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OrgoneConclusion
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The Veil of Forgetfullness
#19075422 - 11/02/13 02:29 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Many New Agers believe either that
a: We are God and forgot.
b. We reincarnated and forgot our previous lives.
So how did these prescient people overcome the impenetrable veil? Did God fuck up?
(The first one to write 'DMT' gets an automatic ban.)
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OrgoneConclusion
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Uh oh. I forgot where I put my keys.
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Cactilove
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No, under this belief structure the claim is that god is playing a game of hide and seek with itself. You, after much searching are supposed to rediscover your true self. Time passes and you eventually forget again and it all starts over.
According to this belief all of existence is god playing with itself.
-------------------- Orgone Conclusion...Bringing OTD to PS&P since 2007.
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Icelander
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Cactilove] 2
#19076089 - 11/02/13 05:04 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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God looks really pathetic when I think about it like that. Bored out of his skull and needing lots of gore and suffering to get his rocks off.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Cactilove
Controversial Mystic


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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Icelander]
#19076301 - 11/02/13 05:47 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Why not? It's not like it is hurting anyone but itself. All of the sudden all of the suffering in the world doesn't seem so bad. Everything is going to be ok, it's all a game..
Isn't that a wonderful thought...
-------------------- Orgone Conclusion...Bringing OTD to PS&P since 2007.
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Icelander
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Cactilove] 1
#19076322 - 11/02/13 05:52 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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No and I'll tell you why. I wasn't asked if I wanted to play any stoopid game.
And what do you mean "be ok"? This bullshit is going to go on forever without end. It's not like theres going to be a big party after game night.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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circastes
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Icelander]
#19076415 - 11/02/13 06:14 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nature is pretty beautiful... and extremely impressive. It is not hard to believe a divinity created it or had some hand.
I understand the God's hide and seek thing is a bit of a cop out, but I suggest something more significant is going on, that we are extremely profound beings and since everything is dream-like we can veil it from ourselves. In fact the world is strange beyond imagining, only we as clever little primates can get wrapped up in simplistic theories and then wail about it.
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Icelander
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19076425 - 11/02/13 06:17 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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IMO you have a very shallow or superficial view of nature. Likely because culture feeds you your meat prepackaged or smoked. 
Nature is based in struggle and violence not beauty. The veneer of beauty is what we see when we step back and have a moment at peace before the next feeding. If god had a hand it it then god is violent and warlike as much or more than anything else it might be.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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circastes
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Icelander]
#19077026 - 11/02/13 08:46 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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-------------------- My solitude... My shield... My armour... TESTED WITH FULL FORCE
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Cactilove
Controversial Mystic


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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19077240 - 11/02/13 09:28 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
No and I'll tell you why. I wasn't asked if I wanted to play any stoopid game.
You weren't asked, you volunteered. Your true self is god. Your true self finds entertainment in suffering as well as happiness.
Quote:
And what do you mean "be ok"? This bullshit is going to go on forever without end. It's not like theres going to be a big party after game night.
Yes it is, but the party comes upon the discovery of your true self.
Let me make it clear that I do not subscribe to this system of belief. I think it is a world view that is developed as a coping mechanism to deal with the negative aspects of the world. I am just explaining it as I understand it.
-------------------- Orgone Conclusion...Bringing OTD to PS&P since 2007.
Edited by Cactilove (11/02/13 10:46 PM)
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Diploid
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes] 2
#19077533 - 11/02/13 10:37 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nature is pretty beautiful... and extremely impressive.
It's also hideously ugly and cruel.
It is not hard to believe a divinity created it or had some hand.
If this is so then god is a sadistic monster.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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cez

Registered: 08/04/09
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19077559 - 11/02/13 10:42 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: No and I'll tell you why. I wasn't asked if I wanted to play any stoopid game.
And what do you mean "be ok"? This bullshit is going to go on forever without end. It's not like theres going to be a big party after game night. 

Quote:
circastes said:
I suggest something more significant is going on
I feel this. I don't subscribe to any belief, but this idea seems plausible.
There's levels through out this reality, why can't there be realities that we are unaware of?
I imagine an ant can't wrap its head around the concept of a human. I think humans can't truly wrap their heads around something greater than them either...So we have religion
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circastes
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Diploid]
#19077565 - 11/02/13 10:43 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I honestly just know I am God or part of God and try to work backwards from there.
-------------------- My solitude... My shield... My armour... TESTED WITH FULL FORCE
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Repertoire89
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Diploid]
#19078302 - 11/03/13 01:17 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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That video was amazing
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TheGreenArrow
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Icelander]
#19078718 - 11/03/13 02:54 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: IMO you have a very shallow or superficial view of nature. Likely because culture feeds you your meat prepackaged or smoked. 
Nature is based in struggle and violence not beauty. The veneer of beauty is what we see when we step back and have a moment at peace before the next feeding. If god had a hand it it then god is violent and warlike as much or more than anything else it might be.
There in lies the predicament. Some have suggested that Death/destruction is only part of the wheel of creation. I personally think that life to something like the consciousness behind all energy is way more like a bacteria to it. That's all we all in our tiny cities made of ashes, a fucking mold. But on some level it does seem a little like a cop out.
-------------------- A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs
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Icelander
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19078761 - 11/03/13 03:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
circastes said:

This response does not mean you comprehend your ignorance.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
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Of course death and destruction is only a part of creation. That's obvious but it is a very important and some may argue major part.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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usulpsychonaut


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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Cactilove]
#19078797 - 11/03/13 04:21 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Cactilove said:
Quote:
No and I'll tell you why. I wasn't asked if I wanted to play any stoopid game.
You weren't asked, you volunteered. Your true self is god. Your true self finds entertainment in suffering as well as happiness.
Quote:
And what do you mean "be ok"? This bullshit is going to go on forever without end. It's not like theres going to be a big party after game night.
Yes it is, but the party comes upon the discovery of your true self.
Let me make it clear that I do not subscribe to this system of belief. I think it is a world view that is developed as a coping mechanism to deal with the negative aspects of the world. I am just explaining it as I understand it.
My true self is a lonely beaten down mammal that must turn life into shit and is always paranoid. These magic flowers that I also magick into shit occasionally deliver the briefest pretty delusions of my being this ancient mischievous multiverse and it is always a damned fine joke, but it gives me no hope.
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Icelander
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The utter honesty of this post humbles me. And within it I see a state of man yet to be realized. It is the seed of a mighty tree that has fallen on barren ground.
Not to wax too poetic or anything, but it's fucking true imo.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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redgreenvines
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Icelander]
#19079931 - 11/03/13 11:33 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I liked the video
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OrgoneConclusion
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I watched then forgot what it was about. I am blaming the VOF.
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circastes
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Well there's always the possibility it is an illusion.
I've always suggested it is but a dream existing on its own, with the great Self, or God, or You as the dreamer.
It has to be something odd. I suggest it is but a dream.
So 'God' or you is not sadistic if it is all nothing more than an appearance.
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Icelander
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19081859 - 11/03/13 06:26 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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There is always lots of possibilities when we have no evidence.
And if god is not sadistic it is also not loving or good.
Do you see how you always need to put a certain one sided spin on this so you feel safe?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Repertoire89
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Icelander]
#19082134 - 11/03/13 07:25 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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If there is a deity, it is a very strange thing indeed. Life is very beautiful, crude and gross
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redgreenvines
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Each dragon is a deity. So is the waterbuffalo. The monkey?
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Thecrimson
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So I suppose my pet hamster is sitting there trying to find out who he really is? No, that's just our ego trying to justify ourselves.
I think our bodies are just antennas in a sea of radio waves. Everything exists without the antenna, but you need the antenna to perceive it all.
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circastes
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Thecrimson]
#19083158 - 11/03/13 10:52 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well the Self doesn't actually forget itself, you see, because it's all there is. All these problems you're having understanding are created in time and will vanish in time, either when you figure out the answer, forget about them, or die. What remains when everything has perished is You. You are That which Alone Is. It's all just you. I guess I shouldn't be calling it God, but I like to flatter myself.
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cez

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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19083244 - 11/03/13 11:09 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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You sound like an Alan Watts broken record..
I'm not saying you're wrong, but you make these claims as if they're for certain with no proof.
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circastes
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: cez]
#19083456 - 11/03/13 11:43 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well I can see my "imagination of myself" change particularly in the eyes when I look in the mirror in different states of mind. When on mushrooms I look like some divine manifestation. This is proof for me.
And yeah I rant about the same shit all the time but I think that's because my life has been a bit dull and putting forward my views on the internet has been a big outlet. I just come on here and repeat myself. Feels good man.
(getting better tho)
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hTx
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19083485 - 11/03/13 11:49 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Umm well, I've seen this actually happen while tripping. The whole 'God is the universe experiencing itself subjectively' thing.
I was tripping but it was still one of the most influential things that ever happened to me. I came too after seeing this in a trance state and I remember asking myself "Why here, why earth?"
-------------------- zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes Light up the darkness.
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circastes
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: hTx]
#19083505 - 11/03/13 11:51 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think a lot of people get the impression that they are God or the universe or that everything is in the mind in these substances, it's one reason why I wonder this forum isn't slanted more toward this kind of thinking.
If you make a thread about 'what is reality' on the psych experience board most people will say it is some kind of illusion or dream within oneself.
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Repertoire89
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: hTx]
#19083518 - 11/03/13 11:52 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: Umm well, I've seen this actually happen while tripping. The whole 'God is the universe experiencing itself subjectively' thing.
I've had experiences like that tripping but don't give them much credence considering the drug use, actually have had similar experiences through sober meditation as well.
Experiences are subjective though, I've had enough contradictory ones to question both the reasoning between them and overall legitimacy of OBEs. No decision has been made on my part.
OBEs are fascinating and immensely entertaining if nothing else.
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hTx
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I'm feeling much the same about it. It really got me going for a bit but like you I don't really give them to much credence any more..
Although I would like to have the experience again, this time with a little less fear and a lot more lovin.
A little less talk and a lot more action.
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And with a video camera as well to record the subsequent mind-blowing synchronicity I experienced for further, less subjective review.
-------------------- zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes Light up the darkness.
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hTx
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: hTx]
#19083567 - 11/04/13 12:05 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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OBEs..I had one once where I was laying down and went to roll over, but my body was asleep I guess and I sort of fell out of my body and there was this entity there that started dragging me around. All while I was like waddafuckered out n then I came too and was all "STOP!" followed by a burst of golden light and the shadowy entity running away, I chased after it and stopped at a door because I tried to use the door knob and it wouldn't open 
Than I just sort of floated there for a bit before I had a perception of my body arise and sort of snapped back too it.
Could have been a dream though, but felt very different.
-------------------- zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes Light up the darkness.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: hTx]
#19083576 - 11/04/13 12:07 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Once I believed I had started a deep and thoughtful thread - and then I woke up.
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Thecrimson
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I always feel out of body on a trip. It feels like if my head wasn't attatched to my body my mind could float off anywhere.
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hTx
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: Thecrimson]
#19083693 - 11/04/13 12:36 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Well I can see my "imagination of myself" change particularly in the eyes when I look in the mirror in different states of mind.
I can relate to this.
-------------------- zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes Light up the darkness.
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cez

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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: circastes]
#19083745 - 11/04/13 12:47 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
circastes said: Well I can see my "imagination of myself" change particularly in the eyes when I look in the mirror in different states of mind. When on mushrooms I look like some divine manifestation. This is proof for me.
And yeah I rant about the same shit all the time but I think that's because my life has been a bit dull and putting forward my views on the internet has been a big outlet. I just come on here and repeat myself. Feels good man.
(getting better tho)
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Repertoire89
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Re: The Veil of Forgetfullness [Re: hTx]
#19086001 - 11/04/13 03:54 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: OBEs..I had one once where I was laying down and went to roll over, but my body was asleep I guess and I sort of fell out of my body and there was this entity there that started dragging me around. All while I was like waddafuckered out n then I came too and was all "STOP!" followed by a burst of golden light and the shadowy entity running away, I chased after it and stopped at a door because I tried to use the door knob and it wouldn't open 
Than I just sort of floated there for a bit before I had a perception of my body arise and sort of snapped back too it.
Could have been a dream though, but felt very different. 
Sounds like a pretty messed up day right there, wouldn't want to have any kind of confrontation like that during an OBE
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