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Offlinewestthebest
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bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions
    #19251357 - 12/09/13 05:29 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

well, planning to spawn some shredded brf cakes to coir/verm tomorrow as a little experiment, and I had a few questions regarding the process...

-I was going to do it very small scale, 2 half-pint brf jars to a quart of coir/verm.  unfortunately, the container I have will only be filled to a 2.5-3" substrate depth.  will this size/depth work?

-after colonization is complete, should I take the block out and fruit it on a piece of foil like a normal cake, or should I leave it in the tupperware, take the lid off, and place the whole container in my SGFC?  if fruiting in the container, do I still mist and fan as often as I would for cakes?

-if I fruit it as a block, should I dunk before first/each flush?  if so, for how long?


was thinking about using my last 2 quart spawn bag of rye to make 2 small trays for the SGFC as well (instead of one mini-mono), would probably be 1 quart rye spawn to 2 quarts coir/verm.  would any of these answers be different for rye grains?  I guess you wouldn't need a dunk since you could rehydrate the grains before you spawned...


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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19251387 - 12/09/13 05:34 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

westthebest said:
well, planning to spawn some shredded brf cakes to coir/verm tomorrow as a little experiment, and I had a few questions regarding the process...

-I was going to do it very small scale, 2 half-pint brf jars to a quart of coir/verm.  unfortunately, the container I have will only be filled to a 2.5-3" substrate depth.  will this size/depth work?



Absolutely.

Quote:

westthebest said:
-after colonization is complete, should I take the block out and fruit it on a piece of foil like a normal cake, or should I leave it in the tupperware, take the lid off, and place the whole container in my SGFC?



This is all personal preference....do you want to fruit 5 sides or just 1?

There might not be a noticeable yield increase either way, but one way gives you a ton more surface area for pinning.

Quote:

westthebest said:
if fruiting in the container, do I still mist and fan as often as I would for cakes?



Yes, anything in a SGFC should get misted/fanned at least 2 times daily.

Quote:

westthebest said:
-if I fruit it as a block, should I dunk before first/each flush?  if so, for how long?



No...bulk does not need to be dunked before the first flush.

Quote:

westthebest said:
was thinking about using my last 2 quart spawn bag of rye to make 2 small trays for the SGFC as well (instead of one mini-mono), would probably be 1 quart rye spawn to 2 quarts coir/verm.  would any of these answers be different for rye grains?



No.


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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19251401 - 12/09/13 05:36 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

westthebest said:
well, planning to spawn some shredded brf cakes to coir/verm tomorrow as a little experiment, and I had a few questions regarding the process...

-I was going to do it very small scale, 2 half-pint brf jars to a quart of coir/verm.  unfortunately, the container I have will only be filled to a 2.5-3" substrate depth.  will this size/depth work?


  Yes, absolutely.

Quote:

westthebest said:-after colonization is complete, should I take the block out and fruit it on a piece of foil like a normal cake, or should I leave it in the tupperware, take the lid off, and place the whole container in my SGFC?  if fruiting in the container, do I still mist and fan as often as I would for cakes?


  Leave it in the tray and shove that whole thing into the SGFC.  Yes, fan as often as with cakes and mist it if it isn't glistening with moisture.

Quote:

westthebest said:-if I fruit it as a block, should I dunk before first/each flush?  if so, for how long?


  Not before the first flush, but you may find it beneficial afterward depending on the dryness of your substrate.


Quote:

westthebest said:was thinking about using my last 2 quart spawn bag of rye to make 2 small trays for the SGFC as well (instead of one mini-mono), would probably be 1 quart rye spawn to 2 quarts coir/verm.  would any of these answers be different for rye grains?  I guess you wouldn't need a dunk since you could rehydrate the grains before you spawned...


  I would recommend going with a mini-mono, personally.  They've been kind to me.


--------------------
Agar - what, why and how?  Everything a beginner needs to know.
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Bored?  Please take one of my experiments off my hands.


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Offlinewestthebest
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: Psilicon]
    #19251761 - 12/09/13 06:34 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

thanks for the quick and thourough responses guys.

Quote:

van der griegen said:
Leave it in the tray and shove that whole thing into the SGFC.  Yes, fan as often as with cakes and mist it if it isn't glistening with moisture.





any particular reason?  I like the tray idea, but I know with monos you need a trash bag liner to shrink with the substrate, will I get smushed side pins if I leave it in the tray?  also was curious if it made a difference with moisture content, as I imagine a tray would hold in a lot more water, but maybe not.

and to the mini-mono thing, I've got two going right now, one I just fruited but one that was fruited a bit ago and still haven't seen pins.  seeing as I have yet to fully succeed with monos, and I have succeeded with my SGFC, I figured it might be a little safer to split up the last bag and put it in an FC that I know I have dialed in.  still thinking about it though.


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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19251845 - 12/09/13 06:45 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I like leaving them in the tray because I live in a dry climate and I like having a container for me to lift everything out of the SGFC when I need to attend to the perlite, and because on occasion I bottom water for the same reason.

Smushed side pins are mainly an issue with large bulk grows (mini-monos and above), because you can deal with them much more easily if your substrate weighs a couple of pounds.  And anyway, nobody said you couldn't line your trays, right?  Mycelium will eat right through aluminum, if that's what you were thinking of using.

If you have colonized BRF cakes to spawn to trays, I'd just toss the grain in the fridge and then wait until you see what happens with your other grows.  But that's just me.  How long has your mini-mono been in fruiting?


--------------------
Agar - what, why and how?  Everything a beginner needs to know.
Oat Prep Tek
Bored?  Please take one of my experiments off my hands.


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Offlinewestthebest
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: Psilicon]
    #19256958 - 12/10/13 06:47 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

van der griegen said:
I like leaving them in the tray because I live in a dry climate and I like having a container for me to lift everything out of the SGFC when I need to attend to the perlite, and because on occasion I bottom water for the same reason.

Smushed side pins are mainly an issue with large bulk grows (mini-monos and above), because you can deal with them much more easily if your substrate weighs a couple of pounds.  And anyway, nobody said you couldn't line your trays, right?  Mycelium will eat right through aluminum, if that's what you were thinking of using.

If you have colonized BRF cakes to spawn to trays, I'd just toss the grain in the fridge and then wait until you see what happens with your other grows.  But that's just me.  How long has your mini-mono been in fruiting?




so no dunk, but how about roll? 

and about a week I guess, which isn't that long, but I left it to consolidate for quite a long time on top of that...  I'm also a little worried because I can't seem to dial them in like most people say.  not running a fan because the room is shared with the SGFC, and even with poly as tight as I can get it in the bottom holes and tighter than some suggest in the top, the condensation dried out within the first day, and since then I've had to mist once a day usually to keep the walls wet, as all the walls but one or occasionally two are often dry within 24 hours...  I'm only using a 20qt tub, so maybe my holes are too big?  They're 1 1/4", although I'm sure some of them are closer to 1 1/2 because I certainly didn't use the most precise way of cutting the holes...


Edited by westthebest (12/10/13 06:49 PM)


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Offlinewestthebest
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19266960 - 12/12/13 05:47 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

bump


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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19266993 - 12/12/13 05:53 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

you can dunk your cakes before spawning no problem(if thats where you were going with that)
as for your mono those holes should be fine, you can just loosen up the top holes as much as possible seeing as you have no fan running in the room


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Offlinewestthebest
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: cronicr]
    #19267071 - 12/12/13 06:11 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

cronicr said:
you can dunk your cakes before spawning no problem(if thats where you were going with that)
as for your mono those holes should be fine, you can just loosen up the top holes as much as possible seeing as you have no fan running in the room



ah, is it necessary to dunk before spawning?  already spawned two brf cakes last night...


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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19267089 - 12/12/13 06:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

no it's no neccesary


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Offlinewestthebest
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: cronicr]
    #19267335 - 12/12/13 07:05 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

cronicr said:
no it's no neccesary



cool, would the block benefit from a roll in verm before it went into the SGFC?  assuming I take it out of the container.

and I loosened the polyfill per shroomery recommendations.  should I be worried that all my walls are drying up every day or two?  I've been misting/fanning when they do


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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19267363 - 12/12/13 07:09 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

yep a roll will do the trick


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OfflineValyr
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: cronicr]
    #19267449 - 12/12/13 07:22 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Rolling the blocks in verm aint gonna hurt anything. Though if working with a cube its said that it isnt neccessary. I would though especially in a sgfc cause vermiculite makes it easy to see when they need moisture due to the color change.

Asfar as a dunk goes, yes on brf cakes since generally they arent feild capacity when made anyways and no on blocks (for the first flush) since bulk sub is braught to field capacity when made and that should be more than enough water for a first wave.

Sounds too me like your area is quite dry. Walls shouldnt dry out like that I dont think. This would be another benefit to a vermiculite roll or atleast casing layer.


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Offlinewestthebest
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: Valyr]
    #19267792 - 12/12/13 08:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Valyr said:
Rolling the blocks in verm aint gonna hurt anything. Though if working with a cube its said that it isnt neccessary. I would though especially in a sgfc cause vermiculite makes it easy to see when they need moisture due to the color change.

Asfar as a dunk goes, yes on brf cakes since generally they arent feild capacity when made anyways and no on blocks (for the first flush) since bulk sub is braught to field capacity when made and that should be more than enough water for a first wave.

Sounds too me like your area is quite dry. Walls shouldnt dry out like that I dont think. This would be another benefit to a vermiculite roll or atleast casing layer.




sounds good.  are you saying you would still dunk the cakes even if you were going to spawn them to bulk?  I'll have to try that next time.  and RH in my grow room goes as low as 30% and as high as 44%.  so pretty dry.  should I mist more or anything like that?


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OfflineValyr
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Re: bulk trays to SGFC, a few questions [Re: westthebest]
    #19269743 - 12/13/13 08:17 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Do you mean would I dunk them even if I were going to crumble them up and use as spawn to a bulk substrate? Answer is yes.

I would pretty much always dunk brf cakes cause there very dry when there made. Also FrankHorrigan has done a study and found that dunking fully colonized grains before adding as spawn to bulk also works to add a faster colonization time and meatier first flush. Same principals and reasoning i think would apply to the brf cakes, even more so :smile:.

Yes you need to mist as much as it takes to keep them wet, however... Id be carefull on this and also id use a verm casing layer and spray that instead of the walls. This will give you the easy visual detection of when you need to remoisten (the verm looks very different between dry and wet) remoisten and will also avoid the pooling that condensation and side spraying can cause.

Excessive condensation is bad. Thats why we stay away from heat pads till you know what your doing atleast. It can gather on walls and run down the sides pooling on the underside of the substrate, and tends to gather in the center of your lid aswell and drip down causing a over wet center aswell as the repeated thumping from the water dripping down.

I am just a newb though so all of this is really just repeated advice that was given to me. Been havin some trouble makin the switch to bulk myself. Hope it all helps :smile:


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