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OfflineLittleDaddy
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The Earth's Conscious
    #19249874 - 12/09/13 12:22 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

So after a dose of mescaline I was thinking about the planet and how interesting the stages of life are. It's crazy to think what might have drove molecules to become attracted to each other to form RNA/DNA and amino acids. I find that profound in its own right. Maybe since there are moles upon moles upon moles of atoms on the planet it isn't that unlikely, but what process made them form the intricate structure of a helix/double helix?

But what if it was our planet's way of stabilizing/protecting itself? What if the planet somehow knew what it was doing and manifested consciousness into these complex molecular arrangements? What if we are the consciousness of our planet?

I don't know if I believe it, but it certainly makes me want to appreciate this world more.


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The hotter the battle, the sweeter Jah victory.
Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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InvisibleK1ngSp4de
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19250056 - 12/09/13 01:05 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Even more interesting is that almost 100% of life on earth uses the L- isomer of amino acids when the D- isomer is just as available and useful for the same life purpose.

I don't see why the earth would need to create consciousness. Actually, I think it would be much better off without conscious beings.


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                                    PC Repair and Troubleshooting Forum

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                    Si peccasse negamus fallimur et nulla est in nobis veritas.


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OfflineLittleDaddy
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: K1ngSp4de]
    #19250129 - 12/09/13 01:24 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
Even more interesting is that almost 100% of life on earth uses the L- isomer of amino acids when the D- isomer is just as available and useful for the same life purpose.

I don't see why the earth would need to create consciousness. Actually, I think it would be much better off without conscious beings.




Maybe I'll get to that in my bio 212 class.

I see what you're saying and this is why I don't agree with the revelation, but I think that we may start benefiting the planet in the future. Things are taking a turn for the better - slowly but surely.


--------------------
The hotter the battle, the sweeter Jah victory.
Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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Offlineabsols
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19250132 - 12/09/13 01:25 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

constant in concept is the reason of superiority or the way .. that is how objective matters a lot in terms of superiority ..
what is constant is real physically, what is real is relating different constant value of being then reality of plural beings fact, what is common cannot be of any being there, why superiority is the answer then to conceive a relation which reality share would be a reality of each still constant being with that superior point up concept, that would become more the present constant and less still, while what is not common share with that present become less constant and more free... so it is always like that, and it is true .. that is how truth is first before existence, all is hundred percent completely known while nothing moving, or what is moving is less known then what is still not aware of being clear

then existence is freedom value from constancy end .. that is how plural freedom exist .. and freedom is always a superior point in concept of being ..

but that is why too we say, where are truth rights of being existing first ?? because freedom is not only out of constancy end fact,  something totally new, or add to truth of the place known well.. but freedom or existence is also the constant beings ends .. so it is the right of what is already there constant thing the right of true superiority.. like it doesn't seem right, that you run to have fun everywhere as having nothing to do because all is done already .. when what contribute for the end free fact  by being still right must stay without being free happy too ...

you don't think of those things but it is all known from ways before .. I mean it looks like it is meant that you cannot care about those stuffs because it is all and any from ever to always more the only matter source.. the ethics of being of seeing of meaning the ethics of present in making something else rights.. all and any out of truth values..

when truth is based on the best concepts possible, like superiority and being free .. then any and all is abstract ethics ways

how everyone seem the opposite especially gods ?? that is why I say it must be meant to throw in garbage all what cant make anything right

but then we are included in that garbage.. it is sad to be now and disgusting..


Edited by absols (12/09/13 01:50 PM)


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OfflineSpace Elf
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19250148 - 12/09/13 01:27 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I think the entire Universe is conscious. It's what I call God. In Hinduism, It's known as Brahman.

Quote:

In Hinduism, Brahman (ब्रह्मन् brahman) is "the unchanging reality amidst and beyond the world", which "cannot be exactly defined". It has been described in Sanskrit as Sat-cit-ānanda (being-consciousness-bliss) and as the highest reality.

According to Advaita, a liberated human being (jivanmukta) has realised Brahman as his or her own True Self.





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Offlineabsols
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: Space Elf]
    #19250304 - 12/09/13 02:03 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Space Elf said:
I think the entire Universe is conscious. It's what I call God. In Hinduism, It's known as Brahman.

this is a lie.. it is impossible what is constant is not conscious only freedom is conscious because freedom exist in concept, so actualizing a relative free sense is conscious realizations of else rights ..

that is how what is still is abused like a thing inferiority that can be possessed

the universe is still reality so never conscious realizations

being objective is not being an object thing

being objective is free else right realizations, which always end with free positive add sense while the object stay still the same, even if more surrounded by plural else freedoms or free wills

that is how the universe will die one day for sure.. but freedom will always exist it is the existing true matter


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OfflineSpace Elf
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: absols]
    #19250339 - 12/09/13 02:09 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

It's a lie? When I said "I think," I was lying? I really don't think that? What do I think?


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Invisiblelessismore
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: Space Elf]
    #19250461 - 12/09/13 02:38 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

try listening to Pink Floyd :-)

they might have the answer :wink:


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19251058 - 12/09/13 04:27 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Interesting, thought-provoking OP.

I'm really intrigued about the apparent complexity of the universe.  I mean...  why is it that complex?  Or... is it really very simple but my complicated brain is misreading it as "complicated"?

What purpose is served in nature by life possessing the (apparently) super-complicated chemical/molecular structure it has? 

(A free trip to Bermuda to anyone who provides definitive answers to the above.)


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OfflineLittleDaddy
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: all this beauty]
    #19251250 - 12/09/13 05:07 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Interesting, thought-provoking OP.

I'm really intrigued about the apparent complexity of the universe.  I mean...  why is it that complex?  Or... is it really very simple but my complicated brain is misreading it as "complicated"?

What purpose is served in nature by life possessing the (apparently) super-complicated chemical/molecular structure it has? 

(A free trip to Bermuda to anyone who provides definitive answers to the above.)




I find that complexity is irrelevant to nature.

It's incredible how things work the way they do because of these chemical structures. What's I find even more astounding is that consciousness can manifest itself in these chemical structures.

\I think consciousness is kind of like the lifestream in Final Fantasy 7 if you will haha. I think the nonphysical universe is composed of consciousness and that is what dictates the physical realm. That maybe this collection of consciousness is God and that God is therefore all of us when we become enlightened.

As for the purpose.. I don't know. Maybe to compose a universe of complete good.


--------------------
The hotter the battle, the sweeter Jah victory.
Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19251647 - 12/09/13 06:16 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

LittleDaddy said:
As for the purpose.. I don't know. Maybe to compose a universe of complete good.



Seems that way to me, too.

Detecting "benevolence" in the universe is a no-no among some thinkers in this department, you know.  I've been threatened with banishment from certain Daoist internet forums for even suggesting that the way of things (the Dao) is biased in the direction of benevolence.  The "Unbiased, Neutral, Impartial, and Essentially-Uncaring Universe" is a sort of basic tenet of faith for some Eastern metaphysicians.

Well...  fuck that, I say. 

I have no interest in living in that kind of universe.  :wink:


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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: all this beauty]
    #19251667 - 12/09/13 06:19 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

LittleDaddy said:
As for the purpose.. I don't know. Maybe to compose a universe of complete good.



Seems that way to me, too.

Detecting "benevolence" in the universe is a no-no among some thinkers in this department, you know.  I've been threatened with banishment from certain Daoist internet forums for even suggesting that the way of things (the Dao) is biased in the direction of benevolence.  The "Unbiased, Neutral, Impartial, and Essentially-Uncaring Universe" is a sort of basic tenet of faith for some Eastern metaphysicians.

Well...  fuck that, I say. 

I have no interest in living in that kind of universe.  :wink:




Why do you think the Universe is biased towards benevolence?

Both benevolence and malevolence are just concepts that we, as humans, apply onto an uncaring world IMO.


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: deCypher]
    #19251833 - 12/09/13 06:43 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Why do you think the Universe is biased towards benevolence?

Both benevolence and malevolence are just concepts that we, as humans, apply onto an uncaring world IMO.



A valid perspective.  As a matter of fact, if you visit any of the Daoist internet forums out there, you'll find that that's the prevailing perspective.

It doesn't resonate with me, however.  It doesn't sing to my heart.

The game, as I see it, is rigged in the direction of benevolence.  Everything that occurs is rigged in the direction of benevolence.

My sufferings define and give shape to my joys.  Without the former, I would not know the latter.

The sufferings of the world define and give shape to the joys of the world.  You know the immense pleasure of being loving and charitable only because there is misery and suffering in the world.  Without the one, you would not know the other.

You withhold water from a plant, and it wilts.  But your natural inclination, your natural "bias," is to not withhold water.  Your natural bias is in the direction of benevolence.

This is not to diminish the horrors of the world.  They are many and they are real. 

But still, I think, there is this bias toward benevolence.


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OfflineLittleDaddy
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: all this beauty]
    #19252118 - 12/09/13 07:40 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

Why do you think the Universe is biased towards benevolence?

Both benevolence and malevolence are just concepts that we, as humans, apply onto an uncaring world IMO.



A valid perspective.  As a matter of fact, if you visit any of the Daoist internet forums out there, you'll find that that's the prevailing perspective.

It doesn't resonate with me, however.  It doesn't sing to my heart.

The game, as I see it, is rigged in the direction of benevolence.  Everything that occurs is rigged in the direction of benevolence.

My sufferings define and give shape to my joys.  Without the former, I would not know the latter.

The sufferings of the world define and give shape to the joys of the world.  You know the immense pleasure of being loving and charitable only because there is misery and suffering in the world.  Without the one, you would not know the other.

You withhold water from a plant, and it wilts.  But your natural inclination, your natural "bias," is to not withhold water.  Your natural bias is in the direction of benevolence.

This is not to diminish the horrors of the world.  They are many and they are real. 

But still, I think, there is this bias toward benevolence.




Maybe that is the task of life, then - to suffer and to realize how to prosper in spite of it. Then to take the happiness you have gained into your consciousness that is not bound to the body.

That may not be a good way of saying it... maybe to suffer until one realizes true happiness through compassion and wisdom.


--------------------
The hotter the battle, the sweeter Jah victory.
Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19252231 - 12/09/13 08:00 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

LittleDaddy said:
Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
Even more interesting is that almost 100% of life on earth uses the L- isomer of amino acids when the D- isomer is just as available and useful for the same life purpose.

I don't see why the earth would need to create consciousness. Actually, I think it would be much better off without conscious beings.




Maybe I'll get to that in my bio 212 class.

I see what you're saying and this is why I don't agree with the revelation, but I think that we may start benefiting the planet in the future. Things are taking a turn for the better - slowly but surely.





I think you are totally wrong and things are getting really bad due to the sum total human actions.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: all this beauty]
    #19252278 - 12/09/13 08:08 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

Why do you think the Universe is biased towards benevolence?

Both benevolence and malevolence are just concepts that we, as humans, apply onto an uncaring world IMO.



It doesn't resonate with me, however.  It doesn't sing to my heart.




Possibly, but I've always been in favor of searching for the truth, no matter how unpleasant it may be or how much it rubs me the wrong way.  :shrug:

Quote:

all this beauty said:
The game, as I see it, is rigged in the direction of benevolence.  Everything that occurs is rigged in the direction of benevolence.




What do you mean by 'rigged in the direction of benevolence' here?  Everything that occurs inevitably does so for the greater good of all?

Quote:

all this beauty said:
My sufferings define and give shape to my joys.  Without the former, I would not know the latter.

The sufferings of the world define and give shape to the joys of the world.  You know the immense pleasure of being loving and charitable only because there is misery and suffering in the world.  Without the one, you would not know the other.




Sure, but so do too the joys of the world define and give shape to its sufferings.  We only know the horrible agony of suffering and pain when contrasted with our previous state of happiness.  Basically, both sides of the coin define and support each other; this doesn't necessarily mean the coin is weighted.  :lol:

Quote:

all this beauty said:
You withhold water from a plant, and it wilts.  But your natural inclination, your natural "bias," is to not withhold water.  Your natural bias is in the direction of benevolence.




Whose natural bias?  Mine personally?  That of every human being?  Plenty of people out there have the natural inclination to rip the plant from the ground and shred it to bits just because they can.  Maybe the majority of humanity tilts in favor of benevolence, but I doubt it.  At any rate not every human shares this supposed natural bias.  :shrug2:

Quote:

all this beauty said:
This is not to diminish the horrors of the world.  They are many and they are real. 

But still, I think, there is this bias toward benevolence.




I'd like to believe there is.  But sadly I just don't think anything innately exists in the physical fabric of the Universe that gives a damn about us.

All life is suffering.
--the Buddha


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


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OfflineLittleDaddy
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: Icelander]
    #19252299 - 12/09/13 08:11 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Quote:

LittleDaddy said:
Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
Even more interesting is that almost 100% of life on earth uses the L- isomer of amino acids when the D- isomer is just as available and useful for the same life purpose.

I don't see why the earth would need to create consciousness. Actually, I think it would be much better off without conscious beings.




Maybe I'll get to that in my bio 212 class.

I see what you're saying and this is why I don't agree with the revelation, but I think that we may start benefiting the planet in the future. Things are taking a turn for the better - slowly but surely.





I think you are totally wrong and things are getting really bad due to the sum total human actions.




Not just wrong, but totally wrong.

That's why the US forest size is increasing, carbon emissions are decreasing, and global warming is in headlines everywhere and everyone is at least aware of it. Once we run out of the fossil fuel supplies then it'll force carbon emissions to decrease.


--------------------
The hotter the battle, the sweeter Jah victory.
Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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Invisiblelessismore
Registered: 02/10/13
Posts: 6,268
Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: all this beauty]
    #19253786 - 12/10/13 02:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Interesting, thought-provoking OP.

I'm really intrigued about the apparent complexity of the universe.  I mean...  why is it that complex?  Or... is it really very simple but my complicated brain is misreading it as "complicated"?

What purpose is served in nature by life possessing the (apparently) super-complicated chemical/molecular structure it has? 

(A free trip to Bermuda to anyone who provides definitive answers to the above.)




To a child a cat is a natural thing, to a physicist a cat is an enormously complicated system

I like my cats real ;-)

just observe and enjoy ;P

sometimes thoughts can add too much abstraction
figuring it all out will never happen, before that is possible we would need to know ourselves fully
but that isnt possible either it seems, as soon as you put thoughts on the state you are off the state
and even if we had a theory of everything, we would need to empirically prove it :-P
which is not going to happen, we would have to test -it all-

science is about making predictions and testing those predictions
so we will probably never get a theory of everything, we cant know everything and verify everything

any insect, animal or plant can surprise me
try studying ants, or animals by observing them, same with plants in nature

I like to notice that we still only know 5% of the known universe (check nasa graphs)
the rest is dark energy/dark matter = no good idea what it is


Edited by lessismore (12/10/13 02:54 AM)


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OfflineLittleDaddy
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: lessismore]
    #19254166 - 12/10/13 07:13 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

figuring it all out will never happen, before that is possible we would need to know ourselves fully
but that isnt possible either it seems, as soon as you put thoughts on the state you are off the state




Well, if one realizes "emptiness" and rids the false perspective they have of a constantly fluctuating "self" then one can fully understand.


--------------------
The hotter the battle, the sweeter Jah victory.
Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: The Earth's Conscious [Re: deCypher]
    #19254345 - 12/10/13 08:34 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
The game, as I see it, is rigged in the direction of benevolence.  Everything that occurs is rigged in the direction of benevolence.




What do you mean by 'rigged in the direction of benevolence' here?  Everything that occurs inevitably does so for the greater good of all?



Something like that.

No "accidents."  No "randomness."  The "direction" is always towards the greater good.  Toward beneficence.

It happens at a snail's pace.  So slowly, I think, that we misread the way things work (the Dao) as neutral, uncaring, impartial.

Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
My sufferings define and give shape to my joys.  Without the former, I would not know the latter.

The sufferings of the world define and give shape to the joys of the world.  You know the immense pleasure of being loving and charitable only because there is misery and suffering in the world.  Without the one, you would not know the other.




Sure, but so do too the joys of the world define and give shape to its sufferings.  We only know the horrible agony of suffering and pain when contrasted with our previous state of happiness.  Basically, both sides of the coin define and support each other; this doesn't necessarily mean the coin is weighted.  :lol:



I think the coin is weighted.  This makes me a terrible Daoist, I know.  And probably a lousy Buddhist. 

I'm not a theist, though -- so I wouldn't / couldn't even begin to guess how or why the coin is weighted as it is.

Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
You withhold water from a plant, and it wilts.  But your natural inclination, your natural "bias," is to not withhold water.  Your natural bias is in the direction of benevolence.




Whose natural bias?  Mine personally?  That of every human being?  Plenty of people out there have the natural inclination to rip the plant from the ground and shred it to bits just because they can.  Maybe the majority of humanity tilts in favor of benevolence, but I doubt it.  At any rate not every human shares this supposed natural bias.  :shrug2:



I think the natural human tendency is to do what is most useful and sustaining. 

As we age, our brains, our consciousnesses, whatever, take on bad habits -- and we make bad judgments. 

If I mug you in the street, I'm making a terrible, terrible mistake in judgment.  I'm much better off in the world having you as friend rather than enemy.  My natural human tendency is to treat you with respect and kindness because that's the optimal behavior for me as a human being.

When we act in a natural, uncontrived way (Philosophical Daoists refer to this as the "uncarved block"), we naturally do what is most optimal.  We treat each other and the environment with honor and respect.


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