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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Icelander]
    #19258902 - 12/11/13 06:42 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

SneezingPenis said:
hey don't have the time to reply to all the posts, but if i helps, I would rather Markos be in this discussion. please do not ban him, I want to hear his input on this. Replies coming in about 9 hours.




This is my reason for doubting that the OP reported him or took offense.

MtG might have a history of warnings and bans due to personalisms that were received all from one particular mod that had it in for him as far as I know, or his friends, that's not evidence without specifics :shrug:.

But back to the topic, the term "nigger" is a contemptuous term used against black / dark skinned people.  It's not a term reserved for some people with sagging pants that drive Impalas or buy 40s with penny wrappers (of which I'm sure a reasonable statistic of other races could apply).  It's a contemptuous term used against black /dark skinned people.  That's why his remark is seen as uniformly racist.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19258919 - 12/11/13 06:52 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

How do you know a mod has it in for Marko's???  Frankly for years here there basically, until recently, has been one Mod doing all the moderating.  And how do you know all his warnings and bans came from one moderator? You seem to be taking a lot of liberties based on your personal beliefs.

Again I think the bias may be yours.

I use the term nigger at times but do not mean it against black people in general but against a type of behavior exhibited by certain black people.

But you are wasting our time with this.  Even if a statement is racist you are directed to condemn the statement rather than the person.  Why is this so difficult for you to understand.  If we start calling each other names then the next step is OTD or something similar.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Icelander]
    #19258940 - 12/11/13 07:00 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I don't know, I suggested that was not evidence, for as for all I knew it could be the case.

It would be my preference that the a person would believe they had been attacked, reported it to a moderator, at which point the moderator used their discretion.  Otherwise, who is to say a name was called  or a person had been condemned?  That's a matter of discretion,  for all we know the OP could have thought "racist" was synonymous with awesome.  That was my point.  What's so difficult about that to understand?


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19258959 - 12/11/13 07:15 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

And it could be that your position is totally full of shit. The fact remains it was a personalism.  Marko's knows this or should know it from years of posting here and previous warnings.  He could have avoided all of it by wording his objections against the post rather than a specific person. It was his call and he made it.  It bit him in the ass.  So be it.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Icelander]
    #19258970 - 12/11/13 07:19 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
And it could be that your position is totally full of shit. The fact remains it was a personalism.  Marko's knows this or should know it from years of posting here and previous warnings.  He could have avoided all of it by wording his objections against the post rather than a specific person. It was his call and he made it.  It bit him in the ass.  So be it.




Are you certain? :wink: The only fact as I see it is that somebody used their discretion and decided it was a personal attack.  It seemed to me that the OP might concur that all statements about his character made by MtG were true.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19259002 - 12/11/13 07:34 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Doesn't matter if they are true or not or if he agrees that they are or not.  I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. :lol: It's a fucking personalism and against forum guidelines.  And btw moderators rarely from what I hear act on a  post unless someone flags it.  So unless you have the inside info that this moderator did it out of a personal bias on his own then all you are doing is stirring up conflict for your own entertainment.  Or you have a personal bias in favor of Marko's. (my guess:wink:)


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlineqman
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #19259029 - 12/11/13 07:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

SneezingPenis said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

SneezingPenis said:
I want to make a tv show where you find the most adamantly "unracist" person and have them take a few graveyard shifts at a 7-11 in detroit and see when and how often they put their hand on the shotgun under the cash register...




Perhaps it is not the color/race of the person that causes them to rob a 7-11, but their socioeconomic status and/or cultural mores.  Perhaps in certain regions, color/race and socioeconomic status + cultural mores are more correlated than in other regions?

Perhaps you are simplifying the situation far too much to justify your racism?




yes! i like where you are going with this.

so if someone doesn't feel safe around a person who is black, who just so happens to fit the stereotype of a felon, are they being racist, or merely cautious?

what I am saying is- how can you tell if a person is racist when there are so many other factors that are "forgivable" to react to?




Humans have something called "statistical commonsense" when assessing a situation, some people like to call this instinct "racism", but it's a basic survival skill at the end of the day, and everyone uses it.

Blacks are more likely to commit any type of violent criminal act, why should my rational thought process eliminate this useful information?


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Icelander]
    #19259061 - 12/11/13 08:07 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I've defended hTx in a thread of yours when you reported him  when you accused him of a personalism (I can dig up the posts if you'd like), and he annoys me to no end :shrug:.

If MtG had told the OP to get fucked and die in a fire, I wouldn't be in disagreement, but as far as I can tell he might just have been telling an undisputed truth (between the two parties in contention).

To me what has transpired is like a lame arbitration based court reality tv show where the two parties don't have a problem with each other that merits a judge, yet the judge wants a piece of action.



Edited: I misstated that Ice reported hTx.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


Edited by CosmicJoke (12/11/13 07:28 PM)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19259306 - 12/11/13 09:32 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I reported him?  Did I say that somewhere?  (I actually don't remember but you better be telling the truth)  So yeah lets see that thread.

Again you are assuming that Diploid is doing this for completely personal reasons.  You don't know that AT ALL and so the problem here is YOU.  You have a bias and you need to pretend you know things you don't to justify that bias in your mind. (no matter what you are claiming imo) :nono:

And if they didn't have a problem with each other why are they in court?  :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (12/11/13 10:11 AM)


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Icelander]
    #19259386 - 12/11/13 09:59 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

The south isn't racist. 

Southern Man.



--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19259655 - 12/11/13 11:17 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

The only fact as I see it is that somebody used their discretion and decided it was a personal attack.

That's because you are not privy to the back-story with Markos which includes dozens of informal warnings and 11 formal warnings and bans from five separate moderators, most recently for again calling people names which lead to a 21 day day ban recently issued by another moderator.

If not for Markos' long rap sheet of constant rule breaking he probably wouldn't have even been warned, let alone banned. The vast majority of the membership here follows the rules and Markos gets far too many slides. He knows this which is why he continues to misbehave.

BTW, he was banned for a tiny fraction of the time recommended by the automated system which takes his disciplinary history into account. Had I not overridden the system-assigned ban duration, he would not be back for a VERY long time. Fortunately for him, I'm a soft touch.

Can we please get back on-topic now? This is an interesting topic and doesn't merit being derailed by childish name calling and debate about bans. If you take issue with the ban, you can PM me or open a support ticket.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Diploid]
    #19259673 - 12/11/13 11:21 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
The person holding up the line at the convenience store scratching off lottery tickets and not moving, pants around his thighs and then buys 2 blount wraps with nickels and pennies and then hops in his 1998 maroon impala with new rims and shaking the windows with shitty bass from a shitty rap song... yeah, that is when people like me just shake their head and think "what a fuckin nigger".

I'm curious. If you see a white guy who is slurring his words at the convenience store dressed in pajamas with a scraggly beard, dirty "wife beater" shirt, and flip-flops buying a single bottle of beer and a pack of cigarettes with nickles and pennies who then hops into his 1998 rusty Celica with a broken radio and a cracked windshield and one of those tiny spare tires on the car, do you shake your head and think "fucking white trailer trash"?





No, i think that guy would probably be fun to hang out with.

but your question raises a good point... why else, other than race, would i react to those similar situations differently?
There are really only 2 ways to become racist. 1) you were indoctrinated/raised to believe that black people are scum or 2) you were conditioned to think that way via the majority of experiences you have had in dealing with black people were negative.

I am contemptuous of the black guy in scenario 1 because he fits the bill of an amalgamation of shitty experiences. I am jovial towards the white guy in scenario 2 because he doesn't fit the bill of an amalgamation of shitty experiences.
my previous exposures to people that are reflected in the demographics of the people in the 2 scenarios vary greatly, which in turn has shaped my reaction or thoughts regarding those 2 scenarios.

If every time you sat next to a fat person on a bus and it was miserable because they stank, you would try to avoid being around fat people in confined spaces as a personal rule of thumb. You might even go one further and claim that most fat people stink and it sucks having to sit next to them.

this isn't devious logic or advanced psychology here...

Like someone has said earlier, it is a survival mechanism to act a certain way based on previous experiences, why should I feel ashamed of that? if anything, black people should be mad at other black people for giving credence to racism, not shaming people by calling them racists for hesitating to turn the cheek for a 9th and 10th time.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Diploid]
    #19259696 - 12/11/13 11:33 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
The only fact as I see it is that somebody used their discretion and decided it was a personal attack.

That's because you are not privy to the back-story with Markos which includes dozens of informal warnings and 11 formal warnings and bans from five separate moderators, most recently for again calling people names which lead to a 21 day day ban recently issued by another moderator.

If not for Markos' long rap sheet of constant rule breaking he probably wouldn't have even been warned, let alone banned. The vast majority of the membership here follows the rules and Markos gets far too many slides. He knows this which is why he continues to misbehave.

BTW, he was banned for a tiny fraction of the time recommended by the automated system which takes his disciplinary history into account. Had I not overridden the system-assigned ban duration, he would not be back for a VERY long time. Fortunately for him, I'm a soft-touch.

Can we please get back on-topic now? This is an interesting topic and doesn't merit being derailed by childish name calling and debate about bans. If you take issue with the ban, you can PM me or open a support ticket.






Considering how I'm viewed by a lot of folk at the shroomery I should have such an impressive rap sheet. But I don't even come close. :hissyfit:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19259751 - 12/11/13 11:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

CosmicJoke said:


But back to the topic, the term "nigger" is a contemptuous term used against black / dark skinned people.  It's not a term reserved for some people with sagging pants that drive Impalas or buy 40s with penny wrappers (of which I'm sure a reasonable statistic of other races could apply).  It's a contemptuous term used against black /dark skinned people.  That's why his remark is seen as uniformly racist.




I was recently banned from a forum for using the word "niggardly". that word has zero etymological ties to the word "nigger". Even though this was made abundantly clear and even accepted as fact by the moderators, I was banned because it upset a black person.

nigger is a very interesting word IMO. There are a slew of other racial epithets and contemptuous terms, but the word nigger is like Schedule 1, or defcon 5, while all the others are just varying degrees of "bad". It goes so far as to somehow justify violence. I would like to take a poll and see how many people think it is ok for someone to get punched for calling a black person a nigger. I am willing to bet that an overwhelming majority of people would say that physical violence is a justifiable act in the face of being called a name. I would also bet that no other word would illicit half as many votes for "yes" even though they would mean the exact same thing. Kike? cunt? bitch? faggot? wetback? beaner? slope?
how about even non racial slurs? Fuck you? suck my dick? asshole? shithead? retard? mungo?

how does a word like "nigger" break records and sit alone at the top in its own category for defaming, cruelty, and insensitivity? how has that word become so incredibly powerful?
words only have the power that you give them, and black people (and the majority of americans for that matter) have the most visceral response to that word.
MtG might have been onto something: maybe it is primal and basal when we instinctually retaliate with the first thing that comes to our mind that can cut and do the most damage. I doubt there is a person out there who has been cut off by a back person in traffic and didn't think or mutter "fuckin nigger".

we have even incorporated it into our laws. if you stab a black person and don't say anything, you just get plain old murder 2. if you stab a black person and say "nigger" you get a much worse sentence under hate crime laws.
how much sense does that make?


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #19259769 - 12/11/13 11:55 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

would you call someone a homophobe for using the word "faggot"?
would you call someone a racist for using the word "cracker" or "white trash"?
would you call someone a nymphomaniac/satyriasis for using the word "fuck"?
would you call someone a coprophiliac for using the word "shit"?

why is using the word "nigger" the only word that unconditionally justifies someone being called/labelled a racist?


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #19259900 - 12/11/13 12:26 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

It's because the niggers don't like it.  I'm kidding!  Sort of.  Really though, Oprah fucking whatever she is big money celebrity, recently claimed people didn't like Obama because he is black.  Not because he is only half black.  I mean, since when did half black become black?  His mom was white.  But he could never be half white.

And now, the Redskins should change their name.  It's a football team.  Cmon'.

Well hell Cher is one fine squaw.  I'd ride her.



--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: Diploid]
    #19260007 - 12/11/13 12:47 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
The only fact as I see it is that somebody used their discretion and decided it was a personal attack.

That's because you are not privy to the back-story with Markos which includes dozens of informal warnings and 11 formal warnings and bans from five separate moderators, most recently for again calling people names which lead to a 21 day day ban recently issued by another moderator.

If not for Markos' long rap sheet of constant rule breaking he probably wouldn't have even been warned, let alone banned. The vast majority of the membership here follows the rules and Markos gets far too many slides. He knows this which is why he continues to misbehave.

BTW, he was banned for a tiny fraction of the time recommended by the automated system which takes his disciplinary history into account. Had I not overridden the system-assigned ban duration, he would not be back for a VERY long time. Fortunately for him, I'm a soft-touch.

Can we please get back on-topic now? This is an interesting topic and doesn't merit being derailed by childish name calling and debate about bans. If you take issue with the ban, you can PM me or open a support ticket.





How do I open up a support ticket, officer?

Ha ha.  Kidding, of course.  You've been mostly quiet lately, are you doing OK?

Honestly a little worried about you when you get too quiet like this.

South's Gonna Do It Again.



--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #19260122 - 12/11/13 01:15 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

the derisive videos actually bring up a point.



that is david allen coe's x-rated album. mostly just gross songs about fingerbanging and rim jobs, but it has a liberal use of the word nigger in it.

still to this day he gets a lot of flack for it, but his drummer is black and he doesn't seem to mind playing the songs.

if rappers can use it, why is it not "art" to some degree when he uses it? at the very least, it is funny as shit because he kind of makes fun of himself the entire time.

thoughts?


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #19260867 - 12/11/13 03:31 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

SneezingPenis said:
Quote:

CosmicJoke said:


But back to the topic, the term "nigger" is a contemptuous term used against black / dark skinned people.  It's not a term reserved for some people with sagging pants that drive Impalas or buy 40s with penny wrappers (of which I'm sure a reasonable statistic of other races could apply).  It's a contemptuous term used against black /dark skinned people.  That's why his remark is seen as uniformly racist.




I was recently banned from a forum for using the word "niggardly". that word has zero etymological ties to the word "nigger". Even though this was made abundantly clear and even accepted as fact by the moderators, I was banned because it upset a black person.

nigger is a very interesting word IMO. There are a slew of other racial epithets and contemptuous terms, but the word nigger is like Schedule 1, or defcon 5, while all the others are just varying degrees of "bad". It goes so far as to somehow justify violence. I would like to take a poll and see how many people think it is ok for someone to get punched for calling a black person a nigger. I am willing to bet that an overwhelming majority of people would say that physical violence is a justifiable act in the face of being called a name. I would also bet that no other word would illicit half as many votes for "yes" even though they would mean the exact same thing. Kike? cunt? bitch? faggot? wetback? beaner? slope?
how about even non racial slurs? Fuck you? suck my dick? asshole? shithead? retard? mungo?

how does a word like "nigger" break records and sit alone at the top in its own category for defaming, cruelty, and insensitivity? how has that word become so incredibly powerful?
words only have the power that you give them, and black people (and the majority of americans for that matter) have the most visceral response to that word.
MtG might have been onto something: maybe it is primal and basal when we instinctually retaliate with the first thing that comes to our mind that can cut and do the most damage. I doubt there is a person out there who has been cut off by a back person in traffic and didn't think or mutter "fuckin nigger".

we have even incorporated it into our laws. if you stab a black person and don't say anything, you just get plain old murder 2. if you stab a black person and say "nigger" you get a much worse sentence under hate crime laws.
how much sense does that make?





Oh, perhaps the fact that the word was used disparagingly against a race of people, while they were unjustly enslaved in the United States for a good 250 years, and had to fight for every civil liberty they presently have,  gives it some great power.  As far as hate crime laws in the United States go, I'm pretty sure they began with the purpose of targeting racially motivated crimes committed by the KKK, and their intent today is to prevent bias related crimes against any social group of people.  If a gay couple is walking across a bridge and are attacked and beaten while being called homophobic slurs, it's probably safe to assume they were targeted because they were gay.  Now all gay people in that city feel less safe walking the street, because it wasn't just anyone who was targeted, it was specifically gay people.  You're honestly arguing against hate crimes now? :braindamage:  (don't take that personally, I would never call you brain damaged after all :rolleyes:)

Edit:

Quote:

Quote:

SneezingPenis said:
would you call someone a homophobe for using the word "faggot"?
would you call someone a racist for using the word "cracker" or "white trash"?
would you call someone a nymphomaniac/satyriasis for using the word "fuck"?
would you call someone a coprophiliac for using the word "shit"?

why is using the word "nigger" the only word that unconditionally justifies someone being called/labelled a racist?








Yes, yes, no, no.  Got anymore questions? Keep em comin'.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


Edited by CosmicJoke (12/11/13 03:42 PM)


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InvisibleJuicin
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Re: have you ever wondered why the south is racist? [Re: CosmicJoke] * 1
    #19260937 - 12/11/13 03:44 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

You honestly think it's that cut and dry?

A crime is a crime, your motivation should not be used to increase penalties arbitrarily. Even if I were to scream "I hate fags" out loud as I committed a crime against a homosexual. How could anyone possibly know the real motivation for my actions?


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