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Offlinenapadrapa
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Registered: 10/22/13
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Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed
    #19012691 - 10/22/13 09:15 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed

Jolly is an experienced edible mushroom hunter, but a pioneer on this matter.
Jolly read a lot on this subject and wants to experience the experience it can give.
Jolly tried most of the best entheogens but understands this could be a different more deliriumlike, not-so-fun still deep and introspective experience.

Jolly picked this beauties in central Serbia (Balkans - NOT Siberia) a few days ago, meaning late October.
More than a half were too old to be picked, still there is more than enough for the experience(s).

To Jolly they don't look like Cesaria(he picked and ate lots of them), nor Virosa or Phalloides?
In case IF some of these are Panthers how much stronger are they comparing to Muscaria?

Question number #1:
First question is on the ID, since they all had some orangy shades. But some of them resemble Pantherinas, even if probably they just lost some colour in the sun and during getting old. They grew like a family, but Jolly knows different Amanitas can grow next to each other.
Jolly really needs an expert eye and advice on these ones.

Question number #2:
Jolly read that in order to convert ibotenic acid into muscimol they MUST be dried at a temperature range 170-210F (75-95C).
Is that really true and necessary?

Questions number #3:
The freshest toxicity of Muscaria and Pantherinas update?

In a book "Amanita Muscaria - Chemistry Biology Toxicology And Ethnomycology" it has been stated:
"As far as toxic effects are concerned, consumption of A.Muscaria and A.Pantherina does not induce any critical organ damage. Thus, in the case of such poisoning, the victims ae not considered endangered, but intensive care is recommended. Nevertheless, severe neuron and brain leisons could be anticipated in cases of recurrent consumption."
(they did some tests on lab animals)

In a book: "Mycopharmacological Outline and Personal Experiences by Francesco Festi and Antonio Bianchi" it has been stated:
"A. pantherina produces a more toxic than hallucinogenic syndrome, however, when ingested. A predominance of nonspecific confusional effects, psychomotor excitement and serious anxious (or anxiety-laden) states generally occur."
"Muscimol, in non-toxic doses, can produce interferences on physiological processes tied to oneiric events [Kulcsar et al., 1977; vide supra]."

And so many other contradictive info online can be found...so...any news, recent experiment results?
Perhaps the most important question - Are these toxins cummulative?
Are there some permanent effects to the brain?

Question number #4:
And finally, the preparation and dosage conslusion according to the forum people suggestions...start with 5g dried...do not go over 15-20g.
Cracker dry them, and then make a tea/soup out of it. Right?



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OfflineUntitled
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Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 1,333
Loc: England
Last seen: 4 years, 11 months
Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: napadrapa]
    #19012719 - 10/22/13 09:22 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

You don't need to type in third person. A. muscaria are not illegal.


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OfflineUntitled
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Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 1,333
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: Untitled]
    #19014173 - 10/22/13 03:17 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Someone should probably reply to this.


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Offlineart2312
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: Untitled]
    #19014249 - 10/22/13 03:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

they all look to be amanita muscaria and if youre not in north america, which i think i read you are not, then you do not have the lookalikes we do here. #2 yes, you do need to convert using heat. cook in eggs, make in tea or soup. if its your first time, i would start low. 3-5 grams. they also have excellent culinary value, if youre interested :wink:  but you will want to boil out the active ingredients for that.


--------------------
I don't mind being ogled, ridiculed, made to feel minuscule.
If you consider the source, it's kinda pitiful
The only thing you really know about me is.....That's all you'll ever know!!!!


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OfflineUntitled
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: art2312]
    #19014261 - 10/22/13 03:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I'm guessing by 3-5 grams you mean dried. what if he wants to eat them fresh? That's probably the best way anyway. Freshly fried!


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OfflineZippyHippyinWA
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Registered: 04/14/13
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: Untitled]
    #19014277 - 10/22/13 03:39 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I know nothing of europe or its varieties sooooo that said:

1.Question number #1:
First question is on the ID, since they all had some orangy shades. But some of them resemble Pantherinas, even if probably they just lost some colour in the sun and during getting old. They grew like a family, but Jolly knows different Amanitas can grow next to each other.
Jolly really needs an expert eye and advice on these ones.

Amanitas have water soluble components and can fade either from sun or rains, also warts can wash off. If unsure then toss it. Check vulva,annulus and warts for easy confirmation.

Question number #2:
Jolly read that in order to convert ibotenic acid into muscimol they MUST be dried at a temperature range 170-210F (75-95C).
Is that really true and necessary?

Yes it is true. sun drying will do the same, so, will making tea.IMO it is not necessary to convert, however I do because it tends to reduce body load significantly.

Questions number #3:
The freshest toxicity of Muscaria and Pantherinas update?

I dont understand the question. Pantherina CAN be more potent than muscaria, however, potency varies a great deal from mushroom to mushroom. And I dont know any of the biological ramifications other than too much can make you inable to roll over to puke and that aspiration of vomit is a very real danger here. Cracker dry for storage and just the act of making tea from fresh will cause the ibotenic acid/muscimol conversion. Preparation here http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/13328498

Don't take what I say as gospel. I speak from more experience than education. I hope this helps.


--------------------
“If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on.”
― Terence McKenna


Edited by ZippyHippyinWA (10/22/13 03:42 PM)


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Offlineart2312
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: Untitled]
    #19014281 - 10/22/13 03:39 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

yes, that was dry. and i havent tried them fresh, aside from boiling out the actives, but when consumed fresh, i hear to fry 1/2 cap to 1 cap in butter (or whatever else) and go from there... i hope this helps :thumbup:..... nice finds BTW OP :cool:


--------------------
I don't mind being ogled, ridiculed, made to feel minuscule.
If you consider the source, it's kinda pitiful
The only thing you really know about me is.....That's all you'll ever know!!!!


Edited by art2312 (10/22/13 03:40 PM)


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Offlineart2312
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: art2312]
    #19014302 - 10/22/13 03:43 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

listen to the hippy!! lol, that was put way better than i could get it out lol :wink:


--------------------
I don't mind being ogled, ridiculed, made to feel minuscule.
If you consider the source, it's kinda pitiful
The only thing you really know about me is.....That's all you'll ever know!!!!


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OfflineZippyHippyinWA
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Registered: 04/14/13
Posts: 493
Loc: Tucson
Last seen: 2 months, 15 days
Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: art2312]
    #19014314 - 10/22/13 03:45 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

They are yummy fresh but unpredictable. Best to dry a bunch grind and mix. Then start on low side and work up as needed. then the dose will remain the same from THAT batch.


--------------------
“If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on.”
― Terence McKenna


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OfflineZippyHippyinWA
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: ZippyHippyinWA]
    #19014320 - 10/22/13 03:46 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

TY very much Art.


--------------------
“If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on.”
― Terence McKenna


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Offlineart2312
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Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: ZippyHippyinWA]
    #19014352 - 10/22/13 03:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

thank you, for the better info :smile: :thumbup:


--------------------
I don't mind being ogled, ridiculed, made to feel minuscule.
If you consider the source, it's kinda pitiful
The only thing you really know about me is.....That's all you'll ever know!!!!


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Offlinenapadrapa
Stranger
Registered: 10/22/13
Posts: 2
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: Amanita Muscaria PICS - ID and advice needed [Re: art2312]
    #19016992 - 10/22/13 11:27 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Hello people,

Tnx for the replies.
Just wandering if someone has anything else to ad :smile: ?

Best wishes,
Napadrapa


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