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Offlinesprinkles
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Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 21,527
Loc: washington state Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 16 days
Re: Blessed are the less fortunate [Re: Icelander]
    #18980892 - 10/15/13 11:12 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

"pain and suffering is our best friend"  Wow, thats so profound.  :rolleyes: I feel so blessed.





and life is a chance to grow a soul...Gimme a break.


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welcome to my world http://www.shroomery.org/forums/postlist.php/Board/326


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Blessed are the less fortunate [Re: sprinkles]
    #18980986 - 10/15/13 11:38 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Most who do some long term serious suffering change their minds about all that.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlineeve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--
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Registered: 04/30/03
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Re: Blessed are the less fortunate [Re: Icelander]
    #18981142 - 10/15/13 12:27 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I knew a woman who hung around the Buddhist scene always demanding help, thinking she was helping promote The Dharma by sucking it up.


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...or something







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OfflineYogi1
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Registered: 04/01/13
Posts: 1,015
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Blessed are the less fortunate [Re: eve69]
    #18982171 - 10/15/13 04:48 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

eve69 said:
I knew a woman who hung around the Buddhist scene always demanding help, thinking she was helping promote The Dharma by sucking it up.




:curbyourenthusiasm:

Some people think shit is so external and reaps external rewards...reincarnartion isnt the rodeo that people think it is, nor is ultimate death after burning away karma...


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OfflineCrimpJiggler
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Registered: 08/28/11
Posts: 251
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
Re: Blessed are the less fortunate [Re: eve69]
    #18984547 - 10/16/13 01:48 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

DOUBLE POST


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…...,~__________________, ,.
….../ `—___________—-___]Give a man a gun
…../_==o;;;;;;;;_______.:/he can rob a bank.
…..), —.(_(__) /
….// (..)),````
…//__/Give a man a bank,he can rob the world!
.//__/


Edited by CrimpJiggler (10/16/13 02:10 AM)


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OfflineCrimpJiggler
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Registered: 08/28/11
Posts: 251
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
Re: Blessed are the less fortunate [Re: eve69]
    #18984587 - 10/16/13 02:06 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

eve69 said:
I got your point, but I don't think anyone is going to say, Jesus I am damn glad I went to prison so I could learn not to fear pitbulls.




When the time comes and the person has to face the pitbulls, they'll be glad they went to prison, I can guarantee you that. Whether a person appreciates what their stay in prison did to them, depends entirely on their perception of reality. If they think life is supposed to be this rosy and happy thing free of suffering, and that anything else is a failure, they will probably feel bad about spending a significant portion of it in hell, and consequently having their ability to obtain material wealth significantly hindered (due to having a criminal record).

If on the other hand, they see this life thing as some kind of spiritual boot camp/training ground, I'm fairly sure they'll be glad they made it through prison.

Quote:

thatmonk said:
I live in all kinds of chronic pain and can report suffering, which is the product of resisting ones painful experience, is indeed the rocket fuel to blast one out of the prison of delusion. If there was no suffering, why bother to grow spiritually, which takes a lot of effort and commitment? If you suffer enough, eventually you start asking questions and looking for freedom beyond what the world has up for offer...



Have you done DMT (ayahuasca or smoked) before? I experienced the principle on salvia before, I was in another dimension and it started closing in on me, to the point that it was so confined and limited that I decided I no longer wanted to exist in that reality, and even though I didn't know it was possible to escape it (I couldn't remember having been in any other reality), I decided I was going to transcend it, and thats what I did. It seems that the main chain that binds us to the prison, is our own attachment to the prison. And suffering seems to be the ultimate tool for severing our attachment to the prison.

I never thought about it from the Buddhist perspective. The illusion of seperateness might be a 3D construct, and that when we transcend it, we transcend this 3D prison. On salvia I got stuck in the 2nd dimension, and transcended it by realising that me and my environment were the same thing. I merged with my environment, and then I found myself in 3D.

Quote:

eve69 said:
spiritual practices are not for the perfect but for those who understand their imperfections. Spiritual aspirants are more often broken or know of their brokenness and often seem fucked up.  It behooves one to understand where is the cart and where the mule.  The mule is the sense of incompleteness or yearning for something better (recognizing lack), the mule is not triumphantly marching into Bethlehem to reclaim the throne.




True, spiritual practices are not for the perfect. People who have not yet attained the courage and honesty to look at their human nature, aren't ready for spiritual practice. I used to think I was perfect when I was a teenager, then I started taking psychedelics and realised I was merely too scared to look at my flaws. Honesty is the first step.

Quote:

Icelander said:
Most who do some long term serious suffering change their minds about all that.



Yeah you really need to see it for yourself to understand. People don't willingly become ascetics for nothing.

Quote:

sprinkles said:
"pain and suffering is our best friend"  Wow, thats so profound.  :rolleyes: I feel so blessed.



I'm sorry you haven't seen it for yourself yet, but it is what it is  :shrug: In my experience, you can only see it in retrospect, so if you're in the thick of it now, then just tough it out, you'll see later down the line, what the shit times actually did for you. My last 2 ayahuasca ceremonies, I felt like I was a damned soul and all I could see was what a fucked up situation I had gotten myself into, it was only afterwards that I could see the kind of changes the experience caused. It reminds me of the quote from the bible "the lord works in mysterious ways". My friend wanted to quit smoking, and the ayahuasca told him "if you haven't quit smoking next time you see me, I'm going to show you hell" and he was so terrified, he quit smoking then and there.

This is why I'm weary of anyone who claims to be on a spiritual path, while also claiming that suffering is not necessary for spiritual evolution. In my experience, various changes can only be made through suffering. Getting free of a 20 year opioid addiction for instance. It doesn't come easy.

Quote:

sprinkles said:
and life is a chance to grow a soul...Gimme a break.



Why don't you quote the person who said that.


--------------------
…...,~__________________, ,.
….../ `—___________—-___]Give a man a gun
…../_==o;;;;;;;;_______.:/he can rob a bank.
…..), —.(_(__) /
….// (..)),````
…//__/Give a man a bank,he can rob the world!
.//__/


Edited by CrimpJiggler (10/16/13 02:57 AM)


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