quote:

Honestly a music or art degree is virtually worthless in each respective field, the highest paying jobs in both require no degree whatsoever (ex: studio exec, gallery owner) and the ones available with a degree are so low paying you'd have to be a trustafarian to get through student loan payments without a second job. A possible  exception would be receiving an ass ton of scholarships but that doesn't tend to happen often.

I'm not saying it's worthless to study music and art, but it is in-debting yourself to get a piece of paper saying you studied in a prestigious location.




I think people misunderstand a lot of things about music school. For starters, if you're a music major, you're expected to practice between 3-5 hour a day. If you're in a really SERIOUS school like Julliard, or USC Music School, you're expected to practice 10 hours a day. How many people do you know practice their skills 10 hours a day on their own?

The thing is, REAL musicians can tell the difference. They can tell the difference between somebody who practiced only one hour a day, and somebody who practices 10. They can tell the difference between somebody who got lessons from somebody good, and somebody who learned off Youtube.

Second, you learn a lot of other things on top of that, such as music theory and composition. Performance is only one aspect of it.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303044 - 12/20/13 01:54 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
you should check out Mark Feldman - Music for Violin and Music for Violin and Piano with Sylvie Courvoisier, Crystal G.




I don't do jazz. I wouldn't know how to play that.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G] * 1
    #19303090 - 12/20/13 02:05 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

the most important part is composition. music theory is good for reading, which is good for composition in and of itself, and which strengthens a consideration for different parts of playing that one maybe has not practiced as much, compared to others...

the playing an instrument for 10 hours a day thing is for people who play piano or viola in orchestra and shit... people who wanna play guitar like Paco DeLucia or some shit, like MASTERCRAFT guitarist or pianist...

it is HARDLY a necessity (i know that is not exactly what you are saying either) and to be expected to practice for so long is just for people who are on tour and who gig with big performances, where they are expected to play flawlessly... but i ask, what is the point if it is not even new music (your own or a fellow artist) that has not been around for forever, with people playing in and out every fuckin day.

to me, thats fuckin boring as shit, i mean, its good to practice for a few hours a day at the very least, but 10 hours... ok, then have fun at your Vivaldi concert; that shit, you gotta be tough as nails... and it isnt even like its YOUR music, its some old song from half a century-century+ ago :lol:

not trying to complain... just saying, it surely aint for everyone.
Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

akira_akuma said:
you should check out Mark Feldman - Music for Violin and Music for Violin and Piano with Sylvie Courvoisier, Crystal G.




I don't do jazz. I wouldn't know how to play that.



so, you dont have to play it to enjoy it. just listen :shrug: didnt know you didnt do Jazz, G. Jazz and Classical music is some of my favorite music.

ever heard of Franco Ambrosetti - Music for Symphony and Jazz Band (wow annoying my keyboard is jacked, i have to restart my computer, i canèt type with no question mark key, stupid...)


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303151 - 12/20/13 02:19 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
it is HARDLY a necessity (i know that is not exactly what you are saying either) and to be expected to practice for so long is just for people who are on tour and who gig with big performances, where they are expected to play flawlessly... but i ask, what is the point if it is not even new music (your own or a fellow artist) that has not been around for forever, with people playing in and out every fuckin day.




Do you think anybody who has created music in the 20th and 21st century has been anywhere CLOSE to the musical genius of Bach?

If not, then why is composing music so important, if it's going to be, let's be honest, nowhere near as good?

With all due respect, even "good" musicians such as Queen who composed their own music, are on a completely different level than say, Rachmaninov.

Quote:

didnt know you didnt do Jazz, G. Jazz and Classical music is some of my favorite music.




Yea, I am only trained classically.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303186 - 12/20/13 02:27 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

frankly Bach is pretty G but i like more avant garde works of the turn of the century, quite more, honestly.

not but a matter of opinion though. which Bach are we talking about anyways, i assume we are talking Johann Sebastian Bach here; big ole Requiem in D minor Bach, right... (scratch that, that's Mozart, what am i thinking :lol:; well there is another of the "runners" for best of the best)

well, not much might reach those heights, as it were but there are plenty of runners... Beethoven, Liszt, Webern

whatever, just plain lots. :lol: i cant remember them all by name yet.

but see, more then i like Romantic era (even Baroque era) and Classical era music, i like modern composition more... like Stravinsky, or Earle Brown (for the avant garde type stuff)


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303239 - 12/20/13 02:37 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Morton Feldman, Steve Reich, John Cage, Chrstian Wolff does any of this modern composition do any thing for you, G? that's my main forte right now; i've only recently started getting to the "classical era" stuff, myself.

still immensely awesome... Marc-Andre Hamelin is a great Pianist, and he has this album of Etudes, made with other composers in mind (like one OP has him combining three of Mozarts sonata on piano into one piece, for example; or another has him doing an OP in the style of Liszt on another.) they are all fascinating; and new compositions as well.


Edited by akira_akuma (12/20/13 02:45 PM)


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303263 - 12/20/13 02:44 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

John Cage? You mean that guy that published 4 minutes of silence and called it "music," THAT John Cage? :lol: I remember telling my piano teacher about that, she laughed so hard she cried.

But she thinks anything after jazz was the downfall of music, and it all started from the Beatles. :lol:


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303282 - 12/20/13 02:49 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

you can still have a reliable day job $$

and play music as a hobby.

seems to me if you're going to be working until you die you should do something to make your time more valuable

i think it's true that some degrees are worthless but only for like 80% of the people who get them.  the world DOES need musicians, but just not that many.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303292 - 12/20/13 02:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

yeah, that's the one. but for the record, John Cage wasn't the first guy to do it. (for example one notable work is a Czech work on piano comprised entirely of rests)

plus, that's not all he's known for... he's done multitudes of different works from Sonata's on prepared piano, Etudes on piano based off of astrological star charts (some of the most commanding piano work like For Bunita Marcus) he's done ballet and more... he's a seminal figure in indeterminacy in music and electroacoustic music (like Satie and others)


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303376 - 12/20/13 03:08 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I stopped caring about the money a long time ago
I just want to put out shit I can bump down the road
I want my neighbors to know this asshole coming home


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19303398 - 12/20/13 03:12 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Endure is a suitable SN.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma] * 2
    #19303432 - 12/20/13 03:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I notice a lot of classical snobbery these days against folk and all it's subgenres. Personally I think most modern music is shit but that's besides the point, rock was definitely not the falling point of music. It was the wave that crested before its downfall.

It was one of the heights of music in my opinion. The crest of a thousand years of folk music mixing up with modern music such as the blues, american folk and electronics and then it was all over in a brief moment of glory. From its remains spawned a million sub genre piles of crapola.

I love classical music but its so damned snobby that I just can't get into it. I love listening to it but folk music and rock is where I find the best comradery among musicians.

It's also in my opinion more individually free.
Plus ear training beats sight reading any day but that's just my opinion.
I do love music theory so there is a point for classical, folk players will surprise you with how much theory they know that. But this is just a formulative opinion from a complete amateur so take my post with a grain of salt...


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303544 - 12/20/13 03:39 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

all music is forward thinking, it's just that not everyone realizes this, and chooses to make music based on regressive "musical" (sometimes entirely non-musical) foreplay...

ie Dubstep

it turned into this thing that is utterly and completely NOT Dubstep, yet people still call it that.

then add into the mix all the other sub genres (psybeat, illbient ect) with a good idea to make something a little different, and of course, you'll see alot of "try-hards" trying to get in on the "new thing"; that at once was great, until people decide that's where they wanna go.

the what was once a brilliant and unique innovation or idea, becomes monotone and that's what MOST people will hear. the monotone trash that has been done in and out before, with no innovation of thought, performance, or concept.

it happens with all music, including Jazz and Rock, and even Classical music.

all of it.

that's why there is constant innovation... the drive to need to bury all that hypnotic trash out of the way for the real good stuff.

it's a harder task, at this point in time, then it ever has been before, and thusly we're all getting alot of good music out of it. just gotta see through the garbage.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303550 - 12/20/13 03:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

GreyMorph said:
I notice a lot of classical snobbery these days against folk and all it's subgenres. Personally I think most modern music is shit but that's besides the point, rock was definitely not the falling point of music. It was the wave that crested before its downfall.




You mean.... jazz and blues?!!??!!?!?1? :crankey:




Totally random, but holy shit, I just found an 8 year old girl playing a piece that I played when I was 15. She plays very robotically, but damn I'm still impressed a girl of her age can play it. I think I was just learning Moonlight Sonata at her age.



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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303593 - 12/20/13 03:49 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i say there is no "bad genre's of music".

all genre's of music have good and bad musicians in them (and by bad i mean, either not worth mentioning, or are just simply not as innovative as what i look for personally in music.)

PS: i wanna see you face while trying to take in For John Cage by Morton Feldman...

you'd be like  :whateveryousayfreak:



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OfflineGreySatyr
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303632 - 12/20/13 03:58 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

GreyMorph said:
I notice a lot of classical snobbery these days against folk and all it's subgenres. Personally I think most modern music is shit but that's besides the point, rock was definitely not the falling point of music. It was the wave that crested before its downfall.




You mean.... jazz and blues?!!??!!?!?




No, I meant that everything that came after rock. Pop...

Django Reindhart was once playing guitar for his friend, Andres Segovia (faster of classical guitar), after he finished playing Andres asked him where he could get a copy of that piece and Django just laughed and said that he was improvising. That to me speaks wonders about the two different cultures of musicians. I prefer Django but respect the classical approach although typically classical players don't show the same respect for self taught folk or other genre players. At least most don't.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303646 - 12/20/13 04:01 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

pop music was around before rock and roll, man.

light music is a "classical form" of pop music... plus, there was AM Pop and commercial and corporate music, to boot.

all that stuff was formulaic as to pop, or be "simple", just like pop music today.

pop music had just since been "informed" by R&B and Gospel music; after Rock became "a thing".


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303705 - 12/20/13 04:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

GreyMorph said:
I wish I had learned music earlier, now I'm stuck trying to learn it at 24 with much less time on my hands and lesser resources. Although I still have the Internet, my time to use it is limited to when people are buggin me or I don't have work to do. Basically, usually when I'm worn out and mentally fatigued. There's always hope that. You don't really appreciate music until you've began playing it.




It's true man, although I personally didn't appreciate music until after I became an adult. Kids are like that, they never appreciate what they are learning while they are young. They just view it as tedious work. I didn't appreciate my music lessons, I didn't appreciate swim team, I didn't appreciate learning Japanese. It wasn't until I was an adult that I realized how great it was that I learned to do these things.

You might not have learned while young, but you have a better sense of appreciation and understanding of music than any child.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303720 - 12/20/13 04:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

all true^

too true. damn



Chopin Etudes

hand punishing.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Yukon Cornelius]
    #19303739 - 12/20/13 04:21 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Yukon Cornelius said:
I'm not saying it's worthless to study music and art, but it is in-debting yourself to get a piece of paper saying you studied in a prestigious location.




I guess that depends on where you go. I had two piano teachers, both from Julliard, one was a concert pianist who played professionally (her name was Yoshie Akimoto). She makes $200 an hour for lessons now, and people fly her all over the world to take her lessons.

She makes more hourly than a psychiatrist, and medical school is WAYYYYY more expensive than 4 years at Julliard.

I had another piano teacher before either teacher from Julliard, and she was good, but definitely nowhere near their level.


Quote:

Lynnch said:
I had the pleasure of being in arts magnet schools for the entirety of my public education while growing up. Quite a few of my school mates have gone on to make successful livings in music. There are a lot more gigs out there than just being one in a million and becoming a rock star, guys. They play on cruise ships, they get hired to play on touring musicals, get a steady gig as the house band...




OMFG that would be such an effing sweet job... I never even considered playing on a cruise ship. Basically you would get to enjoy all the amenities of being on a cruise FOR FREE when you're not working. It'd be like getting paid to be on vacation. SIIIICKKKKK


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303815 - 12/20/13 04:40 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

indeed. people often don't realize the many options you have available to musicians and performers.

just gotta eke out what you can, in this day and age; and sometimes it might sound silly, but whatever, a gig is a gig and playing music is playing music... and same goes for writing it.

i'd love to write music for a play, or video game, or film... something like that. it'd be entirely awesome.

or like... have a sound installation where you feed various instruments into reverb and delay effects generators around various blinking lights.

yeah, there... there's alot of shit you CAN do without being a famous "star" or whatever...


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #19303864 - 12/20/13 04:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
indeed. people often don't realize the many options you have available to musicians and performers.

just gotta eke out what you can, in this day and age; and sometimes it might sound silly, but whatever, a gig is a gig and playing music is playing music... and same goes for writing it.

i'd love to write music for a play, or video game, or film... something like that. it'd be entirely awesome.

or like... have a sound installation where you feed various instruments into reverb and delay effects generators around various blinking lights.

yeah, there... there's alot of shit you CAN do without being a famous "star" or whatever...




There was a professor of music theory at my school that was hired to write the orchestra music for some sci-fi movie... I am not a huge fan of sci-fi (except for Futurama, which is my favorite show) so I don't remember which movie it was. But I remember he had all the music majors at my school do the orchestra recording. Only the professor got paid though. :bored:


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303980 - 12/20/13 05:19 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

lol, that's rather unfair.

players should not be abused like that. i bet it wasn't even that good anyways; the jerk. :snub:

but yeah, on that note, and along with what you were saying earlier... making music can be in a strange source of income; definitely not as "polished" so to speak, as other money making devices. definitely not as "bureaucratic"


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19304145 - 12/20/13 05:50 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

you know what's really worthless? attributing values to things, when one isn't on the forefront of experiencing said "things".


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19304333 - 12/20/13 06:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
(except for Futurama, which is my favorite show)





Just earned a +1, from me. Futurama ...way under rated...


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19304348 - 12/20/13 06:20 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
you know what's really worthless? attributing values to things, when one isn't on the forefront of experiencing said "things".





So basically, no one's opinion is worth anything unless they're 'experts' in said field.  :boxerface:

And why would they become experts?


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304362 - 12/20/13 06:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
(except for Futurama, which is my favorite show)





Just earned a +1, from me. Futurama ...way under rated...




I agree, Futurama was the best of Matt Groening's works. The most ingenious and creative, and I love the way he portrays the future in the year 3000. I also love all of Professor Farnsworth's inventions.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19304365 - 12/20/13 06:24 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:

Am downloading PDF sheet music of Schubert impromptu's, Chopin Nocturne's, and Beethoven Sonata's so I can catch up. IDK why but I've been really itching to play piano again recently.

I still have yet to take a trip out to Ft. Worth just to see the Van Cliburn international piano competition. It's world-famous competition, only happens every 4 years, and people fly from all over the country to compete, it's like the piano Olympics. Unfortunately they just had a winner in 2013 so it looks like their next one is not until 2017.





You're obviously a 'schizo' and have no value to our society...


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19304378 - 12/20/13 06:26 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
(except for Futurama, which is my favorite show)





Just earned a +1, from me. Futurama ...way under rated...




I agree, Futurama was the best of Matt Groening's works. The most ingenious and creative, and I love the way he portrays the future in the year 3000. I also love all of Professor Farnsworth's inventions.




It's over people's heads....people like shit that panders to the LCD, Futurama doesn't do that = shit show.

Gibme mo:

(simplicity and stereotypes without question)


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304391 - 12/20/13 06:29 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
(except for Futurama, which is my favorite show)





Just earned a +1, from me. Futurama ...way under rated...




I agree, Futurama was the best of Matt Groening's works. The most ingenious and creative, and I love the way he portrays the future in the year 3000. I also love all of Professor Farnsworth's inventions.




It's over people's heads....people like shit that panders to the LCD, Futurama doesn't do that = shit show. Gibme mo South Park.




Is it just me, or does South Park's new season suck balls lately? I remember their old episodes, they used to make political jokes and more sociologically intelligent jokes. Now it's all jack-off jokes and fart jokes. Like that "Creme Fraiche" episode... the ENTIRE EPISODE one jack-off joke after another.

South Park must have gotten new writers, because their shit blows now.


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19304403 - 12/20/13 06:31 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Hate Sloth Park, gay hating nonsense.
Panders to the most 'socially conservative' population.

there's a reason it's on nonstop ...24/7 comedy channel.

fart jokes? season one...


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304423 - 12/20/13 06:36 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Southpark > futurama > American dad/family guy

People who say all music today sucks usually fit into these categories

1. Band Wagoner
2. Person who looks in the wrong places
3. Ignorant person
4. Really ignorant person
5. Stuck in the past
6. Doesn't actually care for music
7. Isn't open to the new music

Music from any past makes you feel sweeter. it's similar to smelling a scent (shampoo usually does this to me) and being reminded of child hood memories.

Music is like a relationship.  If u put the work in to listening to it and at least attempting to see what the artist is trying to convey you'll get something out of it

Florence and the machine here to prove you wrong about new music, even some radio music


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19304451 - 12/20/13 06:40 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Contrived nonsense.

You think Florence listens to South Park?

What does South Park have to do with 'new musix'? Nothing.

It's a conservative type show. Passed off as 'new' and 'cutting edge'.

I love new music and dislike South Park = =  Shitting on your theory.



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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304601 - 12/20/13 07:12 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I don't recall comparing or using the two in the same sentence

That whole post you made...
For nothing :P


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19304620 - 12/20/13 07:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

cuz this thread is all about you.

or wait, what was the point of posting a south pork reference alongside a  rant about 'new music'...?


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304633 - 12/20/13 07:16 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:


What does South Park have to do with 'new musix'? Nothing.






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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304647 - 12/20/13 07:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

What is art?


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: SuperSillyUs]
    #19304648 - 12/20/13 07:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SuperSillyUs said:
cuz this thread is all about you.



:feelsgoodman:


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19304654 - 12/20/13 07:20 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
What is art?




Creative Expression


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19304716 - 12/20/13 07:29 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I pass gas creatively.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19304734 - 12/20/13 07:33 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I pass gas creatively.




I wait for the silence


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19304764 - 12/20/13 07:39 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

So you are into negative space?


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19304897 - 12/20/13 08:04 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
So you are into negative space?




I'm into a hot babe who farts


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19304947 - 12/20/13 08:13 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Endure said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
So you are into negative space?




I'm into a hot babe who farts



If it was Yoko (not a hot babe) some peckerhead would call it art


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Offlineskatealex2
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19305036 - 12/20/13 08:34 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Yoko Ono - lol




Also I got a fine arts degree - honestly might be the worst academic I've made. It happens to be the jobs I'm doing don't need college - a lot of it is internet knowledge and experience, etc...  but even so - to date my degree didn't help with anything.  Some of the stuff learned and college and experience was worth it - I did have some interesting classes but having an 'art degree', eh, maybe it helps some but on the job market by itself not sure what it could do.  Could depend on the type of art degree too tho.


Edited by skatealex2 (12/20/13 08:35 PM)


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: skatealex2]
    #19305045 - 12/20/13 08:35 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

My mom met Yoko Ono at Beverly Hot Springs. She saw her naked. She met a lot of other celebrities too, like Sharon Stone, Liv Tyler, and Gwyneth Paltrow. All totally naked. :lol:

She said Liv Tyler's ass was huge and that she's a really chunky girl, and Gwyneth Paltrow was completely flat, and most likely dyed her hair blonde because her pubic hair was brown. :rofl2:


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19305240 - 12/20/13 09:25 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I'm studying music independently. Getting a degree in it is not the greatest course of action for me at least. When all I need is sheet music and a keyboard. Definitely don't have the money for it and the career prospects are slim. That's generally why people consider it worthless. You can't teach someone how to be a great artist or musician it's something that has to be driven by a passion for it. The only thing a "proper" education can give you today is an environment with other like minded individuals that can help motivate you.

I started playing piano when I was 18. I'm 22 now. About half that time I was taking music seriously. I almost exclusively play Chopin and some Liszt. Paganini is great and I like to play transcriptions and variations of his work. I certainly don't play at a professional level yet but I'm getting better every day.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Aedan]
    #19305290 - 12/20/13 09:36 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Aedan said:
You can't teach someone how to be a great artist or musician it's something that has to be driven by a passion for it. The only thing a "proper" education can give you today is an environment with other like minded individuals that can help motivate you.




Yes you can. There are different ways to play different eras of music. Baroque, for example, is supposed to be played entirely different from the Romantic era. Things such as how long to hold the pedals for, how much force to use in a staccato of the era, etc. are all things that are taught. And can't be learned from Youtube.

And unless your keyboard has a pressure sensor which accentuates each tone differently depending on how hard you press it, it's nowhere near the same as playing on a piano.


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OfflineAedan
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19305314 - 12/20/13 09:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah I have an 88 key korg with weighted keys that are pressure sensitive. Dynamics in music are on the sheet music. You just have to read it. And you can gather enough from recordings to know how it's supposed to sound.


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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Aedan]
    #19305389 - 12/20/13 10:04 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I know it's not what is taught in classical study but I think it's cool and worthwhile to interpret those things a bit for yourself as well. Music is most enjoyable when you get to be creative


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19305458 - 12/20/13 10:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

k00laid said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

k00laid said:
i hope you realize this all depends on where you live

no one in downtown detroit is paying 100$ an hour for music lessons from some lady they found at baskin robbins

these ideas are nice and cute, but IMO unrealistic.


i think all degrees are worthless

im climbing the finance ladder with no degree. seems to be working just fine.



Well of course it's relative to where you live - I don't think many people in Detroit are making $100/hr period.

I find it hard to believe that you could "climb the finance ladder" without any degree.  What is your position right now and how much do you make?  I have several friends in finance/consulting and they would never even look twice at you without a degree.  Most firms only hire 1-2 people out of hundreds of applicants, most of whom are either engineering or commerce graduates at the top of their class.




youre thinking a different finance.

i give loans to people who don't really need them

also: i started 5 months ago with no experience. now im training off and on still doing customer service occasionally for 30 a year.




LOL. Things like loan-sharking, and tax consulting, you don't need a degree for. I've met ghetto kids straight out of rehab that were doing what you do. Try going into hedge funds or stockbroking with no degree.





you know kids straight out of rehab that make 30 grand a year in retail finance?

wow.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Aedan]
    #19306127 - 12/21/13 02:17 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Aedan said:
Yeah I have an 88 key korg with weighted keys that are pressure sensitive. Dynamics in music are on the sheet music. You just have to read it. And you can gather enough from recordings to know how it's supposed to sound.




I still don't think it's the same. I doubt your hand posture or fingering is even completely accurate. It's different when you have somebody teaching it to you step by step, and correcting your mistakes along the way, because most people don't even realize when they are making a mistake, even huge ones. You just don't realize the difference because you've never been taught.




k00laid, yes I do, I actually met one from OKCupid that was a heroin addict living in rehab and doing that subprime loan shit.


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19307244 - 12/21/13 10:16 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

credit cards. = retail finance.


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