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Offlinestellarshnap
Poet who doesn't know it


Registered: 05/24/12
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: all this beauty]
    #19155561 - 11/18/13 05:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I get where you're coming from eve, but I can't imagine wanting to share what is essentially peace with someone as a bad thing :shrug:


--------------------
Careful, though your mind may be over matter, matter is all we really know.
"Or is it?"

The problem with intelligence is that it fosters arrogance, and arrogance suffocates intelligence. True intelligence however, bites holes in the bag.


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Offlineeve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: all this beauty]
    #19156180 - 11/18/13 06:52 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

eve69 said:



You are here, posting in an internet forum entitled "Spirituality & Mysticism."  You very much want to "tell about your faith" -- "faith" understood broadly to include your innermost insights.

Are you a "shallow dipshit," eve?




Yes, which is why I am not one of those super deep thinkers over at Esangha.  I prefer this sort of shallow banter to headbutting those who's whole life's purpose is to prove what profoundly Dharmatic their every thought is.

I am shallow,
but I like it


...and that's how I know the truth of it....


--------------------
...or something







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Offlineeve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: stellarshnap]
    #19156210 - 11/18/13 06:58 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

stellarshnap said:
I get where you're coming from eve, but I can't imagine wanting to share what is essentially peace with someone as a bad thing :shrug:




I wish I could see peace as part of the faith experience.  But I see people with crosses tattooed where their track marks are and also tattoo tears.

I hear Mullhas hollering fatwas.  I listened to Maharishi Damn Great Briton and forbid TM there, and damn Democracy, while trying to cuckold dictators.  The Hindu BJP (pre-BJP) assassinated Gandhi for lobbying the creation of Pakistan for Muslims.

I don't see any peace.  And the urge to go out and preach is the opposite of peace. Jesus said he was a fucking sword to ruin families. The Bhagavad Gita says to Rama to stand up and fight!!! 

Where is this peace again? That's rhetorical - it's inside of you or it isn't.  As soon as you open up your peace to be criticized it's gone.


--------------------
...or something







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Offlinestellarshnap
Poet who doesn't know it


Registered: 05/24/12
Posts: 646
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: eve69]
    #19156644 - 11/18/13 08:25 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Well for one thing I think you're making too many assumptions. I don't go around telling people "to accept jesus into their hearts". I don't really tell them anything. Nor do I pray. It's more the way I behave that I think contains my beliefs. I'm aware that humanity still is and always will be, nothing more than smart monkeys. We know nothing, that simple. So I accept that and find immense peace in knowing that everything is so unbelievably complex and bizarre that we will never, ever, ever, ever understand it all. I mean ffs we perceive 2% of reality and are aware of 2% of the entire universe, by aware I mean it's known. The other 98%? Ha. I also understand that this one little planet is all we have, and all we need. So I treat my fellow human monkey creatures with respect and dignity, in the hopes that one day, my little river of "goodness" will converge with all the others made by like-minded people, and the world will finally be a better place. It really goes no deeper than that. But isn't that really what most religions try to teach? People just disregard the core messages and take what is metaphorically translated onto paper in order to communicate an idea, literally.. Which is what's stupid and causing such big problems imho. But really that's just human nature. We're all asshole ape bullshit artists. Fucking miraculous nonetheless.


--------------------
Careful, though your mind may be over matter, matter is all we really know.
"Or is it?"

The problem with intelligence is that it fosters arrogance, and arrogance suffocates intelligence. True intelligence however, bites holes in the bag.


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OfflineGreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche
Male

Registered: 06/20/13
Posts: 3,376
Loc: North Carolina
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: eve69]
    #19156750 - 11/18/13 08:51 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

eve69 said:
I don't believe that some people are happy with their faith. I think that's an utter travesty. Is the mule happy with the yoke? Religion teaches you to not do the things you ordinarily would give not thought to. Religious teachings are about discipline and hardship endurance. 

What happens is people want more than to be just disciplined. They want acknowledgement, prowess, fame, respect, acceptance. They preach not because they found happiness in their religion but because they are totally full of shit. They haven't found what they really need.




Another broad generalization referring to Abraham and some eastern religions. It sounds like just another opinionated perspective.


--------------------
...also, go to hell, huh?


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: eve69]
    #19158272 - 11/19/13 04:20 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

eve69 said:
Like the grumbling stomach, when it's full it is quiet and happy. Those grumbling proselytizing people who charge around shouting everybody down, browbeating them with their faith, it doesn't matter what faith, such people are miserable and their faith hasn't worked for them.

A person who loves tucks that beloved thing away deep down and shelters their love from prying eyes.

I suggest that kissing and telling about ones faith means one is a shallow dipshit.





The irony is that, at least when it comes to the internet, it is the atheists who do what you are saying more than anyone. When I meet an atheist, I am fine with agreeing to disagree. Atheists are the other hand, never ever seem to tire of endless arguments, which to me begs the question why are they so concerned with trying to prove their position. You would think that if they really believed religion was equal to believing in the tooth fairy, they would not spend so much time arguing over it. I certainly wouldn't waste my days arguing with someone over whether the tooth fairy or easter bunny existed. I mean, if they really believe we are as delusional as that, why do they think their logic will have any effect on us?

Anyway, there is a time and a place for preaching and sharing the gospel. Of course the best way to do it is through actions rather than words.


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Invisiblecez
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Registered: 08/04/09
Posts: 5,854
Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: Deviate]
    #19158307 - 11/19/13 04:40 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

The problem lies with politics..
Religious nuts have a lot of power and use their power to push their beliefs on others.


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OfflineDeviate
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Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: stellarshnap]
    #19158342 - 11/19/13 05:11 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

stellarshnap said:
Well for one thing I think you're making too many assumptions. I don't go around telling people "to accept jesus into their hearts". I don't really tell them anything. Nor do I pray. It's more the way I behave that I think contains my beliefs. I'm aware that humanity still is and always will be, nothing more than smart monkeys. We know nothing, that simple. So I accept that and find immense peace in knowing that everything is so unbelievably complex and bizarre that we will never, ever, ever, ever understand it all. I mean ffs we perceive 2% of reality and are aware of 2% of the entire universe, by aware I mean it's known. The other 98%? Ha. I also understand that this one little planet is all we have, and all we need. So I treat my fellow human monkey creatures with respect and dignity, in the hopes that one day, my little river of "goodness" will converge with all the others made by like-minded people, and the world will finally be a better place. It really goes no deeper than that. But isn't that really what most religions try to teach? People just disregard the core messages and take what is metaphorically translated onto paper in order to communicate an idea, literally.. Which is what's stupid and causing such big problems imho. But really that's just human nature. We're all asshole ape bullshit artists. Fucking miraculous nonetheless.




Yes, people who think religion is a scourge of mankind do not understand human nature. It is not religion, or drugs, or gambling or even crime that causes the fundamental ills of society. It's the human tendency toward greed, selfishness, cruelty and all else that doesn't stem from wisdom and love.

Religion actually teaches us the right way to live, it teaches us to lay selfishness aside and treat others as we would wish to be treated, with the recongition that we all in this together as spiritual brothers and sisters. Of course just because someone is exposed to religion is not any sort of guarantee they will actually obey the commandments and live righteously, but at least religion gives those people who are interested in righteousness, a guide and a tradition to get them started on the path, as it can be quite a difficult road in my experience and the experiences and techniques developed by those who went before us, are absolutely invaluable to anyone who desires to follow in their footsteps. There is no need to re-invent the wheel, the way of peace is the same now as it was 2,000 years ago. But man's corrupt nature causes him to continously repeat the same mistakes as prior generations. Peace remains quite elusive for the majority of mankind, religious or otherwise.


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Offlinestellarshnap
Poet who doesn't know it


Registered: 05/24/12
Posts: 646
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: Deviate]
    #19158733 - 11/19/13 08:59 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Deviate said:
Quote:

stellarshnap said:
Well for one thing I think you're making too many assumptions. I don't go around telling people "to accept jesus into their hearts". I don't really tell them anything. Nor do I pray. It's more the way I behave that I think contains my beliefs. I'm aware that humanity still is and always will be, nothing more than smart monkeys. We know nothing, that simple. So I accept that and find immense peace in knowing that everything is so unbelievably complex and bizarre that we will never, ever, ever, ever understand it all. I mean ffs we perceive 2% of reality and are aware of 2% of the entire universe, by aware I mean it's known. The other 98%? Ha. I also understand that this one little planet is all we have, and all we need. So I treat my fellow human monkey creatures with respect and dignity, in the hopes that one day, my little river of "goodness" will converge with all the others made by like-minded people, and the world will finally be a better place. It really goes no deeper than that. But isn't that really what most religions try to teach? People just disregard the core messages and take what is metaphorically translated onto paper in order to communicate an idea, literally.. Which is what's stupid and causing such big problems imho. But really that's just human nature. We're all asshole ape bullshit artists. Fucking miraculous nonetheless.




Yes, people who think religion is a scourge of mankind do not understand human nature. It is not religion, or drugs, or gambling or even crime that causes the fundamental ills of society. It's the human tendency toward greed, selfishness, cruelty and all else that doesn't stem from wisdom and love.

Religion actually teaches us the right way to live, it teaches us to lay selfishness aside and treat others as we would wish to be treated, with the recongition that we all in this together as spiritual brothers and sisters. Of course just because someone is exposed to religion is not any sort of guarantee they will actually obey the commandments and live righteously, but at least religion gives those people who are interested in righteousness, a guide and a tradition to get them started on the path, as it can be quite a difficult road in my experience and the experiences and techniques developed by those who went before us, are absolutely invaluable to anyone who desires to follow in their footsteps. There is no need to re-invent the wheel, the way of peace is the same now as it was 2,000 years ago. But man's corrupt nature causes him to continously repeat the same mistakes as prior generations. Peace remains quite elusive for the majority of mankind, religious or otherwise.




Here's where I disagree with you. The religions we have worked 2000 years ago, but now we have folk quoting scripture from a book that tells you how to treat your slaves, and when it's okay to kill someone. We don't need these olden day religions any more. We now have something that when used properly creates a much more stable foundation, and basically invalidates the concept of arrogance, while giving you a direct connection to the "source"... LSD

:trippinbawelz: It allows you to see it for yourself, and "understand" it (only as much as our biology permits us), rather than take the words of some possible madman 2000 years ago, completely on faith. That's a dangerous and stupid thing to do. Freethinking, something religion undoubtedly inhibits, and LSD fosters, is incredibly important imo.

No way in fuckin' hell can I imagine a user of LSD using what he gains from the experience to control the people and amass riches, (something religion has been an incredibly powerful tool for for a long time), can you?

I do however completely agree with your view on atheists. I used to be an atheist, and boy how I remember always shutting people down with logic. Only when I took LSD did I realize that perhaps, my logic, being human logic, is flawed. This universe is far beyond anything our logic can make sense of, and far more bizarre and fascinating then what religion tells us. I think both theism and atheism are arrogant. Which is why I "subscribe" to the I-don't-knowism and I-love-youism beliefs. :lol:


Edited by stellarshnap (11/19/13 09:15 AM)


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OfflineNastyDHL
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Registered: 04/04/08
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19158750 - 11/19/13 09:06 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

GreyMorph said:
Quote:

NastyDHL said:
"There are only two things. Truth and lies. Truth is indivisible, hence it cannot recognize itself; anyone who wants to recognize it has to be a lie." -Franz Kafka




Bad ass quote.

I don't believe OP. things like this aren't that general. Some people are happy with their faith and preach it, some faiths are taught to preach their faith such as Christians but more so Jehovah's Witness whose soul depends on their works or conversion rate. Anywho, I'm a pagan pantheist and rarely do you rarely hear pagans preaching their faith.




I think the people who are fulfilled with their faith are too joyful to attempt to spread it any other way then emotionally, as they have the knowledge that the intellect and it's attempts to control/contain is not what will achieve joy.

I believe that the people who preach their faith are not truly blissful, they are merely comfortable and are attempting to spread the comfort.


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OfflineNastyDHL
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: Deviate]
    #19158758 - 11/19/13 09:09 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Deviate said:
Quote:

eve69 said:
Like the grumbling stomach, when it's full it is quiet and happy. Those grumbling proselytizing people who charge around shouting everybody down, browbeating them with their faith, it doesn't matter what faith, such people are miserable and their faith hasn't worked for them.

A person who loves tucks that beloved thing away deep down and shelters their love from prying eyes.

I suggest that kissing and telling about ones faith means one is a shallow dipshit.





The irony is that, at least when it comes to the internet, it is the atheists who do what you are saying more than anyone.





To borrow from Robert Anton Wilson, atheists are as dogmatic and robotic as hard-core fundamentalists. I believe that especially in this time when atheism is seen as edgy while also rapidly trending in the mainstream, fervent atheism is a reasonable pendulum swing back from where society has been living at.


Edited by NastyDHL (11/19/13 11:05 AM)


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Offlineall this beauty
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Registered: 02/13/13
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Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: eve69]
    #19158811 - 11/19/13 09:30 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

eve69 said:
Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

eve69 said:



You are here, posting in an internet forum entitled "Spirituality & Mysticism."  You very much want to "tell about your faith" -- "faith" understood broadly to include your innermost insights.

Are you a "shallow dipshit," eve?




Yes, which is why I am not one of those super deep thinkers over at Esangha.  I prefer this sort of shallow banter to headbutting those who's whole life's purpose is to prove what profoundly Dharmatic their every thought is.

I am shallow,
but I like it

...and that's how I know the truth of it....



If you truly embrace your shallowness, then you've won the game.  Collect $100 and go to "home."

You're a very odd one, eve.  You mouth some of the most squalid, vile, and awful dreck the internet has ever seen, yet your posts can be very insightful. "Profound," one might say.

I actually like that in a man.

Sort of a turn-on.


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Offlineall this beauty
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Registered: 02/13/13
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Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Preaching ones faith shows dissatisfaction with it. [Re: NastyDHL]
    #19158961 - 11/19/13 10:13 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NastyDHL said:
To borrow from Robert Anton Wilson, atheists are as dogmatic and robotic as hard-core fundamentalists. I believe that especially in this time when atheism is seen as edgy while also rapidly trending in the mainstream, fervent atheism is reasonable pendulum swing back from where society has been living at.



Oh that's a great post.  Thank you.  It takes a bit of courage to speak that.

I don't believe in a deity or deities, but I refuse to label myself an "atheist" because the professional atheists out there have ruined the word.  The "militant" atheists.  The atheists who pay to have billboards erected telling people not to believe in this or that.

Let people be.

As long as they do as little harm as is humanly possible, let people believe whatever the fuck they want to believe.


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