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OfflineGreySatyr
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: broken] * 2
    #19043213 - 10/27/13 10:50 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

You guys are totally missing OPs point by being passive, sarcastic and dismissive. Oh well. Just remember that there is always two sides to a coin and were not even a coin, were of a multidimensional infinite universe. There are a million ways to take this and you guys are just being negative Nancy's because it involves believing or at least attending a conventention or ceremony that you guys don't believe in. That's just close minded.


--------------------
...also, go to hell, huh?


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: NWlight]
    #19044480 - 10/28/13 06:13 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
a guy at the front of a room reading a book followed by his opinion about the reading, a bunch of archaic ceremonies, doesn't sound familiar?



sounds like a Catholic mass. I've never been to one but I've heard that's what they are like. Sunday fellowship at the church I go to is completely and utterly different.


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: NWlight]
    #19044486 - 10/28/13 06:16 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

NWlight said:
Never mind I need to hide this thread or I'm just going to get angry :lol:

pretend I didnt say anything


save yourself while you can it's a ridiculous pastime based on a centuries old model of control founded in books that have been edited and translated many times.



The dead sea scrolls confirmed that translations have not deviated very much from the original texts. The fact that certain passages are explicitly annotated "This passage does not appear in the earliest manuscripts" ought to be a giveaway that Bible scholars haven't just been translating texts willy-nilly without any standards of scholastic accountability


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: volcomstoner]
    #19044494 - 10/28/13 06:23 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Vapor said:
Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

MisterSandman said:
I hate church:peyotezen:



you aren't attending the right church, methinks. or you have a bad attitude




Or he didn't get that nonsense jammed through his soft spot when he was young.



Sounds to me like you've got a grudge. Did someone jam something into one of your soft spots at church when you were young? No such thing happened to me, so it's not hard for me to be happy, carefree, and open-minded. Sorry you got raped, if that is the case. It's really shitty that some people shame religion with such atrocities.

Quote:

volcomstoner said:
In middle school me and my friends used to sneak into the church to smoke pot
It was a real "fuck you" to god



I used to snort cocaine and eat acid and smoke bowls at church as a teenager when I was forced to go. I haven't been to church under the influence in a while now, but I can't say I've never done it as an adult. I've gone to church on speed and painkillers a couple times.

Quote:

And God didn't even give a fuck.





About what? How do you know? How do you even know there is a God...? Never mind, I'm just talking about going to church, this isn't supposed to be a theological debate.


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: Uzziel]
    #19044509 - 10/28/13 06:33 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Uzziel said:
haha church, what a laugh

"God is good people, let the lord in and he will save you."

So....what happened? why did he create evil? oops....



I don't believe or disbelieve in God, but if that's your most advanced rejection of the possibility of a god, then you're not trying very hard. I don't want to turn this into a theological discussion but if you want to be involved in such discussions and you want to take yourself seriously, you need to familiarize yourself with the arguments that already exist. The argument that denies the existence of God based on the so-called existence of evil has been addressed countless times by countless philosophers who are far more intelligent and more well-versed in both religious and atheistic literature than either you or me. Before Richard Dawkins, Anthony Flew was the world's foremost authority on atheist philosophy. He converted to Christianity in old age. If you want to engage in discussions about the existence of God at a much higher level than "well what about evil?" do yourself a favor and read "There is a God: How the World's Most Notorious Atheist Changed His Mind".

I'm not saying it convinced me, and I'm not saying it will convince you. But I can easily see how God could exist despite the so-called existence of evil.

Quote:

I asked that question when I was like 12 and my pastor just looked at me dumbfounded and couldn't really answer.


It's unfortunate that you
A) had an ignorant pastor or
B) has a pastor who wasn't able to break down somewhat complicated arguments in a way that he believed a 12 year old could understand them


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044515 - 10/28/13 06:42 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


Have you spoken to your fellow value holders about your religious experience with mushrooms?

No?

Oh......


I have. You seem to have a lot of preconceived judgments about how all Christians necessarily behave. I haven't encountered anyone else at Church who actively uses psychedelics but I have encountered two older individuals (in their fifties/sixties) who have used them in the past and who vouch for their potential to induce a kind of divine or at least mystical inspiration. These individuals do not believe that psychedelic drugs are bad in any way whatsoever, they simply do not feel compelled to them them anymore.
Quote:


Alan Watts's books of the '60s reveal the influence of these chemical adventures on his outlook. He later said about psychedelic drug use, "If you get the message, hang up the phone."[16]




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OfflineTheGreenArrow
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044521 - 10/28/13 06:48 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted
Bible scholars haven't just been translating texts willy-nilly without any standards of scholastic accountability



:ilold:  Seriously?  Have you read anything about the council of Nicea... Anything that didn't fit they're version of a "resurrection god" dogma got thrown out.
I mean it has its merits but "The Bible" as a "historical Text" is a fucking joke.  It was created to hold an empire together.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #19044532 - 10/28/13 06:55 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

TheGreenArrow said:
Quote:

morrowasted
Bible scholars haven't just been translating texts willy-nilly without any standards of scholastic accountability



:ilold:  Seriously?  Have you read anything about the council of Nicea... Anything that didn't fit they're version of a "resurrection god" dogma got thrown out.
I mean it has its merits but "The Bible" as a "historical Text" is a fucking joke.  It was created to hold an empire together.



:rolleyes: Yes, I have. The council did not translate the texts. The texts still existed in the original languages at the time of the council. It simply decided which texts would be included in Catholic canon and decided on a canonical interpretation that would end up being used in the Catholic religion. Christianity was spreading like wildfire at the time of the council; don't act like the Roman government deserves the credit for Christianity's popularity.


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InvisibleEverlong
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044544 - 10/28/13 07:02 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Pssh I don't go to sky wizard worshiping meetings,

I meet with sky wizards and get worshiped.


--------------------


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: Everlong]
    #19044552 - 10/28/13 07:05 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Everlong said:
Pssh I don't go to sky wizard worshiping meetings,

I meet with sky wizards and get worshiped.



How do you do that?


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InvisibleEverlong
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044554 - 10/28/13 07:06 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

Everlong said:
Pssh I don't go to sky wizard worshiping meetings,

I meet with sky wizards and get worshiped.



How do you do that?



Top secret, I couldn't tell you or the other sky wizards might bar me from future gatherings.

I'll tell God you said what's up


--------------------


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: Everlong] * 1
    #19044556 - 10/28/13 07:08 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Tell him I said "Thanks"


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InvisibleEverlong
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044557 - 10/28/13 07:08 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Tell him I said "Thanks"



No problem, I'm sure it will give him a good chuckle.


--------------------


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044578 - 10/28/13 07:26 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

NWlight said:
a guy at the front of a room reading a book followed by his opinion about the reading, a bunch of archaic ceremonies, doesn't sound familiar?



sounds like a Catholic mass. I've never been to one but I've heard that's what they are like. Sunday fellowship at the church I go to is completely and utterly different.



Yeah that sounds more or less correct. The sermons (aka homilies) vary a lot depending on who gives them though. Some are really academic and dry, some are more personal, some always start off on a corny joke, etc. The prayers are more or less the same every time, but there are four different readings (Old testament, Psalms (often sung,) New testament, Gospel.) The gospel reading and homily can only be done by a priest or deacon I believe. Deacons are the ones who are sort of like priests but can be married. They can't do confessions or bless the communion but they can do a bunch of things a priest can do.


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: psi]
    #19044607 - 10/28/13 07:44 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

yeah that sounds pretty boring. deacons have different functions at the church I go to. My dad is an elder at his church.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19044635 - 10/28/13 08:01 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah the prayers that are the same every time are kind of a trance inducing thing, it's kind of cool hearing everyone say them in unison. The homilies vary a lot from person to person, some are interesting and thought provoking and some are terrible and take forever. The deacon at our church is a cool guy, very welcoming and inclusive. He's kind of a big jolly Santa Claus character. He does all the baptisms and stuff like that.


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Invisiblejewunit
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: Uzziel]
    #19045574 - 10/28/13 11:12 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

And God didn't even give a fuck.





About what? How do you know? How do you even know there is a God...? Never mind, I'm just talking about going to church, this isn't supposed to be a theological debate.



It was just a joke.
Quote:

Uzziel said:
I asked that question when I was like 12 and my pastor just looked at me dumbfounded and couldn't really answer. I stopped going to church around that time too even though my parents bitched about it nonstop.



Your pastor must have really fucking sucked. I feel like anyone into religion that is worth their weight could come up with a pretty good response to what is one of the most common arguments against religion. People like your 12 year old self go around asking it like it's fucking checkmate or something all the time.


--------------------
!


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Offlinenicechrisman
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19045598 - 10/28/13 11:20 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Never really got into church. I can see some of the wisdom in Christianity and can vibe with it to an extent, but I find most Christians have a hard time accepting that my opinions are not the exact same as theirs.

That said, I've met some very nice people at dharma halls, meditation groups, and kirtans. I guess eastern spirituality is more my bag.

I can see how church could be cool though if it's the right kinda church.


--------------------
"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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OfflineUzziel
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19045647 - 10/28/13 11:32 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

Uzziel said:
haha church, what a laugh

"God is good people, let the lord in and he will save you."

So....what happened? why did he create evil? oops....



I don't believe or disbelieve in God, but if that's your most advanced rejection of the possibility of a god, then you're not trying very hard. I don't want to turn this into a theological discussion but if you want to be involved in such discussions and you want to take yourself seriously, you need to familiarize yourself with the arguments that already exist. The argument that denies the existence of God based on the so-called existence of evil has been addressed countless times by countless philosophers who are far more intelligent and more well-versed in both religious and atheistic literature than either you or me. Before Richard Dawkins, Anthony Flew was the world's foremost authority on atheist philosophy. He converted to Christianity in old age. If you want to engage in discussions about the existence of God at a much higher level than "well what about evil?" do yourself a favor and read "There is a God: How the World's Most Notorious Atheist Changed His Mind".

I'm not saying it convinced me, and I'm not saying it will convince you. But I can easily see how God could exist despite the so-called existence of evil.

Quote:

I asked that question when I was like 12 and my pastor just looked at me dumbfounded and couldn't really answer.


It's unfortunate that you
A) had an ignorant pastor or
B) has a pastor who wasn't able to break down somewhat complicated arguments in a way that he believed a 12 year old could understand them





Who said I rejected the possibility of god? You're getting ahead of yourself here, there is nothing in my statement that says one way or the other. I'm talking about the notion that god is good. I've already said that if god exists he is everything good as much as he is everything bad. I really don't care what a philosopher has to say on the matter either, that doesn't prove or disprove anything either.

Also, I was 12 and nothing he could say would satisfy what I really wanted to hear. The point was that there was nothing that would satisfy my young self unless I heard it from the big man himself.... and that aint ever gonna happen.

Another point, talking to two people about prior psychedelic use is not the same as going up on stage and talking about how psychedelics influenced your spiritual awakening. I'm talking about how they would react to your usage, not some old timers who have an open mind. You are right, I have a conceived notion about how Christians act because I've been around them my whole life and in my opinion they are some of the most judgmental people I've met. History says the same thing too, those assholes have been waging war on people since the beginning.


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OfflineThe Vapor
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Re: I had a great time at church today! [Re: morrowasted]
    #19045874 - 10/28/13 12:24 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

The Vapor said:
Quote:

morrowasted said:
Quote:

MisterSandman said:
I hate church:peyotezen:



you aren't attending the right church, methinks. or you have a bad attitude




Or he didn't get that nonsense jammed through his soft spot when he was young.



Sounds to me like you've got a grudge. Did someone jam something into one of your soft spots at church when you were young? No such thing happened to me, so it's not hard for me to be happy, carefree, and open-minded. Sorry you got raped, if that is the case. It's really shitty that some people shame religion with such atrocities.

Quote:

volcomstoner said:
In middle school me and my friends used to sneak into the church to smoke pot
It was a real "fuck you" to god



I used to snort cocaine and eat acid and smoke bowls at church as a teenager when I was forced to go. I haven't been to church under the influence in a while now, but I can't say I've never done it as an adult. I've gone to church on speed and painkillers a couple times.

Quote:

And God didn't even give a fuck.





About what? How do you know? How do you even know there is a God...? Never mind, I'm just talking about going to church, this isn't supposed to be a theological debate.




Nah, I can count the number of times I've been to church on two hands. My parents never raised me to be religious. Imo the bible and Christianity is just nonsense you have to teach kids when they are young or else no rational adult would believe it. Also, I wasn't raped. Not sure where that comment came from..

:awedisgust:


Edited by The Vapor (10/28/13 12:26 PM)


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