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InvisibleSimplepowa
In Pursuit of Knowledge


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 4,310
Peter Hitchens: why the war on drugs is a 'complete phoney'
    #19073990 - 11/02/13 08:11 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

English author and journalist Peter Hitchens argues his case as to why there is no war on drugs, the failure of law enforcement in addressing the issue and the understanding and acceptance of drugs and drug culture in Western countries.

Hitchens will take the stage at the Sydney Opera House on Sunday to deliver a talk about why a war on drugs has not been effectively waged - a discussion as part of this year's Festival of Dangerous Ideas.

Mr Hitchens outlined his argument to Adam Spencer on 702 Breakfast this week, discussing the legal, social and moral aspects of the issue and his stance.

Labelling the idea of a war on drugs as "completely phoney", Mr Hitchens argued that there hadn't been a serious attempt to stop people taking drugs in Britain for 40 years, with other Anglosphere countries representing much of the same.

"They keep laws on the books, don't enforce them."

"There are laws against supply but if you want to stop something - if you stop the supply and don't stop the demand, then it won't work and it doesn't work."

During the interview, the author of 'The War We Never Fought: the British Establishment's Surrender to Drugs' challenged the approach of Western countries in addressing drug use and prevalence in modern day society, arguing that it is not being effectively policed.

Mr Hitchens said enforcing the law was essential in bringing about change.

"If you have laws, you have to enforce them. If you don't enforce them, then you just bring the law into disrepute.

"That's what has happened in most Western societies, they've just decided not to bother to enforce these laws so people scorn the laws, pay no attention to them and who can blame them when they can see they're not being enforced all around them."

Citing Britain in 1971, Mr Hitchens said the idea of drug use and drug trafficking as being equally bad was "abandoned" - feeding into the issue, and said they "fell in" with a PR campaign about marijuana being a 'soft' drug.

"You hear the word 'soft'...and you think of something harmless and nice. In fact, marijuana is a very dangerous drug and can leave its users, in some cases, permanently mentally ill for the rest of their lives."

"That's not exactly 'soft', yet it's been given this fantastic marketing campaign and it was given these separate classifications."

"Head of our legal system, our Lord Chancellor, told magistrates to stop sending people to prison for possessing cannabis back in 1973. They obeyed and sentences have gone down and down and down."

Mr Hitchens argued that Britain had "effectively given up" trying to prosecute for the possession of cannabis.

Later in the interview however, Mr Hitchens said he thought the use of marijuana in western society was still at a stage where if governments "seriously tried" to prevent it, they could.

According to Mr Hitchens, marijuana's greatest danger is to the young.

"In Britain now, it's being smoked in schools by children aged 11, 12 and 13 - at precisely the point at which their brains are most vulnerable.

"At that point, what people need is a powerful argument against peer group pressure and a seriously enforced law, in which you would genuinely risk career damage, never being able to travel to the United States for the rest of your life..."

"That kind of law would deter people, would provide an argument against peer pressure, would enable young people in school who come under this enormous pressure to smoke dope to say 'no, it's a stupid thing to do, I'm not going to do it'."

Hear Mr Hitchens discuss medical marijuana, drug use and palliative care and answer questions on the moral sides of the argument, by listening to the interview in full.

Peter Hitchens will speak at the Festival of Dangerous ideas on Sunday and appear on ABC 1's Q and program on Monday night at 9.35.

November 01, 2013
Georgia Wilson | ABC Sydney
http://www.abc.net.au/local/stories/2013/11/01/3881848.htm?site=sydney


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Carl Sagan - "Who are we? We find that we live on an insignificant planet of a humdrum star lost in a galaxy tucked away in some forgotten corner of a universe in which there are far more galaxies than people."

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Robert Pirsig - "When one person suffers from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion."

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Brian Cox - "[One] problem with today’s world is that everyone believes they have the right to express their opinion AND have others listen to it. The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense."


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Offlinehuffinglue
tryin to stay sober
Male

Registered: 09/26/08
Posts: 450
Loc: Texas
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
Re: Peter Hitchens: why the war on drugs is a 'complete phoney' [Re: Simplepowa]
    #19074462 - 11/02/13 10:26 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah, they can just keep all those UK potheads in the UK! 'Merica!


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I fucking hate grammer nazis! Yes, I can't spell. Yes, I don't have perfect grammer. I post from my phone and dont give a shit about people whose lifes are so boring they get off on putting people down for not having perfect fucking grammer, even though they know excactly what there saying.. Fuck You. It's just a ride mang...


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Offlineun-known-ome
Stranger

Registered: 03/04/12
Posts: 463
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
Re: Peter Hitchens: why the war on drugs is a 'complete phoney' [Re: huffinglue]
    #19074567 - 11/02/13 10:52 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I actually feel that there is some validity to Peter Hitchen's argument. I don't disagree with his argument in black-and-white terms, actually, but he does demonstrate a bit of ignorance, which he apparently does not realize. His argument is flawed because he assumes assumes that everyone in the United States conforms to a specific profile. That's the thing with making laws: you have to accommodate for the differences in the population. There is a specific type of person, and perhaps Peter Hitchens is the model for this, who would not choose any involvement with illegal substances because of strict policies. But that is not representative of most users anyway. Most users don't show a preference for illegal substances just because the laws on the books are not strictly enforced, so that's where his logic fails him. Similarly, not everyone shares his belief that marijuana is harmful, so when you decide that you should make policy based on that belief, you're not accounting for the fact that a lot of people don't operate with the some understanding, so the logic there fails again. Policy has to be logical, within reason, for everyone involved. Once you reduce it to logic, you realize that in the context of all substance laws in the United States, having laws that regulate marijuana doesn't appeal to logic, so it fails, and frankly it can't be enforced.


Edited by un-known-ome (11/02/13 10:53 AM)


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Offlinedokunai
Cactus, Cannabis, Cubensis

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 1,878
Loc: Hyphal Heights, USA
Last seen: 7 years, 14 days
Re: Peter Hitchens: why the war on drugs is a 'complete phoney' [Re: un-known-ome]
    #19075798 - 11/02/13 03:57 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

This guy wants to ruin your chance of ever getting a job over a joint.

Quote:

a seriously enforced law, in which you would genuinely risk career damage, never being able to travel to the United States for the rest of your life..."




That sounds really fair.  I've never understood the "drugs are harmful, so we're going to REALLY harm you if you use them" logic.  And here in the US, we already have the career damage thing going gangbusters.  This guy has no idea what the consequences of being arrested are, but I'm sure he's seen TV shows where career criminals flippantly toss out lines like "fuck you copper, I'll be out on bail in an hour!!"


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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
Mycologist
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Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,276
Last seen: 9 hours, 11 minutes
Re: Peter Hitchens: why the war on drugs is a 'complete phoney' [Re: dokunai]
    #19075981 - 11/02/13 04:41 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I don't agree that drug laws are not strictly enforced.  Usually when police see drugs, they enforce drug laws. 

How much stricter does he want the cops to be - search everyone for no reason on the off chance that they might have some weed?

And then what, send them to prison camps?

That would just raise the price of weed and make it even more profitable, drawing in more sellers.


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Invisibleroquet
Expat tippler
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/29/07
Posts: 1,195
Loc: Dubai بجدية عربي...
Re: Peter Hitchens: why the war on drugs is a 'complete phoney' [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #19087374 - 11/04/13 08:59 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Alan Rockefeller said:
I don't agree that drug laws are not strictly enforced.  Usually when police see drugs, they enforce drug laws.



It's true that in the UK, where Hitchens is from, people are hardly ever sent to prison for drug possession. It's like the police have decided to decriminalise possession without making any changes to the law. I don't think it's great that so much is down to police discretion.


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