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Sleepwalker
Overshoes

Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: windowlikcer]
#19045409 - 10/28/13 10:20 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
windowlikcer said: The guy with the post full of pictures seemed to get your stamp of approval, whereas the guy toting God got the stamp of disapproval! I don't know what you personally believe, but it is clear to see which thought you warmed up to more.
They are both talking about the same thing.
The picture book was obviously tongue-in-cheek, as was my response. As I said earlier in the thread, I don't think anybody knows what we're doing here.
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The Centre
I am



Registered: 10/04/08
Posts: 1,746
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: liquidlounge]
#19045411 - 10/28/13 10:21 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
liquidlounge said: Universal truth?
Certainly the creator must logically speaking be the universal truth?
I was talking about a personal relationship with God, with the emphasis on PERSONAL.
So your creator is not my creator?
Again, you misunderstand. Don't worry, that is human.
There is only one creator. Any more wouldn't make logical sense. (Note how all polytheistic religions have a single original creator, who started the first bit of creating.)
Big bang? Requires a little something that they dubbed a 'singularity.' Can't come from nothing. Even the most atheistic of explanations require SOMETHING. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Action is required for action to take place. There was at no point 'nothing.' There is always 'something.'
I care not for what you decide to believe, as long as you have some basis for it. How can anything come from nothing? Even the most nihilistic person must confess that there is something here right now, and even if it is an 'illusion' the illusion needs some form of origin.
So you want to call it a singularity or what ever so that you can comfortably say God doesn't exist... Well guess what, if you believe the universe came to be from a singularity, then all you are doing is giving the original creator the name 'singularity.'
When someone comes with some form of logical origin theory where things came from nothing, I will consider that there may possibly not be a God, but until someone can actually say with a straight face that all that there is today came from absolute nothingness, and have some kind of proof of that, then I will have to continue to KNOW that there IS a God. All atheists don't believe in God because they see the world and see pain and suffering and think how can an all loving all knowing all powerful God allow such a thing, and thus conclude that God doesn't exist. This is a big ass leap of faith and illogic. Before any atheists can conclude there is no God, they first have to DEFINE WHAT GOD IS SUPPOSED TO BE. You cannot put the creator of all in a box. You can logically debate on God's character, but not on his existence...
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Sleepwalker
Overshoes

Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: The Centre] 1
#19045414 - 10/28/13 10:24 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Centre said: I will have to continue to KNOW that there IS a God.
All atheists don't believe in God because they see the world and see pain and suffering and think how can an all loving all knowing all powerful God allow such a thing, and thus conclude that God doesn't exist. This is a big ass leap of faith and illogic.
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The Centre
I am



Registered: 10/04/08
Posts: 1,746
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: Brakepad]
#19045417 - 10/28/13 10:25 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Brakepad said: If God exists wouldn't something have to create that God? And if God was created then he technically isn't a God according to the definition
The only sensible argument here.
This is where you have to understand how time can be very non-linear. If you don't get that you haven't chowed enough shrooms.
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Deathcore
Stranger


Registered: 06/08/13
Posts: 1,934
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Quote:
beforeIgetold said:
How can I be 100% certain that you writing isnt simply a projection of my ego trying to keep me content?
this
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windowlikcer
Stranger

Registered: 11/14/11
Posts: 527
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: Sleepwalker]
#19045425 - 10/28/13 10:29 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sleepwalker said:
Quote:
windowlikcer said: The guy with the post full of pictures seemed to get your stamp of approval, whereas the guy toting God got the stamp of disapproval! I don't know what you personally believe, but it is clear to see which thought you warmed up to more.
They are both talking about the same thing.
The picture book was obviously tongue-in-cheek, as was my response. As I said earlier in the thread, I don't think anybody knows what we're doing here.
Ok fair enough, I saw your comments more as an overall attitude I've seen on this forum in which there is a hostility to God, but an openness to Eastern-philosophy-meets-quantum-mechanics type theories without realizing the common basis between the God of monotheism and concepts such as OM. The origin is the same , based off the same human intuitions.
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liquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: windowlikcer]
#19045431 - 10/28/13 10:32 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
windowlikcer said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said: The law of gravity would have no context if it wasn't ordered into general concepts of "reality".
What happens if you jump off a 1000 meter high cliff into sharp rocks with no parachute? Is it reality you will die?
Or if your head get chopped off, will you die?
I could answer "yes, it is reality that I would die". Then immediately, one may ask, what is the being of this reality that I should die, in exactly the same way the being of anything and everything may be interrogated in regards to its being.
Don't you figure out what you don't know, using 1 + 1 = 2?
Or do you figure out things using "god"?
-------------------- As far as I assume to know...
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Sleepwalker
Overshoes

Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: windowlikcer]
#19045437 - 10/28/13 10:33 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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See, I've experienced those same "intuitions" about life and consciousness. That doesn't mean I automatically trust that I know what I'm talking about just because I had some vague feeling, or ate a bunch of mushrooms and tripped out. I prefer to be more honest about what actually constitutes knowledge.
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liquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: The Centre]
#19045463 - 10/28/13 10:41 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Centre said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said: Universal truth?
Certainly the creator must logically speaking be the universal truth?
I was talking about a personal relationship with God, with the emphasis on PERSONAL.
So your creator is not my creator?
Again, you misunderstand. Don't worry, that is human.
When was the other time I misunderstood? Show us.
Posting this as a single post due to The Centre's desire to humiliate me.
-------------------- As far as I assume to know...
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windowlikcer
Stranger

Registered: 11/14/11
Posts: 527
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: Sleepwalker]
#19045489 - 10/28/13 10:51 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sleepwalker said: See, I've experienced those same "intuitions" about life and consciousness. That doesn't mean I automatically trust that I know what I'm talking about just because I had some vague feeling, or ate a bunch of mushrooms and tripped out. I prefer to be more honest about what actually constitutes knowledge.
You still have only yourself to rely on for this knowledge, and this self must be fragmented to the extent that it is largely unknown to you; the same impulse which leads you to distrust your self when you experience these "intuitions" threatens any knowledge you might think you have about anything. So really your attempt to be honest about what actually constitutes knowledge is an attempt over and against your mistrust towards yourself. You haven't escaped the predicament of these intuitions, if anything you plunge yourself further into them by trying to reduce things to the knowledge that you have of them.
This just introduces the dyad of the knower and the known, and I'd be curious to see how you could honestly escape this dyad with any knowledge intact. In fact I think it would be impossible.
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liquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: The Centre]
#19045500 - 10/28/13 10:53 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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There is only one creator. Any more wouldn't make logical sense. (Note how all polytheistic religions have a single original creator, who started the first bit of creating.)
Then why are there no universal truth seeing as almost everyone has been asking THIS question throughout history?
Everyone, please view The Center (in the link "THIS") writing the following:
Just ask this: I want to know the creator of the universe at a personal level, please show me.
The answer will come at the right time.
I care not for what you decide to believe,
How does that make sense if we have the same creator?
So you want to call it a singularity or what ever so that you can comfortably say God doesn't exist... Well guess what, if you believe the universe came to be from a singularity, then all you are doing is giving the original creator the name 'singularity.'
I never said what I wanted to call "it". However, it certainly looks like you struggle conversing substantially and maturely to people.
When someone comes with some form of logical origin theory where things came from nothing, I will consider that there may possibly not be a God, but until someone can actually say with a straight face that all that there is today came from absolute nothingness, and have some kind of proof of that, then I will have to continue to KNOW that there IS a God. All atheists don't believe in God because they see the world and see pain and suffering and think how can an all loving all knowing all powerful God allow such a thing, and thus conclude that God doesn't exist. This is a big ass leap of faith and illogic. Before any atheists can conclude there is no God, they first have to DEFINE WHAT GOD IS SUPPOSED TO BE. You cannot put the creator of all in a box. You can logically debate on God's character, but not on his existence...
Damn, you write a lot of bullshit.
You're full of shit The Center.
-------------------- As far as I assume to know...
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Sleepwalker
Overshoes

Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: windowlikcer]
#19045506 - 10/28/13 10:55 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
windowlikcer said: You haven't escaped the predicament of these intuitions, if anything you plunge yourself further into them by trying to reduce things to the knowledge that you have of them.
It's not about reducing things. In fact my worldview is wide open exactly because I choose not to lock myself into a false sense of secure knowledge. It is possible to allow many opposing points of view to float around in your head without trying to get one in a stranglehold.
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windowlikcer
Stranger

Registered: 11/14/11
Posts: 527
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: Sleepwalker]
#19045537 - 10/28/13 11:02 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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So then you found yourself on a lack of knowledge rather than a surplus of it?
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Sleepwalker
Overshoes

Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: windowlikcer]
#19045557 - 10/28/13 11:08 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have plenty of practical knowledge about the world and how to function in it, about myself and how to deal with others. I'm willing to accept this because otherwise I would be a vegetable.
When it comes to philosophical ponderings, I have many hunches about life ranging from scientific materialism to spiritual transformation. I don't feel like there is any reason to grasp OR deny one side or the other, although when it comes to debating these things, science tends to win out because debate is in itself basically a scientific endeavor.
When we are in our own heads, anything can seem to pass for evidence, but when we decide to lay our collective cards out on the table, the more objective world starts to take form. That's not to say it's the ULTIMATE TRUTH, but it's what we have to work with in order to navigate life.
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The Centre
I am



Registered: 10/04/08
Posts: 1,746
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: liquidlounge]
#19045591 - 10/28/13 11:19 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
The Centre said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said: Universal truth?
Certainly the creator must logically speaking be the universal truth?
I was talking about a personal relationship with God, with the emphasis on PERSONAL.
So your creator is not my creator?
Again, you misunderstand. Don't worry, that is human.
When was the other time I misunderstood? Show us.
Posting this as a single post due to The Centre's desire to humiliate me.
No intention to humiliate you at all. Oh, and didn't you quote me TWICE with QUESTIONS?
You seem to be misunderstanding my intentions in the very least, and most likely you are also misunderstanding my statements themselves.
Look, as heated as this debate is BOUND to become, I have no problem with other people having their own opinions, I'm just stating MY opinion too. Also, I have no problem with people arguing their opinions, but that isn't going to stop me from arguing my own.
So, here is mine, with pure honesty:
Something CANNOT come from nothing. 1 + 1 = 2. 1 x 2 = 2. 0 + 0 = 0. 0 x Infinity is STILL 0. So it doesn't matter if you add nothing to nothing, it is still nothing. If you multiply nothing by what ever, it is still nothing. Because 0 = 0. 0 + 1 = 1. YOU STILL NEED THE SOMETHING!!! One = something, 0 = nothing.
Argue that math away please.
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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


Registered: 06/20/13
Posts: 3,376
Loc: North Carolina
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: The Centre]
#19045612 - 10/28/13 11:23 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Who gives a shit?
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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rikuni

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 982
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: GreySatyr]
#19045649 - 10/28/13 11:32 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
GreyMorph said: Who gives a shit?
Damn Right! Fuck this retarded thread!
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Deathcore
Stranger


Registered: 06/08/13
Posts: 1,934
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: rikuni] 1
#19045690 - 10/28/13 11:42 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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you say that now but once you die, you'll care.
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nicechrisman
Interdimensional space wizard



Registered: 11/07/03
Posts: 33,241
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: Deathcore]
#19045711 - 10/28/13 11:47 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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-------------------- "Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent: it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not." John C. Lily
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rikuni

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 982
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
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Re: HOW IS LIFE/REALITY POSSIBLE? [Re: Deathcore]
#19045776 - 10/28/13 12:01 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deathcore said: you say that now but once you die, you'll care.
been there, done that brou! I dont care shit cause I is cared for
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