Home | Community | Message Board

NorthSpore.com BOOMR Bag!
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Bulk Substrate   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2  [ show all ]
Offlinedokunai
Cactus, Cannabis, Cubensis

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 1,878
Loc: Hyphal Heights, USA
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: NWlight]
    #19202488 - 11/28/13 08:29 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
sorry to say it but people are dumb.  they don't care how the drug works, they don't care what the electron transport chain is or what uncouplers are.

i think mommy government truly needs to protect people from their own ignorance sometimes so that companies can't prey on their stupidity.

a fat stupid person would take DNP out of desperation even knowing the risks, and then become a liability.


i don't care if people eat DNP, you see.

i just don't think that it should be legal to make and sell





So, let me ask a few questions for clarification.

If I understand your position, you would be OK with people running private meth labs for their own use, but not OK with commercial meth labs?  I don't necessarily see how those are different, except that a commercial factory can probably make meth that's cheaper and more pure in most cases than a home chemist.

Why does someone need to know about the specific pharmacokinetics/dynamics of a drug beyond possible side effects and interactions to take it?  Do you know the full extent of how your body processes everything you ingest?  Should bottles of vodka require a quiz about acetaldehyde as a metabolite and specific metabolic pathways?

Who decides what the boundaries of mommy government are?  That's why mommy government doesn't work, and frankly the concept is quite disgusting.  Let me give you an example.  Here in America we have a psychotic Christian right, some of whom want to legislate mandatory compliance with Christianity.  They would tend to think certain behaviors like masturbation, exercise of free speech (blashpemy especially), and not having daily prayer are very harmful because Jeebus doesn't like them and you will burn in a lake of fire forever.  Care to have them send the morality police around to check your prayer log?  And ultimately, almost all attempts at stopping people from harming themselves fail, or result in additional harm at the hands of the legal system.

Quote:

a fat stupid person would take DNP out of desperation even knowing the risks, and then become a liability.




:facepalm:  What if I think you're stupid and fat?  Does that give me the right to tell you what to do?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibledeCypher
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: dokunai]
    #19207813 - 11/30/13 08:58 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Never heard of Nadelmann before but I wholly support him and his message.  :thumbup:

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:

NWlight said:
There's a fine line between legalizing all chemicals and ruining all the progress that the FDA has made...
its important that certain things can't be sold because they are legitimately bad for us and some people will sell those things regardless.





Are you talking about tobacco?



No, I'm talking very specifically about medicines and specifically banned medicines.


Some medicines which are VERY effective are also incredibly dangerous.

One example is DNP.  It was popular as a diet pill in the 30s because it caused a huge surge in your metabolism rate, helping you to lose weight.

However, it effects everyone differently and only a little bit too much kills you.  DNP is now illegal to purchase due to the FDA.


There are countless examples of this, where companies would likely resume selling these harmful products again, should every chemical be legal


people on these drug discussion sites often have tunnel vision for the parts where it infringes upon their 'rights' and how the FDA is being hypocritical, while overlooking all of the good that is done by the FDA as well.




I believe that it should the individual's responsibility to decide what they put into their own bodies, given that an individual is someone who is legally above the age of consent.  Even if a drug is harmful to your brain, mind, or body--I should still have the choice as a free adult to take it, IMO.  I should also have the choice to sell a drug on the free market if I so choose... given that my drug is labeled truthfully and perhaps even required to list potential side effects on the side of the bottle.

I can't stand the mentality of those who would mandate themselves as Nannies of the general public and decide what they can or cannot do, provided their actions do not harm anyone else.  :huxleyfacepalm:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: deCypher]
    #19209326 - 11/30/13 05:12 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

provided their actions do not harm anyone else. 





knowingly producing and selling bad medicines= harming others


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibledeCypher
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: NWlight]
    #19210279 - 11/30/13 09:36 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Chemicals that should be treated with respect and/or have a low LD-50 =/= "bad".


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRiparianZoneJunky
hunter/gatherer
Male


Registered: 10/30/11
Posts: 3,055
Loc: Oregon
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: deCypher] * 1
    #19210686 - 11/30/13 11:50 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
Chemicals that should be treated with respect and/or have a low LD-50 =/= "bad".



:fuckinawesome:


--------------------
RZJ's Tea Tek
RZJ's Tradelist


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: RiparianZoneJunky]
    #19210710 - 11/30/13 11:55 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

RiparianZoneJunky said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Chemicals that should be treated with respect and/or have a low LD-50 =/= "bad".



:fuckinawesome:





selling medicines that you know will hurt people and are dangerous is unethical to me.


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRiparianZoneJunky
hunter/gatherer
Male


Registered: 10/30/11
Posts: 3,055
Loc: Oregon
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: NWlight] * 2
    #19211768 - 12/01/13 09:55 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

RiparianZoneJunky said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Chemicals that should be treated with respect and/or have a low LD-50 =/= "bad".



:fuckinawesome:





selling medicines that you know will hurt people and are dangerous is unethical to me.




Guns are dangerous, is selling guns unethical?  So are knives, motorcycles etc.  Sky diving is potentially dangerous, should it be outlawed?  Drugs are tools, when used correctly they can improve life and lead to greater piece of mind, when wielded carelessly they can be destructive.  People should be allowed to ruin their lives if they want, so long as they are fully educated about the dangers before hand.  Why do we cater to protecting the weakest links from their own stupidity and thus punish all the intelligent, responsible people who could enjoy drugs as part of a balanced, complete and rich life?  I am an otherwise law abiding citizen who outwardly is a successful and productive member of society but have to break laws in order to partake in the psychedelic drugs that constitute my spiritual life.  :shrug:


--------------------
RZJ's Tea Tek
RZJ's Tradelist


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibledeCypher
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: RiparianZoneJunky]
    #19211777 - 12/01/13 09:57 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Thanks for putting into words what I was too lazy to say.  :congrats:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRepertoire89
Cat
Male


Registered: 11/15/12
Posts: 21,773
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: RiparianZoneJunky]
    #19213156 - 12/01/13 02:54 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

RiparianZoneJunky said:

Why do we cater to protecting the weakest links from their own stupidity and thus punish all the intelligent, responsible people




Shit man the FAA is working on something to limit pilots weight, because apparently obesity can lead to sleep Apnea. There has been one cited incident for this measure, for that one incident which happened 5 years ago they're going to spend how much money putting this discriminative horse shit into action?



In a statement Wednesday, AOPA estimated the cost of extra testing for pilots between $99 million and $374 million over several years. The association also said that doesn't include the time and costs associated with seeking special medical certificates. The cost for any given individual could vary widely depending on where he or she lived and other factors, AOPA said.

In a letter to the FAA, AOPA President Mark Baker said "an extensive analysis of 10 years of accidents" involving general-aviation aircraft didn't identify sleep apnea "as either a causal or contributing factor" in a single fatal private-plane crash.


:pokerawe:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemy3rdeye
 User Gallery


Registered: 08/10/12
Posts: 4,354
Loc: Canada Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: NWlight]
    #19214788 - 12/01/13 09:14 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
There's a fine line between legalizing all chemicals and ruining all the progress that the FDA has made...
its important that certain things can't be sold because they are legitimately bad for us and some people will sell those things regardless.




The FDA is a puppet of big pharma they are against herbal remedies and you can be damn sure they would oppose mushrooms too.
I don't need a government agency telling me what drugs i can take. Just because other people are stupid doesnt mean i should be told what i can or cannot take. The FDA is the definition of nanny state.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinedokunai
Cactus, Cannabis, Cubensis

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 1,878
Loc: Hyphal Heights, USA
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: NWlight]
    #19220628 - 12/03/13 04:03 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

RiparianZoneJunky said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Chemicals that should be treated with respect and/or have a low LD-50 =/= "bad".



:fuckinawesome:





selling medicines that you know will hurt people and are dangerous is unethical to me.




So, you didn't answer any of my questions, even after I agreed with you that drugs with severe side effects should not be offered as medication.  But no one here is talking about offering LSD, heroin, or cocaine as anything akin to your concept of traditional medicine. 

We are talking about two things.  First is that you do not have the right to control my taking of things that alter my consciousness or affect my body.  Also, we have the fact that users of some substances that are now illegal have enough problems to deal with aside from incarceration and having their assets seized by money hungry cops. 

Are you saying we should continue with the status quo because some substances have an arbitrarily "low" LD-50 and you think you're smarter than anyone who might want to take such a substance?  I guess then that we should limit anything you can kill yourself with, and put people in jail for having such things.  Oh wait, that's everything.  Water has an LD50 too.  Maybe it's below my arbitrary limit for what I think you can handle responsibly.  Sorry, you can't have any water, unless you want to wind up in Pelican Bay.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinedokunai
Cactus, Cannabis, Cubensis

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 1,878
Loc: Hyphal Heights, USA
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: dokunai]
    #19220639 - 12/03/13 04:08 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

And also, for all your grandstanding about DNP, aspirin kills more people in a single day than DNP has ever killed ever.  Let's ban that shit and lock up people running underground aspirin labs for decades upon decades.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineIcyus
KavitārkikasiṃHa
Male


Registered: 11/07/13
Posts: 3,502
Loc: Inbetween.
Last seen: 8 years, 1 month
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: dokunai]
    #19220644 - 12/03/13 04:12 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Well... alot of idiots are going to be killing themselves out of ignorance.. but then again.. we are seven billion on this tiny planet, so it wouldnt be too much harm getting rid of some idiots either, would it? It isnt like they are an endagered species..


--------------------
And thus begins the  reverse-fusing of our one-dimentional understanding, and adds ever-expanding perspectives, in depth and number; splitting our perception, and in so doing, seemingly irrationally, creates yet more one-ness, with all that ever was, is and will ever be, streching across the infinite, inunderstood concept of everything, percievable and not.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: Icyus]
    #19243389 - 12/08/13 01:48 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

maybe DNP hasnt killed many people because you cant buy it any more, no? It was not legal for very long.

also not saying people should be stopped from taking medicines that will harm or kill them.  Im cool with the human rights aspect of this, I understand and agree with you.  Go ahead, make your own DNP and eat it.

But if someone goes around saying DNP is healthy and people should take it becofore selling it to them, my opinion is that the person doing so should not be immune from criticism and legal action.


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


Edited by NWlight (12/08/13 03:06 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRepertoire89
Cat
Male


Registered: 11/15/12
Posts: 21,773
Re: Legalize all drugs? The man behind loosening pot laws in US eyes new goal [Re: NWlight]
    #19243402 - 12/08/13 01:59 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Lack of drug safety awareness is one of the biggest drawbacks from prohibition, really bizarre imo


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2  [ show all ]

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Bulk Substrate   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Pot laws DO NOT apply to medical users!!! DazedSol 1,882 1 12/26/03 11:49 PM
by DailyPot
* New pot law to be delayed motamanM 2,007 1 05/14/03 08:17 PM
by sir tripsalot
* Legal Drugs Pose Highest Health Threat Sheepish 2,163 4 03/23/04 05:40 PM
by DailyPot
* (Canada) Liberals Plan Pot Law Reforms trendalM 3,853 5 04/25/03 03:28 AM
by GratefulDread
* Bill to protect medicinal pot users falls short in House motamanM 4,156 4 08/17/03 08:21 PM
by Demiurge
* Update on Canadian Pot Saga WildCardsRevenge 3,750 8 02/06/03 08:23 PM
by Mitchnast
* MARYLAND GOV. EHRLICH SIGNS MARIJUANA LAW motamanM 5,282 3 05/27/03 06:27 AM
by Seuss
* The Drug War Goes Up in Smoke (lengthy but worthwhile read) Demiurge 5,379 2 08/14/03 06:17 AM
by TheHobbit

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: motaman, veggie, Alan Rockefeller, Mostly_Harmless
2,904 topic views. 0 members, 5 guests and 2 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.024 seconds spending 0.005 seconds on 13 queries.