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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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Loc: Onypeirophóros
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it's not withdrawl it's an side effect.
read the Erowid link, (after effects last for up to a day; as in the DAY AFTER INGESTION) it shows that there are after effects to having smoked Marijuana, in which are included the apparent SIDE EFFECTS of Marijuana which can include (commonly) tiredness, lack of appetite or libido (can't forget that) ect ect...
as i've said, by your definition all of what any drug induces are "side effects"; which could be true; if we all didn't refer to the drugs common desirable effects as INTENDED EFFECTS.
again, you are the one who is confused. stop saying i am, when you're not able to comprehend what i am saying. i've comprehend what you're saying, now you return the favor. this is how debate works.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
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Quote:
DatIslandLife said: We live in the age of information. There's no point dealing with these people, they are clearly irrational and close-minded, so why bother? You and millions of others know the truth, and that's fine. Don't let it get to you, maintain that weed-smoking stereotype 
funny thing is, i betray the stereotype... i can function just fine "getting off" weed, and i do "get off weed" on a regular basis. which is why ad hominem attacks on me "being to stoned to tell, or just going through withdrawl" are completely not only unfounded but hysterically side tracking as well.
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LittleDipster


Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 4,141
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Quote:
akira_akuma said: it's not withdrawl it's an side effect.
read the Erowid link, it shows that there are after effects to having smoked Marijuana, in which are included the apparent SIDE EFFECTS of Marijuana which an include (commonly) tiredness, lack of appetite or libido (can't forget that) ect ect...
as i've said, by your definition ALL drugs induce are "side effects"; which could be true; if we all didn't refer to the drugs common desirable effects as INTENDED EFFECTS.
again, you are the one who is confused. stop saying i am, when you're not able to comprehend what i am saying. i've comprehend what you're saying, now you return the favor. this is how debate works.
yes those are side effects that happen when using weed. once again those same side effects can also happen after you've stopped suddenly, making them withdrawal symptoms. These withdrawal symptoms can last for a few days, making them not side effects of the drug, because you aren't using that drug any longer.
effects from stopping a drug are withdrawal symptoms.
undesirable effects while using a drug are side effects.
it doesn't matter if they are similar effects or the same. Most people have increased appetite then stop smoking and have a decreased appetite. that would make that a withdrawal symptom, not a " counter-indicated by the initial intended effect"
that isn't the way it works. I'm done with this pointless debate because you are just not getting it.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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they don't last for a few days; not unless you are heavy user, in with which you're used to and are pray to these SIDE EFFECTS; because it's what you generally experience on a day to day basis (being such a heavy user).
as i said, upon stopping the drug, you can have an occurrence of these after effects, long after the drugs initial effects have worn off; and because of that these after effects are easily confused for withdrawl symptoms.
any sort of withdrawl you're getting at, is simply because of your usual ability to "smoke to induce the desired effects" being taken away... you experience the after effects (without taking the drug to reverse this) and they can be wildly similar to withdrawl, and easily confused with it. this is where you are getting confused, not me.
as i've said, Marijuana can have withdrawl effects, and they include some of the usual side effects experienced by the user, only stronger; because this is what the user is used to feeling without weed, from having used it so long and so much. but if the user is smoking weed one day, and then not the next, and he's not a habitual user; then he can experience these after effects, and conclude that he's in withdrawl; when that simply isn't the case. you need to differentiate between what is a common after effect, and what is withdrawl; and the withdrawl (in Marijuana's case) is simply a stronger effect of the drugs SIDE EFFECTS; which are exemplified DURING withdrawl; because withdrawl happens immediately after ceasing long term use. good bye.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
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anyways, another great miscomprehended fact, is that Marijuana CAUSES mental disorder.
it's been shown that there is no link between Marijuana's EFFECTS leading to mental disorder. there may be a physiological reason as to why there is an increased risk of developing psychosis or other similar disorders, but they haven't been proven yet; and may never be...
it's apparent though, that latent pre-existing disorders may be exacerbated by the use of Marijuana, which would indeed increase risk factors for people who use Marijuana; though this can be attributed to the possibility that the user(s) already had the pre-existing condition(s) to begin with; thus skewing any empirical data; which leads researchers to conclude that: there is an increased RISK to developing psychosis or other mental disorders with Cannabis use, ALTHOUGH there is no verifiable data to conclude a direct link to Cananbis use.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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What's this withdrawal shit you guys are talking about with weed?
I've smoked virtually every single day for 15,16 years. Multiple times a day. I can take breaks for a week or two at a time and not have ANY negative withdrawal side effects?
You must be smoking different weed than me
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
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Re: anti-Marijuana Shills [Re: Shroomism]
#19190399 - 11/26/13 04:06 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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they think that because they get tired and hungry for a few days after they stop smoking, that they re experiencing "withdrawl".
apparently.
either that or the withdrawl is gonna sneak up on you if you stop smoking long enough!1 BEWARE!
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Normal Flora



Registered: 05/16/10
Posts: 882
Last seen: 1 month, 2 days
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Quote:
akira_akuma said: as i said, upon stopping the drug, you can have an occurrence of these after effects, long after the drugs initial effects have worn off; and because of that these after effects are easily confused for withdrawl symptoms.
I totally agree with you here. The moment you cease a drug doesn't make everything that happens afterward a withdrawl symptom. That would be crazy.
Also, I think the medical community likes to over-diagnose. A few doctors just need to tell some of these kids "You were just way too high, bro. You just can't handle teh pot"
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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^ this
doctards over-diagnose, over-prescribing, over-scintillating their every opinion, like it's fact.
alot of people are taken to this degree of illogical thinking.
PS: plus i think LittleDipster was just arguing for the sake of Semantics, and not actually trying to get what i was saying. 
PPS: i stopped my House M.D. episode, and lo and behold, it was "Ignorance is Bliss" that i was watching before this instance of explaining over... and over... and over...
and over... and over again; what makes Marijuana so safe and so easy to over exaggerate.
coincidence. maybe.
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Normal Flora



Registered: 05/16/10
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Last seen: 1 month, 2 days
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It's not a coincidence.
Hah! I'm always on your side akira
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
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i wonder if it's because of my immense diagnostic skills
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
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Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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PS: Quote:
Quote:
I personally find that out of all the drugs I have taken weed is the worst for itching at these predispositions and makes quick work of bringing them to the surface
i will address this as it leads to my main point.
you guys say that people WILL IN FACT become more predisposed to a medical disorder, BECAUSE you smoke weed.
I SAY, it's because take weed to lightly and underestimate it's effects on the psyche over time, especially if you are prone to believing that it could possibly "drive you" to having these conditions or disorders.
which is your point, right?
well, it's not AN EFFECT of weed, it's an effect YOU COERCE by making sustained changes to your brain chemistry, without taking heed of the possible dangers of constantly and consistently dosing yourself with drugs. it's YOUR irresponsibility that causes you to think that you're not already predisposed to mental illness, to begin with.
it's YOUR EFFECT. not the weeds.
^this is my hypothesis on why weed gets labelled as a drug that causes mental disorder. (beyond scientific findings overall, that is.)
and this...
Quote:
yes those are side effects that happen when using weed. once again those same side effects can also happen after you've stopped suddenly, making them withdrawal symptoms.
is a false dichotomy. this is one of the illogical pursuits that curtailed from this thread.
saying that side effects or after effects, stop being side effects and after effects and turn to withdrawl effects, because the user stops using weed is faulty logic. withdrawl symptoms can be not only exacerbated by the initial after effects of the drug, but can also "co-mingle", so to speak, with the initial after effects of the drug.
the initial effects of the drug do not simply "BECOME" withdrawl effects, because you've ceased the drug. they can't BECOME anything that they aren't already.
this is why we have definitions for words and lexicon of many different conjunctions, compounding words ect ect...
because we use words, to assimilate and divide the intentional meanings of each individual category of a logical inference.
PPS: to further push this point, i can say that "saying that an effect that occurs after the cessation of the drug is a withdrawl effect and i could CALL IT a WITHDRAWL EFFECT, and it could be true, and would be if it was under the definition of what constitutes a withdrawl effect from that particular drug. ALTHOUGH it doesn't make it true in all cases because not all effects after using a drug ARE WITHDRAWL EFFECTS.
language. it's complicated.
Edited by akira_akuma (11/26/13 05:02 AM)
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TwinEclipse
Psychedelic Alchemist

Registered: 07/06/13
Posts: 1,499
Loc: NGC1097
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I can't say that marijuana affected my life negatively(love my life and it's journey)...but it has enhanced my HPPD/depersonalization effects from a REALLY REALLY horrible LSA trip.
I Ate 15 seeds and they were so potent they made me feel in a dream like state for months...had to stop smoking and consuming drugs(MDMA) for a bit for the morphing/change of colors to stop appearing.
I feel better now though. I had some dart thoughts back then on life...I kept trying to rationalize my existence and its value.
The best cure for HPPD/depersonalization symptoms is extended abstinence, IMO.
-------------------- My purpose: to love, to share, and to experience....all while conforming to my psychedelic experiences.
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broken
455 member(s)



Registered: 09/07/10
Posts: 14,063
Loc: fuckyeah!
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Quote:
JesusGoneRogue said: everbody's entitled to their own opinion. i'm honestly just worried about you.
Quote:
akira_akuma said: because of words on the internet?
words on the internet make me worried about a lot of people.
just sayin'
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Normal Flora



Registered: 05/16/10
Posts: 882
Last seen: 1 month, 2 days
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Quote:
akira_akuma said: PPS: to further push this point, i can say that "saying that an effect that occurs after the cessation of the drug is a withdrawl effect and i could CALL IT a WITHDRAWL EFFECT, and it could be true, and would be if it was under the definition of what constitutes a withdrawl effect from that particular drug. ALTHOUGH it doesn't make it true in all cases because not all effects after using a drug ARE WITHDRAWL EFFECTS.
language. it's complicated.
I was thinking that while reading this thread. Well not that exactly, but it's almost impossible to argue about this subject. It's not at all black and white. Even though biochemistry acts in generally the same way, the subtle differences between each individual's biochemistry makes a subject like this a whole lot of grey area.
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hidenseek1
Its got all the dinks.
Registered: 12/22/12
Posts: 5,423
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id like to add that i believe daily smokers dont notice negative effects due to the combination of cbd build up, and thc tolerance
i draw this conclusion from experience, when i smoked everyday i didnt really notice certain things till i stopped for a few months, then all of a sudden i hated weed, and havnt smoked it in years
also, it seems that only people who dont smoke daily post these kinds of threads
-------------------- You can drink at 7 A.M., because the Beastie Boys fought for that right -------------------------------------------------------------------------- pons asinorum -------------------------------------------------------------------------- lsd and the vietnam war changed music forever
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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Re: anti-Marijuana Shills [Re: hidenseek1]
#19192239 - 11/26/13 02:04 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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no one should be using a drug daily, unless it's for medicinal use.
simply put, it's a mistake that many people make, because every single solitary drug has negative effects, and people who use a drug daily for medication have to live with those negative effects; because the positive outweighs negative in this regard.
but if one is using not for medicinal purposes but for recreational purposes, but continuously uses, you're simply ASKING for problems.
not the drug's fault; but the persons fault
and in the case of Marijuana, it's easy to abuse because it's so easy to attain and so easy to take without losing your functionality in your day to day living... but any drug, even the "softer" drugs, get catch up with you to bite you in the ass; though with Marijuana, like Coffee, it's pretty damn easy to see your way through to NOT misusing or abusing the drug, because it's so lacking in addictive qualities and withdrawal effects, that it's barely an issue for MOST PEOPLE.
which is what Marijuana "enthusiasts" usually preach... which is a far cry from preaching that there is absolutely no bad effects from the drug. no one accepts that, expect the odd "guru" or naturopath that believes that Marijuana is "sacred" or something. yes, this opinions spreads silly enough as it is; usually to the people who are new to Marijuana, but if you'd ask them sensibly, to be honest about any negative effects, i'm sure they'd tell you that although it's hardly an issue for them, that there are negative effects that can lead to someone possibly having a worse off time recreationally using Marijuana, or becoming so enamored by their "favorite" substance that they becoming blinded to the facts of Marijuana use.
but as little as it happens between experienced users of the drug, it leaves little cause for concern over the apparent "lack of concern" towards the typical Marijuana users stance on it's "negative effects", because usually it's in the users best interest to discover what works for him/her while using Marijuana, and to stop using it if it's effecting them negatively; which is as easy as putting down the pipe and effectively quitting inhaling or ingesting the drug, cold turkey.
which is easy, considering the lack of strong withdrawal effects. it's not like quitting Tobacco or quitting Cocaine or Heroin or Ketamine... it's a minor nuisance more then "terrible time".
PS: i just noticed i've been spelling withdrawal WRONG this whole time. damn.
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Bitter Cactus
reformed bad boy



Registered: 01/26/12
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You are so blind kid. Anyone with these illnesses will say that weed is one of the worst drugs for them.
-------------------- Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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yeah, KID, i know, that's why if they HAVE THOSE ILLNESSES, they shouldn't smoke it; because it's BAD FOR THEM. i've never denied that, not even one single time. again, you're projecting your infantile understanding of the argument. YOU'RE BLIND, because i agree with you, and you can't even see that.
PS: i have a family member (twice removed) who has schizophrenia and weed makes his symptoms worse.
you don't seem to understand the fact that, though, that him (like everyone else like him) HAD THE PROBLEM BEFORE SMOKING WEED.
understand this or continue be blitheringly daft.
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Bitter Cactus
reformed bad boy



Registered: 01/26/12
Posts: 11,773
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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Why can they handle most other drugs fine, but when weed comes into the equation they start hearing voices, dissociating, having panic attacks, isolating themselves ect. I think that it works on the mind in a way that most other drugs don't touch. That's what makes it bad for anyone susceptible or with these illnesses. Don't blame them though, they have been taught by people like you that the plant is safe and harmless and just has side effects. Nah, some of the effects weed has on these people are long lasting and serious and I wish you could talk to them face to face cause they would wanna slap you for being ignorant.
-------------------- Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.
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