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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #19444635 - 01/19/14 09:14 PM (10 years, 11 days ago)

:rockon:
oops forgot this is for my sterilized coir

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
So Violet, what in your opinion is going wrong? Conditions are good. While I had stalling issues with two containers,  the other four were done at the same time. FAE is good, and I have gone to great lengths to ensure they are bottom watered and misted at least twice a day. A big part of this thread was to see how V tek could fit into my lifestyle and my grow style and you assured me several times that it could.  What do I need to be doing? I got a container with over 100 pins then 95% abort. Whats the key? If you blame it on the culture fine, but if there is something else I would really like to know as I plan to try this with other species. I dont think its the SGFC fault as I have worked to offset the negative aspects that that chamber has in my environment. I would really appreciate some insight here.



:waitingpatiently:


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #19445333 - 01/19/14 11:26 PM (10 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
Little forced perspective shot for van der grigen :lmafo:






:grrr:


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #19445364 - 01/19/14 11:33 PM (10 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
Little forced perspective shot for van der grigen :lmafo:






:nojustno:


--------------------

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You should take a look. :hehehe:


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Edited by FrankHorrigan (01/19/14 11:41 PM)


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19446900 - 01/20/14 10:07 AM (10 years, 10 days ago)

has harvesting flushes every day that over a week add up to a decent cake harvest been sort of annoying at all?


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InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: bodhisatta]
    #19450274 - 01/20/14 10:27 PM (10 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
has harvesting flushes every day that over a week add up to a decent cake harvest been sort of annoying at all?



Yeah it has. Not sure what the problem is. Guess next time I do this it will be an agar wedge in each container or LC and the jars half loaded so they finish more evenly. Hopefully a different culture works better as well.

Quick update. Not much to look at overall, but this container looks pretty promising. These pins at least look a bit meaty.



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OfflineSgt. Pepper
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #19450307 - 01/20/14 10:32 PM (10 years, 10 days ago)

Go pasty! I'm actually really liking the v-tek flushes. I'm not gonna give up growing mono's of course, but maybe a v-tek container or two is overdue in my greenhouse.


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: cronicr]
    #19452465 - 01/21/14 11:46 AM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
So Violet, what in your opinion is going wrong? Conditions are good. While I had stalling issues with two containers,  the other four were done at the same time. FAE is good, and I have gone to great lengths to ensure they are bottom watered and misted at least twice a day.  What do I need to be doing? I got a container with over 100 pins then 95% abort. Whats the key? If you blame it on the culture fine, but if there is something else I would really like to know as I plan to try this with other species. I would really appreciate some insight here.



I've kindof already mentioned much of it...
Quote:


When I use an isolate, they colonized evenly as they ought, they're all given time to catch-up with plenty of consolidation, and they're cased & introduced to fruiting on the same timeline,  they should all have consistently nearly identical flush speed, frequency, size, and appearance.




I suspect that the main thing for you may be lack of adequate consolidation.

From the dates you published, the straight-grains didn't get to chew long at all.

You may recall how RR and others mention consolidation is particularly important on extra-nutritious substrates.  Fruiting will be delayed, or staggered/wimpy, if they're asked to do so before they're ready.

Quote:

THE CASE FOR CONSOLIDATION
Please do yourself a favor and allow some solid consolidation time before casing and fruiting such cakes. There are several advantages besides potential potency solidification.

These straight grains require some real chewing before the mycelium will be able to flush hardy. This is for the same reason that the grain has such recurring flush capacity.
If you introduce them into fruiting and prompt them to fruit before they're maxed out on readiness, the results could possibly seem quite dwindling and discouraging since the mycelium will have expended itself in fruiting without having gotten to a point where it could do its best. May lead to earlier contamination also.

A case-in-point:

Although these first-flush yields aren't bad, pretty decent considering the possible future flushing curve, they're not as good as the same culture has done on other cakes.
This is because they were cased and set to fruit too soon after fully-colonized.

They haven't had enough time. Others introduced as early or earlier had even less impressive first results. In the past for me, some that went this way even contamm'd during second flush, which would be quite disheartening if you didn't know how you caused/allowed such a thing!

Let these containers take their time before introducing. Best results don't come rushed. If you want regular harvest (beyond the perpetual harvest from these!) then do cycling grows so that their individual delays are irrelevant.




This problem worsens with different grains!

Larger grains like rye have far less surface area per their much greater inner mass.
If I were to use grains like those for this tek (I wouldn't anymore, results didn't seem as great)  I'd likely insist on extra-long consolidation.

Grass seed may require the least consolidation, followed by brown rice, due to how dense the cakes become with mycelium and how quickly greater proportions of the food is consumed and made usable.
Corn may need Far longer consolidation and Still may not do as well as the formers for the same reasons.

Another thing is that your culture, awesome as it is confirmed to be in the grow methods it has proven itself in, is not proven in this quite different approach.
It may have a quite different proclivity to fruit on such high nutrient load.


There are all kinds of things you can try to see what effect it may have.  Deeper casing layers, clumpier/denser/wetter ones the way I prepare them, various grain choice, extended colonization, cultures found to excel at 'bottom-watering' as a hydration method,  cultures with lower abort rates in various scenarios...


Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
A big part of this thread was to see how V tek could fit into my lifestyle and my grow style and you assured me several times that it could.



I assure you still, because of it's reduced size, neglect-ability, reduced materials, simplicity and lack of modification, multiple use of all equipment involved, and more.
But fitting into one's lifestyle is only vaguely and loosely related to maximizing the grow itself in manners similar, but definitely of their own, from how you have gotten to with the process of "bulks"


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
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OfflinePrimalSoup
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Violet]
    #19453062 - 01/21/14 01:54 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

I suspect that the main thing for you may be lack of adequate consolidation.




You think he forced them to fruit too soon?  Could be... 

Mycelium has its own schedule when it comes to life stages, I've seen that many times. :thumbup:

:peace:PS


--------------------

if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat you
Primal's simple tested teks and projects: :awesomenod: Wheat Prep 2.0  Acidic Tea Tek  Potency Project! 


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Offlinesololas
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: PrimalSoup]
    #19453452 - 01/21/14 03:43 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Not to change topics but I find that when the moon is full my cakes, trays and cow fields seem to really pop up in higher ratios.  I am also doing my own test between a pp5 and cakes. I started the pp5 pint size 2weeks after the pf jars where inoculated and both where put into fruiting at same time. The cakes received 1week of consolidation and the pp5 with rye berries where placed in FC one day after 100% colonized and both gave fruits the same time within 24HRS. Seem kinda strange to me because I also went hunting and found some huge unopened (veil still attached) caps 21grams wet growing in E.Florida in 30-40degree nites. The mushroom gods have been kind to me this past week. All I can say is the pp5s look great with some real ropey looking mycelium. I like both teks, the pp5 is slick, I'm doing the 2liter for a lid on one outside of the FC, hope it throws off another flush or 3 I wanna show that off to a couple friends in the future. I got a lot more ideas to try thanks to this thread keep up with the experiments and giving us something to work with, cause both of these work bulk or pp5s its all good. The MOON effects a lot more than werewolves....


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Invisibleblindingleaf
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: sololas]
    #19453711 - 01/21/14 04:36 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

when i think of the moon and mushroom, i think of way back when mushroom ceremonies happened at the new and full moon.


--------------------
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MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!!

The whole is greater than the sum of its parts


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Offlinesololas
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: blindingleaf]
    #19453980 - 01/21/14 05:32 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

I have surfed the island Tortola B.V.I. and there is a place called Bomba's surf shack at Applegarden bay that still has a full moon party every month with local shroom tea for anyone who wants its, cool place with girls panties tacked all over the ceilings. Some funny times  seeing these rich sailboaters get all loopey and their girls stripping down for free tea...  I feel the moon has more effect on living things then what we know, there is defiantly some reason why people use mushrooms during full moons throughout the history of mankind.


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: sololas]
    #19454214 - 01/21/14 06:21 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

sololas said:
I feel the moon has more effect on living things then what we know



It moves oceans and some alleged that is the force that pulls rocks up through soil.  Funnier yet If you are human, you are 45-55% water.  Anyone that works at a police station or hospital will tell you how batty people get for 2-3 days while there is a full moon.  There are certainly reasons why full moons cause issues, and I don't think that gravity is the whole story either.


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OfflineSgt. Pepper
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #19454269 - 01/21/14 06:34 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

HypnotoadCroaked said:
Quote:

sololas said:
I feel the moon has more effect on living things then what we know



It moves oceans and some alleged that is the force that pulls rocks up through soil.  Funnier yet If you are human, you are 45-55% water.  Anyone that works at a police station or hospital will tell you how batty people get for 2-3 days while there is a full moon.  There are certainly reasons why full moons cause issues, and I don't think that gravity is the whole story either.



That's really cool, maybe it has to do with mating behaviors among ancient humans or something. The full moon could release a wave of hormones in men and women that results in a greater drive to mate and general craziness.


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Invisibleblindingleaf
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #19454279 - 01/21/14 06:35 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

hypnotoad (whippy) now ur changing ur signature on us?  its like ur having an online sex change operation, i don't recognize u anymore  :stoned2:


Edited by blindingleaf (01/21/14 06:36 PM)


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InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Violet]
    #19454882 - 01/21/14 08:58 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Violet said:
I suspect that the main thing for you may be lack of adequate consolidation.
From the dates you published, the straight-grains didn't get to chew long at all.

You may recall how RR and others mention consolidation is particularly important on extra-nutritious substrates.  Fruiting will be delayed, or staggered/wimpy, if they're asked to do so before they're ready.




Fair enough. I guess I did jump the gun on that front. Guess I got impatient and that combined with my "bulkers mentality" of fruit at 100% I only let them consolidate a few days, rather than a week or more. Next time I will not make that mistake.

Quote:

Violet said:
Another thing is that your culture, awesome as it is confirmed to be in the grow methods it has proven itself in, is not proven in this quite different approach.
It may have a quite different proclivity to fruit on such high nutrient load.


There are all kinds of things you can try to see what effect it may have.  Deeper casing layers, clumpier/denser/wetter ones the way I prepare them, various grain choice, extended colonization, cultures found to excel at 'bottom-watering' as a hydration method,  cultures with lower abort rates in various scenarios...




Okay, well rather than mess with all that, I will just use a different culture next time. Since a lot of your pics show larger size boomers with more of a sparse pinset, I shall opt for a culture that has similar traits. I only have a couple that will perform this way, as I usually opt for the dense pinset and medium to smaller size fruits, but I have a feeling that they may work better. Might start prepping for round two this weekend.


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InvisibleGimpCollector
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #19455120 - 01/21/14 09:58 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

To many containers to clean, i'd rather be clipping then busting suds. Amusing thread.


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: blindingleaf]
    #19455185 - 01/21/14 10:15 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

blindingleaf said:
hypnotoad (whippy) now ur changing ur signature on us?  its like ur having an online sex change operation, i don't recognize u anymore  :stoned2:



I am in the process of making myself better and and trying to provide ANY help I have had to others without explicitly directing to the pages.  I am in the process of showing myself the door.  I have a few of the "grow-along" threads that I feel committed to, but after that I am out of here.  I feel that the knowledge gained only goes so far, and that personal experience trumps a group discussion.  In the interim I will be helping as I feel fit to, but 100% of all issues on this forum can be solved by a simple use of the search function.  Not much has changed in cube cultivation in the last 4 years, and this year is not looking much different.  I chose that name very carefully.  There is more to "croaked" than simple onomatopoeia.  It is not personal against anyone, but my time here is done as far as I am concerned.


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Invisibleblindingleaf
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #19455208 - 01/21/14 10:21 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

non sense!  stay for the ppl :dancer:

plus, dont u wanna b here to help develop the ideal philip k dick world?  :rofl:


--------------------
A few thoughts on cultivation
MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!!

The whole is greater than the sum of its parts


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OfflinePrimalSoup
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: blindingleaf]
    #19455296 - 01/21/14 10:45 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Uhm, :whathesaid: but not only that you linked my tek! :awegrow::thumbup:

:peace:PS


--------------------

if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat you
Primal's simple tested teks and projects: :awesomenod: Wheat Prep 2.0  Acidic Tea Tek  Potency Project! 


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OfflineStromriderM
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Re: V-Tek meets Bulk [Re: PrimalSoup]
    #19455306 - 01/21/14 10:51 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

:lol: The gospel of Dick!


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