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OfflineMalachi
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Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2
    #1896768 - 09/09/03 03:05 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

and oddly enough I seemed to pick right up at the train of thought that I was at the last time I tripped.  It's so weird tripping these days, I'm only 19, but I've tripped an awful lot, probably as much as the majority of the old people around these parts.  of course that's speculation, but what isn't?

anyway, when I trip these days (well, to be technical about it, twice, once late late friday night (like 3ish) and again the next "day" at perhaps 7ish.) I don't seem to really get nearly the amount or intensity of visual splendor, nor the intense depersonalization/ "ego loss" that used to be so common for my trips.  gone is the lack of bodily control (well, I'm still inebriated, often toking, so I might to be little off, but not even really noticeably to anyone else) and the out of body's and the visitations of entities/ god(s).  of course, quantity/ quality could be the issue, as in the past I was more apt to explore high doses, I reached the bit over a 1/4 mark, I don't really remember, perhaps 8 or 9 gs.  anyway, I tripped on a 1/8 in a choc, it was substantially bigger than most of the others at the festival I was at, but quite authentic.  the other time it was a really fat 1/8, probably upwards of 4gs. 

ok, now that I've given the back-story... my trips on the weekend and the trip at the matrix reloaded were both quite cerebral, quite rational (at least in a certain respect) and based on a kind of question/answer dialectic within myself.  no god(s), no demons, no rainbows and no glitter. however, the conclusions which were reached satisfied me and continue to provide that satisfaction today, and I think most likely it will continue into tomorrow etc etc.  I thought that I should record some of the shpeals (sp?) I went on on my mp3 player, but instead I started typing posts, so I'll record this way. 

I thought a lot about purpose.  I grokked (sp?) purpose. really and truly, "internally" if you will.  in my minds eye, purpose drives the two intertwined snakes, the black and white, to always dace facing each other, to spin and spin around always unable to move fast enough to bite the other, able only to make faces at each other.  this is when I started thinking about the matrix, specifically the scene in which agent smith is falling at trinity, trying to shoot her and vice versa.  of course the analogies aren't quite compatible, since there is direction, etc, but it sure is visually stunning.  I'm soo going to trip and watch the movie again.  now that I think about it, one of my more egoless timeless trips was when the first matrix was one.. but I wasn't watching, I was in a bedroom writhing around in the sheets of a buddies bed trying to remember what people are :smile:

ok, back to the subject. so purpose is everything.  the word itself implies it, purpose is the force behind every "event" if you will.  purpose, you could say, is almost utilitarian in it's shear medium-ness, in it's sweeping necessity.  therefore it seems that the man who fulfills his purpose must be also of everything, in the middle if you will, capable of survival, of existence. the true survivor is the man with purpose. 

this relates to a prior thread about power lifting, if it's spiritual or not.  with the above in mind, the power lifter is unspiritual in his over specialization, cause big meat heads could easily be killed in the wild; exploiting such a slow moving and unbalanced target would not be difficult.  now, just your regular strength training, of course that would be a part of the whole physical thing, and would remain spiritual in nature.  however, excessively long distance running fucks you up to, you get all stiff and can't do yoga or change directions quickly. 

things like yoga and martial arts and surfing are regarded highly because they require so many various skills and attributes, you must walk through the middle of virtually all of sport/training. 

this explains the aesthetic motive behind david, the proportioned body can express the pure nobility of it's inhabitant.  this is very much less true today, and I think that's why everyone's so ashamed to worship the perfect body these days... or to even declare that there is a perfect body type.  relative drivel.

anyway, this all ties into justification for the so-called "holy warrior", indeed, an endorsement of the idea in a whole long age when "crusade" means what GWB is doing to the mideast, or for that matter what the damn chistians did to the mideast in the middle ages. 

a few criteria:

the holy warrior is never fighting for the empire.  he is always fighting for freedom.

he/she is always out matched.

will not receive support from those they seek to protect, as none of them will realize that someone has to keep winter at bay.

the warriors primary task/requirement/step is to learn to distinguish reality (truth) from appearance. 

the warriors second task is to act on his/her findings in the most aggressive manner while employing the most fitting of tactics.  this means "to fight".

so the warrior must essentially also be a philosopher, but then, he/she is also a bit of a doctor, a farmer, a fast driver, handy with this and that, worldly/well traveled, knowledgeable in many topics both academic, emotional, and the amalgam of the two, this nebulous thing we are calling "spirituality".

the warrior knows where to find what he needs, knows what to do to get it.  if he doesn't then he finds out. 

the warrior isn't shamed or intimidated by anyone, and only truly respects those he protects and his equals, his brothers in arms... and backpacks.  brothers in backpacks.  the warrior needs to carry items on his person, weapons, perhaps, water/rations, magic. etc. 

the warrior can run and jump and swim, unless he truly can't, and in those cases he/she is fighting in a different way, and to call them warriors is a worthy figure of speech, but not very good in terms of illustrating my point / meaning. 

anyway, this going on and on, leaving me eventually to the same point I was at in the last class I attended on thursday before the festival and tripping.  that point was throwing my arms up in the air in wonderment at what "automatic" in the human context is supposed to mean. 

zen archery, football, even much art like dali and pollock is said to be done, in a manner,  "automatically".  meaning, essentially, that they are done without conscious thought, the football player doesn't plan out his strides and moves, he goes way to fast. it's all execution.  of course there's the huddle, but you can't go over the specific number of steps, etc, the eventualities of what will happen if this guy moves there, etc.

so is unconscious, automatic activity more important, more useful, more fulfilling, etc, than "conscious" activity?  the word conscious, of course, has it's problems- you're not sleeping or knocked out when unconscious of a certain thing (like shooting at a zen archery tourney or that hour that flew by whilst driving on the interstate) you're just not the "one" if you will that does the driving at that particular time.

so what's happening? are the spiritualist techniques of the east the control of this process, the selective evoking and banishment of consciousness or levels of consciousness?

I did a bit of meditating whilst tripping and listening to the big wu play.  not quite my kind of band, to mellow and hippy, but I was sooo tired from walking the trails and dancing at the DJ tent... anyway, I sat, perfectly comfortably, with my head down but my back fairly straight, for awhile.  I laid down on my side for a bit, but a concerned security guard came to check on me, so I figured I'd just sit so no one would be worried or think I wasn't enjoying the show - all the older hippies sure dug their big wu, busting the hippie side to side shuffle :smile:  us young raver kid generation made many a old hippies eyes pop, I'll tell ya that.  I don't think that many of them had ever seen lock and pop type liquiding before.  :smile:

anyway, about the meditating- it seemed to me that meditation is what you do when you're content, and that's why people have such a hard time at it.  they're trying to go in the wrong order, meditation presupposes contentment or lack of motivation or even better- lack of purpose.  purpose drives us from meditation, drives us to movement to fulfill it, and purpose fulfilled is what satisfies us. 

to the consciousness question- the eastern practitioners of what seems to be the ability to transfer willfully through these states of consciousness also seem to be masters of knowing their purpose(s), of distinguishing the "true way" or "good life" if you will.  this is the part that is widely jumped upon/ is popularly accepted as true (in the west)  without understanding of really why that might be other than the exotic/esoteric-ness of eastern everything. 

I posit that this is because they are more accurately described as almost really good followers rather than good masters, cause it seems that what they are is perfect listeners, observers, thinkers, and ultimately understand that the way to contentment to through satisfaction of purpose, and so they do so with glee, for the act of fulfilling purpose is a great thing, it is "honest work", it is "art" it is all that is or ought to be held up in esteem (at least ostensibly) morally. 

that is why they sit.  cause they can, and the west can't.  the west always is fidgeting, and that's why our kids are "ADD", everyone wants to kill themselves of others (usually this means that they also have a death wish, as most realize that murder = death or equivalent).  any place or culture or person that isn't fulfilling it's purpose has two options: get away from the coercion, or fulfill the purpose.  that's how many people use drugs.

this is where I get to running.  running is interesting, because it seems that it is an example of both the automatic and the conscious.  from what I've read, it's ok to use an mp3 player/ headphone at first, when your stride is all inefficient and you're just starting out, just trying to build a little cardio endurance.  anything that will motivate, get you out there, endure the first few burning runs, is seen as a-ok.  however, there seems to be consensus in the frowning upon use of headphones in real training, because it will distract you from your form.  in the same way you could make the argument that in yoga, you've got to focus, consciously, on what you're doing, whether you've been doing it for a long time of not. it's  stretching, you need to quite literally push yourself every time.  and with martial arts katas (sp?) like in tai chi, it's not automatically, at least I wouldn't imagine it to be so, it seems to require focus.  whereas in other activities the "zone" seems more unconscious.

so the problem is that it's hard to ask yogi's and monks if they know who or what or what part of you or it or the others or etc moves you when it's not you.  the people who I've talked to who has posed this problem to eastern spiritualists tell me that they (the easterners) don't know either, that they scratch their heads and say they don't know, like us.  that's not to say that the cultures are equal in understanding of the self, as the easterners know that purpose has primacy, that they MUST fulfill their purpose.  hence the higher average wage of an asian in america (well, the fact that we're importing high earning professionals who don't have to pay an american uni tuition). 

ok, that's all for now, I'm hungry and tired and I only smoked like half of this hash topped bowl since I started this... so I'm out for now. :smile:


I love festival time, and I love tripping the mushroom, and I love my epistemology class with the crazy pot bellied armenian teacher, and I most of all love realizing that I am the warrior reborn, realizing the continuity. 

I love being a warrior.


--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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OfflineMalachi
stereotype

Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1896775 - 09/09/03 03:07 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

yeah, it's really long, and really more for me than anything else. comments/ questions are quite welcome and would be appreciated though, so fire away.


--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1897614 - 09/09/03 11:24 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

this relates to a prior thread about power lifting, if it's spiritual or not. with the above in mind, the power lifter is unspiritual in his over specialization, cause big meat heads could easily be killed in the wild; exploiting such a slow moving and unbalanced target would not be difficult.
Your ignorance is absoultely amazing. I was a competitive power-lifter at 5'8", 148 pounds (and the categories go down to about 115 for men) and had the build of a Bruce Lee. Was he a big, slow-moving meathead?

now, just your regular strength training, of course that would be a part of the whole physical thing, and would remain spiritual in nature.
The mental training in power-lifting equals anything done in martial arts. Years ago I was pulling a car behind a truck. The truck hit a dip and the hitch came off the jack. When I stopped, the hitch fell forward. Placing about a 1/4 to 1/3 the weight of the 3000lb car on the ground. I was in the middle of nowhere and waited hours for help. There was no traffic, so I knew I had to do something on my own. As I would only get weaker with subsequent tries, I had to get it right the first time. Within intense focus, I lifted that fucker up, cutting deep into my hand in the process. They were bleeding all over the place, but then I found that I had to jerk the entire hitch /car combo over 4 inches to drop it on the ball which was even more difficult than lifting the 700+ pounds. That is focus and belief. Would love to see ANY yogi or martial artist of ANY size do that!

however, excessively long distance running fucks you up to, you get all stiff and can't do yoga or change directions quickly.
My dad was a long-distance runner with over 30 trophies and is an amazing athlete in his 70s. He has a resting heart-rate in the 40 bpm range and can walk down the beach on his hands. Guess that is pretty "fucked-up".

Try talking about things that you know.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineMalachi
stereotype

Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Swami]
    #1901044 - 09/10/03 03:57 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Your ignorance is absoultely amazing. I was a competitive power-lifter at 5'8", 148 pounds (and the categories go down to about 115 for men) and had the build of a Bruce Lee. Was he a big, slow-moving meathead?




right, well guess what? bruce lees build wasn't attained through power lifting alone. without good stretching technique, good aerobic exercise and running and everything else, you're not subtle, not gentle enough to fight. "power lifters" lift. they don't do much else. boxers/ martial artist also have a bruce lee build, but unlike the over speicalized lifter they can move fluidly.

Quote:

The mental training in power-lifting equals anything done in martial arts. Years ago I was pulling a car behind a truck. The truck hit a dip and the hitch came off the jack. When I stopped, the hitch fell forward. Placing about a 1/4 to 1/3 the weight of the 3000lb car on the ground. I was in the middle of nowhere and waited hours for help. There was no traffic, so I knew I had to do something on my own. As I would only get weaker with subsequent tries, I had to get it right the first time. Within intense focus, I lifted that fucker up, cutting deep into my hand in the process. They were bleeding all over the place, but then I found that I had to jerk the entire hitch /car combo over 4 inches to drop it on the ball which was even more difficult than lifting the 700+ pounds. That is focus and belief. Would love to see ANY yogi or martial artist of ANY size do that!




yeah, well, it's called a jack. I'd like to see a power lifter play hackey sack or race a bmx bike or surf/ skateboard or run or swim. personally, I find those things to be much more important.

Quote:

My dad was a long-distance runner with over 30 trophies and is an amazing athlete in his 70s. He has a resting heart-rate in the 40 bpm range and can walk down the beach on his hands. Guess that is pretty "fucked-up".

Try talking about things that you know.





you fucking freaky bitch, why does every reply my make have to contain a dig? some fucking hippie you are. freak.

anyway, if you weren't a mongoloid meat head, if you'd ever actually gotten into ld running yourself, you'd know that all those marathoners are fucking up their bodies. they can't touch their fucking toes. and you should see them dance... it's beyond ridiculous. no fucking flexability. yeah, I'd call that "fucked up". 5k and 10k's are where it's at, you run fast and medium length, a perfect balance.

btw, I'd drive your pops into his grave in a 5k. I'll leave the shitting in the pants, destroyed joints, and inflexable muscles to your daddy.



--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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Invisibletheshiftingwalls
Divine state

Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 4,128
Loc: Residing in thee Universa...
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1901069 - 09/10/03 04:07 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

You need to watch the Animatrix on hbwr..


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OfflineMalachi
stereotype

Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: theshiftingwalls]
    #1901106 - 09/10/03 04:47 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

yeah? do you extract them, or just peel em? some buddys have a bunch, but they've been taking forever with the extraction, I just want to eat them whole. ?


--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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Invisiblechodamunky
Cheers!

Registered: 02/28/02
Posts: 2,030
Loc: sailing the seas of chees...
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1902508 - 09/10/03 04:37 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

btw, I'd drive your pops into his grave in a 5k. I'll leave the shitting in the pants, destroyed joints, and inflexable muscles to your daddy.

Nothing like dissing somebody's parents to prove a point..


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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1903258 - 09/10/03 11:56 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Good post.

I think you have a point with the superior human being thing- evolution picks the medium-builds, faster runners, smart thinkers, and tool-users. Adaptability is very deseriable.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1903539 - 09/11/03 12:59 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

You know... I was going to compliment you on your post... but then your ego stepped in and turned you back into a defensive asshole.

Make stupid assumptions and the Swami is bound to retort. I thought you would've figured this out by now.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Malachi]
    #1903680 - 09/11/03 01:59 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I was also considering responding to some of what you said until your mean-spirited remarks towards Swami. That sort of talk does nothing to advance any points you might have and only ends up making you look like an ass. Be a warrior if you see yourself as that, but don't settle for being a brute. And please stop projecting your own negativity onto others.

Good luck.


--------------------
I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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OfflineMalachi
stereotype

Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: my first mushroom trip since (at least I think) Matrix 2 [Re: Swami]
    #1914292 - 09/14/03 01:26 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Try talking about things that you know.





Quote:

but then your ego stepped in and turned you back into a defensive asshole.




you guys are such clique-y lamers, but you're too old to see it. swami is the most negative old man, most unbecoming of a "mature" "elder" "logical" "rational" "skeptical" spokesperson of this site. he's an asshole who gets off on "telling off" tripped out kids.

but no one will hear the truth, cause of drug cliquery. lame, man, real lame.


BTW meathead (that's you swami, oh spiritual power lifter) try dancing sometime. meatheads look fucking hilarious whilst trying to be graceful. or perhaps some juggling. or perhaps getting off the ego trip of being the ego trip identifier (yes, I realize this puts me in the same category... but that's the point, me and swami are doing the same thing, he just has a highschool-esque "cred" in this spot on the internet. congrats, swami, but you're still an inflexable meathead.)

btw, skepticism is incoherent. duh.


--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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