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Offlines240779
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Would a Buddhist ever commit murder?
    #19109414 - 11/09/13 08:09 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

A true Buddhist. Let's say a Buddhist monk gained knowledge that a certain individual was a human trafficker. Would he kill him? Assume that having the trafficker locked up would be out of the question.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109451 - 11/09/13 08:19 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Sure. People put religion aside all the time and kill. And many people just beg forgiveness afterwords and still think they're getting into their religions afterlife.

People legitimize things in all kind of crazy ways.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Synthe]
    #19109720 - 11/09/13 09:51 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Im Buddhist , By no means perfect thought

I would kill in a heartbeat to protect myself or my family , cold blooded murder never , If I could I would have by now for all the shit Ive gone through in life


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Synthe]
    #19109785 - 11/09/13 10:13 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Synthe said:
Sure. People put religion aside all the time and kill. And many people just beg forgiveness afterwords and still think they're getting into their religions afterlife.

People legitimize things in all kind of crazy ways.



There's a difference between committing murder and killing someone bro.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Atrium]
    #19109837 - 11/09/13 10:28 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I would commit murder If I knew it would protect to people I love

But never out of my own hate


Edited by Kalypto (11/09/13 10:28 AM)


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? (moved) [Re: s240779]
    #19109861 - 11/09/13 10:39 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

This thread was moved from Sexuality and Relationships.

Reason:
Not S&R related.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? (moved) [Re: Chairman Meow]
    #19109869 - 11/09/13 10:42 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

lol I meant to post this in "Spirituality & Mysticism." Didn't realize I posted it in "Sexuality and Relationships."


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109870 - 11/09/13 10:43 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Look at what's going on in Sri Lanka. Yes a "true" Buddhist would commit murder. No religion is absolutely free of bad people.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19109875 - 11/09/13 10:45 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I meant murder in a just way. That's clear from my first post.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109876 - 11/09/13 10:46 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Wouldn't one who would commit murder in an unjust way also murder in a just way?


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19109878 - 11/09/13 10:47 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

No. Ridiculous assertion.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109889 - 11/09/13 10:50 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

So is the assertion that killing a human trafficker is just. Maybe they find the killing of muslims as they're overpopulating Sri Lanka to be just. It's all relative - there's no cold hard line between just and unjust.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19109900 - 11/09/13 10:54 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OZA said:
So is the assertion that killing a human trafficker is just. Maybe they find the killing of muslims as they're overpopulating Sri Lanka to be just. It's all relative - there's no cold hard line between just and unjust.




It never ceases to amaze me how backwards some people are. There obviously is a cold hard line between those two examples.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109905 - 11/09/13 10:56 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

What is a true buddhist?


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #19109907 - 11/09/13 10:57 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Unnecessary question.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #19109908 - 11/09/13 10:57 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Someone who follows the four noble truths and the eight fold path to enlightenment IMO


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109913 - 11/09/13 10:58 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Da2ra said:
Unnecessary question.



As a buddhist, I consider it a necessary question.


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it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #19109916 - 11/09/13 10:59 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

nicechrisman said:
Quote:

Da2ra said:
Unnecessary question.



As a buddhist, I consider it a necessary question.



Ditto


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Kalypto]
    #19109924 - 11/09/13 11:01 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

There are many different interpretations of the 8 fold path, but my understanding of it means that one who follows it would not kill another regardless of the circumstances. Things like what goes in in Sri Lanka are much like any other faith. Some people actually live the faith, and some people use it as a label or a type of social networking.


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it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109934 - 11/09/13 11:04 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Da2ra said:
Quote:

OZA said:
So is the assertion that killing a human trafficker is just. Maybe they find the killing of muslims as they're overpopulating Sri Lanka to be just. It's all relative - there's no cold hard line between just and unjust.




It never ceases to amaze me how backwards some people are. There obviously is a cold hard line between those two examples.



To you there is and I admit the same for me, but you need to understand that somebody else has different values; and as fucked up as *we* see it, they just may consider the killing to be justified. I'm sure the pilot flying into the world trade center thought it was perfectly reasonable to do so. Don't take this as me saying these instances are equally fucked up. I'm saying using "just" as the defining word will get you nowhere

Not backwards (resorting to personal flares doesn't set you on top..), it's perspective and the context of the situation. I guarantee not every human would even find the most justifiable murder case to be an okay thing to do. I'm not offering an answer to your question, I'm saying your question is invalid because what's justified to you could be cold blooded murder to the next guy. Not everybody was raised with your values and not everybody was raised with mine. Use a more objective word and maybe somebody could answer.


E: although it seems no types of murder for a Buddhist are justified..


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Edited by OZA (11/09/13 11:07 AM)


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19109943 - 11/09/13 11:07 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Like batman , well he tries to never kill anyone

Or Ironman who just thinks there is always another way

I would imagine a Buddhist wouldnt kill the guy to maintain his path and not perpetuate violence


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19109953 - 11/09/13 11:11 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

nicechrisman said:
There are many different interpretations of the 8 fold path, but my understanding of it means that one who follows it would not kill another regardless of the circumstances.




Extenuating circumstances, i.e. self-defense. And that's just one possible example.


Quote:

OZA said:
I'm saying your question is invalid because what's justified to you could be cold blooded murder to the next guy.





Nonsense.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19109959 - 11/09/13 11:12 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Do you even 8fold path bro?


--------------------
"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? (moved) [Re: s240779]
    #19109984 - 11/09/13 11:19 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

This thread was moved from The Pub.

Reason:
here we go


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? (moved) [Re: Chairman Meow]
    #19109994 - 11/09/13 11:21 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Thanks, sadsappysucker.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779] * 1
    #19109995 - 11/09/13 11:21 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OZA said:
I'm saying your question is invalid because what's justified to you could be cold blooded murder to the next guy.





Nonsense.



Nonsense?
Why were there thousands of Islamic extremists parading while family, friends, and the nation overall was weeping on 9/11?
Why did America think napalm and agent orange was justified as Vietnamese babies were permanently deformed? Do you think the baby's parents thought it was just?

You're not considering the bigger picture and that's one of the ultimate flaws to have. There exists 12 jurors for a reason. The word "just" has plasticity and you're not realizing that. Your parents, education, and environment raise you with different values than a boy being raised in an Al Qaida dominated territory. What that boy thinks is a "good" thing to do would, I'm sure, be seen as a despicable act by you.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19110003 - 11/09/13 11:24 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

He isnt asking about the big picture


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Kalypto]
    #19110007 - 11/09/13 11:25 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Kalypto said:
He isnt asking about the big picture



He's asking about what's just. I told him the Buddhists committing these acts in Sri Lanka see their actions as just.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19110010 - 11/09/13 11:26 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OZA said:
Why were there thousands of Islamic extremists parading while family, friends, and the nation overall was weeping on 9/11?
Why did America think napalm and agent orange was justified as Vietnamese babies were permanently deformed?




Allow me to stop you right there. Both those examples involve killing collateral people. Whereas a human trafficker is the direct cause of a situation -- the source. Big difference. I hate it when people pull the shit you're pulling. I think it's called a straw man.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19110023 - 11/09/13 11:30 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Killing a human trafficker would warrant sympathy from a juror, but not a not-guilty plea. It's still a wrong people act in some people's eyes.. Anyway I may be going too deep so I'll just leave it there. Sorry


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19110033 - 11/09/13 11:32 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OZA said:
Killing a human trafficker would warrant sympathy from a juror, but not a not-guilty plea.




I don't think legal systems have any bearing on my question. Buddhist doctrine is above the legal system -- to a Buddhist -- the question is how does this question hold up to Buddhist doctrine?


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19110038 - 11/09/13 11:34 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Da2ra said:
Quote:

OZA said:
Killing a human trafficker would warrant sympathy from a juror, but not a not-guilty plea.




I don't think legal systems have any bearing on my question. Buddhist doctrine is above the legal system -- to a Buddhist -- the question is how does this question hold up to Buddhist doctrine?



Thank you


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19110064 - 11/09/13 11:45 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Da2ra said:
Quote:

OZA said:
Killing a human trafficker would warrant sympathy from a juror, but not a not-guilty plea.




I don't think legal systems have any bearing on my question. Buddhist doctrine is above the legal system -- to a Buddhist -- the question is how does this question hold up to Buddhist doctrine?



Buddhist doctrine dictates that one should not kill.


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it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #19110070 - 11/09/13 11:47 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Like I said, there are extenuating circumstances, such as self defense. Also, Thich Quang Duc, burning himself to death. I'm under the impression that the rules are more like guidelines. Strict, but not "irreversible."


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19110076 - 11/09/13 11:48 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

So what are you asking? I keep trying to answer your question and you argue about it. Do you actually have a question, or are you just looking for a debate?


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"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Kalypto]
    #19110089 - 11/09/13 11:52 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Kalypto said:
I would commit murder If I knew it would protect the people I love

But never out of my own hate



Word.

It's totally contrary to basic natural principles, imo, to not self-defend in order to preserve your life or the lives of those who are important to you. 

Snails and slugs do it.  Elephants do it.  All of nature's critters do it.

The hard part for human beings is in the discerning.

No sane human being kills solely out of anger, when there is no threat to his life or the lives of those important to him.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #19110092 - 11/09/13 11:53 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I think I've been clear about my question.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19110110 - 11/09/13 12:00 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I'm pretty sure there is murder in Buddhist populations.

As far as serious religious devotees it seems less likely that they would commit premeditated murder than a monotheist as their religion condemns violence whereas the monotheistic religions directly contribute to violence.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: OZA]
    #19110133 - 11/09/13 12:08 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OZA said:
Look at what's going on in Sri Lanka. Yes a "true" Buddhist would commit murder. No religion is absolutely free of bad people.





I've posted dozens of links over the years to articles showing buddhists
killing for religion, they've attacked and killed both christians and
muslims, even monks were involved in the warring


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #19110282 - 11/09/13 12:53 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

There was once a mass killing of Hindus and the sect being killed off believed so strongly against violence that they never formed a military to defend themselves.

Thus spawned the Sikhs


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19111445 - 11/09/13 06:19 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

No way man. Buddhist monks consider all life as sacred. there are many other ways of punishment for a crime. They believe in loving, understanding, and having compassion for everyone. i feel the same way actually in that death is a cheap punishment for someone who has ruined lives. Better they rott in a prison.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Dboy]
    #19111503 - 11/09/13 06:29 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Dboy said:
No way man. Buddhist monks consider all life as sacred. there are many other ways of punishment for a crime. They believe in loving, understanding, and having compassion for everyone. i feel the same way actually in that death is a cheap punishment for someone who has ruined lives. Better they rott in a prison.




Didn't I say that having the person locked up was out of the question? And whoever said it was about punishment, it's about stopping the trafficker from running his operation and also from capturing future people.


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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: s240779]
    #19111563 - 11/09/13 06:43 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

ok well if jail is out of the question id still say no. personally i view buddhism in such a way that harming any life is wrong. anyway monks wouldnt be getting involved with human trafficing cases anyway lol.


--------------------
An oak tree is an oak tree. That is all it must be. If an oak tree is less than an oak tree, we're all in trouble.
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Re: Would a Buddhist ever commit murder? [Re: Dboy]
    #19111813 - 11/09/13 07:41 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Depends on the Buddhist.


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