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ShroomNeophyte
Stranger
Registered: 10/21/13
Posts: 14
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
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Is this pin growth normal?
#19009585 - 10/21/13 05:32 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Hi everyone! I'm on day 49 of my first grow ever and I'm using the pf tek method. Just yesterday I saw my very first pins and while I'm very excited, it seems odd that they are all just on the very bottoms of the cakes... nothing at all on the rest! Today is day 10 after birthing my cakes.
Here is a photo of my fruiting chamber. It is usually about 74 deg and 100% relative humidity. The left six cakes are Golden Teacher and the right six cakes are half Ecuador and half Burma. None of the Golden Teachers have pinned yet.

This is my biggest pin so far.

Some more pins on another cake.

And some more pins.

Please give me input on my first grow Does the mycelium look healthy? Why don't I have any pins anywhere other than the bottom? Thanks in advance!
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FruitOfLife
Professional Package Handler


Registered: 05/21/12
Posts: 4,832
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You used the wrong kind of jars which I believe is why you got bottom pinning? Get the cakes off the perlite! Use some tin foil to put under them. And you forgot to roll the cakes in vermiculite.
But that mycelium looks great
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TheGreenBox


Registered: 08/03/13
Posts: 276
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
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From my knowledge the mycelium looks good. Weird about the bottom growth. I have a couple of similar sized fruits after only two days in my terrarium.
Did you dunk and roll before putting the cakes into the terrarium?
Drill holes on the top and bottom in the same fashion you've done already , and elevate your box at least one inch by using some wood or something. See shotgun fruiting chamber TEK.
-------------------- And in my darkest moment, fetal and weeping, the moon tells me a secret - my confidant. As full and bright as I am, this light is not my own and a million light reflections pass over me. Its source is bright and endless. - Tool
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TheGreenBox


Registered: 08/03/13
Posts: 276
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: TheGreenBox]
#19009651 - 10/21/13 05:44 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Also get the cakes off the perlite. Put jar lids under them.
-------------------- And in my darkest moment, fetal and weeping, the moon tells me a secret - my confidant. As full and bright as I am, this light is not my own and a million light reflections pass over me. Its source is bright and endless. - Tool
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McShroomin
Shroom Engineer



Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: FruitOfLife]
#19009659 - 10/21/13 05:45 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Pins on the bottom are completely normal.
I believe it is because gravity will pull most the moisture to the bottom of the cake making it the most ideal place for mushrooms to pin.
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Fungi Tunic
Strange
Registered: 10/08/13
Posts: 101
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
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Hrm, relative novice myself but...
Per the PF tek you are supposed to roll your cakes in dry verm before putting them into the fruiting chamber after birthing/dunking. I believe it is to provide better moisture retention.
Also, place your cakes on foil or something similar to lift them off the perlite layer (which looks a little shallow, I've heard 4-5 inches is best and mine is at 4 atm.
Dunno if you should roll now, but my gut leans towards yes.
Nice looking cakes anyway, good luck!
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Giggle_Grower
A lil less noob each day



Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 1,598
Loc: Shroomery
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Do you have 1/4 in holes every 2in in a grid pattern on all 6 sides of the chamber?is the chamber elevated a few inches off the table? Do you have 4-6 in of perlite in the bottom? How often do you fan and mist? How are you measuring the humidity, I dont see a hygrometer anywhere? Not trying to be rude, these are just question based of my observation of the info provided. Your myc does look healthy and id guess you are only getting bottom pins since thats the only humid area. Edit- those are the wrong jars, but that doesnt really matter now that they are colonized. It looks like the OP has the cakes on the jar lids, which Ive done for years. And rolling the cakes is benifical, but not necca sary. I would do it after the first flush, doing so now could damage the pins.
-------------------- I'm always interested in trades. The Awesome Purple Mystics Noobs! The best tool here is up top to the right. Don't forget about it. Just type your question in! RR is my favorite source of knowledge. Check out his videos! If I forgot to leave you a rating, please remind me.
Edited by Giggle_Grower (10/21/13 06:02 PM)
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FruitOfLife
Professional Package Handler


Registered: 05/21/12
Posts: 4,832
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: McShroomin]
#19009703 - 10/21/13 05:54 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
McShroomin said: Pins on the bottom are completely normal.
I believe it is because gravity will pull most the moisture to the bottom of the cake making it the most ideal place for mushrooms to pin.
I'm not 100% confident, but I have to say you are wrong
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SynKyd
ctrl-alt-delite



Registered: 09/27/13
Posts: 1,554
Loc: ૐ
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: FruitOfLife]
#19009729 - 10/21/13 05:59 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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The answer I saw somewhere was "the pins are there because that's where the conditions are best for pinning".............so you need to figure out why that is and adjust accordingly I don't think there is a correct answer. Your holes look too far apart if you're trying to do a SGFC, which would probably help your problem.
-------------------- New inclusive poop emojis from Apple!
   
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ShroomNeophyte
Stranger
Registered: 10/21/13
Posts: 14
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
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Quote:
Giggle_Grower said: Do you have 1/4 in holes every 2in in a grid pattern on all 6 sides of the chamber?is the chamber elevated a few inches off the table? Do you have 4-6 in of perlite in the bottom? How often do you fan and mist? How are you measuring the humidity, I dont see a hygrometer anywhere? Not trying to be rude, these are just question based of my observation of the info provided. Your myc does look healthy and id guess you are only getting bottom pins since thats the only humid area. Edit- those are the wrong jars, but that doesnt really matter now that they are colonized. It looks like the OP has the cakes on the jar lids, which Ive done for years. And rolling the cakes is benifical, but not necca sary. I would do it after the first flush, doing so now could damage the pins.
I have 1/4 inch holes drilled just on the four sides, not the top or bottom.
No, the chamber is not elevated, I did not know to do that, but I will elevate it right after I post this (thanks a bunch!) I fan twice a day, and I don't mist because I can't figure out if I should or not, there seems to be conflicting advice online. Should I be misting even after pinning starts?
The hygrometer is the black device stuck onto the back wall of the chamber, it reads 100% humidity even at the very top there, so I would have to assume that my entire chamber is at 100%.
Thanks for your reply!
Edited by ShroomNeophyte (10/21/13 06:07 PM)
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ShroomNeophyte
Stranger
Registered: 10/21/13
Posts: 14
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: TheGreenBox]
#19009762 - 10/21/13 06:05 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
TheGreenBox said: From my knowledge the mycelium looks good. Weird about the bottom growth. I have a couple of similar sized fruits after only two days in my terrarium.
Did you dunk and roll before putting the cakes into the terrarium?
Drill holes on the top and bottom in the same fashion you've done already , and elevate your box at least one inch by using some wood or something. See shotgun fruiting chamber TEK.
No I didn't dunk and roll... the video I watched to learn how to do this did not dunk and roll.
Should I dunk and roll now? Even 10 days after putting the cakes into the fruiting chamber?
Edited by ShroomNeophyte (10/21/13 06:08 PM)
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McShroomin
Shroom Engineer



Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: FruitOfLife]
#19009763 - 10/21/13 06:05 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Hey Fruit, If you think I'm wrong then prove me wrong. It's a pretty cheap shot to call me out with no information to support your claim.
To prove you wrong read RR's comment in this thread. http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/16619333#16619333
Also this will solve your problem OP.
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Edited by McShroomin (10/21/13 06:09 PM)
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FruitOfLife
Professional Package Handler


Registered: 05/21/12
Posts: 4,832
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: FruitOfLife]
#19009787 - 10/21/13 06:10 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
FruitOfLife said:
Quote:
McShroomin said: Pins on the bottom are completely normal.
I believe it is because gravity will pull most the moisture to the bottom of the cake making it the most ideal place for mushrooms to pin.
I'm not 100% confident, but I have to say you are wrong
By saying Im not 100% confident isnt taking a cheap shot at you, seeing as how I am not 100% sure I am correct... I have seen multiple trusted cultivators say that bottom pinning isnt ideal.
Dont get so defensive man.
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Giggle_Grower
A lil less noob each day



Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 1,598
Loc: Shroomery
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Sigh. You need the holes in the top and bottom. The airflow up through the bottom through the perlite is what keeps the air humid. Thats why it needs ti be elevated and have at least 4 in of wet perlite. I would do 6 since you have a big chamber with lots of cakes. Always fan and mist 3-4 times a day, this is what keeps the perlite moist and fresh air in. That and evaporation are the biggest pinning triggers. In my experence, digital hygometers arent accurate at high humidity. Get a good analog one and calibrate it, it should be much morr accurate. If you are ever unsure of info you read, use the search function and check the Trusted Cultivator box. You can trust any info posted by these members.
-------------------- I'm always interested in trades. The Awesome Purple Mystics Noobs! The best tool here is up top to the right. Don't forget about it. Just type your question in! RR is my favorite source of knowledge. Check out his videos! If I forgot to leave you a rating, please remind me.
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McShroomin
Shroom Engineer



Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: FruitOfLife]
#19009838 - 10/21/13 06:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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I wasn't trying to say the bottom is the most ideal place to pin.
I could have been more clear by saying it becomes the ideal place for the mushrooms to pin when the cake doesn't have the necessary moisture up top.
Why bother posting If you are not sure about something?
Also, it is insulting to accuse me of spreading bad information when the main focuses of this site is to provide accurate information to new mushroom cultivators.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent



Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: McShroomin]
#19009942 - 10/21/13 06:34 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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To the op pretty much everything said is right on the spot.
You can still dunk and roll even now, and I would if I were you. Dunk cakes in cold tapwater for 12-24 hours then roll them in vermiculite. Wait to spray them for a few hours or you'll just spray the verm off of the cakes.
Put the cakes on something like foil or jar lids. The mycellium will grow into the perlite (no good)
Put holes 1/4 inch holes in a 2x2inch grid pattern on all six sides. Make sure your SGFC is elevated at least 6 inches(not 1 like someone said above) from the ground.
For shits and giggles I made two cakes from clone tissue and didn't dunk or roll one of them while the other got dunked and rolled. The one that didn't get dunked and rolled hardly did anything the one that did get dunked and rolled performed WAY better. Though not using an isolated genetic strain the results were dramatic with the clone genetics between the two cakes.
As for misting and fanning. Mist when the cakes no longer look wet/glistening. Mist them directly until they do and then fan right after to evacuate the 95-100% humid air (making room for evaporation to happen) You should have to do this 3-5 times a day on average.
So put holes in all the sides, elevate it, dunk your cakes, roll your cakes, and then post some new pictures.
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Giggle_Grower
A lil less noob each day



Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 1,598
Loc: Shroomery
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: bodhisatta]
#19009978 - 10/21/13 06:41 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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And add more perlite!!!!
-------------------- I'm always interested in trades. The Awesome Purple Mystics Noobs! The best tool here is up top to the right. Don't forget about it. Just type your question in! RR is my favorite source of knowledge. Check out his videos! If I forgot to leave you a rating, please remind me.
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aomoriakuma
Sensei


Registered: 09/09/13
Posts: 176
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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just to help combine everyones good advice into one post with a step by step for you. here you go (:
1. Drill holes on the bottom and top
2. Elevate SGFC by an inch or two
3. Add a bit more perlite
4. Dunk and roll
5. grow mushrooms!
6. eat mushrooms
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SynKyd
ctrl-alt-delite



Registered: 09/27/13
Posts: 1,554
Loc: ૐ
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: aomoriakuma]
#19010161 - 10/21/13 07:10 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
aomoriakuma said: just to help combine everyones good advice into one post with a step by step for you. here you go (:
1. Drill holes on the bottom and top
2. Elevate SGFC by an inch or two
3. Add a bit more perlite
4. Dunk and roll
5. grow mushrooms!
6. eat mushrooms 
Absolutely!!! nice summary.
-------------------- New inclusive poop emojis from Apple!
   
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TwistedByDesign
shredder138



Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 422
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: bodhisatta]
#19010214 - 10/21/13 07:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: To the op pretty much everything said is right on the spot.
You can still dunk and roll even now, and I would if I were you. Dunk cakes in cold tapwater for 12-24 hours then roll them in vermiculite. Wait to spray them for a few hours or you'll just spray the verm off of the cakes.
Put the cakes on something like foil or jar lids. The mycellium will grow into the perlite (no good)
Put holes 1/4 inch holes in a 2x2inch grid pattern on all six sides. Make sure your SGFC is elevated at least 6 inches(not 1 like someone said above) from the ground.
For shits and giggles I made two cakes from clone tissue and didn't dunk or roll one of them while the other got dunked and rolled. The one that didn't get dunked and rolled hardly did anything the one that did get dunked and rolled performed WAY better. Though not using an isolated genetic strain the results were dramatic with the clone genetics between the two cakes.
As for misting and fanning. Mist when the cakes no longer look wet/glistening. Mist them directly until they do and then fan right after to evacuate the 95-100% humid air (making room for evaporation to happen) You should have to do this 3-5 times a day on average.
So put holes in all the sides, elevate it, dunk your cakes, roll your cakes, and then post some new pictures.
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ShroomNeophyte
Stranger
Registered: 10/21/13
Posts: 14
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: bodhisatta]
#19010247 - 10/21/13 07:26 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: To the op pretty much everything said is right on the spot.
You can still dunk and roll even now, and I would if I were you. Dunk cakes in cold tapwater for 12-24 hours then roll them in vermiculite. Wait to spray them for a few hours or you'll just spray the verm off of the cakes.
Put the cakes on something like foil or jar lids. The mycellium will grow into the perlite (no good)
Put holes 1/4 inch holes in a 2x2inch grid pattern on all six sides. Make sure your SGFC is elevated at least 6 inches(not 1 like someone said above) from the ground.
For shits and giggles I made two cakes from clone tissue and didn't dunk or roll one of them while the other got dunked and rolled. The one that didn't get dunked and rolled hardly did anything the one that did get dunked and rolled performed WAY better. Though not using an isolated genetic strain the results were dramatic with the clone genetics between the two cakes.
As for misting and fanning. Mist when the cakes no longer look wet/glistening. Mist them directly until they do and then fan right after to evacuate the 95-100% humid air (making room for evaporation to happen) You should have to do this 3-5 times a day on average.
So put holes in all the sides, elevate it, dunk your cakes, roll your cakes, and then post some new pictures.
Thanks to everyone! You're all so helpful, and I'm very grateful. I just dunked my 12 cakes, tomorrow night I will roll them and put them in my fruiting chamber which will be elevated and have holes on all six sides, and then I'll post updated photos.
Thanks again!!!
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Giggle_Grower
A lil less noob each day



Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 1,598
Loc: Shroomery
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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I still say, wait on dunk and roll until after the current pins have matured. Personal preference i guess. To each his own. Edit just saw that you have already done this.
-------------------- I'm always interested in trades. The Awesome Purple Mystics Noobs! The best tool here is up top to the right. Don't forget about it. Just type your question in! RR is my favorite source of knowledge. Check out his videos! If I forgot to leave you a rating, please remind me.
Edited by Giggle_Grower (10/21/13 07:32 PM)
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ShroomNeophyte
Stranger
Registered: 10/21/13
Posts: 14
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
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Ok, I have finished the dunk and roll, I have added more perlite, I have drilled more holes and in all six sides, and I have elevated my terrarium roughly four inches off the ground. By the way, some of the cakes were slightly blue after the dunk and roll, but I guess that's just natural bruising? No green or bad smells whatsoever. What does everyone think? Anything else I could/should do? Any other recommendations or observations?
Thanks again for all the great advice!



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Gretchenmeister
Starbeing/Psilocybin Savant



Registered: 07/23/05
Posts: 1,032
Loc: From the Stars
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I would raise that FC up at least three feet from the grounds surface. Nastiest of contams hover at ground level.
-------------------- What's wrong with folks? Point your IRC client to irc.socialirc.com, port 6667, #cultivation and #shroomery for live chat with like minded hobbyists and connoisseurs. Mush Porn
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent



Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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The higher the better but at least it's not on the floor anymore I personally think the 4 inches is fine I always say shoot for at least 6. I say you're golden there's plenty of contams in open air anyway, but yes more by the floor. I would maybe try to even out the perlite more so it's uniformly flat but everything looks way better than it did. You should be getting good results soon. The bluing is normal
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ShroomNeophyte
Stranger
Registered: 10/21/13
Posts: 14
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
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Re: Is this pin growth normal? [Re: bodhisatta]
#19015658 - 10/22/13 07:42 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Thanks guys! Actually, the FC is raised about 4 inches off of the surface of a desk, not the ground, so it is not at the ground level at all.
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sytar
Radiant


Registered: 09/01/13
Posts: 381
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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My guess - I'm a newbie - but here goes.
Might have something to do with excessive FAE while still in the jars. Most in vitro pins seem to occur on the bottom. Could be bottom pinning was triggered while in the jars (but went undetected because they were mere hyphal knots/primordia when you birthed.
-------------------- I post from my phone. Excuse the typos and autocorrects.
Edited by sytar (10/22/13 08:04 PM)
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