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Offlineg00ru
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life after life documentary * 1
    #19153724 - 11/18/13 11:39 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

i read this book by Raymond Moody and then watched this rather short documentary. It's some pretty fascinating interviews with people who have had NDE's. check it out and give some feedback :cool:



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InvisibleHeartAndMind
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: g00ru]
    #19153790 - 11/18/13 11:53 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Will watch tomorrow after work:shineon:


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OfflineChuckfinely
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: g00ru]
    #19153810 - 11/18/13 12:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Can only hope death is that cool :thumbup:


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Offlineeve69
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #19153876 - 11/18/13 12:26 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

one look and bullshit


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: eve69]
    #19154540 - 11/18/13 02:46 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

how so?


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: g00ru]
    #19155407 - 11/18/13 05:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Neuroscientists are getting close to understanding near-death experiences and the reports of those involved.  Seems the brain goes somewhat crazy when it senses the lights are being shut off, and the resulting electrical chaos is what results in the sensory stuff experienced by people.

It's chemical and electrical.  Has nothing to do with Jesus or white tunnels or reincarnation. 

People on this of all goddamn internet forums, for cryin' out loud, should "grok" this.

Sorry I don't have a link, but if you google you should be able to come up with the recent research on this.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty]
    #19155478 - 11/18/13 05:10 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

well if chemicals can cause you to have experiences like that, makes me think that maybe there is something pretty interesting (i.e. sacred) going on with this reality. and did you watch the whole video? they actually directly address that question you bring up.


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: g00ru]
    #19156112 - 11/18/13 06:42 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

g00ru said:
well if chemicals can cause you to have experiences like that, makes me think that maybe there is something pretty interesting (i.e. sacred) going on with this reality.



I agree it's interesting.  Just like reports from mushroom and LSD users are interesting.  But there's a layer of fantasy in many NDE reports that really calls into question the objective reality of these experiences.

I'm talking about the "I saw Jesus beckoning me" and "I was walking down a long and luminous tunnel" stuff -- as if the subjects were literally seeing and doing that stuff.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty]
    #19156305 - 11/18/13 07:15 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

i think they are literally seeing it...how else could it be so life changing and make them so happy?


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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty] * 1
    #19156987 - 11/18/13 09:30 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Neuroscientists are getting close to understanding near-death experiences and the reports of those involved.  Seems the brain goes somewhat crazy when it senses the lights are being shut off, and the resulting electrical chaos is what results in the sensory stuff experienced by people.

It's chemical and electrical.  Has nothing to do with Jesus or white tunnels or reincarnation.




All experiences are simultaneously chemical and electrical.  This doesn't negate their validity or meaningfulness.


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OfflineChuckfinely
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: deCypher]
    #19159087 - 11/19/13 10:47 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
Neuroscientists are getting close to understanding near-death experiences and the reports of those involved.  Seems the brain goes somewhat crazy when it senses the lights are being shut off, and the resulting electrical chaos is what results in the sensory stuff experienced by people.

It's chemical and electrical.  Has nothing to do with Jesus or white tunnels or reincarnation.




All experiences are simultaneously chemical and electrical.  This doesn't negate their validity or meaningfulness.




I was searching for how to respond to that. Well put sir :thumbup:


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #19159293 - 11/19/13 11:41 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Chuckfinely said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
Neuroscientists are getting close to understanding near-death experiences and the reports of those involved.  Seems the brain goes somewhat crazy when it senses the lights are being shut off, and the resulting electrical chaos is what results in the sensory stuff experienced by people.

It's chemical and electrical.  Has nothing to do with Jesus or white tunnels or reincarnation.




All experiences are simultaneously chemical and electrical.  This doesn't negate their validity or meaningfulness.




I was searching for how to respond to that. Well put sir :thumbup:



We need to define "valid" and "meaningful" here.

If I'm having a chemically or electrically-induced hallucination (which is what the classic "I saw Jesus beckoning me" NDE is), then it might be "meaningful" to me personally, but it is not objectively "valid."

Jesus does not really "beckon" in NDEs.  As in:  "There really is no Santa Claus, folks." 

He may beckon you, but it's a hallucination and a hallucination only. 

Meaningful, perhaps, to you -- but not "real."


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InvisibleDeadHearts

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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty]
    #19162482 - 11/19/13 10:01 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Explain to me how we have so many similar experiences revolving around people "floating" around the different parts of a hospital and able to see what their lived ones are doing or even hearing conversations that actually took place.

I don't know if there is life after life but I don't think it can be ruled out with such a simple answer.

Razorsssss


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: DeadHearts]
    #19164011 - 11/20/13 08:54 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DeadHearts said:
Explain to me how we have so many similar experiences revolving around people "floating" around the different parts of a hospital and able to see what their lived ones are doing or even hearing conversations that actually took place.



I suspect a lot of it is cultural indoctrination.  We've all been "implanted" by the media and popular culture with the idea that when you experience the hallucination we call a "near-death experience," you'll find yourself floating around the room, seeing your loved ones, yada yada yada.  So that's what we see and experience.

They've done experiments and found that it's possible to implant "dream ideas" into people as they fall asleep.  For example, I can implant within your subconscious mind the idea of seeing a panda munching on a stalk of bamboo -- and -- voila -- you will, in fact, dream about pandas.


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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty]
    #19164680 - 11/20/13 11:25 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

Chuckfinely said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
Neuroscientists are getting close to understanding near-death experiences and the reports of those involved.  Seems the brain goes somewhat crazy when it senses the lights are being shut off, and the resulting electrical chaos is what results in the sensory stuff experienced by people.

It's chemical and electrical.  Has nothing to do with Jesus or white tunnels or reincarnation.




All experiences are simultaneously chemical and electrical.  This doesn't negate their validity or meaningfulness.




I was searching for how to respond to that. Well put sir :thumbup:



We need to define "valid" and "meaningful" here.

If I'm having a chemically or electrically-induced hallucination (which is what the classic "I saw Jesus beckoning me" NDE is), then it might be "meaningful" to me personally, but it is not objectively "valid."

Jesus does not really "beckon" in NDEs.  As in:  "There really is no Santa Claus, folks." 

He may beckon you, but it's a hallucination and a hallucination only. 

Meaningful, perhaps, to you -- but not "real."




Just to play Devil's advocate here, where's your argument for these bare assertions?  How do you know what's real and what isn't?


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: deCypher]
    #19164850 - 11/20/13 11:54 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
Just to play Devil's advocate here, where's your argument for these bare assertions?  How do you know what's real and what isn't?



I have no "argument" and I never claim to "know" this shit.

I'm only guessing. 

All of us are only guessing.


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InvisibleDeadHearts

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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty]
    #19167190 - 11/20/13 07:46 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

DeadHearts said:
Explain to me how we have so many similar experiences revolving around people "floating" around the different parts of a hospital and able to see what their lived ones are doing or even hearing conversations that actually took place.



I suspect a lot of it is cultural indoctrination.  We've all been "implanted" by the media and popular culture with the idea that when you experience the hallucination we call a "near-death experience," you'll find yourself floating around the room, seeing your loved ones, yada yada yada.  So that's what we see and experience.

They've done experiments and found that it's possible to implant "dream ideas" into people as they fall asleep.  For example, I can implant within your subconscious mind the idea of seeing a panda munching on a stalk of bamboo -- and -- voila -- you will, in fact, dream about pandas.





That doesn't explain what I wrote. Basically you just said people are seeing some visual preconceived memory about something they heard AFTER they are clinically dead.


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InvisibleChronic7
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: DeadHearts]
    #19168392 - 11/21/13 01:34 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

bumping this so it comes up in my threads & i remember to watch it...


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Offlineall this beauty
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: DeadHearts]
    #19169217 - 11/21/13 10:03 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DeadHearts said:
Basically you just said people are seeing some visual preconceived memory about something they heard AFTER they are clinically dead.



No.  I'm suggesting (as recent research has found) that the NDE is a sort of hallucination resulting from wild and erratic brain activity.

Studies are beginning to show that when the human brain senses that it's shutting down (i.e., dying) it emits all manner of chaotic electrical and chemical stuff.  "Brain panic," if you will.  As with dreams, the subconscious mind converts all of that into a kind of hallucination.

I don't know this for a fact -- but I bet people who are not exposed to the "luminous white tunnel" or the "I saw Jesus" pop culture notion of what people experience in NDEs don't experience luminous white tunnels or Jesus when they themselves have NDEs.

Only guessing, mind you. 

It would be great if someone, somewhere, were doing research on this.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: life after life documentary [Re: all this beauty]
    #19170283 - 11/21/13 02:10 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
I don't know this for a fact -- but I bet people who are not exposed to the "luminous white tunnel" or the "I saw Jesus" pop culture notion of what people experience in NDEs don't experience luminous white tunnels or Jesus when they themselves have NDEs.





Jesus is more than a simple 'pop' phenomenon...his existence is very much accepted by historians. Sure cultural conditioning can influence mystical visions...it IS a mystical vision in it's own right. But some things come from beyond even the cultural sphere. I believe Jesus's life to be like this. I am not in any way guessing, because I have certainly experienced the love and energy of Jesus to be real...regardless at the very least don't put society on a pedastal above individual visions, put the individual vision on a pedestal above society


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