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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: elasticaltiger]
    #19093094 - 11/05/13 10:54 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

elasticaltiger said:


Three cakes cased with straight verm at field capacity.  Does that look like an increased yield to you?  Though they looked pretty like that looking like a forest they didn't yield substantially more or less than any of my individual cakes.

Casing cakes with field capacity verm doesn't increase yield.  It's the same as rolling in dry verm and misting.




What it looks like to me is a multispore grow.  And rolling in dry verm and misting does increase yield.  That's why we do it.


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Invisibleelasticaltiger
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: Psilicon]
    #19093235 - 11/05/13 11:21 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

van der griegen said:
Quote:

elasticaltiger said:


Three cakes cased with straight verm at field capacity.  Does that look like an increased yield to you?  Though they looked pretty like that looking like a forest they didn't yield substantially more or less than any of my individual cakes.

Casing cakes with field capacity verm doesn't increase yield.  It's the same as rolling in dry verm and misting.




What it looks like to me is a multispore grow.  And rolling in dry verm and misting does increase yield.  That's why we do it.




:facepalm3: Really dude?  You know I meant casing with field capacity verm doesn't increase yield MORE THAN rolling in dry verm and misting.  Sorry if I didn't make that clear but I find it hard to believe that you didn't understand what I meant.


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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: elasticaltiger]
    #19093349 - 11/05/13 11:52 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

elasticaltiger said:Sorry if I didn't make that clear but I find it hard to believe that you didn't understand what I meant.




I find it hard to believe I'm having this argument at all.  I don't want to talk about whether a casing layer improves cubensis yields significantly--it has not been shown to, and I agree with you there.  But this whole argument is about NAH's incorrect assertion that casing layers provide no moisture, which is so wrong it's funny, with a brief aside about whether mycelia can redistribute moisture.

As for whether it provides more moisture than dunking?  You can case a tray with a much, much larger volume of moist vermiculite than the one-particle-thick layer of dry vermiculite you can get to stick to a completely covered cake.  I'm not an advocate of casing anything, guys.  But it's just not correct to say it provides no moisture.


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: Psilicon]
    #19094147 - 11/06/13 06:03 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

van der griegen said:
:feelingblue:
caption:  David Tennant (with no additional moisture)




David is getting wetter on the surface. His surface will dry soon after he's out of the rain. He is not becoming more hydrated. This pic is silly.

You are missing the big picture. I can't believe you're having this argument either.


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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #19094197 - 11/06/13 06:44 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

David is not made out of hyphae, which can draw water toward the main mycelial mass from a depth of ten meters or more.


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: Psilicon]
    #19094257 - 11/06/13 07:35 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I understand what you're saying. I have from the beginning. I'm not saying you are wrong.

On a strictly technical level, you are correct. But, in the spirit of what's trying to be accomplished, Hacker is also correct.

Depending on a casing as THE source of moisture is, IMHO, bad practice. Much like the trickle-down logic of Reaganomics.

Cakes (crumbled or not) need to be hydrated directly.

With crumbling, mixing with properly hydrated substrate is superior to casing for this purpose.

Adding a casing layer does not add water to crumbled cakes in a significant way. Mixing does.

I can accept your arguments as being technically reasonable, but your position is primarily semantic in nature and does not support best practices, which is really the point.


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Edited by SpitballJedi (11/06/13 08:58 AM)


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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: Would this work as a bulk grow? [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #19096744 - 11/06/13 05:59 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

SpitballJedi said:
I understand what you're saying. I have from the beginning. I'm not saying you are wrong.

On a strictly technical level, you are correct. But, in the spirit of what's trying to be accomplished, Hacker is also correct.

Depending on a casing as THE source of moisture is, IMHO, bad practice. Much like the trickle-down logic of Reaganomics.

Cakes (crumbled or not) need to be hydrated directly.

With crumbling, mixing with properly hydrated substrate is superior to casing for this purpose.

Adding a casing layer does not add water to crumbled cakes in a significant way. Mixing does.

I can accept your arguments as being technically reasonable, but your position is primarily semantic in nature and does not support best practices, which is really the point.




:thumbup:

I can definitely meet you halfway there, for sure.  I do not agree that the amount of water provided is trivial, but vehemently agree that relying on casing for moisture is far from best practices.  It is my opinion (based on little but conjecture, but I think many will agree) that a really productive clone in a monotub will push the bounds of what is possible both spatially and in terms of nutrition.  Casing provides an amount of moisture that, while not insignificant in terms of percentage of the whole, does not make a difference because of the other limiting factors in a good monotub.  Someday I might like to do a study of casing on a poor or moderate producer to compare results, as it is my suspicion that the studies that showed there to be no difference were done on high producers where other limiting factors made the difference between the two insignificant--kind of like a distance race between two cars that are governed at 140mph.


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