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Le_Canard
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Here's political thing that pisses me off...
#19203485 - 11/29/13 03:18 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I am of the opinion that the Citizen's United ruling was a really bad idea. Furthermore, corporations are not "people". Thoughts? Comments? Keep it civil folks.
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starfire_xes
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: Le_Canard] 1
#19203559 - 11/29/13 04:08 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ToiletDuk said: I am of the opinion that the Citizen's United ruling was a really bad idea. Furthermore, corporations are not "people". Thoughts? Comments? Keep it civil folks. 
I believe that calling corporations 'people' is for the purpose of having someone to sue in lieu of an individual. Otherwise, it would be hard to bring a suit against a company if you couldn't find a real person to blame.
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Le_Canard
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: starfire_xes]
#19203562 - 11/29/13 04:09 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I see. Well, I still don't like that ruling. It gives them too much influence in the political process.
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zappaisgod
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: Le_Canard] 1
#19204806 - 11/29/13 12:52 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Tough shit. Unions can broadcast all the crap they want and so can the news media, almost all of whom are, wait for it, corporations. Citizens United was a start to taking away the fraudulent media's power to control. Almost every fucking page of the NY Times should be considered a campaign contribution to Democrats.
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Enlil
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: Le_Canard]
#19204999 - 11/29/13 02:02 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ToiletDuk said: I see. Well, I still don't like that ruling. It gives them too much influence in the political process.
I think you're misunderstanding the impact of the ruling. The point is that people have the right to freedom of speech. No speech is more protected than political speech. If you and I can both spend money to endorse or criticize a candidate, why shouldn't we be able to pool our money and make better use of it?
That really is all Citizen's United stands for. It recognizes that PACs are just groups of like minded people pooling their money to get their message out more broadly.
Keep in mind that the alternative is far more unfair. Without the ability to pool money, only the rich could afford to advertise for or against a candidate effectively. The average joe would be virtually unheard in comparison. Citizen's United allows 10000 average joes to be heard when they pool their money together.
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Le_Canard
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: Enlil]
#19207173 - 11/30/13 01:44 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well, okay, that makes sense, but still wouldn't that come down to $ voting instead of people?
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: Le_Canard]
#19207187 - 11/30/13 01:51 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Obviously they are not people, because people have the ability to claim rights independently, not as a conglomeration. A corporation is much more akin to an Idea, which is only existing in peoples minds rather than existing in reality. If it is many people that make a corporation then how can a corporation be a person?
Does a mother give birth to a corporation through her vaginal orifice?
Makes no sense to me.
I mean a fetus has less rights, and it is way closer to a human/person.
Simple ratification, define people as having the human attribute, derp.
I really don't know of any people that aren't human, do you?
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207194 - 11/30/13 01:56 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Looks like the corporations haven't convinced the dictionaries yet . . lol
Quote:
peoΒ·ple ΛpΔpΙl/Submit noun 1. human beings in general or considered collectively. "the earthquake killed 30,000 people" synonyms: human beings, persons, individuals, humans, mortals, (living) souls, personages, men, women, and children; More the citizens of a country, esp. when considered in relation to those who govern them. noun: the people "his economic reforms no longer have the support of the people" synonyms: citizens, subjects, electors, voters, taxpayers, residents, inhabitants, (general) public, citizenry, nation, population, populace More those without special rank or position in society; the populace. noun: the people "he is very much a man of the people" synonyms: common people, proletariat, masses, populace, rank and file, commonality, plebeians; More a person's parents or relatives. noun: one's people; plural noun: one's peoples "my people live in West Virginia" synonyms: family, parents, relatives, relations, folks, kinsmen, kin, kith and kin, kinsfolk, flesh and blood, nearest and dearest More the supporters or employees of a person in a position of power or authority. noun: one's people; plural noun: one's peoples "I've had my people watching the house for some time now" the state prosecution in a trial. plural noun: People; noun: the People "pretrial statements made by the People's witnesses" 2. the men, women, and children of a particular nation, community, or ethnic group. "the native peoples of Canada" synonyms: race, (ethnic) group, tribe, clan More verb verb: people; 3rd person present: peoples; past tense: peopled; past participle: peopled; gerund or present participle: peopling 1. (of a particular group of people) inhabit (an area or place). "an arid mountain region peopled by warring clans" synonyms: populate, settle (in), colonize, inhabit, live in, occupy; More
So I guess our government redefines definition as is seen fit for their wallets.
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psyconaught
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207205 - 11/30/13 02:10 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
human beings in general or considered collectively.
that sounds like a corporation to me
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: psyconaught]
#19207212 - 11/30/13 02:19 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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The corporation isn't the beings, they are the idea of the beings, which to me is a huge difference.
A corporation doesn't literally speak, sleep, eat or shit. It doesn't have DNA and it isn't alive, a living being should have more rights than a corporation, because a living being can feel pain. Your idea feels no pain, it has no cns.
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psyconaught
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207218 - 11/30/13 02:26 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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i corporation is a group of people acting together for a single goal. Corporations are made of of living beings. When a corporation decides something it is a group of humans deciding something.
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: psyconaught]
#19207222 - 11/30/13 02:29 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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The corporation isn't literally made of human beings, it is made of their idea's. The corporations could die and the humans still live, but if the humans all died, would the corporations remain?
We can look at it from the natural stand point as well. If nature is everything besides humans and their creations then are corporations considered natural?
Only natural beings are alive. Idea's don't have rights in reality, only in a psuedo economical ponzi scheme, would they have the rights that natural living beings have.
Edited by teknix (11/30/13 02:36 AM)
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207227 - 11/30/13 02:38 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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If all the people of a tribe dies, the tribe ceases to exist, can you say that is true of a corporation? There are so many differences it is ridiculous to even consider a corporation as a person.
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psyconaught
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207228 - 11/30/13 02:40 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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the reason corporations have rights is because corporations are people. Its as simple as that, 'corporation' is simply a legal term recognizing a group acting together. Why should people lose rights when working together as a group?
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: psyconaught]
#19207241 - 11/30/13 02:48 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Corporation don't just have rights, they have peoples rights . .
Sure they should have rights, but they shouldn't be considered as a person, it is too far imo, especially when many other living beings do not get those rights, which imo, are way in front of the corporations in line.
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psyconaught
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207242 - 11/30/13 02:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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why should a group of people have less rights than a single person?
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: psyconaught]
#19207245 - 11/30/13 02:50 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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The people already have rights . .
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207248 - 11/30/13 02:52 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Can a corporation give people more rights some how or even at all?
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psyconaught
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: teknix]
#19207250 - 11/30/13 02:53 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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a corporation is a group of people acting together. So if a group of people are building computers together why should they have less rights than a single person building a computer in his garage?
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teknix
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Re: Here's political thing that pisses me off... [Re: psyconaught]
#19207254 - 11/30/13 02:56 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Not really, there are a few people in a corporation acting together over the others. You think everyone in a coorporation has an equal say?
The head honcho's speak for the corps,(like 3-10 people out of hundreds) not the people in general as you make it seem.
Why does a corp need right if the people already have them?
So if I spit on an office building I should be charged with assaulting a person?
If I break a window out of a building then I am hurting a person, as in causing them literal pain?
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