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OfflinePatlal
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18958987 - 10/10/13 11:47 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Periods of increased temperatures have somehow coincided with the periods of great advancement in human history. Isn't that amazing?

When you've personally queried all the worlds climate scientist you let me know. 95% might actually mean something then. While doing so remind yourself that the predictions of doom and gloom have fallen flat and that few, if any, of the climate models have even been close to accurate.

The MSM is on-board and the odds of hearing the dissenting voices are pretty slim. It's become a more religion than an actual religion.

But hey, let Mother Earth know that we have it all figured out. I'm sure she'll be delighted.




It'll never be a 100% conclusion. We only have one sample in this research and it's planet Earth. If we had 10 planets to test on we could come to a 99.99% certainty.

I have believed in some coincidences before, but with doubt. I was on the side of the earth cycle opinion not too long ago. It made sense to me. There's probably a lot of that that affects the current results. But then again, we live in an aquarium of air and we've been burning copious amounts of oil and chemicals and releasing them in the atmosphere. That's on top of cutting down nature's lungs at a rapid rate. Something is bound to fuck up the balance.

Personally, when you take levels of CO2 and the temperatures of the planet over 1000000 years and compare them to the last 100 years which is when we started nurning all the crap and cutting trees. That's a 1/10000 chance. Its beyond coincidence


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Offlinedark3st
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Patlal]
    #18959003 - 10/10/13 11:50 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Or a 0.0000001—5% certainty

Hey maybe a -5690—0.0000005269042% and ice age's are more common. 

I love to assume shit too :pirate:


--------------------
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Edited by dark3st (10/10/13 11:53 AM)


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Patlal]
    #18959023 - 10/10/13 11:56 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Here's how I see it (and it's not hard to find scientists that agree).

Yup, we've polluted the shit out of the planet.

Yup, we shouldn't have.

Yup, we should do our best to minimize our impact.

Yup, clean air and water should be our goal.

Nope, the end days are not upon us.

Nope, we should not make radical changes based upon what we know at this time regarding "climate change".



We just don't know. Perhaps had the climate models not been so far off you'd find more willing to join your religion. As it stands now, "the sky is falling" is an accurate assessment of the hysteria.

It's more likely that humans will be wiped out by the flu or an asteroid then that mankind will suffer great consequences from climate change.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinempd
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18959114 - 10/10/13 12:16 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

tl;dr the thread.  Global warming is like affirmative action, you know you are getting scammed and you hang with it anyway because that is where there are people who are willing to accept all arriving freaks and geeks.  Believing it requires one to abhor logic and actual science instead.  This makes it an ideal cause celeb for liberals.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: mpd]
    #18959121 - 10/10/13 12:17 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

:thumbup:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinedark3st
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18959127 - 10/10/13 12:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

:dontspillme:


--------------------
Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this.

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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18959230 - 10/10/13 12:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Here's how I see it (and it's not hard to find scientists that agree).

Yup, we've polluted the shit out of the planet.

Yup, we shouldn't have.

Yup, we should do our best to minimize our impact.

Yup, clean air and water should be our goal.

Nope, the end days are not upon us.

Nope, we should not make radical changes based upon what we know at this time regarding "climate change".




The scientific community doesn't agree on what the result will be of global warming.  I haven't seen any scientist claim that it will result in the extinction of the human race or even a serious reduction in population.

Still, nearly every expert agrees that human activity is a major cause of it.  That's all I'm arguing here.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Patlal]
    #18959411 - 10/10/13 01:28 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Don't argue with him. Conservative such as Zap dislike change. They would rather be at the status quo so that they aren't moved out of their comfort zone. They believe that everything they learned at 20 years old is going to be the absolute truth until they die, therefore they will reject any forms of change or anything that goes against what they think is right. This kind of mentality is what is constantly holding the world back because most elected officials are older. They live 30 to 50 years in the past.

Nothing can be done




Pretty dumb statement.

The reason many don't buy into this shit based upon what we know now is because many of us not only pay attention to what both "sides" say, but we've lived through a great many "the sky is falling" crises which turned out to be a load of shit.




It's not gonna cause the end of the world. But it's going to create significant challenges in the future which could be lessened if we act now. It's always better to prevent that to react.




Fact not in evidence.  When did you start accepting whatever authorities say?  Show me the proof.
Quote:

 

Both "sides". Right now side one has 95% and side 2 has 5%. And that's not a political opinion. It's scientific research




2/3rds of the IPCC are not scientists, they are politicians.  Not just any politicians but politicians for the most part from shit countries who would exempt themselves from being hamstrung.  And if you don't hew the line as a scientist they kick you off the panel.  Please find me ONE scientist who says he has a peer reviewed and replicated study that proves a strictly human activity caused rise in planetary temperature, which rise has been non-existent for 15 years contra all these ersatz scientists who think modeling is proof even when the models don't work.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18959441 - 10/10/13 01:37 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:

There is not one single scientific study that establishes human activity as contributing to global warming or that global warming requires an explanation that is not normal natural variability. 



Not one you've read, of course...but there are many such studies:

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.167.2337&rep=rep1&type=pdf
"None of the natural processes can account for the overall warming trend in global surface temperatures. In the 100 years from 1905 to 2005, the temperature trends produce by all three natural influences are at least an order of magnitude smaller than the observed surface temperature trend reported by IPCC [2007]."

http://articles.adsabs.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/nph-iarticle_query?2000ESASP.463..201T&data_type=PDF_HIGH&whole_paper=YES&type=PRINTER&filetype=.pdf
"our results strongly suggest that anthropogenic forcings have been the dominant cause of temperature changes over the last 30 to 50 years."

http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/full/10.1175/1520-0442%282004%29017%3C3721%3ACONAAF%3E2.0.CO%3B2
"The late-twentieth-century warming can only be reproduced in the model with anthropogenic forcing"

http://thingsbreak.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/improved-constraints-on-21st-century-warming-derived-using-160-years-of-temperature-observations.pdf
"we detect a response to changes in greenhouse gases, aerosols and natural
forcings in the full 1851–2010 instrumental temperature record, and find that greenhouse-gas-induced warming was significantly larger than the observed warming over the 1951–2000 period"



Not one of those meets the criteria I established.  This sloppiness supports my assertion that you don't know shit about what science is.

1.  Both natural and anthropogenic influences caused
twentieth century climate change but their relative roles
and regional impacts are still under debate
.

2.  our results strongly suggest

3.  in the model

4.  Projections of 21st century warming may be derived
by using regression-based methods to scale a model


Models are not science.  For the last 15 years for sure and I believe going back forever the fucking models do not work.  "Strongly suggesting" is not proof.  "Still under debate" kind of kicks the consensus argument to the curb, does it not?

You have done a better job of making my case than your own.  Thanks


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18959455 - 10/10/13 01:40 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Here's how I see it (and it's not hard to find scientists that agree).

Yup, we've polluted the shit out of the planet.

Yup, we shouldn't have.

Yup, we should do our best to minimize our impact.

Yup, clean air and water should be our goal.

Nope, the end days are not upon us.

Nope, we should not make radical changes based upon what we know at this time regarding "climate change".




The scientific community doesn't agree on what the result will be of global warming.  I haven't seen any scientist claim that it will result in the extinction of the human race or even a serious reduction in population.

Still, nearly every expert agrees that human activity is a major cause of it.  That's all I'm arguing here.




Not according to your links.  You are clearly a complete dilettante in this matter.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18959680 - 10/10/13 02:25 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I love how you move the goalposts. First, you said:

Quote:

There is not one single scientific study that establishes human activity as contributing to global warming




Now, when I've shown you studies that established just that, you say:

Quote:

Both natural and anthropogenic influences caused
twentieth century climate change but their relative roles
and regional impacts are still under debate




As I've said all along, human activity is partially to blame...you now admit that.  It took you 8 pages, but you've finally admitted it.

Even an old dude like you can use reason from time to time...kudos.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18959845 - 10/10/13 02:55 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Zappa, 97% of climate scientists agree that human activity is responsible for global warming.  Source.  So, on one side, there's 97% of the experts, and on the other side, there is 3% and YOU...raging for what you desperately hope is the truth.

As I've said time and again, I am no expert, and neither are you.  Simply put, when 97% of the experts agree on something...anything...that's a strong indicator that they're right.

I'm going with the 97% on this one...you're free to deny to your grave, though.


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Offlinechutney
slappin' the whiners
Registered: 07/26/13
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18959920 - 10/10/13 03:12 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

lulz at how zappaisgod  fronts like he's smarter than any of the hundreds (if not thousands) of climate scientists who've spent their entire lives studying this at great length in academia... but hey let's listen to the "expert" who spends his days and free time on the shroomery  :rofl:

Good laughs though, thanks


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Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18960253 - 10/10/13 04:24 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:

There is not one single scientific study that establishes human activity as contributing to global warming or that global warming requires an explanation that is not normal natural variability. 



Not one you've read, of course...but there are many such studies:

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.167.2337&rep=rep1&type=pdf
"None of the natural processes can account for the overall warming trend in global surface temperatures. In the 100 years from 1905 to 2005, the temperature trends produce by all three natural influences are at least an order of magnitude smaller than the observed surface temperature trend reported by IPCC [2007]."

http://articles.adsabs.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/nph-iarticle_query?2000ESASP.463..201T&data_type=PDF_HIGH&whole_paper=YES&type=PRINTER&filetype=.pdf
"our results strongly suggest that anthropogenic forcings have been the dominant cause of temperature changes over the last 30 to 50 years."

http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/full/10.1175/1520-0442%282004%29017%3C3721%3ACONAAF%3E2.0.CO%3B2
"The late-twentieth-century warming can only be reproduced in the model with anthropogenic forcing"

http://thingsbreak.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/improved-constraints-on-21st-century-warming-derived-using-160-years-of-temperature-observations.pdf
"we detect a response to changes in greenhouse gases, aerosols and natural
forcings in the full 1851–2010 instrumental temperature record, and find that greenhouse-gas-induced warming was significantly larger than the observed warming over the 1951–2000 period"



Not one of those meets the criteria I established.  This sloppiness supports my assertion that you don't know shit about what science is.

1.  Both natural and anthropogenic influences caused
twentieth century climate change but their relative roles
and regional impacts are still under debate
.

2.  our results strongly suggest

3.  in the model

4.  Projections of 21st century warming may be derived
by using regression-based methods to scale a model


Models are not science.  For the last 15 years for sure and I believe going back forever the fucking models do not work.  "Strongly suggesting" is not proof.  "Still under debate" kind of kicks the consensus argument to the curb, does it not?

You have done a better job of making my case than your own.  Thanks




no matter how many times, they'll still come back with, but the scientists agree!1 even though they can't state why it's such a big deal as to be arguing for the fact that they know scientists agree, about climate change, when there is nothing else to discuss, anyway.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18960263 - 10/10/13 04:28 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
I love how you move the goalposts. First, you said:

Quote:

There is not one single scientific study that establishes human activity as contributing to global warming







There isn't and you haven't posted one. 
Quote:



Now, when I've shown you studies that established just that, you say:

Quote:

Both natural and anthropogenic influences caused
twentieth century climate change but their relative roles
and regional impacts are still under debate




As I've said all along, human activity is partially to blame...you now admit that.  It took you 8 pages, but you've finally admitted it.

Even an old dude like you can use reason from time to time...kudos.




You have not posted one single study that establishes human activity is causing warming that mayor may not exist.  Do you really not know what the word "establish" means?  Everything you posted was full of caveats or models.  Where is the study, real science, that establishes human caused warming?


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18960290 - 10/10/13 04:35 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Zappa, 97% of climate scientists agree that human activity is responsible for global warming.  Source.  So, on one side, there's 97% of the experts, and on the other side, there is 3% and YOU...raging for what you desperately hope is the truth.

As I've said time and again, I am no expert, and neither are you.  Simply put, when 97% of the experts agree on something...anything...that's a strong indicator that they're right.

I'm going with the 97% on this one...you're free to deny to your grave, though.



Once again you and they have failed to come close to prove your contention.  They have been trying oh so hard and still can't do it.  Their predictions don't pan out.  Do you know what science that can't predict is?  Bullshit.  The real world says your heroes are fucking morons, at best.  The alternative is that they are fund seeking liars.  Either way, they are :failboat:

Do or do not.  There is no try in science.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18960349 - 10/10/13 04:48 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

You seem to misunderstand what science is.  Science can rarely give us a 100% positive answer to any question.  That's not really how it works.  That's why we have theories like evolution that will likely always remain theories despite the fact that they are universally accepted as true.

You can pretend to know what you're talking about, but you clearly don't.  Computer models are routinely used in science, and the fact that you reject them out of hand just means that you're living in the 60's when you went to college.

You're free to reject the conclusions of nearly every expert in the field.  At this point, however, you're just starting to sound like another :tinfoil: who thinks he's got the inside track on what's really happening while all of the sheeple are falling for the "official story."


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18960374 - 10/10/13 04:53 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

he's not saying that he doesn't agree with what you're saying, he's asking you to provide an example of a reason why anyone should have cause for concern... or whether or not anyone can bring anything else to the table here other then an argument for how scientists "now believe climate change is caused by humans"; when that conclusion provides nothing. nothing, at least, but more questions.

those questions, by the way, which seemingly cannot be answered. that's what's annoying and stupid.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #18960389 - 10/10/13 04:56 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Experts, that is; people with graduate degrees in climate science and published research papers agree that manmade climate change exists, to the tune of 95%.

Thats about the same as doctors who agree smoking cigarettes cause cancer.



On the other hand, its probably just another global conspiracy perpetrated by the liberal education system, through the liberal science community, via the liberal media.

:FattyNoneck:


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: akira_akuma]
    #18960395 - 10/10/13 04:57 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I'm not concerned in the least about global warming.  It's undoubtedly caused by humans, but who cares?  Whatever is going to happen is inevitable.  These facts are not going to change:

1. We will burn every drop of oil that we can find and extract from the planet
2. We will burn every ton of coal that we can find and extract


Any discussion about what we "should" do is irrelevant simply because the above facts are not going to change.

As a result of the above, it really doesn't matter what the effects of global warming will be, since there's nothing we can do to avoid them.  Maybe some coastlines will change, but it's no skin off my dick since I won't be living at 20 ft MSL.


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