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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: CosmicJoke]
#19212886 - 12/01/13 02:00 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I remember that comment too.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: CosmicJoke]
#19213056 - 12/01/13 02:33 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Actually, I was one such stoner who made an inappropriate comment in jest when a girl in college stumbled on the last step and verbalized it. I did not get up to help. I was 18, and that lack of empathy was partly due to my immaturity and partly due to cannabis influence. On another occasion, while listening to a student present something in the 'Great Hall,' the presenter had a stutter. The crowded room was packed and silent. Not having a seat, I was watching from behind the rails of of a staircase. I let out a very inappropriate laugh, to which many heads turned in my direction. I knew the uncontrolled laugh was wrong even as it left my mouth. Today, I find nothing at all humorous about someone's difficulties no matter what form they take, but back then, being stoned made me more stupid than I already was due to other factors. Those instances were not able to be taken in any slap-stick sense, like someone missing their chair, stepping on a banana peel, etc. The responses were just wrong in those cases.
 Many years later, I was hanging out with a female who lived in my apartment after my divorce. We were sitting outside at a cafe and she was saying really obnoxious things about people. She had a PhD in social work, was a secretive opiate addict with some of her social worker friends who often stole prescription pads and forged oxy scripts. She once accused me of stealing her Vicodin from her undies drawer!  It was one of her junkie friends. Anyway, when I commented on her being mean, she simply shot back "You don't have to hang around with me you know!" Short-lived friendship. Fairly insensitive person hell-bent on making herself even more insensitive with opiates. I should have known, she used to be a lawyer. At the time, she was a substance abuse counselor at a local clinic, and I was thinking with my other 'head.' One of the reasons I stayed away from cannabis over the 27 years I worked in middle schools was the hypocrisy factor. When kids I was trying to steer away from cannabis asked me if I used cannabis, I could say in all honesty that I did, but I don't now. I'm free of that obligation now, and if I could locate a bit of hashish, I would be happy to hit it again, mostly just for the flavor, but it's uncommon in Florida and I'm not traveling to Amsterdam just for that. It's doubtful that I would become a douchebag again with a few hits of hash.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Nothing has changed IMO. You are still trying to steer people away from weed, and maybe more up on your soapbox than ever considering you are retired.
You would still smoke hash but for some reason are down on weed. I think the work hypocrite applies in spades.
The douchebag thing I won't even address, sounds like a personal problem to me.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: LunarEclipse]
#19213680 - 12/01/13 04:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I don't see what the difference between hash and weed is??? Isn't the active ingredient THC?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: Actually, I was one such stoner who made an inappropriate comment in jest when a girl in college stumbled on the last step and verbalized it. I did not get up to help. I was 18, and that lack of empathy was partly due to my immaturity and partly due to cannabis influence. On another occasion, while listening to a student present something in the 'Great Hall,' the presenter had a stutter. The crowded room was packed and silent. Not having a seat, I was watching from behind the rails of of a staircase. I let out a very inappropriate laugh, to which many heads turned in my direction. I knew the uncontrolled laugh was wrong even as it left my mouth. Today, I find nothing at all humorous about someone's difficulties no matter what form they take, but back then, being stoned made me more stupid than I already was due to other factors. Those instances were not able to be taken in any slap-stick sense, like someone missing their chair, stepping on a banana peel, etc. The responses were just wrong in those cases.

Well, should you come visit me in Portland, I'll happily introduce you to many of friends who still get lit, and you can stutter and fall a bunch, and we'll gauge their reactions. I'm genuinely curious
Quote:
One of the reasons I stayed away from cannabis over the 27 years I worked in middle schools was the hypocrisy factor. When kids I was trying to steer away from cannabis asked me if I used cannabis, I could say in all honesty that I did, but I don't now. I'm free of that obligation now, and if I could locate a bit of hashish, I would be happy to hit it again, mostly just for the flavor, but it's uncommon in Florida and I'm not traveling to Amsterdam just for that. It's doubtful that I would become a douchebag again with a few hits of hash.
My mother, who was a substance abuse counselor for many years, also quit for comparable reasons, also including job security and having children she would never jeopardize losing over a random drug related offense... Now that we're all grown up and out of the house and she approaches retirement, I'd personally love it if she'd reassess the situation. She won't use entheogens, and I think it would be as close to a psychedelic headspace as she could approximate.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19214991 - 12/01/13 10:18 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I've had truly profound "spiritual" experiences on bud. Great insight into my life and the world and astoundingly beautiful experiences deep into the woods. And it's one of the very best pain relievers on the planet imo. If used to that end I don't think it's any kind of a lesser drug. However because it can be used daily so easily it is prone to abuse imo. I just think that many come to rely on it too heavily and use it irresponsibly (such as when driving etc.) . Balance is the key for almost anything imo.
Yes me too, I have had so many beautiful experiences on cannabis I truly value it more than any other drug, more than mushrooms and LSD. The only real negative thing about cannabis is as you said, that it can be used every day. If you used cannabis only once every few months, then I don't see why it shouldn't be respected and put on the same level as mushrooms and LSD. It is definitely a mind expanding drug. The problem comes when you start using it chronically, which I did in college and it had very negative consequences on my psychological, social and academic development.
It's not that it wasn't mind expanding even then, it's just that I never acted on the majority of my insights. I was actually just talking about this with a friend of mine whose life has been ruined by drug addiction. He was telling me how he still smokes weed and when he is stoned, he has insights about his life, how he needs to stop using drugs (he is addicted to alcohol and opiates) and other more spiritual thoughts. But then when he comes down, he never acts on any of the thoughts he had while high. I was just the same. In college I used to smoke all day every day. Sometimes while high I would think about how I needed to start doing better in school or this or that thing that I needed to improve about myself, but when I came down from being high, I would feel tired and burnt out so I would put off acting on my insights and just smoke more weed instead.
So my point is here, that weed is not any different from LSD or mushrooms except the fact that those drugs are self limiting. When you come down from LSD, you cant just take more LSD, so you have more oppurtinity to actually act on the things you learned.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19215136 - 12/01/13 11:05 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I don't see what the difference between hash and weed is??? Isn't the active ingredient THC?
No difference in THC, but like different liquors, despite the commonality of ethanol, I have noticed that people do seem to behave differently under certain formulations like tequila. I had an acquaintance that experienced the same thing that I do. He was the only person in almost 30 years who had some hash, and whereas his girlfriend's grass made him edgy and paranoid, the hash took him right out of it. Alas, they both moved to Asheville, NC before they broke up.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



Registered: 12/09/99
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: LunarEclipse]
#19215171 - 12/01/13 11:13 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Your opinion is just that - YOUR opinion, which is completely tainted by your emotional reactivity and is nothing more than a piss-poor attempt to insult me. Try harder if that's who you are. Also, try re-reading my responses until you understand what I wrote, then you won't see the hypocrisy you want to see. Maybe you should PM me so I can explain it to you. Personal problem? Really? Play nicely.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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There's a higher concentration of THC in hash, like in upwards of 90% in the oils. So in other words, if you're edgy and paranoid, the problem is you didn't take enough
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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There is a lot of classic literature about high-dose hash trips. I tried high-dose edibles once and it was just as powerful as psilocybin or lsd. It seemed more time/thought oriented than transcendent. Time looped in small 10 second bursts within larger loops of one and ten minutes. It was hellacious.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said:
Quote:
Icelander said: I don't see what the difference between hash and weed is??? Isn't the active ingredient THC?
No difference in THC, but like different liquors, despite the commonality of ethanol, I have noticed that people do seem to behave differently under certain formulations like tequila. I had an acquaintance that experienced the same thing that I do. He was the only person in almost 30 years who had some hash, and whereas his girlfriend's grass made him edgy and paranoid, the hash took him right out of it. Alas, they both moved to Asheville, NC before they broke up.
Yet you choose to vilify bud on this basis alone? Imo that's irrational.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19215595 - 12/02/13 01:21 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Well it's interesting that he's spoken out about hard liquor on more than one occasion, which is too strong, and causes great harm to society... Yet if you've read more than a dozen MtG posts, you'd know he loves merlot... Meanwhile, bud is too weak and causes paranoia, unlike the considerably stronger hashish.... Seems like you can't win the dosage game with him. 
Personally, I think it's important to realize that everyone has their own metabolism and neurotransmitters, and needs to use their own discretion as to what works..... Also, FWIW, with drugs like marijuana (and LSD for that matter) I've tended to acclimate myself to them.... What once required stronger doses, now no longer does - in my early 20s I'd always opt for that 3-5 hit psychedelic dose, and now I can get into the same psychedelic headspace with just two hits of acid, or a 1 hitter of 'heady nugs' instead of a night long smoke out. If you're out of the loop, it may take some time and a handful of experiences to know what you're talking about.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
Edited by CosmicJoke (12/02/13 01:33 AM)
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: CosmicJoke]
#19215701 - 12/02/13 02:05 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I think it's important to realize that everyone has their own metabolism and neurotransmitters, and needs to use their own discretion as to what works..
I'm totally convinced of the truth of this. And like I said I've had truly profound experiences on bud. It gets overused imo but really that's not the topic of this thread. I have no reason to believe it's a divine gift from some imaginary power.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Ultron
alchemist programmer




Registered: 08/04/13
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19215704 - 12/02/13 02:07 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Marijuana is a goddess she wraps me in her ever loving embrace daily
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19215758 - 12/02/13 02:53 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I think it's important to realize that everyone has their own metabolism and neurotransmitters, and needs to use their own discretion as to what works..
I'm totally convinced of the truth of this. And like I said I've had truly profound experiences on bud. It gets overused imo but really that's not the topic of this thread. I have no reason to believe it's a divine gift from some imaginary power.
Aye, but the OP abandoned the thread on the first page and here we are six pages in... so now there's not much left to argue over it, but I do find it interesting when MtG says marijuana is not a 'sacrament'... While I don't particularly believe in visible signs of inward 'spiritual divine grace' to begin with (as if any consensus on what that means could be came to), I find the term 'profound' more significant, in the sense of showing greater knowledge and insight than usual... That's all relative to the partaker, not the substance itself, in which some may have more profound experiences, while others may have exceedingly mundane experiences...
"I had a profound experience listening to Beethoven" - "Beethoven is not a sacrament!" You discern the profundity based on the description of the experience, it's not in the object.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19215958 - 12/02/13 05:39 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I don't see what the difference between hash and weed is??? Isn't the active ingredient THC?
I though the active ingredient was the brain, huhuh.
But actually the active ingredient alone isn't the only item of importance. In many things it's achieving the threshold dose necessary to cross whatever resistance, same thing applied to antibiotics. Acid works because the minute amount pushes the brain monoamines to a different level of functioning in a split second, the rest of the body takes time catching up - if the LSD infusion was very slow then nothing would be perceived.
...the unconscious may very well be the physiological which hasn't reached the plateau of consciousness....
-------------------- ...or something
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: CosmicJoke]
#19215984 - 12/02/13 05:51 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
CosmicJoke said:
Quote:
Icelander said: I think it's important to realize that everyone has their own metabolism and neurotransmitters, and needs to use their own discretion as to what works..
I'm totally convinced of the truth of this. And like I said I've had truly profound experiences on bud. It gets overused imo but really that's not the topic of this thread. I have no reason to believe it's a divine gift from some imaginary power.
Aye, but the OP abandoned the thread on the first page and here we are six pages in... so now there's not much left to argue over it, but I do find it interesting when MtG says marijuana is not a 'sacrament'... While I don't particularly believe in visible signs of inward 'spiritual divine grace' to begin with (as if any consensus on what that means could be came to), I find the term 'profound' more significant, in the sense of showing greater knowledge and insight than usual... That's all relative to the partaker, not the substance itself, in which some may have more profound experiences, while others may have exceedingly mundane experiences...
"I had a profound experience listening to Beethoven" - "Beethoven is not a sacrament!" You discern the profundity based on the description of the experience, it's not in the object.
OK
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: eve69]
#19215989 - 12/02/13 05:52 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
eve69 said:
Quote:
Icelander said: I don't see what the difference between hash and weed is??? Isn't the active ingredient THC?
I though the active ingredient was the brain, huhuh.
But actually the active ingredient alone isn't the only item of importance. In many things it's achieving the threshold dose necessary to cross whatever resistance, same thing applied to antibiotics. Acid works because the minute amount pushes the brain monoamines to a different level of functioning in a split second, the rest of the body takes time catching up - if the LSD infusion was very slow then nothing would be perceived.
...the unconscious may very well be the physiological which hasn't reached the plateau of consciousness....
Take more or less hash, Smoke more or less bud. Same same don't you think?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
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Re: Marijuana is a gift from divinity [Re: Icelander]
#19216968 - 12/02/13 12:08 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yet you choose to vilify bud on this basis alone? Imo that's irrational.
Dude, I only want to "taste" some hashish again, preferably something like the light crumbly yellow 'blond hash' of yesteryear. I do NOT want to start smoking/vaping hash again, and that's not even possible. It is the Rhinencephalon, the 'smell-brain,' so-called that I want to 'light up' with emotional associations. I will no doubt enjoy the euphoria, but in fact it is the smell and flavor that I wish to experience again. There are buried emotional states that can be re-experienced with the requisite stimulus to the smell brain. I am interested in using scents in conjunction with hypnotherapy to facilitate the evocation of repressed emotions. This is my own personal experiment. I'm never going be a regular user of cannabis again. 
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
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Who said anything about being a regular user.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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