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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Sockadin]
#19007115 - 10/21/13 04:44 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thanks Sockadin,
I am going back and fourth in my mind -
But I keep going back to this tried and true, simple and effective tek. I believe I will take on violets for fun later, a month or so perhaps.
I think I am going to just use RR's tek, or a simple BRF, and do the jars like said - saving enough liquid for later use, and having a good amount of culture for grain to grain - bulk, and all things go well, plenty of spore prints. Again
As you said, all the while doing the jars and mini-mono's or simple cakes, working on my agar recipes and isolates, perfecting the craft. Hell, time is going to be spent regardless of agar work, and dishes are cheap as it is, might aswell create a super-"strain" while watching my jars colonize and babies fruit 
-- Any input on the whole Cyrovials?
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Sockadin]
#19007373 - 10/21/13 07:37 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sockadin said: I really wish you the best, but forget all that RGS bull. I tried and tried to make it work, it didn't. It was harder to get the water ratio correct than WBS, and I still have yet to test the strength of the fruits. (for the record I have a half stalled tub of this nightmarish RGS)
Do your self a favor and make 15 Jars of BRF- 3 of each strain.
For the record, I am not saying anything against a plastic bottom watering tech, or RGS as a substrate. I have honestly noticed that RGS just does so much better in my back yard. RGS is amazing when applied to soil...were it should be V.
So you failed to prep RGS well. That doesn't make it "all that RGS bull", you should know better.
How sensible would it be to say Rye is for bread where it should be, WBS is for the birds where it should be, or brown rice is for dinner where it should be?
If you boil RGS a lot, it has to be strained a very long time due to all the excess water held amongst the many tiny grains. However it's possible to adjust your preparation based on that very problem, like the grain prep for my tek. By only briefly boiling the grains to get them started you make it so that the water stuck amongst the grains is just right to finish hydration. Toss them in a strainer until most of the dripping stops and load up for sterilization. I've done it many many times and always end up with a perfectly hydrated, loose, fine grain substrate that colonizes extra quickly with thick rhizos and gives me the best results of any grain I've yet used.
The cryovials work, although it may be a bit much for sterile work for someone new to sterile tech. The abstract about it mentions transferring test-tube slants every year, which I'm pretty sure isn't nearly as necessary as the abstract says. We often keep slants for a decade, perhaps even more. Culture vials may or may not be a better option for keeping cultures preserved but regardless it's still a bit of a risk, as you probably will not find out until the far-off day you decide to use it whether it's sterile for use or not.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it! PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers! • Violet's Teks and Posts •
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Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 3 months, 14 days
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Violet]
#19009384 - 10/21/13 04:46 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Let me first address Violet. Then the OP.
Violet, we all think your grows are amazing, I am not saying that. I think you have some amazing results and definitely know what your talking about. My comment about RGS Bull, is only in relation to the struggle that I had with it. It works in the plastic tech, but it is a bitch to use as a true grain. The seeds colonize so tightly that they are a pain to remove from the jars, and you get a lot of clumping.
OP, if you follow Violet's tech you may very well have great results. But is it worth the cost of the equipment, prep and setup time?
Violet, I believe you have created a very easy to read and useful series of teks, and most of the information in them is useful beyond helpful. I love reading your theories and opinions on what is happening in specific situations and why. However, I personally would not recommend them to a new grower, or someone who is looking at getting back into growing because the over all cost and time consumption is higher than the standard PF Tek, and if it fails, the grower might have a larger sense of frustration when considering the costs and time.
I would however recommend your teks to experienced growers, and would love to see what someone like Frank could end up with following your tek.
OP, I think it is awesome that you are coming back into this experience, as I myself have recently decided to continue my journey. It is with helpful people and civilized constructive conversation that we advance the knowledge and understanding in to community.
Good luck with your grow!
Violet, as always, it was a pleasure conversing with you and your perspectives.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Sockadin]
#19009515 - 10/21/13 05:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Wow sock that was very well said. I'm impressed
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Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 3 months, 14 days
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19010326 - 10/21/13 07:48 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Im not trying to start a war, Im just defending what I think would be most productive for the OP.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Sockadin]
#19010333 - 10/21/13 07:50 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I know
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19010580 - 10/21/13 08:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thanks Sockadin.
Just one thing though... With the exception of not needing a PC (which even PFtekkers that want to keep growing will surely end up with one) my tech is just as inexpensive as PF (if not less; doesn't require vermiculite or perlite nor the elaborate maiming of a fancy FC). Just a $2 2lb bag of brown rice is substrate for a dozen containers.
I've done PFtek many times and it certainly takes more time & effort than my current tek. Measuring/mixing, loading, wiping, verm-barrier-ing, steaming, needle-flaming, 4-inoc-per-jar-ing, long waiting, dunking dunking dunking... and for what output? I boil, strain, sterilize, inoc, wait, bottom-water... and thoroughly enjoy the output.
As for what is a good recommendation for a new grower... Not every new grower is the same. Neither are newbies and "n00bs" really the same thing either; everyone is new at their beginning but certainly not everyone is a "n00b" as it's meant. I agree that your recommendation is best for a "n00b" but I disagree that such a recommendation is called for to all beginners as if they're all on the same level. Who are we to determine which tek is right to recommend to each person? Is making only a single recommendation the right way to approach that?
My first successful grow was a "bulk" grow, and I was more than ready & able to start with that. I understand that everyone may not be like that, but I certainly had NO related skills, hardly even knew how to keep plants! If I could do it, anyone short of someone noobish certainly can. I mixed PFtek along with my 2nd set of grow endeavors and learned quickly that it's extra annoying for so little payoff. From the angle I had it was hard to see why PFtek is supposed to be ANY easier. IMO it's really only because a pressure cooker is not required. If someone has/gets one I don't see why they might as well not go straight for "bulk" grows. Honestly I think the self-maintaining bulk sub and mono FC is easier than PF cakes and a somewhat complex Shotgun FC (consider how many noobs we inform that their SGFC is improper). There is no single scale of "easy" that applies to all learners.
Not to forget, it's not only the OP that reads our posts here. It's important to remember that what we say to each other may be read by each other once or twice but by complete strangers hundreds of times.
EDIT: I'm reminded to add that I mostly made the above statements about relative newbishness because our OP here is definitely smart and is doing his research. He's already talking about culture storage and sterile work. IMO recommending the likes of PFtek is particularly unfitting for him. He may be new but he's got on his papa shoes.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it! PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers! • Violet's Teks and Posts •
Edited by Violet (10/21/13 08:47 PM)
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Violet]
#19010643 - 10/21/13 08:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I definitely agree with that. Doing pf tek and operating a sgfc is a pain in the ass and yeilds poor results for the amount of effort it takes. I don't find growing bulk anymore difficult. You just have to be able to read and follow instructions. Some people just have a hard time with that I guess
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19011147 - 10/21/13 10:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Wow guys, I really appreciate your constructive arguments here, I really do. Please stay with me through this process * hugs *
This is the same question as before - I have done research, almost too much. Beyond the Violet Tek, which I will be running simultaneously - How would you go about this.
I want to do a minimal contam rate initial grow - to best use my avaliable 50'ccs of P.cubenis liquid spores. Someone recommended 3 quart jars of each, making 15 quarts total.
Should I start with Organ Rye Berries, or Wild Bird Seed? Brown Rice Flour? I want to be able to do a grain to grain possibly for bulk innoculations in a clean-room or glovebox/sab. I may be a beginner, but I believe I can follow directions diligentially.
How would I begin to do my Agar, wait for a fully colonoized jar of each " strain " and take a piece of grain and drop onto the dish, or take one of each three quart jars, and create a liquid culture? Or simply take a drop of each syringe and put one drop onto each section of the three tiered petri dishes?
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: JMcDoogle]
#19011240 - 10/21/13 10:58 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I would start with wbs. It is pretty forgiving with getting the moisture content just right. You could just use your syringe to inoculate a couple wbs jars then take your best looking jar and use it to inoculate several more with g2g transfers
If you want to inoculate agar just use a drop from your syringe. Or better yet just use your syringes to inoculate grains and/or cakes and save your agar for use with your own spore prints and for doing tissue clones
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19011301 - 10/21/13 11:11 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: JMcDoogle]
#19011498 - 10/21/13 11:51 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I always do g2g. I have a good friend that always does glc. We are both successful so I know they both work. I guess it's just personal preference
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19011500 - 10/21/13 11:53 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Say I wanted to do a bulk g2g - I mean 100's of quarts...
Where would I find the cheapest Jars, from glass to plastic, anything resuable -
Im guessing widemouth Ball Quart Jars? But Arent they like 20$ for 15 of them?
Bags Perhaps?
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: JMcDoogle]
#19011530 - 10/22/13 12:01 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yeah probably spawn bags. How many mushrooms does one man need?
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19011546 - 10/22/13 12:05 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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One and done, minimialize risk by taking advantage of the time used to create one large batch, and store clean materials until I need them in the upcomming years, I say this, than I'll probably become addicted to the actual hobby of creation - and do a more legal edible/exotic grow to hone in on my skillsets -
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: JMcDoogle]
#19011551 - 10/22/13 12:08 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yeah you're already hooked and you don't even know it. Mushroom Cultivation is a very fun and satisfying hobby
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19011741 - 10/22/13 01:01 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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No, theres no way. Its not possible...

Okay, maybe a little bit -
I have central heating and its really dry in here - going to have to experiment with a hygrometer ( think thats what its called ) and a cool mist humidifier and a steam humidifier so I can atleast have the outside of my GH / FC not so try as to leech the humidity at every chance it gets.
Pressure cooker arrives tomorrow, will be prepping grains in the morning before work, and after work.. well..
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: JMcDoogle]
#19011755 - 10/22/13 01:07 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Awesome!
I run a humidifier in the room where my tubs are 24/7 It is an ultrasonic humidifier.
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

Registered: 07/07/09
Posts: 1,495
Loc: Nunavut
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: Stromrider]
#19011794 - 10/22/13 01:17 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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This is the one I think I am going to purchase tomorrow.
I think this will do the job? What do you think?
Thanks! PS - I sense a bromance forming, alteast on my part. Or maybe its just one of those teacher student romances. Creepy, I know right?
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: Need Help Sailing through Endless Skies - Starting Up Again [Re: JMcDoogle]
#19011848 - 10/22/13 01:33 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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That looks like a nice humidifier but I don't really know much about them.
Btw.... Your a homo j/k you're alright man. We can have a bromance if that is what you really want. My wife might get jealous though
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