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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Ever get the feeling 1
#19216160 - 12/02/13 07:14 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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that most subjects that humans deal with, in the sense of discussions or actions aimed at working them out or resolving them mostly act on the surface of the issue, ignoring the core of the matter and so purposely, however possibly unconsciously, obfuscating the matter so as not to ever resolve it. 
Just sayin
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Insidious
Stranger


Registered: 11/14/13
Posts: 43
Loc: Ontario
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Icelander] 1
#19216216 - 12/02/13 07:38 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yes, getting to the core core of an issue usually reveals some ugly, uncomfortable truths or dilemmas that most people would rather pretend don't exist.. It's human nature to take the easy way out, the path of least resistance and it can be observed in many issues from relationships to politics....
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest


Registered: 05/09/08
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Insidious]
#19216271 - 12/02/13 08:06 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yes, especially around political/social issues. Which I guess is why I'm not usually interested in politics. I think it's less that people don't want to resolve it but that they are afraid to explore the real reasons for the problems (life, themselves etc.).
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Repertoire89
Cat



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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Icelander]
#19216412 - 12/02/13 09:20 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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teknix
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Icelander] 1
#19216440 - 12/02/13 09:30 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: that most subjects that humans deal with, in the sense of discussions or actions aimed at working them out or resolving them mostly act on the surface of the issue, ignoring the core of the matter and so purposely, however possibly unconsciously, obfuscating the matter so as not to ever resolve it. 
Just sayin
I guess it depends on if you are trying to protect yourself or not?
I think it could be related to an egoic self wanting to be right.
Protecting the image of yourself seems to be numero uno for the ego, because that image is the ego, so I wonder if it utilizes /feed off the same imbeded will to survive that humans do.
Edited by teknix (12/02/13 09:36 AM)
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teknix
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: teknix]
#19216480 - 12/02/13 09:44 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think The bigger the image the harder it has to work to protect itself. So it is probably those huge images that are more likely to obfusicate for the sake of preserving the size. In doing so it only get bigger, if it didn't do so it would shrink.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: teknix]
#19216485 - 12/02/13 09:46 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah it's all ego shit. The why is up for debate and of course you know where I stand on the issue.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Icelander]
#19216546 - 12/02/13 10:10 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I forget who said it, but some psychologist was once remarking about the most amazing thing he'd learned while being a psychologist. He mentioned how humans come seeking a truth of some kind, about themselves or something external, but the truth is the last thing that they'd want to hear. So they'll do everything to tip toe around it, not think about it, and create other problems.
It could be that the problems that people want to resolve are what give people meaning. If there was no problem or issue, would people still have meaning? I'm just throwing a guess out there.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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teknix
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: r72rock]
#19216555 - 12/02/13 10:14 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Hmm, interesting thought...
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Icelander]
#19216709 - 12/02/13 11:00 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think that with most people, when they think they got to the core, they are barely touching the surface
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DrugsRGood
Analytical Anarchist



Registered: 07/10/09
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What if your ego is based on getting down to the real truth (i.e. the core of the problem)
Shouldn't these people be listened to?
Instead of someone who isn't able to get down to the truth because of his preconceived notions.
-------------------- Life is an adventure; not knowing what's ahead brings a great sense of anticipation; and meeting women is the reward.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: DrugsRGood]
#19216772 - 12/02/13 11:16 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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if the ego is based upon it, for sure you can't trust it. there is already a conflict of interest.
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Kickle
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: r72rock]
#19217950 - 12/02/13 04:04 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
r72rock said: I forget who said it, but some psychologist was once remarking about the most amazing thing he'd learned while being a psychologist. He mentioned how humans come seeking a truth of some kind, about themselves or something external, but the truth is the last thing that they'd want to hear. So they'll do everything to tip toe around it, not think about it, and create other problems.
It could be that the problems that people want to resolve are what give people meaning. If there was no problem or issue, would people still have meaning? I'm just throwing a guess out there.
I've found this to be mostly true. Depressed individuals tend to have some very realistic views of themselves and subsequently have a hard time finding meaning in their life. It's the illusionary self that seems to be full of meaning. The future self, the better self, the self that doesn't even exist and is in the clouds
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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Repertoire89
Cat



Registered: 11/15/12
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Kickle]
#19218024 - 12/02/13 04:22 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said:
I've found this to be mostly true. Depressed individuals tend to have some very realistic views of themselves and subsequently have a hard time finding meaning in their life. It's the illusionary self that seems to be full of meaning. The future self, the better self, the self that doesn't even exist and is in the clouds 
Could well be true for the majority of people, if you waste your life away there's little reason to be happy about it.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Kickle]
#19218038 - 12/02/13 04:23 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I fully agree and as a lifelong depressed person can attest to it. There was a few years there in the middle when I had things going my way and the depression was minimal. I had lots of dreams that gave my life meaning. They were all unrealistic as it turned out and so over time the depression deepened until suicide seems like a very attractive choice and I don't do it because I lack the courage of my convictions. With age chronic pain issues haven't helped one bit. Realistically I know that there is no great healing ahead of me only further breakdown and decay. The future seems mostly empty now that I don't live under the illusion of my immortality and supernatural success in life.
I have my dogs, I have you guys and I have one very dear woman in my life, music and some drugs. Those make things bearable part of the time but my brain chemistry is just depressive no matter what anymore.
Sounds pretty grim right. It is very grim to actually be living it. I don't paint a pretty picture of the reality behind the persona of Master Icelander but there is no real point in lying to you all. Lying doesn't change it.
What's a poor boy to do? Joke has always been on me.
I wish I was one of those happy winners I hear about but that's not my fate. Not to say I haven't had some very awesome experiences in my life. I just wish they added up to something that fixed my mental state. I once had a therapist tell me that considering my childhood it's amazing that I'm mostly sane. Little does she know. 
And blah blah blah
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Kickle
Wanderer


Registered: 12/16/06
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Assuming there is anything such as wasting life.
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Quote:
Repertoire89 said:
Quote:
Kickle said:
I've found this to be mostly true. Depressed individuals tend to have some very realistic views of themselves and subsequently have a hard time finding meaning in their life. It's the illusionary self that seems to be full of meaning. The future self, the better self, the self that doesn't even exist and is in the clouds 
Could well be true for the majority of people, if you waste your life away there's little reason to be happy about it.
Waste your life? I wonder what that means? I've done things that people tell me are amazing and wonderful and they wish they had had the ability to do them but it doesn't make me feel great. Even when I was doing them there was always and underlying sadness in me.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Repertoire89
Cat



Registered: 11/15/12
Posts: 21,773
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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Kickle]
#19218058 - 12/02/13 04:28 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said: Assuming there is anything such as wasting life.
Its not so much an assumption as an arbitrary line drawn and suspended in my perception, the line isn't quite arbitrary or clear cut either.
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DirtyTomFlint
( ΰ²₯ΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΰ²₯)




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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Insidious]
#19218060 - 12/02/13 04:29 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Insidious said: Yes, getting to the core core of an issue usually reveals some ugly, uncomfortable truths or dilemmas that most people would rather pretend don't exist.. It's human nature to take the easy way out, the path of least resistance and it can be observed in many issues from relationships to politics....
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   Know Your Body, Know Your Mind, Know Your Substance, Know Your Source
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Kickle
Wanderer


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Re: Ever get the feeling [Re: Icelander]
#19218066 - 12/02/13 04:30 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I fully agree and as a lifelong depressed person can attest to it. There was a few years there in the middle when I had things going my way and the depression was minimal. I had lots of dreams that gave my life meaning. They were all unrealistic as it turned out and so over time the depression deepened until suicide seems like a very attractive choice and I don't do it because I lack the courage of my convictions. With age chronic pain issues haven't helped one bit. Realistically I know that there is no great healing ahead of me only further breakdown and decay. The future seems mostly empty now that I don't live under the illusion of my immortality and supernatural success in life.
I have my dogs, I have you guys and I have one very dear woman in my life, music and some drugs. Those make things bearable part of the time but my brain chemistry is just depressive no matter what anymore.
Sounds pretty grim right. It is very grim to actually be living it. I don't paint a pretty picture of the reality behind the persona of Master Icelander but there is no real point in lying to you all. Lying doesn't change it.
What's a poor boy to do? Joke has always been on me.
I wish I was one of those happy winners I hear about but that's not my fate. Not to say I haven't had some very awesome experiences in my life. I just wish they added up to something that fixed my mental state. I once had a therapist tell me that considering my childhood it's amazing that I'm mostly sane. Little does she know. 
And blah blah blah
Yeah it sucks man. I know I'm fairly balanced but it doesn't seem like it would take much to throw it off at any given point. I don't have much meaning in my life so I'm almost entirely dependent on beneficial circumstances. I've come to find that others are kinder towards me than I am to myself. Aging will likely be very unkind to me.
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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