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OfflineCarlWonderful
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Registered: 02/05/13
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Wait and Consolidate
    #19277693 - 12/15/13 04:13 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Does a longer consolidating period usually lead to bigger and more fruits on the 1st flush?

Could small size and early opening be the subs response to a lack of consolidation? ...Because it did not have time to eat and really power itself up yet?  It seems like this could be the case as a lot of 1st flushes can be full of tiny guys while a 2nd flush can boom...And I mean without rehydrating or anything. 



Any thought on that.....


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InvisiblePestile

Registered: 05/02/13
Posts: 875
Loc: Northern Europe
Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: CarlWonderful]
    #19277740 - 12/15/13 04:28 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I remember a thread not long ago, I can't find the link, there was a discussion about higher potency when consolidating longer. But I believe that was all it was; a discussion.

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Allowing a substrate some time to consolidate is always a good idea.  It's not as critical with bulk substrates as it is with brf cakes because they're not as nutritious.  The idea is to ensure most of the nutrients in the substrate are used up by fruiting time. This is because an over-nutritious substrate leads to deformed fruits and other mutations. 

Grains such as rice take a bit longer to be consumed therefore we recommend a longer consolidation period with cakes.  With bulk substrates, give it a day or three after full colonization and then let it rip.
RR




I think the general consensus is MS is a crapshot and only with a mono culture can you expect anything from a particular culture or grow.


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: CarlWonderful]
    #19278017 - 12/15/13 07:19 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

It seems like this could be the case as a lot of 1st flushes can be full of tiny guys while a 2nd flush can boom...And I mean without rehydrating or anything. 




Second and subsequent flushes are almost always a different strain when using multispore inoculation.
RR


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OfflineCarlWonderful
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #19279806 - 12/15/13 03:09 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

That's interesting, I did not know is was consistent like that. 

So what is the main factor in a 2nd flush that overshadows the first?

-Is it the "other" strain has had more time to power up for its flush?

or

-Is it just a coincidence and the "other" strain just has better genetics.  Say a poor first flush of one strain is followed by a good second flush of another.  If these strains were reversed would the first flush have then been bigger than the second?  So more about genetics than a time issue, or maybe its both I guess?

Trying to gain some understanding, I know there might not be a sure answer to these questions but It always helps to question things..


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Invisibledusttodust


Registered: 11/26/12
Posts: 491
Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: Pestile]
    #19279826 - 12/15/13 03:15 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pestilence said:
I remember a thread not long ago, I can't find the link, there was a discussion about higher potency when consolidating longer. But I believe that was all it was; a discussion.




You meant this? http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/15181139/


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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: CarlWonderful]
    #19279858 - 12/15/13 03:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

there are too many factors to give an answer on that, but PE  is a good example of something that benifits from a good consolidatoin, it produces alot of mutant blobs during it's first flush which i believe to be directly related to it's metab
Quote:

CarlWonderful said:
That's interesting, I did not know is was consistent like that. 

So what is the main factor in a 2nd flush that overshadows the first?

-Is it the "other" strain has had more time to power up for its flush?

or

-Is it just a coincidence and the "other" strain just has better genetics.  Say a poor first flush of one strain is followed by a good second flush of another.  If these strains were reversed would the first flush have then been bigger than the second?  So more about genetics than a time issue, or maybe its both I guess?

Trying to gain some understanding, I know there might not be a sure answer to these questions but It always helps to question things..



too many factors to answer that, but types like pe are a good example of first flush mutant blobs to second flush beauty's which some believe to be consolidation related others believe to be enviromental as per franks casing PE thread


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OfflineCarlWonderful
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: cronicr]
    #19280083 - 12/15/13 04:26 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

If you consolidate PE longer will you get less mutant blobs?


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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: CarlWonderful]
    #19280099 - 12/15/13 04:30 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

The blobs on cubensis are caused by a too-nutritious substrate at fruiting time.  BRF cakes are always too nutritious unless allowed to consolidate for a sufficient time.  Cased manure or coir trays are generally much less nutritious, thus the problem of mutants is reduced.  I don't think I've ever seen them on straw.

One blob-inducing mistake I see a lot of growers make is using a too-high spawn rate.  It really doesn't make a substrate colonize much faster because once the mycelium starts growing in high gear, it's usually fully colonized in a few days.  It's that first week to ten days that's slow, and using a high spawn rate doesn't really change those dynamics much, but it does lead to mutants due to the extra nutrition of all the grains or brf, ect., which was in the spawn.
RR

thats from the thread i was talking about here
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18943955#18943955


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InvisibleMudaFuka
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: cronicr]
    #19280272 - 12/15/13 05:05 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Wouldn't a higher spawn rate leave more nutrition for later flushes


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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: MudaFuka]
    #19280277 - 12/15/13 05:07 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MudaFuka said:
Wouldn't a higher spawn rate leave more nutrition for later flushes



yep


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Invisiblestareatclouds
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: cronicr]
    #22520942 - 11/14/15 01:45 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

I don't understand why extra nutrition would lead to blobs. It hasn't processed or digested all of the extra nutes and somehow this fucks up the fruit itself? If in ideal conditions (as in, no contaminations) a sub needs full colonization to pin, why wouldn't the myc just wait until it's digested the nutrition and just pump up a baller flush?


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Invisible13shroomsM
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Re: Wait and Consolidate [Re: stareatclouds]
    #22521077 - 11/14/15 04:10 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

to me PE blobs are lack of consolidation, I dont case at all ever (sometimes on 2nd flushes) because its not needed with any cubensis strain, I just think over the years a crappy substrain of PE got passed around cus noobs print anything thats not normal and spread that shit around..  Ive never gotten blobs from PE uncut or APE or PE6 or any other PE strain besides reg PE..  I think its just something that needs work to have a better perfuming substrain of PE to go around and this blob BS can be put to the wayside.  :2cents:

although the blobs will kick your dick in the dirt, I dont get why people dont want them? 
they will :header:


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