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OfflinePsilicon
Really Nice Guy


Registered: 08/26/12
Posts: 7,057
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19234233 - 12/05/13 10:13 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

They should have shown some growth by now.  How are they looking?


--------------------
Agar - what, why and how?  Everything a beginner needs to know.
Oat Prep Tek
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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Psilicon]
    #19234307 - 12/05/13 10:30 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I disposed them after three days. They had a bad smell on them.


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OfflinePsilicon
Really Nice Guy


Registered: 08/26/12
Posts: 7,057
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19234325 - 12/05/13 10:35 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

:hugitout:


--------------------
Agar - what, why and how?  Everything a beginner needs to know.
Oat Prep Tek
Bored?  Please take one of my experiments off my hands.


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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
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Re: My jars stalled [Re: Psilicon]
    #19234342 - 12/05/13 10:40 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Yup. It's a damn shame.:frown:
I got a PC for further attempts. It might make things better.
:smile:


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OfflineKnownPown
Fathead Shroomer
Male

Registered: 10/27/12
Posts: 219
Loc: Washington State
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19234418 - 12/05/13 11:00 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

When I did my jars with normal half pint glass jars with metal lids, they worked great. I didnt use silicone on the innoc ports though, so I probably got better air exchange than you...but you also have to use a dry verm layer. Idk try both ways and see what's going to work.

Imo though if you're already going through all the work of using polyfil and silicone you might as well just buy some quart jars and get started on bulk...look up how frank gets shit done and begin your research!


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Offlineredfox7450
princess bubblegum
Female


Registered: 05/20/12
Posts: 225
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Re: My jars stalled [Re: KnownPown]
    #19234453 - 12/05/13 11:10 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

yup OP that's your problem. gas exchange and temperature. temperature needs to be around 80 degrees, and you don't want to cover your holes. just put a dry vermiculite layer ontop of your mixture. store them in a nice warm dark dry place and you should be good to go. better luck next round!


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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: KnownPown]
    #19234459 - 12/05/13 11:12 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I have removed the polyfill and the sillicone and will make some more jars tomorrow for another run. And yes, I have thought of trying bulk, but because of space issues and simply because I haven't made a single growth to successful completion... I will stick to pf for now.  :thanx:


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Offlineredfox7450
princess bubblegum
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Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19234483 - 12/05/13 11:20 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

smart thinking OP. better to walk before you run. :P


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Offline1down5up
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Registered: 11/04/13
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Re: My jars stalled [Re: redfox7450]
    #19241033 - 12/07/13 01:50 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

The boiling for 90 minutes works fine...you really don't have to get a PC if you can't afford one.  I had some glasses and jars that i knocked up with a bogus syringe, and after a month they showed no signs of any growth at all...myc or otherwise.....so that's a pretty good indication that the steam sterilization worked...at least for me it did.
If you do have access to a PC, then you're golden there....Good luck on your next one!!!


--------------------
~~Everything is relative~~


A Simplified Overview of Mushroom Cultivation Strategies  -  RR says  -  EvilMushroom666's Take on BRF Cakes  -  Frank's list of goodies  -  Cronicr's Goodies


No one is placed higher than another no matter race or creed or gender, we must teach forgiveness and compassion for all life.  J.L.


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OfflineChuckfinely
another round for me an my buddy

Registered: 06/27/13
Posts: 628
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19242653 - 12/07/13 09:12 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Insider said:
I have removed the polyfill and the sillicone and will make some more jars tomorrow for another run. And yes, I have thought of trying bulk, but because of space issues and simply because I haven't made a single growth to successful completion... I will stick to pf for now.  :thanx:





I did grains my very first try and it was much easier than I thought it would be. In fact, I would say its easier then brf and verm layers and everything. I tried to make a cake after a year of doing bulk, and failed like 10 jars worth.

Grains are super simple and you'll never look back:thumbup:


If you're concerned about space then you dont have to make a huge mono tub. 1 qrt jar spawned to pasteurized coco/verm into a shoe box works GREAT. I've done it multiple times and usually come out with 1-1.5oz first flush.


Just line a shoebox like it was a mono, mix 1 qrt of grain spawn to 1-2 qrts of pasteurized sub, however much it takes to fill it about 1/2" from the top. Then for the lid you just take another shoe box and either drill it like a sgfc, or make 1 large polyfil hole on each side, then simply set it on top of the bottom shoebox for fruiting. Of course you would use the snap on lid for while the bottom one is colonizing.


There was a really great shoebox tek around here a long time ago, ill see if I can find it. I think frank knows about the one im talking about, and its really great for giving grain a go in a small space:peace:


Good luck man, and keep trying till you get it. Once you see that first flush, you'll be hooked for life:noargument:


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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #19243301 - 12/08/13 01:00 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

1down5up said:
The boiling for 90 minutes works fine...you really don't have to get a PC if you can't afford one.  I had some glasses and jars that i knocked up with a bogus syringe, and after a month they showed no signs of any growth at all...myc or otherwise.....so that's a pretty good indication that the steam sterilization worked...at least for me it did.
If you do have access to a PC, then you're golden there....Good luck on your next one!!!




Thank you very much, I have bought a small pc (6qt) for very little so now I can do some stuff a little cleaner.

Quote:

Chuckfinely said:
Quote:

Insider said:
I have removed the polyfill and the sillicone and will make some more jars tomorrow for another run. And yes, I have thought of trying bulk, but because of space issues and simply because I haven't made a single growth to successful completion... I will stick to pf for now.  :thanx:





I did grains my very first try and it was much easier than I thought it would be. In fact, I would say its easier then brf and verm layers and everything. I tried to make a cake after a year of doing bulk, and failed like 10 jars worth.

Grains are super simple and you'll never look back:thumbup:


If you're concerned about space then you dont have to make a huge mono tub. 1 qrt jar spawned to pasteurized coco/verm into a shoe box works GREAT. I've done it multiple times and usually come out with 1-1.5oz first flush.


Just line a shoebox like it was a mono, mix 1 qrt of grain spawn to 1-2 qrts of pasteurized sub, however much it takes to fill it about 1/2" from the top. Then for the lid you just take another shoe box and either drill it like a sgfc, or make 1 large polyfil hole on each side, then simply set it on top of the bottom shoebox for fruiting. Of course you would use the snap on lid for while the bottom one is colonizing.


There was a really great shoebox tek around here a long time ago, ill see if I can find it. I think frank knows about the one im talking about, and its really great for giving grain a go in a small space:peace:


Good luck man, and keep trying till you get it. Once you see that first flush, you'll be hooked for life:noargument:




This shoebox thing actually sounds like a very nice idea! I think I will try that very soon! Thank you very much for pointing me in that direction. A question if you care to answer: If I have no agar cultures available, can I inoculate grains with a multispore syringe?


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InvisiblePirateSwazey
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Registered: 12/12/12
Posts: 2,993
Loc: Here, Now
Trusted Cultivator
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19243312 - 12/08/13 01:08 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Insider said:
If I have no agar cultures available, can I inoculate grains with a multispore syringe?




Absolutely.

Agar is mainly used for insuring you're working with clean cultures and selecting more powerful sub-strains.
It is probably the most powerful tool that we have, but no more necessary just because you're using grain spawn :thumbup:


--------------------
 

BULK RYE PREP  -  MY FAVORITE THREADS  -  BUILD A FLOWHOOD



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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: PirateSwazey]
    #19243384 - 12/08/13 01:46 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

PirateSwazey said:
Quote:

Insider said:
If I have no agar cultures available, can I inoculate grains with a multispore syringe?




Absolutely.

Agar is mainly used for insuring you're working with clean cultures and selecting more powerful sub-strains.
It is probably the most powerful tool that we have, but no more necessary just because you're using grain spawn :thumbup:




Well, that is just perfect. I might start some grain work soon then. Let's see how it goes.


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OfflinePsilicon
Really Nice Guy


Registered: 08/26/12
Posts: 7,057
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19245217 - 12/08/13 02:07 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Stick with small amounts of inoculant in your grain, though, and spawn small tubs.  If you're using MS, there's a good chance of contaminants even in syringes from good vendors, and the more solution that goes into a tub the higher your chances of contamination.


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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Psilicon]
    #19246019 - 12/08/13 04:44 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

van der griegen said:
Stick with small amounts of inoculant in your grain, though, and spawn small tubs.  If you're using MS, there's a good chance of contaminants even in syringes from good vendors, and the more solution that goes into a tub the higher your chances of contamination.




What is considered a "small amount" of MS solution? 1cc? less?


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
Retired, but will check MSGs

Registered: 01/05/13
Posts: 1,168
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Insider]
    #19246184 - 12/08/13 05:21 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

redfox7450 said:
yup OP that's your problem. gas exchange and temperature. temperature needs to be around 80 degrees, and you don't want to cover your holes. just put a dry vermiculite layer ontop of your mixture. store them in a nice warm dark dry place and you should be good to go. better luck next round!



Quote:

redfox7450 said:
smart thinking OP. better to walk before you run. :P



I have colonized grain jars in the mid 60s before.  The amount of work to use colonized grain for spawn is LESS than the what is required of PF cakes in a SGFC....but is cost prohibitive due to needing quart jars and a pressure cooker.
Quote:

Insider said:
I disposed them after three days. They had a bad smell on them.




Your issue was with either inoculation (dirty syringe), bad sterile technique, or improper heat treatment of the cakes prior.

Quote:

Insider said:
What is considered a "small amount" of MS solution? 1cc? less?



I have used as little as one drop per quart jar with success.  It takes time, but certainly colonizes IF you have your grain properly prepped.  I don't know what is prescribed per jar, but certainly ANYTHING that begins to grow will quickly spread.  Less is better than more. 

I see that you have a small PC, and I don't know what "jar" it can hold, but having a pressure cooker that holds a quart jar is what you need. 

I read over your post, and find it odd that every jar you did stalled/contaminated.  I can't think blaming this on ge/temps is correct.  I would be concerned that IF you flame sterilized your needle @ each jar, and did not touch it IN ANY WAY after flaming it, that there is a possible issue with the syringe.  If you inoculate other jars keep an eye out.  I have gotten syringes prior that were polluted. 

There are plenty of avenues for success from where you are right now.  I started with the PF tek, and dropped it before I ever finished making my first SGFC.  I spawned my first cakes to bulk, picked up a 16qt pc and never looked back.  No 5x daily mist/fan etc.  HOWEVER each method of success has its pros and cons.  The PF tek is designed for needles...if you get into Agar, you will realize what a non-issue needles are.

There is quite a bit of dynamics with the hobby, and in retrospect, There are more than a few users here who started with PF and very quickly moved over to agar and grain for a reason.  It is amazing how the hobby shapes the individual.  Agar puts you in control of growth and makes you the front seat driver for a contaminant free colonization.


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InvisibleTiN 42
Be the tree
Male


Registered: 12/15/11
Posts: 1,242
Re: My jars stalled [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #19246198 - 12/08/13 05:25 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Chuckfinely said:
Look up some of the bulk grain teks. They're way easier then they seem. The second you try WBS or rye, you'll never look back :thumbup:



I'm in full agreement I've never done PF cakes but it seems like most the problems I see people have on here is with cakes. :mushroom2:
Bulk grain is the shit.


--------------------
:mushroom2:MUSH LOVE:mushroom2:


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OfflineInsider
Just a random platypus


Registered: 10/18/13
Posts: 56
Loc: Under the sea! Under the ...
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: My jars stalled [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #19246365 - 12/08/13 06:01 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Whippy said:
I read over your post, and find it odd that every jar you did stalled/contaminated.  I can't think blaming this on ge/temps is correct.  I would be concerned that IF you flame sterilized your needle @ each jar, and did not touch it IN ANY WAY after flaming it, that there is a possible issue with the syringe.  If you inoculate other jars keep an eye out.  I have gotten syringes prior that were polluted. 





Yes, indeed I found it odd too. That's why I made a little experiment earlier with 3 1 pint glass jars. Long story short, they all contam'd (same ugly smell  :puke: ) even without using a syringe. Therefore I concluded that it was not the innoc procedure but the time I was steaming them (1hour). That's why I decided to buy a small PC and do it all again but correctly now. And yes, I am thinking of moving to grains now. They seem a lot less trouble, my only issue is that I have not a lot of space, that's why even with grains I am going to go the "small amounts" route.  :aweohyou:

Also I like agar work a lot :heart:. I've done it in school and I loved it the first day I did it.


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