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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: elax420]
    #19482644 - 01/27/14 06:13 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

They wouldn't settle a frivolous suit. It's much cheaper to get a frivolous suit dismissed.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19482722 - 01/27/14 06:29 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

I don’t know what you are trying to argue man. I think that depends on the company more than anything. Sometimes the PR hit wouldn’t be worth it, basically there are so many variables at play you can’t say if X then Y.

Im just getting sick of this thread popping up in my list, and i thought it was funny that when i left Zap was pretending to be a business man now he’s pretending to be a lawyer.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: elax420]
    #19482740 - 01/27/14 06:32 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
I don’t know what you are trying to argue man. I think that depends on the company more than anything. Sometimes the PR hit wouldn’t be worth it, basically there are so many variables at play you can’t say if X then Y.

Im just getting sick of this thread popping up in my list, and i thought it was funny that when i left Zap was pretending to be a business man now he’s pretending to be a lawyer.



I'm a business man who understands business law to a certain extent.  Was I right or was I wrong?


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: elax420]
    #19482746 - 01/27/14 06:33 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

From where I sit, it looks more like you're the one doing that.  Either way, there is a "hide thread" function if you don't want to see it pop up in your threads.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19482878 - 01/27/14 06:59 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
I don’t know what you are trying to argue man. I think that depends on the company more than anything. Sometimes the PR hit wouldn’t be worth it, basically there are so many variables at play you can’t say if X then Y.

Im just getting sick of this thread popping up in my list, and i thought it was funny that when i left Zap was pretending to be a business man now he’s pretending to be a lawyer.



I'm a business man who understands business law to a certain extent.  Was I right or was I wrong?





Im just pissed you are going to win the Super Bowl bet off of my team :crankey:


Seriously though tort seems like it is a snorefest and a half. Unfortunately i have a class where this is the only shit we talk about. Dude has spent a lot of time talking about people who got fucked over trying to sue big corporations. I would never do it personally.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: elax420]
    #19482973 - 01/27/14 07:11 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

From my experience I find it far more fascinating than criminal law.  The thought experiments seem way more intricate.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19482998 - 01/27/14 07:16 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

It is very different because both parties have to play by the same rules.  Litigation can be boring as fuck though, and trials are extremely rare.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19483052 - 01/27/14 07:24 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Ya the professor was saying 9/10 cases settle out of court or something crazy like that.

Depositions seems like they could get real interesting aside from that i think criminal law is more interesting in about every way. Maybe intellectual property could be cool :shrug:


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19483129 - 01/27/14 07:37 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
It is very different because both parties have to play by the same rules.  Litigation can be boring as fuck though, and trials are extremely rare.



Don't most criminal cases get settled as well?

I am quite sure the actual trials are mostly tedious unto death.  I just find the intellectual trappings far more interesting especially since it is a level field in the legal sense.  Preponderance of evidence vs beyond a reasonable doubt makes for far more intricate reasonings.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19483215 - 01/27/14 07:50 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Preponderance of evidence doesn't even come into play until trial.

Sure, most criminal cases don't go to trial, but it's something like ten times more likely in criminal than civil.  Over 99% of civil cases end before trial.  A lot of lawyers hate trial, but I love it.  It's a lot of work, but it's a rush.  I love the competition, and trial draws on many different skills that are either at your fingertips or you get pwned.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19483301 - 01/27/14 08:04 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Preponderance of evidence doesn't even come into play until trial.




You really don't think they make an assessment on that issue before trial?  Say after discovery somebody finds out that, Holy Shit, they knew that!
Quote:



Sure, most criminal cases don't go to trial, but it's something like ten times more likely in criminal than civil.  Over 99% of civil cases end before trial.  A lot of lawyers hate trial, but I love it.  It's a lot of work, but it's a rush.  I love the competition, and trial draws on many different skills that are either at your fingertips or you get pwned.




My wife's ex-husband is a criminal defense attorney who doesn't make much money because he was too lazy to actually get paying clients.  From what I understand from good sources he has an incredible rate of success at trial.

For my money I would rather trick somebody into killing his case in a deposition and then imagine the face palm when they figure out what just happened.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19483350 - 01/27/14 08:14 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Preponderance of evidence is only a level playing field in theory.  It's determined by a jury, usually, and that changes everything.  Even in bench trials, judges bring their baggage to the trial.

Deposition is fun, too, but you can't really play the same games you can at trial.  Lawyers can pause the deposition, sometimes for days...that gives the witnesses lots of opportunities to change tactics.  Also, the witness gets the transcript afterward and gets to make corrections.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19483361 - 01/27/14 08:17 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Also, the witness gets the transcript afterward and gets to make corrections.




That's terrible:shocked:  What's the fucking point, then, if they can change it anytime they want?  Do they have to include what they amended it from, i.e. the original transcript?


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19483384 - 01/27/14 08:22 PM (10 years, 3 days ago)

When corrections are made, the witness can be cross examined using the original statements made at deposition as well as his corrections.  The corrected version, however, is the one that is used for motions, etc.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19484476 - 01/28/14 01:31 AM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Really, because the lawyer i was talking to made it seem like the depositions sole purpose is to put tons of pressure on the witness, and the witness is under oath so it doesn’t seem like it would be hard to get them to slip up after 4 hours, or however ungodly amount of time you are given with them.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: elax420]
    #19484787 - 01/28/14 04:52 AM (10 years, 3 days ago)

Depositions do put a witness under a lot of pressure, and they are a good way to get information.  When compared to other forms of discovery like interrogatories (written questions) and requests for documents, they are far more likely to get a spontaneous answer.  You absolutely can lock a witness into a position and use it against the other party later, but the end product is rarely fatal to the opponent's case.

Depositions serve several goals:

1. To gather information
2. To test the witness' performance under pressure
3. To show the other party the witness' weakness
4. To commit the witness before trial so he/she won't be able to change the story.

All of these are designed to position your party for a better settlement.  Once in awhile, deposition testimony will be dispositive of the case, but it isn't a common occurrence. Usually, depositions just serve to inform both parties about the relative strengths of their cases in order to determine an appropriate settlement amount.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19488046 - 01/28/14 07:14 PM (10 years, 2 days ago)

If a lawyer suspects a witness has a piece of information that only the witness knows, but won't reveal if asked directly, might the lawyer frame a set of questions for the deposition that would at least confirm his suspicion?  It would be information gathering I guess.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19488142 - 01/28/14 07:30 PM (10 years, 2 days ago)

The trick to taking depositions well is to take the deponent right to the edge of making an admission he doesn't want to make without directly asking the question.  This can only be done if the deponent doesn't know where you're headed with a line of questions.  I like to go off on tangents that may be completely irrelevant just to get a few key facts out without tipping off my plan.  Later, once those facts are on the record, I'll confirm them in an order which lets the witness know exactly what he's already admitted and how I plan to argue his testimony.  Then he and his attorney, and opposing counsel if the deponent isn't a party, are aware of how this witness will play at trial.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: Enlil]
    #19488178 - 01/28/14 07:35 PM (10 years, 2 days ago)

that's what I was  eluding too.  Frame questions so he doesn't know the piece of information your are trying to get is the one he is hiding.


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Re: Government Vs. Business What Are Your Views? [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19488242 - 01/28/14 07:49 PM (10 years, 2 days ago)

Alluding.  Just so you know


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