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OfflineMaxwellSmart
Enemy of State


Registered: 10/27/13
Posts: 113
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Fellow Anarchists? * 1
    #19076758 - 11/02/13 07:42 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Anyone else here see the state as an extortion racket or is it just me?

Taxation = Theft FTW!!!


--------------------
"The cost of sanity, in this society, is a certain level of alienation." -Terence McKenna.


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OfflineMush4Brains
LOOL HACKED!!!

Registered: 07/31/13
Posts: 4,419
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: MaxwellSmart]
    #19076771 - 11/02/13 07:46 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

:facepalm:

Anarchism is for deluded 15 year olds.  If you want anarchy, you can go live in many shithole 3rd world countries if you would like.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Mush4Brains] * 1
    #19076829 - 11/02/13 07:55 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Mush4Brains said:
:facepalm:

Anarchism is for deluded 15 year olds.  If you want anarchy, you can go live in many shithole 3rd world countries if you would like.



Holy shit.  We agree on something


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OfflineMaxwellSmart
Enemy of State


Registered: 10/27/13
Posts: 113
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Mush4Brains] * 2
    #19076919 - 11/02/13 08:14 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Mush4Brains said:
:facepalm:

Anarchism is for deluded 15 year olds.  If you want anarchy, you can go live in many shithole 3rd world countries if you would like.



I wish I a dollar for every time I've heard something like that.


--------------------
"The cost of sanity, in this society, is a certain level of alienation." -Terence McKenna.


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OfflineEddeee
Observer/messenger
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Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 933
Loc: under the pacific ocean o...
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: MaxwellSmart]
    #19076934 - 11/02/13 08:17 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

True Anarchy is having complete mutual respect and love for all your fellow human beings. But if you fuck me over I fuck you over worse


--------------------
Don't read books study life then write books
we are nothing but atoms trying to figure out what atoms are.



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OfflineMaxwellSmart
Enemy of State


Registered: 10/27/13
Posts: 113
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Eddeee]
    #19076950 - 11/02/13 08:23 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Eddeee said:
True Anarchy is having complete mutual respect and love for all your fellow human beings. But if you fuck me over I fuck you over worse



YES!!


--------------------
"The cost of sanity, in this society, is a certain level of alienation." -Terence McKenna.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
OTD God-King
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,967
Loc: Uncanny Valley
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: MaxwellSmart] * 1
    #19076963 - 11/02/13 08:27 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

MaxwellSmart said:

I wish I a dollar for every time I've heard something like that.



What the fuck would an anarchist want money for?


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OfflineMaxwellSmart
Enemy of State


Registered: 10/27/13
Posts: 113
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #19076995 - 11/02/13 08:37 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

MaxwellSmart said:

I wish I a dollar for every time I've heard something like that.



What the fuck would an anarchist want money for?



To buy shit.


--------------------
"The cost of sanity, in this society, is a certain level of alienation." -Terence McKenna.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: MaxwellSmart]
    #19077003 - 11/02/13 08:39 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Pretty hypocritical, brah.


--------------------
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OfflineMaxwellSmart
Enemy of State


Registered: 10/27/13
Posts: 113
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Enlil]
    #19077043 - 11/02/13 08:49 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

In what way?


--------------------
"The cost of sanity, in this society, is a certain level of alienation." -Terence McKenna.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: MaxwellSmart]
    #19077056 - 11/02/13 08:52 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Never you mind, kid....you'll figure it out...or not.


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.

Ask an Attorney

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OfflineEddeee
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Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 933
Loc: under the pacific ocean o...
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Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Enlil]
    #19077130 - 11/02/13 09:10 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

MaxwellSmart said:

I wish I a dollar for every time I've heard something like that.



What the fuck would an anarchist want money for?



To light my cigars  and wipe my ass


--------------------
Don't read books study life then write books
we are nothing but atoms trying to figure out what atoms are.



Edited by Eddeee (11/02/13 09:18 PM)


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InvisibleHalfLight
.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/03/13
Posts: 2,322
Loc: Black Flag
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Enlil]
    #19077757 - 11/02/13 11:23 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

MaxwellSmart said:

I wish I a dollar for every time I've heard something like that.



What the fuck would an anarchist want money for?




To use in a current system which provides rewards for currency (I mean the money/noun, not the currency the state of being current/adjective).


Anyways, I'm pretty sure we all know that acclaimed beliefs do not often transfer into actions, or probably more accurate would be to say that acclaimed beliefs often notactual beliefs.
You think that anyone actually wants anarchy? No. We all just want to push our desires onto one another for our own benefit. Hence, government.

But yes, I am a theoretical anarchist. I say theoretical because it wouldn't work, and because I don't actually want it to work. I desire the goods of other human beings just as everyone else. This is also why communism wouldn't work. Everyone at heart is a capitalist except for those without goods to trade with others. This is why the poor are acclaimed marxists (because they don't have possessions to trade) and why the rich are acclaimed capitalists. If given significant possessions, any communist would realize, "Hey, other people value my possessions enough for me to extort something from them!"

Everyone believes in the system that it benefits them most to believe in, and everyone acts according to systems which benefit them most to act on.

I say that I am a theoretical anarchist because the above would prevent ACTUAL anarchy. I really just want people to stay out of my fucking business. I'm a person whom other people have imposed their will on, however, I also want to benefit from other people's existence, which is impossible if they can't benefit off of mine. Thus, anarchy isn't truly what I want, despite my own claims.

Taxation is not theft, it's paid protection of your life and property. Unfortunately, our federal government does an absolute shit job off of this for most people, only the impossibly rich.


--------------------
dead man walking


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Offlinepsilynut
aka Patchraper

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 1,244
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: HalfLight]
    #19078022 - 11/03/13 12:09 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Taxation is not theft, it's paid protection of your life and property. Unfortunately, our federal government does an absolute shit job off of this for most people, only the impossibly rich.



   
  Its a little more than that ......




If you don't like paying taxes . . .

- Don't drive on paved streets or highways.

- Don't call 911.

- Don't flush your toilet.

- Don't bring your garbage to the curb.

- Don't fly in an airplane that uses air-traffic controllers.

- Don't use the court system.

- Don't call the police when you get robbed.

- Don't use the US Post Office, send all your letters via FedEx or UPS.

- Don't ask for a farm subsidy for not growing crops.

- Don't ask for a taxpayer subsidy to do business in a city or state.

- Don't buy a sports franchise and ask the taxpayers to build your stadium.

- Don't send your children to public schools.

- Don't attend a state university.

- Don't expect a social security payment.

- Don't let Medicare pay your bills if you are over 65 or disabled.

- Don't look for a government contract to bolster your defense industry business.

- Don't look for a government.

- Don't look for a lucrative government consultant contract.

- Don't run for political office where your salary is paid for by the taxpayers.

- Don't accept government research findings that subsidize research for your industry.

- Don't be an airline and expect the government to bail you out.

- Don't be a car company and expect the government to bail you out.

- Don't be a steel company and expect the government to bail you out.

- Don't be a company that pollutes and expect the taxpayer to bail you out.

- Don't climb to the top of the Washington Monument, which is maintained at taxpayer expense.

- Don't make use of police services.

- Don't be rescued by fire department paramedic team.

- Don't call the fire department.

- Don't expect federal assistance if a natural disaster destroys your home or business.

- Don't expect the military to defend our country.

- Don't visit national parks or hike in national forests.

- Don't eat USDA inspected meat, cheese, eggs or produce.

- Don't take any medications tested and approved by the FDA.

- Don't drink, bath or otherwise use the water from municipal water systems.

- Don't look at or relay a weather report.

- Don't look at a NASA generated picture.

- Don't expect a unit of measure like a gallon of gas to be a full gallon.

- Don't expect an elevator to work correctly or not fall.

- Don't expect a red light to work.

- Don't be the Minority Senate Leader Named Trent Lott and expect American taxpayers to subsidize the building of private industry cruiseliner ships in your home state.

- Don't accept government money to help develop a product which you then personally patent or copyright and sell for your own profit.

- Don't use the services of a doctor who is licensed through the state.

- Don't expect research into medical problems such as cancer, heart disease, diabetes, aging, prostrate, menopause, etc.

- Don't use the public library.

- Don't go to a state university affiliated hospital.

- Don't go to a state university.

- Don't watch state college sports.

- Don't apply for government grants.

- Don't use your state's convention centers.

- Don't go to a state, city or municipal-run airport.

- Don't ask for rural electrification.

- Don't ask for FEC regulations that protect us from crooked financial planners.

- Don't ask to keep the airwaves free so your right-wing psycho radio talk show host can lie to you.

- Don't ask for a business loan from the small business administration.

- Don't ask to use the G.I. bill to go to college.

- Don't allow Al Gore to sponsor legislation to turn a military computer network (DARPANet/ARPANet) into the public-accessed "Internet."

- Don't drive a car that benefits from government safety regulations.

- Don't use electricity generated by TVA or some government-owned and maintained dam or facility.

- Don't use currency printed by the US Treasury.

- Don't use a bank or credit union that insures your deposits through the FDIC.

- Don't buy or build a house that requires the efforts of county deed offices or needs building permits and inspections.

- Don't get married, have children or die and expect the government to keep track of all the certificates.

- Don't expect the government to keep an eye on cemeteries, crematories and funeral homes so you won't get dug up and thrown in a swamp. And ask George Bush why he lied about his involvement with a company that did just that.

- Don't run for an elected office, because the local, state and federal election commissions could be involved.

- Don't go to a beach kept clean by the state.

- Don't use public transportation.

- Don't visit public museums.

- Don't go hunting, fishing, or camping on government property.

- Don't cross a bridge.

- Don't use truckstops or public restrooms.

June 24, 2002 Updates

- Don't expect the government to protect the copyright for the works you create.

- Don't move to any other developed nation, because the taxes are higher in all
the others, except South Africa.

- Don't expect your tap water to be clean and germ free.

- Don't expect there to be much wildlife left other than rats.

- Don't use wood or eat meat grown on Forest Service or BLM land.

- Don't eat any food transported on roads.

- Don't eat any vegetables in winter, 'cause they're mostly grown with "reclaimed" water.

- Don't expect any workplace safety standards, labor laws, or minimum wage.

- Don't use any gasoline, oil, or natural gas that was discovered by the USGS.

- Don't live in New Orleans, Sacramento or any other city protected by a levee.

- Don't expect zoning laws.

- Don't expect clean air, clean water, clean soil, etc.

- Don't expect highway signs.

- Don't expect laws against murder, theft, etc. (the govt. DEFINES crime).

- Don't expect to OWN anything, like your house, car, etc. (the govt. keeps track
of titles).

- Don't expect anyone to plow your roads when it snows or sweep them when they're dirty.

- Don't expect the government to regulate industries that have monopolies and use that power to raise your rates for reduced service and product quality.

- Don't expect the government to keep gasoline rates low, compared to the rest of the world.

- Don't expect convicted criminals to be in prison and off your street.

- Don't expect the local government to condemn private property at below market rates so that your major league baseball franchise can build a stadium on the land and make millions of dollars in profit while leaving the taxpayers to foot the bill when the courts order the government to pay the property owners a fair price.

July 26, 2002 Updates

- Don't expect to receive a cheap land lease on Federal lands, then mine or cut the forest for your profit with no repayment to the landlord (we the people).

- Don't expect to have uniform building codes.

- Don't expect to go to buildings and high rises that have been reviewed and inspected during construction to ensure it was built to current building codes.

- Don't expect to eat in restaurants that have been inspected to ensure cleanliness and the safe preparation of food.

- Don't expect your children to be able to ride the bus to school.

- Don't try to adopt a child through your county or state government.

- Don't expect the state or county to pay foster parents to take care of the children left abandoned or orphaned.

- Don't expect the state or county to investigate and/or remove children from neglectful or abusive homes.

- Don't visit the Smithsonian.

- Don't write any material to be published and copyright it.

- Don't go to your book store and try to find a book by its ISBN number.

- Don't expect the government to stop the auto companies from building SUVs that roll over and kill your wife and kids.

- Don't expect the court to appoint a taxpayer-paid attorney to represent you (or your child) when you are accused of a crime.

- Don't call or go to the US Embassy in a foreign country when you get in trouble.

- Don't get a passport or try to get out of the US without a Passport.

- Don't expect to enjoy the benefits of the most stable regime in the world.


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InvisibleHalfLight
.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/03/13
Posts: 2,322
Loc: Black Flag
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: psilynut]
    #19078238 - 11/03/13 12:53 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

All of this is true I was admittedly over-simplifying.


--------------------
dead man walking


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Offlinestarfire_xes
I Am 'They'
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 21,590
Loc: Dallas with all the assho...
Last seen: 7 months, 26 days
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: psilynut] * 2
    #19078323 - 11/03/13 01:22 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Don't expect some unelected fucking asshole government beaurocrat to be up your asshole 24-7 with a microscope controlling every aspect of your life.


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OfflineMush4Brains
LOOL HACKED!!!

Registered: 07/31/13
Posts: 4,419
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19078361 - 11/03/13 01:42 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Don't expect some unelected fucking asshole government beaurocrat to be up your asshole 24-7 with a microscope controlling every aspect of your life.




Well, with most decisions, if you work your way up the chain of command, there was eventually someone who had been elected who made the choice to hire someone, who made the choice to hire someone else... and so on.


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Invisiblelighthouse09
Stranger thats mr. stranger
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Registered: 03/16/13
Posts: 699
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Mush4Brains]
    #19078640 - 11/03/13 01:56 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I used to be a hardcore escapist/anarchist now i just want change and whatever it takes to get that?
anarchy i still don't see as a reasonable solution without serious reprocutions.
but i do feel lost how do we get out of this fucked system i just dont see the light at the end of the B.S. am i doomed dooooooommmmeeeddd!!!??>????


--------------------
<--This fuckin guy


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Offlinekneesocks
Divineress
Female User Gallery


Registered: 12/25/11
Posts: 870
Loc: Puget Sound/PNW Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: Eddeee]
    #19078670 - 11/03/13 02:15 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I like how the thread quieted the fuck down after psilynut's post.

"Anarchy", like any other system of government (or lack-of), is inherently going to be corrupt, because an individual or individuals will seek to compete over who gets to lord their power, eventually turning into a feudal system or oligarchy, and we already know how those turn out.

There is no perfect system of government, just some that are more tolerable than others.
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

MaxwellSmart said:

I wish I a dollar for every time I've heard something like that.



What the fuck would an anarchist want money for?



Quote:

MaxwellSmart said:
In what way?



Dude, to simplify things, you just got hardcore exposed as someone who doesn't understand anarchy at all.

Quote:

Eddeee said:
True Anarchy is having complete mutual respect and love for all your fellow human beings.



Where I'm from, that is commonly called "being a decent person".


--------------------
"An ignorant man is lost, faithless, and filled with self-doubt;
A soul that harbors doubt has no joy, not in this world or the next."
-Bhagavad-gita 4:40


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OfflineOpenQwerty
Stranger
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Registered: 08/05/10
Posts: 165
Last seen: 6 days, 15 hours
Re: Fellow Anarchists? [Re: MaxwellSmart]
    #19078838 - 11/03/13 05:07 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

...Well, in the last few months I have tried to understand the anarchist ideas and to get closer to those who  call themselves anarchists (there is a lot of anarchist groups, here) .

Firstly, I have read some works by Kropotkin ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Kropotkin ). As far as I can understand his ideas, he starts from the observation that in nature, members of the most highly evolved species tend to cooperate with each other rather than compete with each other (you see, for example, dolphins, elephants, monkeys....), and also in the human  society, it can be observed that, in many "key areas", (for example, the scientific research ) the push toward cooperation is stronger than the competition (I will give a modern example : the space exploration is started as a competition but now is going to become a cooperation, with joint operations like the ISS  - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Space_Station ). Starting from these premises, his conclusion is that the human society should evolve into forms of cooperation, and mutual aid,  instead of to perpetuate the hierarchical forms of domination as the state, the capitalist market or anything else.

I don't fully agree with all of his ideas, but …his analysis seems quite logical to me.


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