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InvisibleInsidious
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Registered: 11/14/13
Posts: 43
Loc: Ontario Flag
American Healthcare Expenditures
    #19211256 - 12/01/13 05:16 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I would like to hear your opinions on why the US has the highest per capita expeditures on Healthcare.. Is this just Government/public expenditures, or is this private/personal costs too? Is medical research included in this number?


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Insidious]
    #19211418 - 12/01/13 07:32 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I think a big part of it is the consumer who buys into the notion that every little twitch has to be checked out immediately and in detail.  And of course the doctor wants to please the patient and the pharmaceutical salesman so he gets his perks.  The problem in a nutshell imo is human nature. Specifically our cultural version of it.

My Brother in Law is currently dying of Bone Cancer.  Every time he gets a new pain they do a CT scan giving him a nice dose of radiation and chalking up an amazing bill for services.  He is having at least 5 to 7 doctor/hospital appointments per week right now.  And he's still going to die.  They all know this except him maybe.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflinePhred
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Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 18 days
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Insidious]
    #19211453 - 12/01/13 07:56 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I would like to hear your opinions on why the US has the highest per capita expeditures on Healthcare



America also has the highest per capita wealth. They not only spend more than anyone else on health care, but also on cars, consumer electronics, clothes, toys for their kids... they spend more on health care because they can.

Also, the third party payment system conceals costs. If your insurance company is going to foot the bill you have no incentive to shop around for the best value when you are contemplating an elective procedure or any other medical expenditure. Why bother? The insurance company is footing the bill and we've been told all our lives that insurance companies are greedy rapacious evil corporations looking to screw us so why should we do them any favors?

Third, American medicine is cutting edge and everyone wants cutting edge. No one wants five year old or ten year old technology when it comes to medical stuff. Cutting edge is pricey. Always has been, always will be.

I can think of more reasons but I have to do something now. I may add more later.


Phred


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Offlinesweeper54
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Registered: 11/07/12
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Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Phred]
    #19212483 - 12/01/13 12:34 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)



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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #19212687 - 12/01/13 01:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

If ACA is the law of the land how come Obama keeps violating it?


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Phred]
    #19212725 - 12/01/13 01:26 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Third, American medicine is cutting edge and everyone wants cutting edge.

This is not a valid point, as most of good medicine, old proven technology is just helping the body heal itself. It works, and is applicable, I'm just guessing here, but probably this is what 98 percent of what American doctors as whole use as treatment for any given need for treatment. IMO opinion, Americans in general don't realize this and so have been sold on the prospect of pricey stuff that most of them will never need. 

Also, the third party payment system conceals costs. If your insurance company is going to foot the bill you have no incentive to shop around for the best value when you are contemplating an elective procedure or any other medical expenditure. Why bother?

Indeed, but many of third party payment systems list who you can shop with, by not using their approved providers you must paying extra. This cannot be attributed wholly to the consumer as the limitations are built into the system.

And your first point is suspect, as the massive amount of money that Americans have to spend, in a global market it should attract competition, such as Walmart has provided in the retail markey.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: falcon] * 1
    #19212772 - 12/01/13 01:39 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

And your first point is suspect, as the massive amount of money that Americans have to spend, in a global market it should attract competition, such as Walmart has provided in the retail markey.



You know two areas of medicine that aren't covered by insurance? Laser eye surgery and cosmetic surgery. Those are the two specialties where prices have been dropping for decades. Probably just a coincidence.

Quote:

This is not a valid point, as most of good medicine, old proven technology is just helping the body heal itself.



From heart attacks? Strokes? Diabetes? Prostate cancer? Cataracts? Ulcers? Ninja, please! Nobody who can afford it would take a generic antibiotic whose patent had expired and has a clinical success record of 85% cure rate when they can get a newer proprietary antibiotic which has a success record of 96% but costs ten times as much. You haven't thought this through.


Phred


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Phred]
    #19212903 - 12/01/13 02:04 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

From heart attacks? Strokes? Diabetes? Prostate cancer? Cataracts? Ulcers? Ninja, please! Nobody who can afford it would take a generic antibiotic whose patent had expired and has a clinical success record of 85% cure rate when they can get a newer proprietary antibiotic which has a success record of 96% but costs ten times as much. You haven't thought this through.

I think maybe in strokes there have been considerable improvement in the last 5 to 10 years. Where have there been improvements in any of the other things mentioned?


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Offlinepsyconaught
Chemical Connoisseur


Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 6,100
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: falcon] * 1
    #19213045 - 12/01/13 02:31 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

http://www.medpagetoday.com/InfectiousDisease/PublicHealth/17594
in general medical  advances over the past 5 - 10 years. The article was published about 2 years ago so it doesn't contain the more recent stuff like medical 3d printing, which is going to be fucking revolutionary.


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Think for yourself, question authority


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OfflineBig_Dave
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Registered: 07/07/13
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Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: psyconaught]
    #19213273 - 12/01/13 03:15 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Another reason our costs are so high is because our choice of OTC medication is pathetic. If whats wrong with you cant be fixed with a little tylenol, then you need to go see a doctor. Then they usually prescribe the weakest prescription possible and tell you to come back if it doesnt work. Not to mention that you're also probably taking off work to make the appointment. Thats all pretty expensive if you already know whats wrong with you. And in a lot of cases a quick google search of you're symptoms can at least point you in the right direction. What I'd like to see is self diagnosis kits at pharmacies with phamacists that can give me the drugs that actually work. As far as Im concerned, I dont want to see a doctor unless I really have to.


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Invisiblememes
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Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 27,785
Loc: In a Tree
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Big_Dave] * 1
    #19214383 - 12/01/13 07:40 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

It's very simple. 


  • We're Rich.  Not only can we afford necessary life-saving surgeries and procedures, we also can afford (and do purchase) procedures and appointments that aren't necessary - braces, non-emergency tonsillectomies, etc.  Even beyond that, we have so much money that we spend it on perfecting our physical appearance since we can't deal with not being perfect.  Boob jobs.  Face lifts.  Implants.  The list can go on forever.  I briefly touched on our inability to deal with shit, keep it in mind - it'll come back later.

  • We're horribly unhealthy:  We are lazy as fuck, and eat complete garbage.

  • Our system is Screwy: Doctors are enticed to prescribe meds.  People can't deal with shit, and want meds.  We have a fuckton of people on meds.


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Offlinepsyconaught
Chemical Connoisseur


Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 6,100
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: memes]
    #19214390 - 12/01/13 07:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

memes said:
It's very simple. 


  • We're Rich.  Not only can we afford necessary life-saving surgeries and procedures, we also can afford (and do purchase) procedures and appointments that aren't necessary - braces, non-emergency tonsillectomies, etc.  Even beyond that, we have so much money that we spend it on perfecting our physical appearance since we can't deal with not being perfect.  Boob jobs.  Face lifts.  Implants.  The list can go on forever.  I briefly touched on our inability to deal with shit, keep it in mind - it'll come back later.

  • We're horribly unhealthy:  We are lazy as fuck, and eat complete garbage.




pretty much


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Think for yourself, question authority


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Invisiblememes
Blessed


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 27,785
Loc: In a Tree
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: psyconaught]
    #19214394 - 12/01/13 07:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i had to edit back in a 3rd bullet piont because i forgot to come back to the mentally unstable part.


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: memes] * 1
    #19214397 - 12/01/13 07:42 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Culture in decline imo.  Just the obesity stats alone would bear this out.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineMush4Brains
LOOL HACKED!!!

Registered: 07/31/13
Posts: 4,419
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19215054 - 12/01/13 10:40 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
If ACA is the law of the land how come Obama keeps violating it?




I'm not sure if you understand the constitution or if you're completely ignorant.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: American Healthcare Expenditures [Re: Mush4Brains] * 1
    #19216405 - 12/02/13 09:17 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Mush4Brains said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
If ACA is the law of the land how come Obama keeps violating it?




I'm not sure if you understand the constitution or if you're completely ignorant.



Show me where in the Constitution it says a President is a dictator who can pick and choose what legislation he will enforce.


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