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Cactilove said:
Does anyone have a logical argument against nihilism? I have been studying it a bit lately and have found that this label seems to fit my current viewpoint. I really think that this is the most logical philosophy that I have come across.

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stzacrack said:

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Cactilove said:
Does anyone have a logical argument against nihilism? I have been studying it a bit lately and have found that this label seems to fit my current viewpoint. I really think that this is the most logical philosophy that I have come across.

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when i was a young boy, rebelling against everyone and everything, i found nihilism because of the rancid song titled accordingly.

this was when i was in 7th grade...how old are we in 7th grade? ha

i soon thereafter found leftover crack, another punk band, and i am thankful that i did, because this was the basis of my cynical, pessimistic, REALISTIC view of experience.

yea, surely it has ingrained many attitudes which have gotten me imprisoned, addicted to drugs, and lost me an opportunity to play in the national hockey league, but fuck it, i'm proud of myself, whatever that means.

i truly believe that life is only about survival.  not about pleasure, not about pain specifically, but our ability to survive excesses of either.

living on the street, evading police, shooting heroin, dropping out of school to play hockey for money, begging for money, that shit makes you stronger.

jail will do that to you too.

end of my stupid fucking rant

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Particularly liked the ending 10/10 would read again

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Cactilove said:
Does anyone have a logical argument against nihilism? I have been studying it a bit lately and have found that this label seems to fit my current viewpoint. I really think that this is the most logical philosophy that I have come across.

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MarkostheGnostic said:

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Cactilove said:
Does anyone have a logical argument against nihilism? I have been studying it a bit lately and have found that this label seems to fit my current viewpoint. I really think that this is the most logical philosophy that I have come across.

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That's too bad. I remember writing a paper about nihilism, just to get my thoughts out. LSD changed my mind. Nihilism seems to be a philosophy colored by depression. Even if one is not familiar with the work of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, which is to a certain extent anthropologically slanted, the opposite view is of teleology. The universe of space-time emerged from eternity, expanded rapidly from a sub-atomic singularity, differentiated from incomprehensible energy into particles. Hydrogen formed, stars formed, the rest of the elements formed within the stars, compounds formed, planets formed, life formed! The Great Chain of Being began with the first particles and evolved into self-aware nodes of complex socio-biological-psychological-cultural-spiritual beings on Earth. The macro universe defies the more local laws of physics by speeding up.

The bottom line here is that joyful, optimistic minds can envision all manner of ecstatic cosmic possibilities. A non-articulated faith underlies such a hopeful outlook, which is bolstered by the awareness of the Great Chain of Being. Of course there are opposite forces at work, like entropy, death, Thanatos Principle behind heinous acts against animals, humans, the biosphere, but duality is built into the whole 0, 1 dualism inherent in existence. Nevertheless, transcendence of the duality of existence is a perspective sub specie aeternitatis, a cosmic perspective which immediately dismisses nihilism with a hearty laugh. Nihilism can't be abolished by argument, but it quite easily evaporates through ecstasy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omega_point

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Cactilove said:
I think nihilism is extremely misunderstood. I find the philosophy to be freeing. I am no more depressed then the average person. In fact I would have to say that I may be happier then the average person. Pessimism and skepticism are paths to disillusion and nihilism is often the finished product. The first stages of nihilism can be hard on one's psyche. Think of it as nigredo. If one is able to sit down and truly examine nihilism the darkness begins to burn away. it is only the beginning stages of nihilism that nietchze deemed a disease of humanity.

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You might be right. I'm going to get back to you on that.

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Icelander said:
but it quite easily evaporates through ecstasy

And vice versa.

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Sorry Ice, I haven't had a complete reversal of ecstasy becoming meaninglessness. I have lows, losses, and periods of disharmony to be sure, but I've never had the opposite. Then again, unlike many people, I don't suffer from Bipolar Disorder in which these pendulum swings can occur with various rates and degrees.

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Nihilsm comes with profoundly negative consequences to most every person I've encountered socially or therapeutically. There are no great nihilist philosophers as far as I can tell. In fact, a philosophical endeavor to describe reality is contrary to the basic position of nihilism. Why even bother? What would be the point? Who cares?

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Most people can't handle nihilism as a philosophy so upon encountering it they choose a true world theory as an anti thesis philosophy. If you can handle it however, it becomes beautiful. I don't need an outside source to give me my purpose, I stand independent pursuing happiness for the sake of pursuing happiness. I don't live my life for implicit meaning, I live for my life for me.



Why should a man require a divine purpose? Why should a man be born out of meaning? Why can't a man decide this for himself? I have but one destiny and that Is to dance with death, and until then, I shall dance this dance of life, if not for anything else but the simple pleasure of it.

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MarkostheGnostic said:

Perhaps you should look at the etymology of ecstasy from the Greek ecstasies.

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Nihilsm comes with profoundly negative consequences to most every person I've encountered socially or therapeutically.

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I wonder if you are out of your 20s yet.

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Cactilove said:

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Nihilsm comes with profoundly negative consequences to most every person I've encountered socially or therapeutically. There are no great nihilist philosophers as far as I can tell. In fact, a philosophical endeavor to describe reality is contrary to the basic position of nihilism. Why even bother? What would be the point? Who cares?

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Most people can't handle nihilism as a philosophy so upon encountering it they choose a true world theory as an anti thesis philosophy. If you can handle it however, it becomes beautiful. I don't need an outside source to give me my purpose, I stand independent pursuing happiness for the sake of pursuing happiness. I don't live my life for implicit meaning, I live for my life for me.



Why should a man require a divine purpose? Why should a man be born out of meaning? Why can't a man decide this for himself? I have but one destiny and that Is to dance with death, and until then, I shall dance this dance of life, if not for anything else but the simple pleasure of it.

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MarkostheGnostic said:
Just a question pertaining to human development. Many people go through stages of inner development during which time it is reflected by the music they listen to and the philosophies they adopt. Not every constructed weltanschauung deserves to be called a philosophy in its original Pythagorean sense as 'love of wisdom,' especially if that world-view simply constellate negative consequences. But of course, that is just my opinion, not your's. You needn't be so reactive. It was not an insult to inquire about your chronological age. One's philosophy of choice is often a manifestation of one's developmental timeline. I passed through a nihilistic phase, albeit, not a very articulated, elaborated one. Clearly you have read on this, either current or ancient exponents, and have taken a stance. I've simply made an inquiry of where you're coming from chronologically because I'm a human developmentalist and it's pertinent. I don't make a secret out of my own age. It is what it is, and it can move into what developmental psychologist Erik Erickson differentiated as a stage of either Integrity or Despair. A philosophy or weltanschauung can have an enormous influence on how one develops across the lifespan.

Ecstasy is a condition that suggests 'being beside oneself,' in a transcendental ego sort of way. The elevated emotion yields to a more neutral clarity, at least in the way the Buddhists describe the Jhanas becoming increasingly subtle such that the bliss dissipates and yields to an indescribable (ineffable) clarity.

Are you are claiming to be a Mereological Nihilist? Clearly, you won't agree with much of anything I have to say philosophically. Maybe with Mereological essentialism, there would be some common understanding through Madhyamaka philosophy, although I am not wed to that either.

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MarkostheGnostic said:
The only reaction I've had has been to your personalism and seeming lack of understanding in regard to the simple concepts which make up nihilism. I've no firm stance on nihilism or any other philosophy and have not claimed to.

I try to be as transparent as possible without totally conflating my MtG persona with my professional one. I have been called all kinds of things, and accused of all kinds of things here. I have been banned for joking with someone with whom I have a relationship, by a moderator who was apparently looking for any opportunity to ban me. I explained my inquiry about your age, and hopefully the explanation was satisfactory.

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