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FunkyBuddha
Mycophile


Registered: 08/17/13
Posts: 280
Loc: Australia
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Why do conservatives exist? 2
#19273654 - 12/14/13 07:25 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Okay first off let me just define my ideas behind the words I'm going to use, feel free to correct me on them because I'm sure they're wrong based on today's standards, but I'm going by my understandings of the words. Conservative: Against change, pro-life, anti-gay marriage, no public healthcare etc Libertarian: Do what the fuck you want as long as it hurts no one else + public health care etc
So my question is the title, why do conservatives exist? All they try to do is stop other people from doing things that they want to do (apart from no public healthcare, but I have weird views on healthcare) while libertarians seem to be arguing for peoples rights to do what they want regardless of whether people agree with it or not.
Now I don't identify as either yet because I don't fully understand the scope of both sides but I'm probably a libertarian based on what I already know.
The thing that makes no sense to me is that, if you're a conservative, you and your family can live perfectly conservative and happy lives under libertarian style laws, no one is forcing you to do drugs or go to gay peoples weddings or have abortions, but if the laws are conservative, people can't live freely and the way that they want and shouldn't everyone just want as many people as possible to live the way that they want to?
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koraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha] 4
#19273658 - 12/14/13 07:27 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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In general, I think it's healthy for a population to play safe and to explore/innovate at the same time. So as a result, a successful species will have more innovative and more conservative specimens - and even both traits locked in the same individual.
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FunkyBuddha
Mycophile


Registered: 08/17/13
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: koraks] 1
#19273663 - 12/14/13 07:30 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I understand what you're saying but I don't think being anti-gay and pro-life is 'playing it safe'. In my opinion playing it safe is sticking with wheat and corn instead of re-doing the entire agricultural system for quinoa.
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Patlal
You ask too many questions



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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha] 3
#19273717 - 12/14/13 08:14 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Conservative exist to prevent the fucktards from taking over...
In all seriousness though. Most conservatives aren't really what you described. They are simply people that want to make a balanced budget and they want the gov to stay away from as many things as possible. Both ideas are very sound. A blanced budget = no debt and if the gov isn't involved in many thing than taxes a low. It's a great idea when you think about it.
What most conservatives don't understand is that the government isn't only there to govern. It's also the country's referee and it is it's duty to ensure the quality of life of its citizens. Which means, health care, schools, programs etc...
I understand the way they think too. Everything the government touches costs twice as much as if a private company did it. But there are things you can't give to the private market.
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vinsue
Grand Old Fart



Registered: 02/17/04
Posts: 17,953
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha] 1
#19273734 - 12/14/13 08:24 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
FunkyBuddha said:
Now I don't identify as either yet because I don't fully understand the scope of both sides but I'm probably a libertarian based on what I already know.
There's more than 2 sides to this coin.
you have varying degrees of conservatives and liberals, and those 'fence sitters' in the middle

Diversity

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"All mushrooms are edible; but some only once." Croatian proverb. BTW ... Have You Rated Ythans Mom Yet ?? ... ... HERE'S HOW ... (be nice) . ...
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mpd
Lammen Gorthaur



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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: vinsue] 1
#19273768 - 12/14/13 08:43 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Because someone has to be accountable and responsible for what happens with public policy. That's why we are here and everywhere. There are almost twice as many people identifying themselves as conservatives as identify themselves as liberals.
-------------------- There is no truer calling for mankind than that of true conservatism.
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MisterSandman
Neo Nazi



Registered: 03/23/13
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha] 3
#19273784 - 12/14/13 08:52 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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You're focusing on purely social issues OP, there's also the economic aspect you have to look at. I honestly agree with a good bit of conservative economics.
And it's already been said but diversity is good. You need to challenge your views on the daily, look at things from different perspectives. Circle jerks aren't exactly the most beneficial thing in the world.
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jewunit
Brutal!


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 34,264
Loc: Ohio
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha] 2
#19273827 - 12/14/13 09:07 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I don't think libertarians are for public health care.
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MisterSandman
Neo Nazi



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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: jewunit]
#19273834 - 12/14/13 09:11 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
jewunit said: I don't think libertarians are for public health care.
This^
Also libertarians are considered economically conservative, so you're question seems kinda silly OP.
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KremrBigSikter
Spränger Språnger




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Libertarians are extremely capitalist and pro-free-market. How is that economically conservative?
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jewunit
Brutal!


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 34,264
Loc: Ohio
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Libertarians and conservatives, in American politics at least, often have similar economic ideals.
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ThatKidWithTheFace
R.I.P. ZIG R.I.P. Sloth


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Quote:
KremrBigSikter said: Libertarians are extremely capitalist and pro-free-market. How is that economically conservative?
-------------------- Check Out My Beats SoundCloud
[quote]Sheekle said: [quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said: Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote] u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]
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MisterSandman
Neo Nazi



Registered: 03/23/13
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Quote:
KremrBigSikter said: Libertarians are extremely capitalist and pro-free-market. How is that economically conservative?
Ummmmmm free trade and deregulation of the economy are most certainly conservative ideas
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R



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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha]
#19273897 - 12/14/13 09:38 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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You could ask why do some people hold to things that are changing and do not want to change. Why are some people so stupid and uneducated on subjects that need a lot of attention. Change is inevitable and some people do not like/want it! The gays, guns, abortion, and ganja issues are hot topics among the general public. Some people hold true to "tradition" because they are scared of the changes that coming. They might say the breaking down of these "values/traditions" is the road to the end of society as we know it.
There are just too many points to take on with this subject in a brief few sentences. The old people and ways are dying out. It is slowly coming around to a new era of open mindedness. The old ones have trained the young ones well though. Each generation gets filtered a little more, and they hold that the old ones have is slowly being loosened by the net and the information that is available to the younger ones.
I have faith in the younger generation. I know that the changes that need to made will happen. I may not see it in my life time, but there will be a day when the people will be laughing at the things that are hot button issues now such as "gay marriage", drugs, etc... all the kids in school will be discussing how ignorant we seemed about issues that should not matter.
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koraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha]
#19273911 - 12/14/13 09:43 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
FunkyBuddha said: I understand what you're saying but I don't think being anti-gay and pro-life is 'playing it safe'. In my opinion playing it safe is sticking with wheat and corn instead of re-doing the entire agricultural system for quinoa.
Anti-gay = entire population available for procreation Pro-life = optimizing odds of the path between conception and procreation Look at it from an evolutionary perspective. It makes perfect sense.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Why would you have faith in the younger generation? The members of my generation that have been teaching them for the last several decades are failures and cowards hiding behind a false notion of tenure. Then you have the contributions of the opt out news media which is almost overwhelmingly liberal to go along with sycophantic hypocrites in the entertainment media. The younger generation has been sold a lie about what is and is not conservative by the enemy and this has engendered a complete lack of consideration of the real ramifications of encouraging and supporting those who will not work. Work is not play. The younger generation seems to be completely wrapped up in what it wants to do and doesn't much grasp the idea that there are things you have to do to survive.
This conservative doesn't think the government should be involved in either sanctioning or penalizing any marriage. That goes for the tax code especially. The only role government should have in marriage is to adjudicate its dissolution just as it does in any other contract dispute. I also believe that the nuclear family is the most effective form of social arrangement for the parties involved. The liberals are actively encouraging its dissolution through the welfare state and have been for decades. How's that working out? Drugs? Liberals want to prohibit big sodas. What drugs would you release from prohibition? This conservative would release them all. You should have the freedom to fuck yourself up and I should not be forced to help you if you do so. My sole duty should be to inform you that they may be harmful to your health. After that it is up to you. Go ahead and snort Peru. I don't give a fuck. Abortion? I have no conflict on this issue. Up to viability (which is going to continue to change) they should be permitted. That doesn't mean they should be funded by the government. There is no conflict for me because I am an atheist but every abortion supporter who professes a religious belief in the soul is a fucking hypocrite.
I don't give a fuck about open-mindedness. I give a fuck about what the government is doing to stifle freedom and control our lives. It is largely being done by liberals.
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qman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
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Quote:
MisterSandman said:
Quote:
KremrBigSikter said: Libertarians are extremely capitalist and pro-free-market. How is that economically conservative?
Ummmmmm free trade and deregulation of the economy are most certainly conservative ideas
In today's sense of conservatism, but real conservatism does not like the idea of free trade/globalization. Being conservative means keeping the status quo, and not implementing big changes without knowing the outcome. The same could be said with deregulation, true conservatives are NOT always in favor of deregulating established polices.
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setb
10th level beer nerd
Registered: 01/30/11
Posts: 2,580
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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
#19274250 - 12/14/13 11:12 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
is a fucking hypocrite.
Many American liberals have a strong authoritarian streak. They talk about "open mindedness" but they are so willing to shut up and shut down anyone that doesn't toe their line.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: setb]
#19274320 - 12/14/13 11:28 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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That's why the NY Times is screaming so much about Citizens United
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Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


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Re: Why do conservatives exist? [Re: FunkyBuddha]
#19274568 - 12/14/13 12:26 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
FunkyBuddha said: Why do conservatives exist?
because someone has to be right all of the time and it's certainly not liberals or libertarians
Quote:
The thing that makes no sense to me is that, if you're a conservative, you and your family can live perfectly conservative and happy lives under libertarian style laws, no one is forcing you to do drugs or go to gay peoples weddings or have abortions, but if the laws are conservative, people can't live freely and the way that they want and shouldn't everyone just want as many people as possible to live the way that they want to? 
see, an example of how libertarians are wrong, you listen to the media, most conservatives dont give two shits about this crap
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