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Invisibled0urd3n
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Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants
    #19172839 - 11/21/13 10:09 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I didn't know where else to ask this question, mods feel free to move. Thanks.

A list,naming off, or giving links etc for any nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants would be greatly appreciated. I am mainly speaking of drugs that truly would be considered recreation, or could be, based on the dosage (e.g. not adaptogens). This may sound like an odd question to ask, but I consider it interesting and important for a few reasons. Thanks again.


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19172871 - 11/21/13 10:18 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

The one in your signature is a definite candidate.

Datura, plants containing Scopolamine


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19172875 - 11/21/13 10:19 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Datura is NOT recreational.


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Invisibled0urd3n
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19172948 - 11/21/13 10:41 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah I have to agree with starfire I'd estimate less than one percent of people consuming datura/brugmasia (sp), belladonna, etc. enjoy it.


Thanks for throwing out an idea of a potential one though.:thumbup:


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InvisibleLordSenate
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19172958 - 11/21/13 10:43 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Datura is NOT recreational.




This..

and OP sounds like a robot.


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Invisibled0urd3n
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: LordSenate]
    #19172983 - 11/21/13 10:53 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

LordSenate said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Datura is NOT recreational.




This..

and OP sounds like a robot.




Ha. I am just trying to be concise as this is a very specific question.





I thought of thujone as it is thought to be neuro-toxic but I don't think most would consider it recreational either.


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: LordSenate]
    #19173013 - 11/21/13 11:01 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

:lol: missed the part about recreational.

Is aminita even recreational? What about wormwood?


Edited by Everything (11/21/13 11:03 PM)


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OfflineAcaterpillar
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19173017 - 11/21/13 11:02 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

There's probably certain naturally occurring fumes that could kill enough brain cells to get you high. Or kill you.


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InvisibleLordSenate
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173019 - 11/21/13 11:02 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

:shrug:

I know any deliriant sounds like a terrible idea though.


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: LordSenate]
    #19173026 - 11/21/13 11:04 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Definitely. I think dreaming is a much better way to get the same effects.


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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19173044 - 11/21/13 11:14 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

You can't say datura is neurotoxic though. Adverse effects and potential to overdose does not translate to brain damage.


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: s240779]
    #19173051 - 11/21/13 11:18 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I've met two people that had taken it and told me to never take it. One of them had taken datura with a friend, both of them weren't right after but his friend went into a psychosis and is now in a mental ward. I guess you hear the same shit about LSD but I seriously bet you datura is neurotoxic.

Didnt take me long to find a source to back that up...

http://www.inflibnet.ac.in/ojs/index.php/AUJSAT/article/download/516/487


Edited by Everything (11/21/13 11:20 PM)


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OfflineAcaterpillar
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173057 - 11/21/13 11:21 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah it's not something to play with.
I've done it a few times, but never in heavy doses.

Light amounts of Datura with other entheogens is a safer route, but it's still scary as hell for the average person.
Be careful what you're combining it with though. And have a sitter.


--------------------
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*Cough* *Cough*
Ooo...U E I O Aaa...U E I Aaa..A E I O Uuuuu...

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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173065 - 11/21/13 11:25 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Everything said:
I guess you hear the same shit about LSD but I seriously bet you datura is neurotoxic




His state could be purely psychological though. People have reported that datura and related plants can be like a living nightmare.* One member specifically said that his experience was "traumatizing."


*Here's an example:

I took a shower and when I saw spider webs and spiders crawing through them in the corners of the shower. I remembered that I was still trashed from the night before but also wondered whether the spiders were real or not. I decided that they were hallucinations but couldnt help having a fit when one jumped on me. I was starting to catch on that the people I was talking to werent real becouse they would always disappear. They kept tricking me though and I always caught myself talking to hallucinations. I got to a point when I would just look away then look back and they would be gone when they tried to talk to me. Even when real people tried to talk to me I would try to make them dissapear.

http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=20789


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Invisibled0urd3n
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173071 - 11/21/13 11:27 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Well either way we decided it is not recreational. I wouldn't mind discussing that further but I'd really like this thread to stay on track. I am on my phone right now but tomorrow I will try to link a thread from the Shroomery I remember reading, debating that very topic.


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Edited by d0urd3n (11/21/13 11:29 PM)


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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173094 - 11/21/13 11:36 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Everything said:
Didnt take me long to find a source to back that up...

http://www.inflibnet.ac.in/ojs/index.php/AUJSAT/article/download/516/487




Kudos to you for providing a source. However, it certainly doesn't sound that toxic. I associate bona fide toxicity with permanent cell death and there is no indication of that.


The anticholinergic syndrome results from the inhibition of central and peripheral muscarinic neurotransmission. The patient  presents with dry skin and mucosa, flushing, mydriasis with loss of accommodation that causes blurred vision and photophobia, altered mental status, hyperpyrexia, sinus tachycardia, urinary retention, myoclonic jerking. Other  symptoms may include ataxia, impaired short-term memory, disorientation, confusion, hallucinations, psychosis, agitated delirium, seizures, coma, respiratory failure and cardiovascular collapse (Alberto et al., 2001).

Alberto, K., Claudia, S., Ludmilla, K. and Arnon, B. (2001). Toxic Delirium due to Datura stramonium. Israel Med.Asso. J. 3:538-539.


Maibam  Rasila  Devi 1 , Meenakshi  Bawari 1 , S.B  Paul 2 , G.D.Sharma 1. Neurotoxic and Medicinal Properties of Datura stramonium L. – Review. Assam University Journal of Science & Technology, Vol. 7 Number I, 139-144, 2011


Edited by s240779 (11/21/13 11:47 PM)


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InvisibleNWlight
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: s240779]
    #19173097 - 11/21/13 11:39 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

what the fuck are you guys talking about


he said "pants" not once but twice.


am I missing something?


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: NWlight]
    #19173111 - 11/21/13 11:45 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Pants in general are neurotoxic

:studmuffin:


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InvisibleNWlight
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173123 - 11/21/13 11:48 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

...is that why i can't get a boner?


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InvisibleLordSenate
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: s240779]
    #19173135 - 11/21/13 11:54 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Whether or not it is neuro toxic doesn't change the fact that it more then likely will cause you to have a horrible experience.

I'm not going to go so far as to say the person who enjoys it is a weirdo.. I will however say its enjoyed by a small minority of drug users.


Edited by LordSenate (11/22/13 12:14 AM)


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: LordSenate]
    #19173191 - 11/22/13 12:13 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I love how what your saying could go for pants too :tongue:


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InvisibleLordSenate
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19173195 - 11/22/13 12:14 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I've never heard of pants.


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: LordSenate]
    #19173209 - 11/22/13 12:19 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

God, I wish I lived where you do.

Oh fuck, totally derailing this thread


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InvisibleLordSenate
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything] * 1
    #19173215 - 11/22/13 12:21 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

To bring this thread back on topic..

Yes... pant's are neuro toxic.


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InvisibleNWlight
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: LordSenate] * 1
    #19173277 - 11/22/13 12:46 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

:studmuffin:

agreed


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OfflineNotTheDevil
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19173541 - 11/22/13 03:27 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

d0urd3n said:
I didn't know where else to ask this question, mods feel free to move. Thanks.

A list,naming off, or giving links etc for any nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants would be greatly appreciated. I am mainly speaking of drugs that truly would be considered recreation, or could be, based on the dosage (e.g. not adaptogens). This may sound like an odd question to ask, but I consider it interesting and important for a few reasons. Thanks again.



Alcohol


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: NotTheDevil]
    #19173553 - 11/22/13 03:43 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Alcohol comes from a bacteria grown on sugars produced by plants, seems close enough.


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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything] * 1
    #19173598 - 11/22/13 04:18 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Yeast is not a bacterium it is a fungal species although some bacteria can produce ethanol they are not used to brew commercial supplies


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InvisibleSleepwalker
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19173688 - 11/22/13 05:27 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

OP, care to tell us why you are asking this question?  Kinda confusing...


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19173908 - 11/22/13 07:32 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catharanthus_roseus

This plant has some neurotoxic/cytotoxic alkaloids but I don't think it's psychoactive.


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OfflineNotTheDevil
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: psi]
    #19173933 - 11/22/13 07:46 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Mushrooms make you brain bleed and thats how you trip so I guess that means there neurotoxic.


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InvisibleSleepwalker
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: NotTheDevil] * 2
    #19173940 - 11/22/13 07:50 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

They don't make your brain bleed dumbass, they open up tiny black holes in your pineal gland.


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OfflineNotTheDevil
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #19173981 - 11/22/13 08:10 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Sleepwalker said:
They don't make your brain bleed dumbass, they open up tiny black holes in your pineal gland.



:facepalm: how could I have been so stupid!


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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: NotTheDevil]
    #19174120 - 11/22/13 08:54 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

look up like 10 deadliest plants on youtube

you said neuro toxic though

that is extremely specific lol


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Invisibled0urd3n
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Konyap]
    #19174161 - 11/22/13 09:07 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Well it seems like there are many synthetic recreational drugs that are neuro-toxic, or have the potential to be. I really couldn't think of any natural drugs that are relationally used and neuro-toxic.

Some are toxic to other organs or cause cancer such as nicotine, but none are physically harmful to the brain. It was just something I was wondering about, did some brief research on and couldn't find much so I thought I would ask you guys.

Do you think that there is a reason that there aren't many or is this just purely coincidence?


Edited by d0urd3n (11/22/13 09:09 AM)


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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19174173 - 11/22/13 09:11 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

most plants in speculation just make you trip so you don't fuck with them anymore and go away from them

you could develop a disorder and your brain would develop differently but it's more or less average

i want to hypothesis though if you got an extreme fever there would be some brain damage over a certain threshold but you would probably die at that point


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Invisibleschwarg
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19174177 - 11/22/13 09:12 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

you guys forgot about jenkem


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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: schwarg]
    #19174353 - 11/22/13 10:05 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3-Quinuclidinyl_benzilate
Quote:

BZ is dispersed as an aerosol. It may be micropulverized for dissemination by a disperser (90% dissemination efficiency), or mixed with a pyrotechnic burning mixture for dissemination in burning munitions (70% dissemination efficiency). Alternatively, it may be dissolved in a solvent such as DMSO to enhance percutaneous absorption, though experiments before this proved unsatisfactory for military purposes.
Bioavailability via ingestion and by inhalation of particles 1 micrometer in size approximates 80%, and 40 to 50%, respectively, of a parenterally delivered dose of BZ. Percutaneous absorption of BZ dissolved in propylene glycol yields, after a latent period of up to 24 hours, serum levels approximately 5 to 10% of those achieved with intravenous or intramuscular administration.
Following absorption, BZ is systemically distributed to most organs and biological tissues of the body. Its ability to reach synapses and neuromuscular and neuroglandular junctions throughout the body is responsible for its PNS effects, whereas its ability to cross the blood–brain barrier confers upon it the ability to cause CNS effects. Atropine and hyoscyamine both cross the placenta and can be found in small quantities in breast milk; whether this is also true for BZ is unclear.
Metabolism of BZ would be expected to occur primarily in the liver, with elimination of unchanged agent and metabolites chiefly in the urine.




edit: nevermind this is synthetic. reading comprehension fail.


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OfflineNotTheDevil
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: d0urd3n]
    #19174464 - 11/22/13 10:36 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

d0urd3n said:
Well it seems like there are many synthetic recreational drugs that are neuro-toxic, or have the potential to be. I really couldn't think of any natural drugs that are relationally used and neuro-toxic.

Some are toxic to other organs or cause cancer such as nicotine, but none are physically harmful to the brain. It was just something I was wondering about, did some brief research on and couldn't find much so I thought I would ask you guys.

Do you think that there is a reason that there aren't many or is this just purely coincidence?



Alcohol, and there are way more synthetic drugs than natural ones in the first place.


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Spiderbaby]
    #19174899 - 11/22/13 01:37 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Spiderbaby said:
Yeast is not a bacterium it is a fungal species although some bacteria can produce ethanol they are not used to brew commercial supplies




Thanks mate, shoulda known.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Nonsynthetic neuro-toxic psychoactive drugs/pants [Re: Everything]
    #19174959 - 11/22/13 01:56 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

there are a bunch of non-synthetic toxic plants. not so much neuro-toxic psychoactive plants.


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