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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: CidneyIndole] * 1
    #19110644 - 11/09/13 02:25 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

In a terry frisk, they can only pat you down.  They can't empty your pockets unless they feel something that feels like a weapon.  If they feel something that can plainly be determined to be contraband WITHOUT MANIPULATING THE OBJECT, that can give them probable cause to seize that object...

Of course, this last point is among the most ridiculous and most abused doctrine of all.  We call this the "plain feel doctrine" and most lawyers only use the term sarcastically.

Then a terry frisk is of a car, however, they can search any part of the passenger compartment.  They can't search the trunk or under the hood, however.


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OfflineAcaterpillar
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Enlil]
    #19120483 - 11/11/13 12:59 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I received the information on my arrest that I requested today.

They gave me video of me sitting in the back car, but for some reason there is no video or audio of the actual arrest. Aren't the officers required to record audio and video once they leave their cars to approach a suspect?


And from the narrative of the incident, the officer makes it sound like I was covering my  pockets with my hands when he pat me down (I never removed my hands from the car).
If I can't get audio or vieo of the arrest, than it would simply be my word against his.

If there was audio or video of the actual arrest that was withheld, can I attempt to appeal to a later court date and ask for the withheld items?



The only other point I could make, is that the officer approached me first and patted me down; and then claimed to be able to "see inside my pocket because it contained a large smartphone which made a bag of marijuana visible"; so he claims to have not even searched me, but just so happened to see inside my pocket.
However, he had no reason to look inside that specific pocket because he was suspicious about the long metal e-cig in my other pocket, so why would he be looking in the other pocket that only held my smartphone?

The narrative is actually very biased. I know that the bag of marijuana wasn't visible because it was underneath my keys, which were underneath my smartphone; and he reached inside my pocket before he saw anything. As he was reaching in my pocket, he even said "What do you have in your pockets that have you so scared?"

However, considering there's no audio or video that I received of the arrest, it would simply be my word against his. In which case I would take a guilty plea.

Could I go into court before my first court date and change my plea to guilty?
Since it's only a citation, I'd rather just pay the money for the ticket instead of paying for several courts fees.


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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Acaterpillar]
    #19120507 - 11/11/13 01:03 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Maybe you should file a motion to suppress the evidence based on the illegal search / he could not have seen the marijuana.

It will probably fail but its a shot...

When you have your court dates to file stuff like this you could talk to the prosecutor and see if he is willing to knock it down to something that is not a drug charge.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Acaterpillar]
    #19120536 - 11/11/13 01:09 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Acaterpillar said:
I received the information on my arrest that I requested today.

They gave me video of me sitting in the back car, but for some reason there is no video or audio of the actual arrest. Aren't the officers required to record audio and video once they leave their cars to approach a suspect?



Not by law they aren't, but maybe by policy.  The real questions are who started the recording, and why did he start it then?  These are the questions your lawyer should be asking the officers on the stand.  Is there a reason for starting the recording later? 
Quote:



And from the narrative of the incident, the officer makes it sound like I was covering my  pockets with my hands when he pat me down (I never removed my hands from the car).
If I can't get audio or vieo of the arrest, than it would simply be my word against his.

If there was audio or video of the actual arrest that was withheld, can I attempt to appeal to a later court date and ask for the withheld items?



If they have the audio or video and are claiming they don't, you'll probably never find out.  Just make sure that your attorney requests those specific things in discovery.  Force them to deny having it or turn it over.  That way, they can't bring it out later to prove you lied about something without really fucking themselves.
Quote:


The only other point I could make, is that the officer approached me first and patted me down; and then claimed to be able to "see inside my pocket because it contained a large smartphone which made a bag of marijuana visible"; so he claims to have not even searched me, but just so happened to see inside my pocket.
However, he had no reason to look inside that specific pocket because he was suspicious about the long metal e-cig in my other pocket, so why would he be looking in the other pocket that only held my smartphone?

The narrative is actually very biased. I know that the bag of marijuana wasn't visible because it was underneath my keys, which were underneath my smartphone; and he reached inside my pocket before he saw anything. As he was reaching in my pocket, he even said "What do you have in your pockets that have you so scared?"

However, considering there's no audio or video that I received of the arrest, it would simply be my word against his. In which case I would take a guilty plea.

Could I go into court before my first court date and change my plea to guilty?
Since it's only a citation, I'd rather just pay the money for the ticket instead of paying for several courts fees.



Of course the report is biased.  You're right about the cops story of being able to see inside your pocket.  That's clearly bullshit unless you have a cellphone from the 80's.  He wrote that he could see it for the sole purpose of trying to make the search hold up in court.

If you want my honest, professional opinion, I think I could get this search ruled illegal and the evidence suppressed.  The cops story on the report is pretty weak, and a simple in-court demonstration with you wearing the pants and the phone would make him look very silly and dishonest.

Having said that, yes...it's going to cost money to fight it unless the lawyer is working pro bono.  It's up to you whether it's worth the fight.


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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Enlil]
    #19120559 - 11/11/13 01:12 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Probably worth the fight if it is your first drug conviction.  You really want to reduce the number of drug convictions on your record.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #19120581 - 11/11/13 01:17 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I'd agree, but then I'd be accused of just trying to make sure that my lawyer brethren are getting paid.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Enlil]
    #19120643 - 11/11/13 01:32 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
I'd agree, but then I'd be accused of just trying to make sure that my lawyer brethren are getting paid.




You bastard. You're just trying to make sure that my your lawyer brethren are getting paid.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19120664 - 11/11/13 01:37 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Ixnay on the uthtray.


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OfflineAcaterpillar
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #19120709 - 11/11/13 01:49 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I have one possession of marijuana charge, but I am a few months away from having it expunged.
I believe my expungement would be made invalid with the paraphernalia citation.

My court date is in two days, I was going to request a public attorney. Do you think this is a case that wont be won unless I actually hire an attorney?


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Acaterpillar]
    #19120766 - 11/11/13 02:04 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

If you qualify for a PD you should get one.  You might not have a constitutional right to one, but some states still provide them.  The PD will likely agree that a motion to suppress should be filed, but you should probably suggest the idea to him/her.


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OfflineAcaterpillar
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Enlil]
    #19120799 - 11/11/13 02:11 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

My first court hearing is in two days. If I am not hiring an attorney, will I need to have a PD before then, or can I request a PD at that first hearing?


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Acaterpillar]
    #19120825 - 11/11/13 02:18 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Request one then.  It may not be an option.  If it isn't, tell the court you need some time to hire a private attorney.


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OfflineAcaterpillar
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Re: Representing yourself [Re: Enlil]
    #19123715 - 11/11/13 10:00 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Alright, so I'm pretty sure I'm going to hire an attorney.
I spoke with a few on the phone and one said I could hire him tomorrow to file for a hearing, but I'm going to wait till I get my bail back from my first court date so I have the cash to pay him.
How should I go about finding out his experience with actual trials?
Is there somewhere I can look it up; or is it best to just directly ask him?


He was recommended to me by a family law attorney, and he has 37 years experience, but I don't know if he was always doing criminal law or what.
The information I read online on him was rather ambiguous.


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At first sight, The Perfection of Wisdom is bewildering, full of paradox and apparent irrationality.


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