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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint
    #19287878 - 12/17/13 10:12 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint

A supposedly “voluntary” survey checkpoint run by a private firm in Reading, Pennsylvania on behalf of the White House Office of National Drug Control Policy caused outrage when residents said they were forced off the road into a car park and coerced into giving cheek swabs as a result of an intimidating police presence.

The Pacific Institute for Research and Evaluation was hired by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration to run the checkpoint, during which motorists were quizzed about their driving habits.

Reading resident Ricardo Nieves said that he had to repeatedly refuse to take part in the survey over a 5 minute period before the was allowed to leave. Nieves noted that the presence of city police and a police car with flashing lights was designed to “intimidate motorists” into submission and “gave the checkpoint an air of authority it would not otherwise have had,” according to the Reading Eagle.

Nieves told the City Council Monday that the company’s hiring of police officers to help run the checkpoint was “a gross abuse of power on many levels” and that the firm running it refused to divulge why they were demanding to take swabs of people’s cheeks, with Nieves asserting, “Clearly it was for DNA.”

City Police Chief William M. Heim later remarked that the cheek swabs were to test for the presence of prescription drugs, dismissing Nieves’ assertion that the police presence was coercive by claiming, “People are not pressured by police presence to do something they don’t want to.”

“Our rights are being violated more and more every day, it’s another way of government intrusion into our lives,” said Councilman Dennis M. Sterner, complaining that local police were unable to pick up local drug dealers after years of investigations, yet were perfectly happy to pull over motorists on a whim.

“A car driver or passenger cannot be required or pressured into providing a DNA sample and, in fact, can’t be stopped at all except on suspicion of a crime or for a properly conducted sobriety checkpoint,” Mary Catherine Roper, senior staff attorney for the ACLU of Pennsylvania, told the newspaper.

However, this hasn’t stopped police across the country running the supposedly “voluntary” checkpoints at the behest of the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, which in some cases involve the collection of not just saliva but blood too.

Motorists in Fort Worth who were subjected to the same program also complained that the checkpoint did not seem voluntary at all and that police forced them to pull over. It also emerged that even without consent, police were taking “passive alcohol sensor readings” from drivers.

“The NHTSA defended these non-stops by stating everything was “voluntary” and that law enforcement officers were only on hand for “safety” reasons. But the passive alcohol test wasn’t voluntary. And the officers never bothered to point out stopping was voluntary until after the test subjects had actually stopped,” reports TechDirt.

As we reported back in 2010, motorists who refuse to submit to a breath test at DUI checkpoints now face the prospect of police forcibly jabbing a needle in their arm and extracting blood.

Shocking video footage taken at the Gwinnett County jail in Georgia shows police strapping down citizens accused of drunk driving before using a needle forcibly draw blood as victims scream, “what country is this?”


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19288822 - 12/17/13 02:11 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Police state, anyone?


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OfflineNetDiver
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Lord_McLovin] * 2
    #19288834 - 12/17/13 02:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

No thank you, I'm on a low-tyranny diet.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19288847 - 12/17/13 02:16 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I don't know if we can really count "infowars.com" as news, though.


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Offlinethedream
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil] * 2
    #19288977 - 12/17/13 02:47 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

^ So you wouldn't consider this credible because it was posted on infowars?
Do you not believe it happened? If so did you look to verify it?

What would you consider a legitament news source?


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil] * 5
    #19288993 - 12/17/13 02:53 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
I don't know if we can really count "infowars.com" as news, though.




WTF? Really?

Would the local paper count?

http://readingeagle.com/article/20131217/NEWS/312179910


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: thedream] * 1
    #19289001 - 12/17/13 02:54 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I don't know whether it happened as the site claims or not.  The site is a known conspiracy nutter site, though, so I definitely won't assume it's all true.

There are plenty of legitimate news sources, but I wouldn't assume anything they write is true either...at least not without a bit more.  Infowars, however, is even less credible.  More often than not, if Infowars says something, it's untrue or half-true.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19289011 - 12/17/13 02:56 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

That is a far more objective article than the first one you linked.  You should have used that instead of infowars in the first place.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil]
    #19289020 - 12/17/13 02:58 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Or perhaps you should have read the article while paying attention.

Had you done so you'd have seen a link.  It's not hard to miss. "according to the Reading Eagle."


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms] * 1
    #19289030 - 12/17/13 03:00 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I read the article you linked.  I didn't realize that my obligation was to follow every link on every page you link.  Do I have to follow every link on those pages too?  Is this a six degrees of separation thing?  Or is it more like a "where's waldo?" where I have to keep clicking links until I find whatever the fuck your point is supposed to be?

Was I supposed to click the link about the boston bomber being mind controlled too?


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil] * 3
    #19289044 - 12/17/13 03:04 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

No. You don't have an obligation to follow every link anymore than I have an obligation to pick and choose sources that suit you.

However, actually following the link would have gone part way to making you appear less foolish today.

It would have taken you a long time to find a point as I wasn't attempting to make one.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms] * 1
    #19289061 - 12/17/13 03:11 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Posting a link to an infowars story in a news forum is foolish.  You might as well link a story from The Onion.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil] * 2
    #19289068 - 12/17/13 03:12 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Right. What's the matter. New practice not working out so you spend your day trolling?

Your laziness is not my problem.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19289074 - 12/17/13 03:13 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I haven't moved to California yet, so I haven't started the practice.

And I never troll.


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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil]
    #19289086 - 12/17/13 03:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

And what about this article screams of a conspiracy?


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil]
    #19289092 - 12/17/13 03:20 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
And I never troll.




Right.

:laugh2:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: thedream]
    #19289111 - 12/17/13 03:24 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

thedream said:
And what about this article screams of a conspiracy?



Nothing.  I was talking about the source more than the actual article. The source routinely posts conspiracy nutter stories and claims.  Sure, they mix some truth in with the lies, but all great manipulators do that.  The problem comes in telling the two apart.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil]
    #19289130 - 12/17/13 03:27 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

A problem comes from people who whine about links before looking into the story.

Don't be lazy.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19289217 - 12/17/13 03:46 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I read the story before I posted.  I also saw the other links to 9/11 conspiracies and boston bomber conspiracies.  The internet is a large and strange place wherein one can find himself in :tinfoil: land very quickly...


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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil]
    #19289225 - 12/17/13 03:48 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I mean its just for research right? However, I would not want to contribute to anything that would support swabbing people for drugs as a new form of DUI.
Although, its not like people were getting arrested or anything, at least not yet. Its only a matter of time before the cops will have another tool in their arsenal against getting high.


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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: ChinChiller]
    #19289274 - 12/17/13 04:00 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

This happened in my town


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InvisibleJoker Flash
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19289433 - 12/17/13 04:34 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I can't wait until our children have to wear photo ids and pass a cheek swab everyday before their mandatory brainwashing. Then forced cheek swabbing won't even make the news, and we can all go back to our fantasy lands.


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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19293126 - 12/18/13 12:29 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I heard about his on NPR, happened near me.

Quote:

He said federal and local tax dollars were being used to stop innocent people without probable cause, and allow a private company to hire uniformed police to force citizens to listen to their questions




Quote:

City Police Chief William M. Heim said the two federal agencies are trying to see what can be done about crashes and injuries, and the swabs were not to get DNA samples but to test for the presence of prescription drugs.

The checkpoint was supposed to be voluntary, but Nieves said he had to refuse several times over a five-minute period before the woman taking the survey let him go.




And that is how it goes. They set it up like DUI checkpoint, are not upfront that it's voluntary and hope they can take advantage of you like most police in these circumstances. More data for bigger pools so they can have a file on everyone. Corporations and government working hand in hand to take DNA samples of citizens without probable cause wasting money we don't have in the process.

Quote:

Mayor Vaughn D. Spencer said neither he nor Managing Director Carole B. Snyder were aware of it, and he needs to understand what role police played before making any comment on it.

Councilman Dennis M. Sterner was livid that government can't pick up local drug dealers without a two-year investigation, but can stop motorists at random.





When I hear about this shit I get so frustrated. This story especially, look at the politicians go in to damage control. 7.9 million on a dual federal agency study with police in badges stopping you for a mouth swab just want another reason to get their nose in your car and they act like they don't know a thing about it. Fuck that and fuck them. This country is fucking retarded.

Quote:

"Our rights are being violated more and more every day," he said. "It's another way of government intrusion into our lives."




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InvisibleCidneyIndole
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Joker Flash] * 1
    #19293489 - 12/18/13 02:05 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Oh, HELL no...


Quote:

City Police Chief William M. Heim later remarked that the cheek swabs were to test for the presence of prescription drugs, dismissing Nieves’ assertion that the police presence was coercive by claiming, “People are not pressured by police presence to do something they don’t want to.”






This clown has clearly never been on the other side of the badge, in one of these encounters. Police presence can be one of the most intimidating things in the world. Doubly so if you're prone to an anxiety disorder, a disorder related to authority, have had bad experiences with cops, or simply read the news regularly.


Let's see how much you like it when some group, that you're NOT a member of, with guns, numbers, and full legal authority tells you that you are no longer free to travel as you like, until they see fit. That, alone, is an intimidating feeling. Further, when this group is known for their use of force, violence, locking people up, giving out fines, (not to mention chasing and/or firing on people who fail to stop, aka "run") etc etc.


Since the second worse possible offense to a cop is to not stop when they tell you to (the first being touching them, the third being "back talk") what cause does a person have to assume that they have the right NOT to stop?


I call bullshit.


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Offlinedokunai
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: CidneyIndole]
    #19293640 - 12/18/13 02:39 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I'm rarely one to advocate resistance that will more likely get the "suspect" hurt instead of just sending him on his way with his rights completely violated.  Pull me over and demand a DNA swab?  You're going to have to break both my arms and I'll bite your fucking finger off when you try to stick your q-tip in my mouth.


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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: dokunai]
    #19293652 - 12/18/13 02:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

So, you'd be in a hospital bed with a handcuff around your cast waiting for pretrial....

Sound's like a great fucking idea, dude.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: dokunai]
    #19293749 - 12/18/13 03:09 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

dokunai said:
I'm rarely one to advocate resistance that will more likely get the "suspect" hurt instead of just sending him on his way with his rights completely violated.  Pull me over and demand a DNA swab?  You're going to have to break both my arms and I'll bite your fucking finger off when you try to stick your q-tip in my mouth.




:seriousbusiness:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: Enlil]
    #19293750 - 12/18/13 03:09 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
So, you'd be in a hospital bed with a handcuff around your cast waiting for pretrial....

Sound's like a great fucking idea, dude.




It does seem like the better course of action would be to say... no.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19294374 - 12/18/13 05:44 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Every nation gets the government it deserves.
Joseph de Maistre




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Offlinedokunai
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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19295226 - 12/18/13 09:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
So, you'd be in a hospital bed with a handcuff around your cast waiting for pretrial....

Sound's like a great fucking idea, dude.




It does seem like the better course of action would be to say... no.




So let's say your sister and girlfriend (lol u actaully have one of those) are being forced to undergo a body cavity search (lolz, buttole and pussy with the same glove used on all four holes).  I'm sure you would be thrilled at what was happening.  A pre-trial with a handcuff around my cuff sounds absolutely delightful compared to defending my sister's honor against state sanctioned rape.  Put me in a room with such a cop for 3 minutes and you will need a trauma team for a crushed windpipe and shattered ribcage. 
but hey, fellow pig, none of your fellow officers cAn do  a do damn thing wrong and the perp deserved 10 times what he got.  Just ask office perp crusher.













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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: dokunai]
    #19296532 - 12/19/13 04:30 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

That is a truly stupid post.  Resisting the cops isn't going to stop them. It's just going to get you in more trouble.  So which would you rather have:  Your sister violated, or your sister violated and you in jail, dead, or in the hospital?  Which of those two would put you in a better position to help her?


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Re: Pennsylvanians Coerced Into Giving Cheek Swab at “Voluntary” Checkpoint [Re: dokunai]
    #19296614 - 12/19/13 05:09 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

dokunai said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
So, you'd be in a hospital bed with a handcuff around your cast waiting for pretrial....

Sound's like a great fucking idea, dude.




It does seem like the better course of action would be to say... no.




So let's say your sister and girlfriend (lol u actaully have one of those) are being forced to undergo a body cavity search (lolz, buttole and pussy with the same glove used on all four holes).  I'm sure you would be thrilled at what was happening.  A pre-trial with a handcuff around my cuff sounds absolutely delightful compared to defending my sister's honor against state sanctioned rape.  Put me in a room with such a cop for 3 minutes and you will need a trauma team for a crushed windpipe and shattered ribcage. 
but hey, fellow pig, none of your fellow officers cAn do  a do damn thing wrong and the perp deserved 10 times what he got.  Just ask office perp crusher.





:underage:

Grow up and stop making posts this stupid.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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