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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Just saw it again today.
#19223334 - 12/03/13 05:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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This is how it works imo. You're young and full of energy and hope, you are making tons of progress. And then with the coming years you stall. Any further progress beyond the stall is in very very tiny increments and it's not enough to sustain hope and the slipping back and entropy of your energy. So you sink into depression or drug addiction or pure fantasy or mediocrity but you'll get no further. I've watched this happen to myself and ALL my wonderful young brothers and sisters. You hit the wall and your humanity wins. This is why the world looks as it does imo. My mentor is now a meth addict.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19223399 - 12/03/13 06:08 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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To prevent stall, keep your flaps down and your rudder true.
--------------------
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birdland

Registered: 07/24/11
Posts: 2,202
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19223411 - 12/03/13 06:10 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Once there's momentum it's easy to keep motivated, active and optimistic. It's often hard to get that ball rolling though.
Is that what you're saying? Because that's definitely been my experience.
Or are you saying we all get to a certain point/age and then it's all downhill?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: birdland]
#19223616 - 12/03/13 06:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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The latter of course. Unless I make posts that obscure.
How old are you? Unless you're at least in your late 40s your comments are inexperienced.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DrugsRGood
Analytical Anarchist



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19223732 - 12/03/13 07:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I'm 24 but...
In order to avoid hitting the wall maybe it is important to continuously develop existing hobbies/interests and/or create new ones?
A busy mind is a sane mind...
-------------------- Life is an adventure; not knowing what's ahead brings a great sense of anticipation; and meeting women is the reward.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: DrugsRGood] 1
#19223835 - 12/03/13 07:35 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Do you really think you are doing some original thinking here? That might be called youthful folly in light of the evidence I've seen. 
No one at your age can imagine with any accuracy what life will feel like at 40,50, 60. That's what I'm saying here but it's not really for your ears yet. It's hard to keep that busy if you're distracted by a search for "truth".
I'm just talking to myself.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DrugsRGood
Analytical Anarchist



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19223844 - 12/03/13 07:38 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I was hesitant to speak. 
I didn't really think it was that obvious to be honest.
-------------------- Life is an adventure; not knowing what's ahead brings a great sense of anticipation; and meeting women is the reward.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: DrugsRGood]
#19223907 - 12/03/13 07:47 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Keeping busy is a lot easier with your head in the sand. I find so little of interest anymore that distracting hobbies are hard to come by.
I never got tired of wilderness trekking but it seems my knees did. Two surgeries and now I may be looking at a third. Things that work can be stripped away. Just sayin.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 6,325
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224052 - 12/03/13 08:12 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I never got tired of wilderness trekking but it seems my knees did.
Why not play hiking simulator?
Edited by White Beard (12/03/13 08:13 PM)
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 6,325
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224092 - 12/03/13 08:22 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: It's hard to keep that busy if you're distracted by a search for "truth".
What do you mean by "truth"?
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Repertoire89
Cat



Registered: 11/15/12
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224203 - 12/03/13 08:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: This is how it works imo. You're young and full of energy and hope, you are making tons of progress. And then with the coming years you stall. Any further progress beyond the stall is in very very tiny increments and it's not enough to sustain hope and the slipping back and entropy of your energy. So you sink into depression or drug addiction or pure fantasy or mediocrity but you'll get no further. I've watched this happen to myself and ALL my wonderful young brothers and sisters. You hit the wall and your humanity wins. This is why the world looks as it does imo. My mentor is now a meth addict. 
Indian Classical musicians tend to come into their prime in their 40s, its all uphill until then, generally they stay at their creative peak into their late 60s. Then its a sharp drop downhill at some point. Its a very large scene and I've observed that trend with most of the larger figures, can't think of another group of people who consistently share that sort of motivational push.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: White Beard]
#19224245 - 12/03/13 08:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
White Beard said:
Quote:
Icelander said: I never got tired of wilderness trekking but it seems my knees did.
Why not play hiking simulator?
Where's the nekked girl?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224250 - 12/03/13 08:53 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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do you typically find naked girls on your wilderness hikes?
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: White Beard]
#19224258 - 12/03/13 08:53 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
White Beard said:
Quote:
Icelander said: It's hard to keep that busy if you're distracted by a search for "truth".
What do you mean by "truth"?
The "" gives it away. A search for the secret of life You know, the one where it's not really how this all appears.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: White Beard]
#19224263 - 12/03/13 08:54 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
White Beard said: do you typically find naked girls on your wilderness hikes? 
My virtual reality ones, yes! And once in real life.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DisoRDeR
motional



Registered: 08/29/02
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Some writers progress similarly. I've been reading Henry Miller's On Writing, which is a selection of his reflections on the writing process from various works. He published his first notable book at 42, struggling to find his voice and the commitment necessary to compose for much of his adult life before that. But I suppose this is a little different from developing musical technique.
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Jaegar
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: DisoRDeR]
#19224312 - 12/03/13 09:02 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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We all have to pay the piper some day.
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224344 - 12/03/13 09:06 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
White Beard said: do you typically find naked girls on your wilderness hikes? 
My virtual reality ones, yes! And once in real life.
whats the story behind that one?
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 6,325
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224369 - 12/03/13 09:11 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
White Beard said:
Quote:
Icelander said: It's hard to keep that busy if you're distracted by a search for "truth".
What do you mean by "truth"?
The "" gives it away. A search for the secret of life;) You know, the one where it's not really how this all appears. 
oh true that.
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Repertoire89
Cat



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: DisoRDeR]
#19224375 - 12/03/13 09:12 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
DisoRDeR said: Some writers progress similarly. I've been reading Henry Miller's On Writing, which is a selection of his reflections on the writing process from various works. He published his first notable book at 42, struggling to find his voice and the commitment necessary to compose for much of his adult life before that. But I suppose this is a little different from developing musical technique.
Not all that different, all the motivation for me comes from the act itself and the ideas being expressed. Music or writing Couldn't imagine becoming bored with either, knowing others who have pushed the point well into old age without losing motivation I don't see a reason to worry about that happening.
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shetalks
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: White Beard]
#19224416 - 12/03/13 09:21 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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There can be physiological reasons behind why you are feeling this way, but since you are talking about lack of energy and motivation (and meth) sounds like dopamine receptors.
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DisoRDeR
motional



Registered: 08/29/02
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Loc: nonsensistan
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Same here, at least on the writing side. If I have a major regret from my childhood it's that I didn't cultivate much musical ability, but poetry takes that place for me now.
I find stories like Miller's inspiring. They've helped to keep the writer in me alive. Many people's dreams collapse under the weight of insecurity, or come careening back to the mean for their insufficient talent-thrust. With a world so thoroughly clouded in distractions, some stand prepped but never leave the surface as the launch window ticks away.
I think getting too fixed on some imagined achievement is where the slide Icelander mentions comes from. Great if you hit your target, but it's a gamble and delusions are rampant.
Edited by DisoRDeR (12/03/13 10:26 PM)
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Jaegar
Formless One



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: DisoRDeR]
#19224598 - 12/03/13 10:06 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Arn't we just mutations of DNA driven by evolutionary psycology. Another species to join the bucket list in the temporary experience called life.
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DisoRDeR
motional



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Jaegar]
#19224801 - 12/03/13 10:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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We're conglomerations of subatomic particles bumping uglies around nuclei. We're slippity sliding carbon buoys swimming synchronized in the sea. It may be we're arrangements of vibrating strings, tuning instruments, composing, coerced and yet free.
Emergent properties are a bitch, eh?
It's helpful for perspective to reduce ourselves to less and see the progression, but why not embrace what makes us distinct?
We are what came before and more than any of it, and different from all else we see.
And yes, a cold bucket for all, but not yet.
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Cactilove
Controversial Mystic



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224817 - 12/03/13 10:55 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I plan on hitting that wall at full speed, breaking through the other side and cruising down the hill until I no longer feel that life is worth living. Then I'll start the propofol/fetanyl drip, turn on the gas, and float away painlessly. At least that's my plan. Not sure how it will turn out. Might get hit by a car tomorrow. I would imagine finding out that you hit that wall is quite depressing. I see it in my father at times. He always comments that he is too old for this and that. Says he is tired. He seems depressed when he meets his limitations. I'm not really looking forward to it myself. Especially the pain, I already have back pain, can't imagine what it will be like in my 60's. What can you do though? What options do you have? Make the best of it or suicide are the only options that come to me off the top. I want to add to that last statement to make it more uplifting and encouraging, but I can't really think of anything else to say. Dreary.
-------------------- Orgone Conclusion...Bringing OTD to PS&P since 2007.
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cez

Registered: 08/04/09
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19224996 - 12/03/13 11:43 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I typically agree with your posts but I cannot adopt this viewpoint regardless of how true it may seem as a collection.
There is no truth or expectations for me right now, although I cultivate things which I expect to grow so I'm kinda lying 
Following nature's blueprint of life in relation to passions, they will grow given you nurture them.. ..Of course they grow to their eventual death but we can enjoy them for the time being.
Edited by cez (12/03/13 11:52 PM)
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225030 - 12/03/13 11:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Two surgeries and now I may be looking at a third

There goes your last good leg.
--------------------
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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Quote:
Repertoire89 said:
Quote:
DisoRDeR said: Some writers progress similarly. I've been reading Henry Miller's On Writing, which is a selection of his reflections on the writing process from various works. He published his first notable book at 42, struggling to find his voice and the commitment necessary to compose for much of his adult life before that. But I suppose this is a little different from developing musical technique.
Not all that different, all the motivation for me comes from the act itself and the ideas being expressed. Music or writing Couldn't imagine becoming bored with either, knowing others who have pushed the point well into old age without losing motivation I don't see a reason to worry about that happening.
For everyone that pushes it well into old age there are likely thousands who give it all up. I know two pretty amazing guitarists personally who never pick them up anymore.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻



Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 11,953
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225175 - 12/04/13 02:32 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Any advice on how to protect my knee's now so I can keep on trekking when I get up there?
They have exoskeletons and shit now that could possibly help, but I'm sure they are expensive.
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225335 - 12/04/13 04:41 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I hit the wall a long time a go. I'm 23 and I read yesterday this is supposed to be my happiest year. Gee I sure hope not.
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: teknix]
#19225392 - 12/04/13 05:51 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
teknix said: Any advice on how to protect my knee's now so I can keep on trekking when I get up there?
They have exoskeletons and shit now that could possibly help, but I'm sure they are expensive.
Good quality trekking poles and build up the muscles
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Grapefruit]
#19225397 - 12/04/13 05:52 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Grapefruit said: I hit the wall a long time a go. I'm 23 and I read yesterday this is supposed to be my happiest year. Gee I sure hope not.
I wish you some better years.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Cactilove]
#19225408 - 12/04/13 05:57 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Cactilove said: I plan on hitting that wall at full speed, breaking through the other side and cruising down the hill until I no longer feel that life is worth living. Then I'll start the propofol/fetanyl drip, turn on the gas, and float away painlessly. At least that's my plan. Not sure how it will turn out. Might get hit by a car tomorrow. I would imagine finding out that you hit that wall is quite depressing. I see it in my father at times. He always comments that he is too old for this and that. Says he is tired. He seems depressed when he meets his limitations. I'm not really looking forward to it myself. Especially the pain, I already have back pain, can't imagine what it will be like in my 60's. What can you do though? What options do you have? Make the best of it or suicide are the only options that come to me off the top. I want to add to that last statement to make it more uplifting and encouraging, but I can't really think of anything else to say. Dreary.
Make the best or suicide if you are able.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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collision
Stranger
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225546 - 12/04/13 07:14 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Just curious, Icelander... When you were younger, with effortless knees, did you not, beneath your creative/adventurous acts, feel the same presence of impermanence as you do now?
-------------------- You can do what you want, but you can't want what you want
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: collision]
#19225562 - 12/04/13 07:28 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Good question. No I really didn't, not consciously. My belief is it's our energy levels that determine our mind state to a great degree. I had to do a lot of all types of losing to start to understand the futility of my situation. In other words I had to come to grips with the reality of my impermanence and my humanness. That took a lot of experience. It was really after about 50 that it started to dawn on me. Then, after 55 things started to really crash down on my shields and found most of them wanting. I had, for better or worse become an expert in cognitive dissonance. I saw through most of my shields and they then of course became useless. I had and have nothing to replace them with now. No belief in an afterlife, no belief in the goodness of man or the benignness of nature nor in the protection of wealth. No belief that my physical ills are going to be cured. No belief in romantic love that conquers all. It's kind of like finding yourself out of doors in winter without your coat or anything and realizing you can't get back in and night is coming on.
And welcome to the Shroomery.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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quinn
some kinda love


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Posts: 6,799
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Grapefruit]
#19225564 - 12/04/13 07:28 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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woah i didnt know you were younger than me
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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quinn
some kinda love


Registered: 01/02/10
Posts: 6,799
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225574 - 12/04/13 07:36 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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hah i had the thought the other day that love is just something to keep people distracted for long enough so that when they start realizing what's up at least they have someone to be confused about it with.. 
nice to hang around fellow cynics sometimes
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225579 - 12/04/13 07:38 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
quinn said: hah i had the thought the other day that love is just something to keep people distracted for long enough so that when they start realizing what's up at least they have someone to be confused about it with.. 
nice to hang around fellow cynics sometimes
Thats very well stated actually.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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quinn
some kinda love


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225584 - 12/04/13 07:39 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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there are some who have strength and character and fortune who do not follow the path in the op imo tho
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225589 - 12/04/13 07:41 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Absolutely agree. Just haven't met any. 
Well that's not true actually. I haven't met any I'd want to trade places with. That's interesting when I think about it. What satisfies them I find wanting. But that might just be weakness of a sort.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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quinn
some kinda love


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225601 - 12/04/13 07:50 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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ive met a few people i'd put up there.. and dont sound so surprised i posted something good
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225610 - 12/04/13 07:55 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've met a few people who have good shields that allow them to enjoy life to a great extent. That's the most I can say. I don't find them special in any other way. But imo they are still to be envied if not admired.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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quinn
some kinda love


Registered: 01/02/10
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225612 - 12/04/13 07:56 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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there are posters on these forums who i would rate as not falling into the op's category.. idk tho humans are all different and crazy i guess 
maybe i just like some more, or some seem more realistic in their personal outlook and growth, idk
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225616 - 12/04/13 07:57 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Ultimately it's hard to tell. We look at others though the lense of our own personalities. For all I know I guess there may be some truly great humans out there.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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quinn
some kinda love


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225621 - 12/04/13 08:00 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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well 'shields' make it sound like everyone is kidding themselves, which although may be true does not account for some shields being better or more realistic or flexible than others and that the possibility of having no shields is likely impossible
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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quinn
some kinda love


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225635 - 12/04/13 08:03 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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i think there are some great humans, but i'm just a belieber
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225686 - 12/04/13 08:21 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
quinn said: well 'shields' make it sound like everyone is kidding themselves, which although may be true does not account for some shields being better or more realistic or flexible than others and that the possibility of having no shields is likely impossible
Well you are just saying what Becker was saying in Denial of Death. It's the quality of our shields that determines the quality of our lives. And I'm not using "quality" in any moral sense but rather a utilitarian sense. And maybe a better way than to say that a shield is used to kidd ourselves (although often it is) it is used to distract ourselves from an uncomfortable truth.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (12/04/13 08:21 AM)
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19225688 - 12/04/13 08:23 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
quinn said: i think there are some great humans, but i'm just a belieber
Well relatively speaking I agree. Albert Einstein, George Carlin, Britney Spears etc.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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quinn
some kinda love


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19225713 - 12/04/13 08:30 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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interesting.. that rings pretty true... i think that a utilitarian outlook may even end up more 'moral' than a moral one as it sidesteps righteousness and dogma (and is more flexible)
-------------------- dripping with fantasy
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn] 1
#19225915 - 12/04/13 09:37 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Well as they say "if it works don't fix it" and I'd add "don't question why it works" (or it may quit working) All good advice wasted on me. Too late to not question everything. It was a huge mistake that I thought was a brilliant solution. So much for intuition.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Allisterem
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: White Beard]
#19226147 - 12/04/13 11:10 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I'm 25 so no I don't fully understand what you're trying to get across.
BUT, from my experience working with and helping people in their 50's and up I can say that the very happiest of them; all have love in their lives.
That means they actively try to help and care for their fellow human beings. Their hearts are warm and their minds are open.
The above persons are VERY rare, most of the older folks I run into are as you say in the throes of depression "Just trying to survive".
Not sure why, haen't had enough observations yet.
my 2 cents!
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Allisterem]
#19226155 - 12/04/13 11:11 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I believe ya.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19227008 - 12/04/13 02:37 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
teknix said: Any advice on how to protect my knee's now so I can keep on trekking when I get up there?
They have exoskeletons and shit now that could possibly help, but I'm sure they are expensive.
Good quality trekking poles and build up the muscles
I thought it had to do with the cartilage more than the muscles.
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: teknix]
#19227085 - 12/04/13 02:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Muscles protect the cartilage from damage also as far as I know. Another thing is to not be overweight.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19227114 - 12/04/13 02:57 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yeah, you're right, I guess a nice pair of quads can help prevent cartilage loss in the knee's. 
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/11/061116100945.htm
I should prob invest in some trekking poles.
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: teknix]
#19227600 - 12/04/13 04:25 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Kickle
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19228046 - 12/04/13 06:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: This is how it works imo. You're young and full of energy and hope, you are making tons of progress. And then with the coming years you stall. Any further progress beyond the stall is in very very tiny increments and it's not enough to sustain hope and the slipping back and entropy of your energy. So you sink into depression or drug addiction or pure fantasy or mediocrity but you'll get no further. I've watched this happen to myself and ALL my wonderful young brothers and sisters. You hit the wall and your humanity wins. This is why the world looks as it does imo. My mentor is now a meth addict. 
So in your opinion is there any merit in, while young, working to develop patience for when you need it with yourself down the line, comfort with silence for when it surrounds you, or dispassion for bettering the world for when the world will not be getting better for you?
Or is it all a wash and there is no mental habituation that can be done in advance to ease the degradation.
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Kickle]
#19228685 - 12/04/13 08:25 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Try everything and decide for yourself. I don't for one second think anyone's going to take my word for anything. I just post this shit mostly for myself.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Grapefruit
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19230822 - 12/05/13 11:34 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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“I saw my life branching out before me like the green fig tree in the story. From the tip of every branch, like a fat purple fig, a wonderful future beckoned and winked. One fig was a husband and a happy home and children, and another fig was a famous poet and another fig was a brilliant professor, and another fig was Ee Gee, the amazing editor, and another fig was Europe and Africa and South America, and another fig was Constantin and Socrates and Attila and a pack of other lovers with queer names and offbeat professions, and another fig was an Olympic lady crew champion, and beyond and above these figs were many more figs I couldn't quite make out. I saw myself sitting in the crotch of this fig tree, starving to death, just because I couldn't make up my mind which of the figs I would choose. I wanted each and every one of them, but choosing one meant losing all the rest, and, as I sat there, unable to decide, the figs began to wrinkle and go black, and, one by one, they plopped to the ground at my feet.” - Sylvia Plath
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Grapefruit]
#19230934 - 12/05/13 12:07 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Funny how in no branch was she experiencing any of the tragedy that is the normal outcome of many lives.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Kickle
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander] 1
#19231091 - 12/05/13 12:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Try everything and decide for yourself. I don't for one second think anyone's going to take my word for anything. I just post this shit mostly for myself.
While that may be true you are a tribal elder and the rest of the tribe listens to your stories. Its sorta the unassigned but naturally occurring role. I like the honest stories best
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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DisoRDeR
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19231186 - 12/05/13 01:11 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Funny how in no branch was she experiencing any of the tragedy that is the normal outcome of many lives. 
Those branches were broken off by cruel children and desperate survivors in the dead of winter.
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Kickle]
#19231219 - 12/05/13 01:21 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Or is it all a wash and there is no mental habituation that can be done in advance to ease the degradation.
Yes but don't count on it. You'll have to give it a shot. I wasn't up to the challenge it seems.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: DisoRDeR] 1
#19231225 - 12/05/13 01:22 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
DisoRDeR said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Funny how in no branch was she experiencing any of the tragedy that is the normal outcome of many lives. 
Those branches were broken off by cruel children and desperate survivors in the dead of winter.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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Chronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19235263 - 12/06/13 05:46 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: This is how it works imo. You're young and full of energy and hope, you are making tons of progress. And then with the coming years you stall. Any further progress beyond the stall is in very very tiny increments and it's not enough to sustain hope and the slipping back and entropy of your energy. So you sink into depression or drug addiction or pure fantasy or mediocrity but you'll get no further. I've watched this happen to myself and ALL my wonderful young brothers and sisters. You hit the wall and your humanity wins. This is why the world looks as it does imo. My mentor is now a meth addict. 
Thanks for the heads up
--------------------
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quinn
some kinda love


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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19235270 - 12/06/13 05:51 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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hey yeh so who was your mentor? (orgone conclusion??)
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: quinn]
#19235372 - 12/06/13 07:07 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
quinn said: hey yeh so who was your mentor? (orgone conclusion??)
Certainly no one from this site.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Chronic7]
#19235373 - 12/06/13 07:07 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
The Chronic said:
Quote:
Icelander said: This is how it works imo. You're young and full of energy and hope, you are making tons of progress. And then with the coming years you stall. Any further progress beyond the stall is in very very tiny increments and it's not enough to sustain hope and the slipping back and entropy of your energy. So you sink into depression or drug addiction or pure fantasy or mediocrity but you'll get no further. I've watched this happen to myself and ALL my wonderful young brothers and sisters. You hit the wall and your humanity wins. This is why the world looks as it does imo. My mentor is now a meth addict. 
Thanks for the heads up
anytime. (although I know you are being sarcastic )
File it away for future reference.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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LunarEclipse
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19235483 - 12/06/13 08:13 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Why do tweakers like rocks?
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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Mr Person



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Kickle]
#19235608 - 12/06/13 09:12 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said:
While that may be true you are a tribal elder and the rest of the tribe listens to your stories. Its sorta the unassigned but naturally occurring role. I like the honest stories best 
This. Even when I think I am at the level and finally accepting my DA he tosses off one of these casual asides that makes me feel like I need to leave the shroomery for another sabbatical.
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Mr Person]
#19236039 - 12/06/13 11:17 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I'm flattered. 
Anyhow in this vein you might want to add this to your reading list. A theologians take on Becker work. TRANSFERENCE & TRANSCENDENCE by Daniel Liechty.
I'm about a quarter through it and it's very good.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Mr Person



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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Icelander]
#19238044 - 12/06/13 07:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Thanks I will definitely check it out.
Next up on my list are THE HUMAN ENCOUNTER WITH DEATH by Stan Grof and THE WILL TO MEANING by Viktor Frankl. Reading HANDBOOK TO HIGHER CONSCIOUSNESS by Ken Keyes Jr first though.
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Icelander
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Mr Person]
#19238396 - 12/06/13 08:50 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've read the HHC several times. It's an amazing book. Amazing.
I'll have to check out that book by Grof.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Guitar Bushido
Arisen

Registered: 12/09/13
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Quote:
Repertoire89 said:
Quote:
DisoRDeR said: Some writers progress similarly. I've been reading Henry Miller's On Writing, which is a selection of his reflections on the writing process from various works. He published his first notable book at 42, struggling to find his voice and the commitment necessary to compose for much of his adult life before that. But I suppose this is a little different from developing musical technique.
Not all that different, all the motivation for me comes from the act itself and the ideas being expressed. Music or writing Couldn't imagine becoming bored with either, knowing others who have pushed the point well into old age without losing motivation I don't see a reason to worry about that happening.
I completely agree and also know many elder people who are well motivated to do what they do.
I have no idea what the OP is talking about, however.
I just can't imagine myself and most of my friends slinking into a depression and/or giving up the passions which provide endless sources of joy and fulfillment. That's just absurd.
And that's not even to mention the exponentially-increasing aid that we're constantly receiving from technology, and the implications of that.
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Jaegar
Formless One



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Technology may prolong life expectancy. But regardless our inevitable rotting demise is a inevitable destination.
I find our evolutionary psychology and constraints a bleak destiny. I don't think technology or attempts at engineering enhanced specimens of our species providing anything fruitful.
Maybe a new form of life like artificial intelligence without our biological limitations could take fruition.
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LunarEclipse
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Re: Just saw it again today. [Re: Jaegar]
#19320106 - 12/24/13 08:37 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Jaegar said: Technology may prolong life expectancy. But regardless our inevitable rotting demise is a inevitable destination.
I find our evolutionary psychology and constraints a bleak destiny. I don't think technology or attempts at engineering enhanced specimens of our species providing anything fruitful.
Maybe a new form of life like artificial intelligence without our biological limitations could take fruition.
One too many Terminator movies for you.
Face it the Mamas and the Papas will never die.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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