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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: volcomstoner]
    #19083997 - 11/04/13 02:15 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
also we don't need the ad hominem arguments in a conversation where you keep criticizing us for not being intellectual.



Quote:

d00d557 said:
As all you can resort to is ad hominems



:rolleyes:


please find an ad hominem by me in this thread.


Quote:

d00d557 said:
http://www.livescience.com/27920-quantum-action-faster-than-light.html



the photons themselves were not moving faster than the speed of light.

Quote:

volcomstoner said:
Quote:

d00d557 said:
We're very sure of ourselves and our place in the world.  Is it so hard to admit we don't know everydamnthing in the universe?  Yes.



umm no we aren't and no it isn't



^


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OfflineNotTheDevil
Transhuman


Registered: 01/08/13
Posts: 5,436
Loc: US Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: volcomstoner]
    #19084003 - 11/04/13 02:18 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
The light barrier cannot be passed.

Quote:

You guys need to come up with better. 




no, we really don't.



Quote:

intellectualism




:lolsy:



There are ways around the speed of light, lot of them in fact.
Quote:

volcomstoner said:
Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

d00d557 said:
bilaterally symmetrical organisms



oh my god blow it out your ass :lol:


I don't think we are the only organisms in the universe, not by a long shot.






But this, probably no nearby et's


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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NotTheDevil]
    #19084008 - 11/04/13 02:21 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NotTheDevil said:

There are ways around the speed of light, lot of them in fact.




go on?


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Offlinehealing
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NotTheDevil]
    #19084013 - 11/04/13 02:21 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I can imagine something that goes faster than the speed of light. The speed of light is actually very slow, since it is limited. Since it is a concept, is it fair to compare the speed of light to the concept of infinity, or does the fact that the concept of the speed of light is derived from a tangible, observable phenomenon rule that comparison out?


--------------------
Open mind, open heart, open book.



Edited by healing (11/04/13 02:22 AM)


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InvisiblezZZz
jesus
I'm a teapot User Gallery

Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 33,478
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: healing]
    #19084019 - 11/04/13 02:24 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

it's true about the camera, i've tried catching some ufos with a good vid camera and you can barely see the dots when you zoom, sometimes you can't see them at all. i've seen a bunch ufos in the sky, sometimes they are obviously a space satellite or something, but other times they are like stars that suddenly fade in from the distant space at high speeds, almost like a shooting star, but these stars fade in and slowly hover over our atmosphere for a while then suddenly shoot back out into to space like a small comet. it's crazy..

op i've heard stories of those orbs in mexico, supposedly they are witches/brujos or some shit.. :yesnod: there are lots over there


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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: healing]
    #19084020 - 11/04/13 02:24 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I can imagine something that goes faster than the speed of light



but it doesn't mean that thing will exist.

the speed of light is not fast or low, it is just a rate (distance per time).  fast and slow have no meaning in science.


It is also not a concept, it is a measurable phenomenon.


comparing the speed of light to infinity is not a fair comparison because the speed of light is a finite number


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OfflineNotTheDevil
Transhuman


Registered: 01/08/13
Posts: 5,436
Loc: US Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NWlight]
    #19084023 - 11/04/13 02:26 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

NotTheDevil said:

There are ways around the speed of light, lot of them in fact.




go on?



Teleportation which can be theoretically done by making a wormhole between two part of space time, or perhaps by making two parts of spacetime into one.

Faster than light travel which bends space around it to make an increase in spatial density behind the ship and a decrease in front of it causing the ship to move the space around it, and because the ship itself is not actually moving but rather is changing the space around it there is no known limit to the speed to which it can go from one place to another,


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Offlinehealing
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NWlight]
    #19084025 - 11/04/13 02:28 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

I can imagine something that goes faster than the speed of light



but it doesn't mean that thing will exist.

the speed of light is not fast or low, it is just a rate (distance per time).  fast and slow have no meaning in science.


It is also not a concept, it is a measurable phenomenon.


comparing the speed of light to infinity is not a fair comparison because the speed of light is a finite number




Is it impossible to compare a finite number to infinity? If so, what is the value of the concept of infinity?

To be clear, I meant that the speed of light can be discussed as a concept because it requires a person conceptualizing it for it to be observed.


--------------------
Open mind, open heart, open book.



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InvisiblehTx
(:
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Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 5,724
Loc: Space-time
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: healing]
    #19084038 - 11/04/13 02:33 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

the speed of light, imo, and the physics contained within its limit are just that. Physics contained within the speed of light. I think its fair to say that there is a possibility that the higgs field has quite a lot to do with slowing down particles into not only matter and mass but photons to the speed of light as well.

I believe that much of the universe exists there.

Which explains the appearance of dark matter/energy.


--------------------
zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes
Light up the darkness.


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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: healing]
    #19084044 - 11/04/13 02:37 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

healing said:
Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

I can imagine something that goes faster than the speed of light



but it doesn't mean that thing will exist.

the speed of light is not fast or low, it is just a rate (distance per time).  fast and slow have no meaning in science.


It is also not a concept, it is a measurable phenomenon.


comparing the speed of light to infinity is not a fair comparison because the speed of light is a finite number




Is it impossible to compare a finite number to infinity? If so, what is the value of the concept of infinity?

To be clear, I meant that the speed of light can be discussed as a concept because it requires a person conceptualizing it for it to be observed.



you can compare them.  just like you can compare a TV remote to an orange.

I fail to see the value in doing so.  We understand both in different contexts.  they have different properties and are useful in different situations.

what is the value of the concept of infinity? mostly in understanding limits of equations that approach a value but never reach it.


the speed of light can be discussed as a concept, I do not disagree.  and it doesn't require a person to conceptualize it for it to be observed.


the speed of light is the same and behaves the same whether or not there is someone there to see it and measure it.


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


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OfflineNotTheDevil
Transhuman


Registered: 01/08/13
Posts: 5,436
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: hTx]
    #19084047 - 11/04/13 02:37 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hTx said:
the speed of light, imo, and the physics contained within its limit are just that. Physics contained within the speed of light. I think its fair to say that there is a possibility that the higgs field has quite a lot to do with slowing down particles into not only matter and mass but photons to the speed of light as well.

I believe that much of the universe exists there.

Which explains the appearance of dark matter/energy.



If the speed of light is the fastest something can go, you just have to cheat your way around it


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Offlinehealing
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NWlight]
    #19084052 - 11/04/13 02:40 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

healing said:
Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

I can imagine something that goes faster than the speed of light



but it doesn't mean that thing will exist.

the speed of light is not fast or low, it is just a rate (distance per time).  fast and slow have no meaning in science.


It is also not a concept, it is a measurable phenomenon.


comparing the speed of light to infinity is not a fair comparison because the speed of light is a finite number




Is it impossible to compare a finite number to infinity? If so, what is the value of the concept of infinity?

To be clear, I meant that the speed of light can be discussed as a concept because it requires a person conceptualizing it for it to be observed.



you can compare them.  just like you can compare a TV remote to an orange.

I fail to see the value in doing so.  We understand both in different contexts.  they have different properties and are useful in different situations.

what is the value of the concept of infinity? mostly in understanding limits of equations that approach a value but never reach it.


the speed of light can be discussed as a concept, I do not disagree.  and it doesn't require a person to conceptualize it for it to be observed.


the speed of light is the same and behaves the same whether or not there is someone there to see it and measure it.




Yes, but without the concept of speed, or light there would be no reason for a person to create a situation in which there would be the possibility of learning that there is a speed at which light travels.

In ancient Greece, the scholars of the time believed that light was projected from the eyes upon that which was being observed. They had no concept of light as we know it, and could, therefore, not even begin to try to observe the speed of light.


--------------------
Open mind, open heart, open book.



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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NotTheDevil]
    #19084055 - 11/04/13 02:42 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NotTheDevil said:
Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

NotTheDevil said:

There are ways around the speed of light, lot of them in fact.




go on?



Teleportation which can be theoretically done by making a wormhole between two part of space time, or perhaps by making two parts of spacetime into one.

Faster than light travel which bends space around it to make an increase in spatial density behind the ship and a decrease in front of it causing the ship to move the space around it, and because the ship itself is not actually moving but rather is changing the space around it there is no known limit to the speed to which it can go from one place to another,



this goes into reaches of physics I do not yet understand.

I mean, I get the general concept and some specifics of its basis for exploration as a possibility but have yet to master the equations governing its behavior.


Perhaps another day I will be prepared to discuss this :smile:


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


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InvisiblehTx
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Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 5,724
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NotTheDevil] * 1
    #19084056 - 11/04/13 02:43 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Also, with black holes..

If even light cannot escape them, wouldn't it be safe to assume that something greater than the speed of light is making that so? Gravity? Since gravity effects light like it does especially in regards to a black holes ability to eliminate it, I think gravity may be particles (of the cohesive sorts) that exist outside of the speed of light, FTL particles.

Which is why gravity is such a mystery and why it is the weakest force in the galaxy, even though one of the most obvious ones.


--------------------
zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes
Light up the darkness.


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OfflineBovice
Suspect

Registered: 09/28/12
Posts: 355
Last seen: 5 years, 4 months
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NWlight]
    #19084059 - 11/04/13 02:44 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Hmm the only weird thing I've seen..

Little back info, I don't believe in ghosts, but I do believe in UFO's.. not necessarily the little gray men UFO's but more like different dimensional beings.. that or bacteria growing on some rock wayy out on the other side of the universe. Never have and never will believe in ghosts.

ANYWAYS, I was 16 and just turned my lights off to go to bed. I sleep on my side, and when I cant fall asleep on one side I roll over on the other and that usually does the trick. Well no more than a minute and a half, and I swear it couldn't have been longer, I decided to try the other side since I was still wide awake. I roll over onto my left side, and immediately notice what appeared to be an aluminum birthday balloon floating about three feet high, and two feet away from me, laterally to my chest.

Immediately I just assumed it was just as I first described it as.. an aluminum birthday balloon or get well balloon (I assume you guys get the point). But this aluminum balloon was different, it had no string, was perfectly round, and had no decal of any sort on it, it was just pure metallic in color. Another interesting thing about this was you know when those actual aluminum birthday balloons start to get old after a week or so, they get all crinkley and don't float all the way to the ceiling anymore?? Well this is another reason I instantly thought it was someone from my family's old birthday balloon because it looked like an old silver birthday balloon that had been around for a couple weeks and needed to get tossed out, but again had no picture, writing or anything on it, just was one solid color. I could see it decently because I had a large alarm clock on the other side of my room that gave off green light instead of red, so the crinkly part of the balloon thing whatever it was really stands out to me.

ANYWAYS, my first immediate thought was what the fuck, who put an old birthday balloon in my room??? Just kinda annoyed that someone would put that trash in my room. Then I realized it had not been anyones birthday in over a month, and that this couldn't have been a balloon because it was just all aluminum colored and didn't even say anything. I was scared Shitless at this point, and without wasting another even fraction of a second dashed to my door to wake my dad, and as I made it to the door I made one glance back before leaving my room and it was GONE. I still woke my father and he could tell I was terrified. He checked my room and then just assumed I was having a bad dream or something.

I regret not acting differently years later now because it was close enough for me to touch if I had just sat up a little ways and reached out for it. I will reiterate that the lights had just been turned off in my room and I had just layed down no more than a minute and a half before seeing this and there is absolutely no way this could have been a dream.

Still gives me chills when I think of it, whatever it was.


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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: healing]
    #19084063 - 11/04/13 02:45 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

healing said:
Yes, but without the concept of speed, or light there would be no reason for a person to create a situation in which there would be the possibility of learning that there is a speed at which light travels.

In ancient Greece, the scholars of the time believed that light was projected from the eyes upon that which was being observed. They had no concept of light as we know it, and could, therefore, not even begin to try to observe the speed of light.



OK I am now following your line of thinking.

what might it be to do with non-terrestrial craft?

merely saying them and the science governing their motion is, as of yet, not understood to us, and so foreign, in fact, that the idea "you don't know what you don't know" is particularly relevant?

I cannot refute that which I do not understand :grin: true, true.


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


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InvisiblehTx
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NWlight]
    #19084077 - 11/04/13 02:57 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Therefore the existence of FTL travel exists, since there are more than likely TONS of particles which exist above the speed of light limit that we cannot easily observe, since we don't know how to observe what isn't observable (as they exist outside of the speed of light, the only thing we can observe) quite yet...at least not publicly any ways.


--------------------
zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes
Light up the darkness.


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Offlinehealing
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: NWlight]
    #19084081 - 11/04/13 02:58 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Quote:

healing said:
Yes, but without the concept of speed, or light there would be no reason for a person to create a situation in which there would be the possibility of learning that there is a speed at which light travels.

In ancient Greece, the scholars of the time believed that light was projected from the eyes upon that which was being observed. They had no concept of light as we know it, and could, therefore, not even begin to try to observe the speed of light.



OK I am now following your line of thinking.

what might it be to do with non-terrestrial craft?

merely saying them and the science governing their motion is, as of yet, not understood to us, and so foreign, in fact, that the idea "you don't know what you don't know" is particularly relevant?

I cannot refute that which I do not understand :grin: true, true.




I'm saying that since I can conceptualize the ability of some observable thing to be able to travel faster than the speed of light, a good line of reasoning might lead someone to begin to test a hypothesis related to such a concept. Based on my assumption that since there is a number higher than 299,792,458m/s and that, therefore, their might be the possibility that something can go as fast as even just 299,792,459m/s, is the line of reasoning that such an imaginary thing could exist useful to leading us to discovering something faster than the speed of light, or does that seem delusional?

Either way, since I can imagine something going much faster than 299,792,458m/s, the speed of light is sort of dwarfed by the infinite number of m/s I can conceptualize.


--------------------
Open mind, open heart, open book.



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InvisiblehTx
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: healing]
    #19084099 - 11/04/13 03:27 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

since no one has attempted to counter me, I will assume I am right muaha and that FTL is not only possible, but happens all the time, making time possible for us here contained within the speed of light.

I'll also assume that an ET figured this out somewhere in the universe and therefore FTL travel is possible, and why we see UFOs manipulate time-space like a piece of butter.. :dancer:


--------------------
zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes
Light up the darkness.


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OfflineConstantine
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/01/11
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Re: Experiences with non-terrestrial craft? [Re: d00d557] * 1
    #19084187 - 11/04/13 04:59 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

d00d557 said:
I hate when people ask for photographic evidence




Yeah, who needs that huh ?


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