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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher
#18954982 - 10/09/13 03:40 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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http://zencomprehensible.com/confessions-of-a-fucked-up-zen-teacher/
I thought this was great, and really hit me at a good time in my life. Being "awakened" or "enlightened" doesn't let us escape from reality and never feel anymore pain. It's mostly about just being aware and awake to the pain fully and living with it. 
At least to me, that takes a whole lot of courage.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18955118 - 10/09/13 04:15 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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I think I'll skip the Zen for now.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 3,910
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18955158 - 10/09/13 04:22 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
r72rock said: http://zencomprehensible.com/confessions-of-a-fucked-up-zen-teacher/
I thought this was great, and really hit me at a good time in my life. Being "awakened" or "enlightened" doesn't let us escape from reality and never feel anymore pain. It's mostly about just being aware and awake to the pain fully and living with it. 
At least to me, that takes a whole lot of courage.
There ARE great people out there, in all walks of life. But conversely there are some star bellied sneetches. It is incumbent for the student to shop around and have only the most altruistic intention for truth and liberation.
-------------------- ...or something
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: eve69]
#18955186 - 10/09/13 04:29 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
eve69 said: There ARE great people out there, in all walks of life. But conversely there are some star bellied sneetches. It is incumbent for the student to shop around and have only the most altruistic intention for truth and liberation.
For sure, he wasn't denying that though. He was just saying, zen doesn't fix you as a person and doesn't solve life's problems.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18955349 - 10/09/13 04:57 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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But no religion solves life's problems.
-------------------- ...or something
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c0sm0nautt

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,303
Loc: The Astral Realm
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: eve69]
#18955367 - 10/09/13 05:01 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I think I'll skip the Zen for now. 
Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Quote:
eve69 said: But no religion solves life's problems.
Religion is such a loaded word with powerful subjective meaning. I wouldn't go as far to make a statement like this, for some people may be living a better more for fulling life through a "religion." I personally choose to not attach any labels to my own ideas of spirituality, but if someone does, and it works for them - what's the gripe? Nothing is that black and white.
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: eve69]
#18955517 - 10/09/13 05:31 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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All Life's Problems are Transitory in nature.
The body is is the vehicle that takes you through life. At the end of life is two possibilities.
A.Transmigration in the Reincarnational Cycles
B.Evolving extra-dimensional vessel that can take the Consciousness to Higher Dimensions.
You have to be Born Again is a reference to Righteous Attainment Ways that enable the individual to evolve in and into the Higher Dimensions.
Higher Dimensions means greater dimensional complexities of spaces. To exist in Higher Dimensional Complexities requires a Vessel that has Higher Dimensions.
Edited by Mr.Al (10/09/13 05:32 PM)
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: eve69]
#18955558 - 10/09/13 05:41 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
eve69 said: But no religion solves life's problems.
Maybe I misread something somewhere, but neither the author, nor I ever argued that point. We're in agreement. This article was saying just that.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: c0sm0nautt]
#18955573 - 10/09/13 05:45 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Icelander]
#18955627 - 10/09/13 05:56 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
Someone who doesn't avoid pain becomes strong.
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c0sm0nautt

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,303
Loc: The Astral Realm
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Icelander]
#18955688 - 10/09/13 06:05 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
We just need to find someone to face pain and report back. So far I've been pretty content being a big ol pussy.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mr.Al]
#18955707 - 10/09/13 06:07 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Al said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
Someone who doesn't avoid pain becomes strong.
or dead
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Icelander]
#18955727 - 10/09/13 06:11 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
Someone who doesn't avoid pain becomes strong.
or dead
That is True.
Pain is an indication of something wrong physiologically sure, ignoring that can lead to dying.
Suffering does make a person stronger, it just isn't good psychologically.
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MeinDarkEye



Registered: 12/01/12
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mr.Al]
#18955906 - 10/09/13 06:50 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Al said:
Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
Someone who doesn't avoid pain becomes strong.
or dead
That is True.
Pain is an indication of something wrong physiologically sure, ignoring that can lead to dying.
Suffering does make a person stronger, it just isn't good psychologically.
Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.
Life isn't a problem to be solved, but a reality to experience.
--------------------
Why can't you be normal! What you mean to say is, Average. What's the pride in country if it robs a man of will? What's the pride in manhood if a man will rape and kill? What's the pride in killing if the dead will rise again? Ah, but there's a pride in knowing the enemies within.
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: MeinDarkEye]
#18956050 - 10/09/13 07:24 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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To not suffer over your suffering does not avoid the suffering.
Siddhartha said that there is not a Self that Suffers because Siddhartha specifically does not have Self.
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MeinDarkEye



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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mr.Al]
#18956078 - 10/09/13 07:32 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Al said: To not suffer over your suffering does not avoid the suffering.
Siddhartha said that there is not a Self that Suffers because Siddhartha specifically does not have Self.
Desire not to desire is still desire. Distinctions are meaningless.
--------------------
Why can't you be normal! What you mean to say is, Average. What's the pride in country if it robs a man of will? What's the pride in manhood if a man will rape and kill? What's the pride in killing if the dead will rise again? Ah, but there's a pride in knowing the enemies within.
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: MeinDarkEye]
#18956089 - 10/09/13 07:35 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Simply focus Awareness without Mind Intent. Words may be dualistic but the Mind can see beyond.
Distinctions are important. Truth is seen truly with distinct clarity.
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MeinDarkEye



Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 50
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mr.Al]
#18956198 - 10/09/13 07:58 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Al said: Simply focus Awareness without Mind Intent. Words may be dualistic but the Mind can see beyond.
Distinctions are important. Truth is seen truly with distinct clarity.
What is the difference between up or down.
--------------------
Why can't you be normal! What you mean to say is, Average. What's the pride in country if it robs a man of will? What's the pride in manhood if a man will rape and kill? What's the pride in killing if the dead will rise again? Ah, but there's a pride in knowing the enemies within.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: MeinDarkEye]
#18956213 - 10/09/13 08:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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I'm glad Mr. Al found a new friend.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: c0sm0nautt]
#18956221 - 10/09/13 08:03 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
c0sm0nautt said: We just need to find someone to face pain and report back. So far I've been pretty content being a big ol pussy.
Yeah, same here. Life can be tough. It's hard to stand bare and naked in front of the awesomeness of the cosmos and life. I'm trying to work up some muscle and face the pain. We'll see how that goes.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: MeinDarkEye]
#18956228 - 10/09/13 08:04 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
MeinDarkEye said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said: Simply focus Awareness without Mind Intent. Words may be dualistic but the Mind can see beyond.
Distinctions are important. Truth is seen truly with distinct clarity.
What is the difference between up or down.
Go ask the man doing Yogic headstands while pissing in the bathroom stall sideways-clumsy.
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MeinDarkEye



Registered: 12/01/12
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Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mr.Al]
#18956299 - 10/09/13 08:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Al said:
Quote:
MeinDarkEye said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said: Simply focus Awareness without Mind Intent. Words may be dualistic but the Mind can see beyond.
Distinctions are important. Truth is seen truly with distinct clarity.
What is the difference between up or down.
Go ask the man doing Yogic headstands while pissing in the bathroom stall sideways-clumsy.
Why ask when I can enjoy a good laugh. And probably get pissed on but c'est la vie
--------------------
Why can't you be normal! What you mean to say is, Average. What's the pride in country if it robs a man of will? What's the pride in manhood if a man will rape and kill? What's the pride in killing if the dead will rise again? Ah, but there's a pride in knowing the enemies within.
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: MeinDarkEye]
#18956321 - 10/09/13 08:25 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
MeinDarkEye said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said:
Quote:
MeinDarkEye said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said: Simply focus Awareness without Mind Intent. Words may be dualistic but the Mind can see beyond.
Distinctions are important. Truth is seen truly with distinct clarity.
What is the difference between up or down.
Go ask the man doing Yogic headstands while pissing in the bathroom stall sideways-clumsy.
Why ask when I can enjoy a good laugh. And probably get pissed on but c'est la vie 
His work is everywhere, but only very few know the Yogi.
He honed his work so well that many argue as to whether there were hands involved in the first place.
What is hand.
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MeinDarkEye



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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mr.Al]
#18956402 - 10/09/13 08:46 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Lol I don't know. Still think would be interesting to get pissed on by Yogi.
--------------------
Why can't you be normal! What you mean to say is, Average. What's the pride in country if it robs a man of will? What's the pride in manhood if a man will rape and kill? What's the pride in killing if the dead will rise again? Ah, but there's a pride in knowing the enemies within.
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Deviate
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18956586 - 10/09/13 09:18 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
r72rock said: http://zencomprehensible.com/confessions-of-a-fucked-up-zen-teacher/
I thought this was great, and really hit me at a good time in my life. Being "awakened" or "enlightened" doesn't let us escape from reality and never feel anymore pain. It's mostly about just being aware and awake to the pain fully and living with it. 
At least to me, that takes a whole lot of courage.
What do you think enlightenment or awakening (in the fullest sense) really is?
Its not just being a regular guy who has vices and addictions but practices some meditation on the side and has been trained as a zen teacher.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that if you are not perfect it means you can't be a zen teacher, on the contrary it would be unrealistic to expect zen teachers to all be perfect. But I have two issues here. The first is the one I already mentioned, what is enlightenment? if itt's just being aware and awake to pain and fully living with it, then it's certainly not an end to suffering. But on that same webiste, the author says that it is an end to suffering "I don’t know why anyone would expect to learn how to end suffering for free" and he says that it is "finding self acceptance and peace." My second issue is
" I wouldn’t say I’m honest, or authentic or enlightened. Bullshit, I call myself these things all the time."
Am I misunderstanding or is he is saying that he lies to his students and tells them he is enlightened when according to his own definition of enlightened, he isn't?
I guess I dont understand the point of this article.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Posts: 95,368
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Deviate]
#18956597 - 10/09/13 09:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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He reminds me of most "professionals".
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Deviate]
#18957119 - 10/09/13 11:00 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said: What do you think enlightenment or awakening (in the fullest sense) really is?
I don't really know what enlightenment is, which is why I tend to stay away from the word today. I believe that's why he stays away from the word in the article.
While he does use it, he doesn't define it. He only uses it in ways to poke fun at the idea of enlightenment and the western romantic idea of it. He's purposely staying away from defining the word because because he doesn't really believe in it. I've never read anything else by this dude either, just this article.
Quote:
The first is the one I already mentioned, what is enlightenment? if itt's just being aware and awake to pain and fully living with it, then it's certainly not an end to suffering. But on that same webiste, the author says that it is an end to suffering "I don’t know why anyone would expect to learn how to end suffering for free" and he says that it is "finding self acceptance and peace."
Being aware of pain and fully living with it isn't the same as suffering (dukkha) according to Zen. It's argued that while you'll always feel the pain of life, it's optional whether you create more pain through one's delusions. Hence the end of suffering. It'd be the same as self acceptance and peace. That's what his post was about. He was at peace about being human and being who he was, and he accepted it. That's accepting that one's subject to pain. That's accepting that one isn't perfect.
Quote:
" I wouldn’t say I’m honest, or authentic or enlightened. Bullshit, I call myself these things all the time."
Am I misunderstanding or is he is saying that he lies to his students and tells them he is enlightened when according to his own definition of enlightened, he isn't?
I guess I dont understand the point of this article.
From his tone, I gathered he was just poking fun at himself. He was just talking about how much of the bullshit he sees in himself and how much he's aware of it as well.
The point of his article, that he stated, was to say that there's nothing special about being a Zen Teacher. He's just a human who happens to be an ordained Zen Priest.
What I took away from it, was that no matter what happens or what one tries to do in life, there's no escape from life. Life kinda just sucks and it's hard to deal with, but that doesn't mean we still can't try our best to be a better person each day.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Deviate]
#18957843 - 10/10/13 03:35 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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I listened to some of his talks and I actually like him a great deal. I just needed to understand more about who he was and his teaching.
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Deviate]
#18961075 - 10/10/13 07:24 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Glad you liked it! I actually just listened to one of his talks where he talked about the essence of what Zen is. Cool stuff.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18961289 - 10/10/13 08:22 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Is one living Zen, or Life. If they live Zen are they also living Life. If one lives Life are they also living Zen?
Do you pay much to live Zen in Life? How much? How much is Life? Why did nobody make one pay for Life when Zen costs so much?
Maybe it's better not to live without zen maybe zen without life makes more sense.
Or maybe if one is fucked up with zen one can pay less and not be fucked up with zen and yet still live!!!
I think I've got it! Herpes.
But I lived and I lived Zen. But that's a whole other story.
The Zend.
-------------------- ...or something
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lolwut
bad motherfucker


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18961543 - 10/10/13 09:25 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
r72rock said: http://zencomprehensible.com/confessions-of-a-fucked-up-zen-teacher/
I thought this was great, and really hit me at a good time in my life. Being "awakened" or "enlightened" doesn't let us escape from reality and never feel anymore pain. It's mostly about just being aware and awake to the pain fully and living with it. 
At least to me, that takes a whole lot of courage.
Wrong
-------------------- Please allow me to introduce myself, I'm a man of wealth, and taste...
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Jaegar
Formless One



Registered: 05/04/09
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: lolwut]
#18962608 - 10/11/13 04:47 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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O woe is you who has probably not experienced real pain or discomfort.
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Jaegar
Formless One



Registered: 05/04/09
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Jaegar]
#18962613 - 10/11/13 04:49 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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If any of you were serious of your noble intents go to Africa spending all your money and skills on contributing to its infrastructure.
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GoldenEye
...



Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 4,340
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18962631 - 10/11/13 05:04 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
r72rock said: http://zencomprehensible.com/confessions-of-a-fucked-up-zen-teacher/
I thought this was great, and really hit me at a good time in my life. Being "awakened" or "enlightened" doesn't let us escape from reality and never feel anymore pain. It's mostly about just being aware and awake to the pain fully and living with it. 
At least to me, that takes a whole lot of courage.
As Terence the Roman playwright said: "Nothing human is alien to me."
Humans will be humans and we will all have similar feelings/sins/shortcomings/self deceit and so forth.
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Jaegar
Formless One



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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: GoldenEye]
#18963585 - 10/11/13 11:45 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Fuk I feel sick.
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thatmonk
Monk!

Registered: 09/27/13
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: c0sm0nautt]
#18966592 - 10/12/13 12:44 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
c0sm0nautt said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
We just need to find someone to face pain and report back. So far I've been pretty content being a big ol pussy.
I've experienced HIV for 20 years, ruptured disks in my back, sciatica, trigeminal neuralgia (permanent nerve pain in the face), neuropathy in my hands and feet, Hepatitis B, the death of my partner from liver failure, PTSD, emotionally and psychologically abused as a kid by my father, depression, growing up gay and all the abuse that goes with it, six years on opiates to supposedly treat the nerve pain in my face, the sheer horror of tapering off and recovering which took three years and I still have restless leg sometimes... and I am sure I am missing a few.
I can report that when you discover that suffering comes from pushing away your experience and grasping after what you no longer experience or posses, you suffer. Add to that all the stories our mind generates about our pain and our situation, we create even more suffering for ourselves. Lost in a mental stew of concepts and projections about our pain, we wander in endless misery.
I have spent 17 years in training and experienced at times what feels like hell. All caused my by own resistance. Seeing more and more deeply into this does not stop the physical pain, but the suffering vanishes like darkness in the sun. Sure, I don't feel good physically and have lost an awful lot, but pain really is just innocent sensation.
But what I have "gained" though all the pain is priceless. I no longer fear pain and suffering is my teacher. To sum up: it is the shittiest experiences that have turned into the greatest blessings and teachers. I am very fortunate! I also have a lot more work to do...
As to the Zen Priest writing this article, he is doing really well. It takes a lot of balls to see our fucked-up-ness. But seeing it openly is a full HALF the Path right there. Now we know what to work on. Before we believed we were fine, or worse, it was someone or something "out there" who was responsible for our problems. And for the sucker who thinks their problems come from the outside... well you're pretty much SOL 'till the universe beats that tendency out of you; and the universe has plenty of time to accomplish this!
I am pretty good at a number of things, and my friends ask me how I got so good at whatever it is I am currently doing well. My usual answer is crafted from very carefully chosen words: "From fucking up a lot!" Fuckupery is the path to awakening. Make enough mistakes and there you are... awake.
-------------------- ...because life is fleeting.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: thatmonk]
#18966710 - 10/12/13 01:36 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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dood! 
My brother in law imo is the opposite example that imo shows how it's different for everyone.
He's basically followed the party line his whole life. Conservative Marine redneck pain in the ass. Now he is dying of cancer and in some amount of pain. I was expecting him to freak and break down out but he doesn't seem to be doing it. He just keeps believing that everythings going to fix itself and the docs will come up with a last minute miracle. Even though they keep fucking up the treatments and making things worse.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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c0sm0nautt

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,303
Loc: The Astral Realm
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: thatmonk]
#18970426 - 10/12/13 11:18 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
thatmonk said:
Quote:
c0sm0nautt said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Facing pain is often the only way to go through it.
Maybe, maybe not. Maybe facing pain is the best way to be miserable. 
We just need to find someone to face pain and report back. So far I've been pretty content being a big ol pussy.
I've experienced HIV for 20 years, ruptured disks in my back, sciatica, trigeminal neuralgia (permanent nerve pain in the face), neuropathy in my hands and feet, Hepatitis B, the death of my partner from liver failure, PTSD, emotionally and psychologically abused as a kid by my father, depression, growing up gay and all the abuse that goes with it, six years on opiates to supposedly treat the nerve pain in my face, the sheer horror of tapering off and recovering which took three years and I still have restless leg sometimes... and I am sure I am missing a few.
I can report that when you discover that suffering comes from pushing away your experience and grasping after what you no longer experience or posses, you suffer. Add to that all the stories our mind generates about our pain and our situation, we create even more suffering for ourselves. Lost in a mental stew of concepts and projections about our pain, we wander in endless misery.
I have spent 17 years in training and experienced at times what feels like hell. All caused my by own resistance. Seeing more and more deeply into this does not stop the physical pain, but the suffering vanishes like darkness in the sun. Sure, I don't feel good physically and have lost an awful lot, but pain really is just innocent sensation.
But what I have "gained" though all the pain is priceless. I no longer fear pain and suffering is my teacher. To sum up: it is the shittiest experiences that have turned into the greatest blessings and teachers. I am very fortunate! I also have a lot more work to do...
As to the Zen Priest writing this article, he is doing really well. It takes a lot of balls to see our fucked-up-ness. But seeing it openly is a full HALF the Path right there. Now we know what to work on. Before we believed we were fine, or worse, it was someone or something "out there" who was responsible for our problems. And for the sucker who thinks their problems come from the outside... well you're pretty much SOL 'till the universe beats that tendency out of you; and the universe has plenty of time to accomplish this!
I am pretty good at a number of things, and my friends ask me how I got so good at whatever it is I am currently doing well. My usual answer is crafted from very carefully chosen words: "From fucking up a lot!" Fuckupery is the path to awakening. Make enough mistakes and there you are... awake.
Hell yea man. I'm learning this as well. I used to resist a lot more and the resistance in itself is what caused me most of my suffering.
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GoldenEye
...



Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 4,340
Loc: Amsterdam
Last seen: 6 months, 19 days
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: thatmonk]
#18972791 - 10/13/13 04:07 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
thatmonk said:
I've experienced HIV for 20 years, ruptured disks in my back, sciatica, trigeminal neuralgia (permanent nerve pain in the face), neuropathy in my hands and feet, Hepatitis B, the death of my partner from liver failure, PTSD, emotionally and psychologically abused as a kid by my father, depression, growing up gay and all the abuse that goes with it, six years on opiates to supposedly treat the nerve pain in my face, the sheer horror of tapering off and recovering which took three years and I still have restless leg sometimes... and I am sure I am missing a few.
I can report that when you discover that suffering comes from pushing away your experience and grasping after what you no longer experience or posses, you suffer. Add to that all the stories our mind generates about our pain and our situation, we create even more suffering for ourselves. Lost in a mental stew of concepts and projections about our pain, we wander in endless misery.
I have spent 17 years in training and experienced at times what feels like hell. All caused my by own resistance. Seeing more and more deeply into this does not stop the physical pain, but the suffering vanishes like darkness in the sun. Sure, I don't feel good physically and have lost an awful lot, but pain really is just innocent sensation.
But what I have "gained" though all the pain is priceless. I no longer fear pain and suffering is my teacher. To sum up: it is the shittiest experiences that have turned into the greatest blessings and teachers. I am very fortunate! I also have a lot more work to do...
As to the Zen Priest writing this article, he is doing really well. It takes a lot of balls to see our fucked-up-ness. But seeing it openly is a full HALF the Path right there. Now we know what to work on. Before we believed we were fine, or worse, it was someone or something "out there" who was responsible for our problems. And for the sucker who thinks their problems come from the outside... well you're pretty much SOL 'till the universe beats that tendency out of you; and the universe has plenty of time to accomplish this!
I am pretty good at a number of things, and my friends ask me how I got so good at whatever it is I am currently doing well. My usual answer is crafted from very carefully chosen words: "From fucking up a lot!" Fuckupery is the path to awakening. Make enough mistakes and there you are... awake.
Aho!
Edited by GoldenEye (10/13/13 04:07 PM)
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r72rock
Maybe so. Maybe not.




Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 1,327
Loc: Chicago
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: thatmonk]
#18972860 - 10/13/13 04:24 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
thatmonk said: I've experienced HIV for 20 years, ruptured disks in my back, sciatica, trigeminal neuralgia (permanent nerve pain in the face), neuropathy in my hands and feet, Hepatitis B, the death of my partner from liver failure, PTSD, emotionally and psychologically abused as a kid by my father, depression, growing up gay and all the abuse that goes with it, six years on opiates to supposedly treat the nerve pain in my face, the sheer horror of tapering off and recovering which took three years and I still have restless leg sometimes... and I am sure I am missing a few.
I can report that when you discover that suffering comes from pushing away your experience and grasping after what you no longer experience or posses, you suffer. Add to that all the stories our mind generates about our pain and our situation, we create even more suffering for ourselves. Lost in a mental stew of concepts and projections about our pain, we wander in endless misery.
I have spent 17 years in training and experienced at times what feels like hell. All caused my by own resistance. Seeing more and more deeply into this does not stop the physical pain, but the suffering vanishes like darkness in the sun. Sure, I don't feel good physically and have lost an awful lot, but pain really is just innocent sensation.
But what I have "gained" though all the pain is priceless. I no longer fear pain and suffering is my teacher. To sum up: it is the shittiest experiences that have turned into the greatest blessings and teachers. I am very fortunate! I also have a lot more work to do...
As to the Zen Priest writing this article, he is doing really well. It takes a lot of balls to see our fucked-up-ness. But seeing it openly is a full HALF the Path right there. Now we know what to work on. Before we believed we were fine, or worse, it was someone or something "out there" who was responsible for our problems. And for the sucker who thinks their problems come from the outside... well you're pretty much SOL 'till the universe beats that tendency out of you; and the universe has plenty of time to accomplish this!
I am pretty good at a number of things, and my friends ask me how I got so good at whatever it is I am currently doing well. My usual answer is crafted from very carefully chosen words: "From fucking up a lot!" Fuckupery is the path to awakening. Make enough mistakes and there you are... awake.
Thanks for sharing. That was a good read. Things like this inspire me to try my best.
-------------------- Current favorite candy: Peanut Butter Kisses
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: r72rock]
#18972972 - 10/13/13 04:49 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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And it just goes to show that we are all pretty much equals in this show.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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c0sm0nautt

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,303
Loc: The Astral Realm
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Icelander]
#18976107 - 10/14/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: And it just goes to show that we are all pretty much equals in this show. 
Equals, for sure. But that doesn't stop some people from kicking and screaming the whole ride.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: c0sm0nautt]
#18976252 - 10/14/13 11:49 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Or some playing the guru. (for fun and profit)
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Icelander]
#18985601 - 10/16/13 10:56 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Or some playing the guru. (for fun and profit)
That is an excellent example of psychological projection.
What motivates one individual is not the same for another.
Some Beings are qualified to teach Cultivation Practice. Most are not qualified because they do not have a specific valid Way and they have not existed long enough to have a Knowledge Base of Enlightenment to draw upon.
Very specific Beings are qualified to teach Enlightenment.
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crkhd
☾☼☽

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 2,401
Loc: A human sphere enfolding ...
Last seen: 8 months, 8 days
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: MeinDarkEye]
#18987192 - 10/16/13 05:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
MeinDarkEye said:
Quote:
Mr.Al said: Simply focus Awareness without Mind Intent. Words may be dualistic but the Mind can see beyond.
Distinctions are important. Truth is seen truly with distinct clarity.
What is the difference between up or down.
Across.
-------------------- "Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern." "THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker "If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific
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Mahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 117
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: eve69]
#18992573 - 10/17/13 07:31 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
eve69 said: There ARE great people out there, in all walks of life. But conversely there are some star bellied sneetches. It is incumbent for the student to shop around and have only the most altruistic intention for truth and liberation.
Quote:
eve69 said: But no religion solves life's problems.
These are excellent points.
I read once that the first samadhi is only the beginning, and that hints at a distinction that isn't emphasized enough: self realization isn't the same as an end to suffering. They're related, because the things that help lead to self realization - meditation, selflessness, ethical conduct, avoiding attachment - also diminish suffering, but self realization isn't a cure-all for life's problems.
-------------------- Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times, Come, yet again, come, come
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mahananda]
#18992842 - 10/17/13 08:15 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Opium is the cure.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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crkhd
☾☼☽

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 2,401
Loc: A human sphere enfolding ...
Last seen: 8 months, 8 days
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mahananda]
#18999734 - 10/19/13 01:15 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mahananda said:
Quote:
eve69 said: There ARE great people out there, in all walks of life. But conversely there are some star bellied sneetches. It is incumbent for the student to shop around and have only the most altruistic intention for truth and liberation.
Quote:
eve69 said: But no religion solves life's problems.
These are excellent points.
I read once that the first samadhi is only the beginning, and that hints at a distinction that isn't emphasized enough: self realization isn't the same as an end to suffering. They're related, because the things that help lead to self realization - meditation, selflessness, ethical conduct, avoiding attachment - also diminish suffering, but self realization isn't a cure-all for life's problems.
I can confirm, I am Nirvikalpa
-------------------- "Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern." "THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker "If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific
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Mahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 117
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: crkhd]
#19000244 - 10/19/13 03:38 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
crkhd said: I can confirm, I am Nirvikalpa
The Yoga Sutras do contain an elaborate taxonomy of samahdi, and since they also take the position that failure of discrimination is the root of suffering, a higher samadhi should in theory involve the absorption of purusha in purusha, a state free of suffering. I've never met or read of a living guru or student, however, who was utterly free of life's concerns or who did not, in effect, come back from the bliss of samadhi to the mundane particulars of daily living, with their disappointments, hurts, illnesses, losses and so on. Many of those whose insights and long practice have led them to a teaching path have also fallen prey to the difficulties of student teacher relationships, overstepping the bounds in ways harmful to both student and teacher. I personally do not believe that in all of these cases the teacher was/is simply a charlatan, though certainly there are many of those around, just that in many (and maybe all) instances having a genuine religious experience, while providing insight that can be profound, wipes away the difficulties and limitations of being human.
-------------------- Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times, Come, yet again, come, come
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deff
just love everyone



Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 9,406
Loc: clarity
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mahananda]
#19000293 - 10/19/13 03:48 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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the way i heard the samadhis described was along the lines that initially one goes through a series of increasingly profound absorptions until nirvikalpa samadhi is reached. then one engages in entering this absorption again and again, though while in nirvikalpa samadhi one cannot engage in the world. after having entered and exited this peak samadhi many many times, one eventually attains sahaja samadhi - a state where 'entering' and 'exiting' samadhi have both been transcended and one is in a permanent state of absorption while still able to maintain worldly engagement. the analogy given was that nirvikalpa samadhi was like being on the top floor of a building (the highest samadhi) whereas sahaja samadhi was like being on all floors of the building simultaneously, and thus one is able to engage in the world while also being in samadhi.
i'm not sure if this is accurate, but it's what i remember reading
--------------------
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Mahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: deff]
#19000405 - 10/19/13 04:17 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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The term from the Sutras is asamprajnata samadhi, a state that would in theory remove the latent causes of karma and bring complete liberation. But while I think that samadhi/self realization is more easily within reach than most people imagine (Crowley once said, reversing the Biblical phrasing, that few are called but of those few many are chosen, and I personally think he had a point), I've never met or read about a teacher or practitioner within living memory who plausibly was realized to that degree (Ramana Maharshi might have come closest, but I've read more of his teaching than of his biography), and I'm disinclined to believe anyone can be.
-------------------- Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times, Come, yet again, come, come
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deff
just love everyone



Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 9,406
Loc: clarity
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mahananda]
#19000492 - 10/19/13 04:39 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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i think realized masters can act out in the world while inwardly being totally liberated at all times. it's a matter of inner mechanics rather than external conditions that allow this. i'm currently re-reading Yogananda's Autobiography of a Yogi and it seems from the descriptions of the saints included in it that many were capable of this feat, such as Lahiri Mahasaya and Sri Yukteswar as two examples. there's also many accounts from buddhist sources that also seem to indicate this. though most masters outwardly don't directly indicate this, possibly to set an example of humility. but i don't see why it should be impossible to maintain spiritual/mental freedom at all times
--------------------
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Mahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 117
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: deff]
#19000588 - 10/19/13 05:06 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Deff, I admire your perspective and I sincerely hope you're right. Unfortunately, perhaps, for me, every personal experience I've had, with gurus and students both, has (while many of them were fine people) led me away from being able to hold that optimistic perspective (in more than one case with a heavy dose of disillusionment); the readings I've done have generally also have led me to feel the humanity of those put forward as saints, the more so the more detailed and impartial the biographical information, and I tend to discount as hagiography many stories that claim a fuller liberation and/or extraordinary events, particularly when the figures involved aren't within living memory. The kernel of hope that I hold, and firmly believe, is that self realization can occur despite all of our foibles and limitations. To me it is an encouraging thought.
That's just me, though, Deff, and I hope that your own experiences will confirm your view rather than undermine it. Spiritual friendship and spiritual consolation, and the hope of these, are wonderful things, the more so if they are undiluted by nagging doubts and harmful experiences.
-------------------- Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times, Come, yet again, come, come
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Sse
Saṃsāra

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Posts: 2,769
Loc: Interdependent Co-arising
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: deff]
#19000672 - 10/19/13 05:27 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Confucius said, "At thirty, I was able to stand on my own feet. At forty, I had no more doubts. At fifty, I knew the mandate of Earth and Sky. At sixty, I could do what I wanted without going against the path."
"The last of the ten ox herding pictures in the Zen tradition is called "Entering the Marketplace with Open Hands." You are free to come and go as you please. This is the action of non-action. Suffering no longer arises. This stage is not something you can imitate. You have to reach this stage of realization within yourself."
The Heart of the Buddha's Teaching by Thich Nhat Hanh
-------------------- "Springs of water welling from the fire" "Life may seem to flee in a moment, but when the mind is freed of the veil of ignorance, and illusion that comes between the mind and the truth, life and death are only opposite sides of the same coin - "water welling from the fire."
"Within us, we carry the world of no-birth and no-death. But we never touch it, because we live only with our notions." -Thich Nhat Hanh instant "Experience always goes beyond ideas"
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Deviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mahananda]
#19000952 - 10/19/13 06:46 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mahananda said:
Quote:
eve69 said: There ARE great people out there, in all walks of life. But conversely there are some star bellied sneetches. It is incumbent for the student to shop around and have only the most altruistic intention for truth and liberation.
Quote:
eve69 said: But no religion solves life's problems.
These are excellent points.
I read once that the first samadhi is only the beginning, and that hints at a distinction that isn't emphasized enough: self realization isn't the same as an end to suffering. They're related, because the things that help lead to self realization - meditation, selflessness, ethical conduct, avoiding attachment - also diminish suffering, but self realization isn't a cure-all for life's problems.
Yes it is a cure for all life's problems, according to Ramana Maharshi. The Self-realized man has stopped worrying about the world, as Jesus put it "I have conquered the world". The world still exists for him and in his body-mind complex he still feels pain and sorrow, in a far deeper way than we do in fact. however, as hard as it is for us to understand, these things do not bother him the way they bother us. He doesn't see the pain as "his" pain or as a "problem" the way we do, rather for him, the pain of life exists inside of an ocean of eternal bliss and not only that, it has a purpose for being there.
I am not fully realized yet, but I have gone far enough that I can testify to these things being very likely true. Not that I am trying to convince anyone, but should anyone desire to know, then dedicate your own life to self-realization.
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Deviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Mahananda]
#19000956 - 10/19/13 06:47 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mahananda said: The term from the Sutras is asamprajnata samadhi, a state that would in theory remove the latent causes of karma and bring complete liberation. But while I think that samadhi/self realization is more easily within reach than most people imagine (Crowley once said, reversing the Biblical phrasing, that few are called but of those few many are chosen, and I personally think he had a point), I've never met or read about a teacher or practitioner within living memory who plausibly was realized to that degree (Ramana Maharshi might have come closest, but I've read more of his teaching than of his biography), and I'm disinclined to believe anyone can be.
Why do you think Ramana Maharshi wasn't liberated?
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



Registered: 04/30/03
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Sse]
#19001006 - 10/19/13 06:59 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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There are no sidhis in this present world, there are works. There is perfection, but there are no sidhis. Perfection is an accretion of wisdom. Sidhis are an aberration. The greater the depth of Samadhi there yet more everything remains the same. There is no discernible separation between inner and outer. The dividing line ever trembles like a leaf. Rest and motion. Time like a tide. Time is a circle, age is a spiral, like a rock thrown down a well.
-------------------- ...or something
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Mahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 117
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: Deviate]
#19001063 - 10/19/13 07:17 PM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said: Yes it is a cure for all life's problems, according to Ramana Maharshi. The Self-realized man has stopped worrying about the world, as Jesus put it "I have conquered the world". The world still exists for him and in his body-mind complex he still feels pain and sorrow, in a far deeper way than we do in fact.
We are having a definitional difference of opinion: you agree that a realized person is not liberated fully from the experience of pain and sorrow, but posit such a person's relationship to that pain and sorrow as having "cure[d] . . . all of life's problems". I agree that spiritual life in general, and the experience of self realization in particular, bring about a change in perspective, but see someone who still is suffering as not being free from karma and samskaras in quite the way the scriptures would suggest. In short, I look at a similar state as you do, but don't reach the same conclusion about whether it constitutes being free from all of life's problems. To take a current example, while I would conclude that Baba Hari Dass has almost certainly had deep experiences of samadhi, my guess is that he has good days and bad ones, disappointments, etc. You could react by saying, "well, assuming Mahananda, that you're correct, he's just not fully realized." But I would say that in my experience I haven't encountered anyone who I'm convinced is any more so, at least in terms of a complete annihilation of karmas and samskaras.
Quote:
Deviate said: Why do you think Ramana Maharshi wasn't liberated?
I never said I concluded Ramana Maharshi wasn't liberated, only that I am not convinced anyone is, to reach back to the expression that started this discussion, freed from all of life's problems by self realization. To continue the comparisons made above for Baba Hari Dass, I think it very likely that Ramana also had good days and bad ones, disappointments, etc., even though I would also say he almost certainly had a very deep realization (he is, in fact, one of the spiritual figures I most revere). (Nisargadatta Maharaj is another example - thought to be deeply realized, but also known for a quick temper.) Is is possible that, upon reading a detailed biography, I could conclude that he was indeed completely free from karma and samskaras, and the sorrows and trials of life? Sure. But I don't think it's likely.
-------------------- Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times, Come, yet again, come, come
Edited by Mahananda (10/19/13 07:28 PM)
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crkhd
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Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 2,401
Loc: A human sphere enfolding ...
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: eve69]
#19003358 - 10/20/13 10:56 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
eve69 said: There are no sidhis in this present world, there are works. There is perfection, but there are no sidhis. Perfection is an accretion of wisdom. Sidhis are an aberration. The greater the depth of Samadhi there yet more everything remains the same. There is no discernible separation between inner and outer. The dividing line ever trembles like a leaf. Rest and motion. Time like a tide. Time is a circle, age is a spiral, like a rock thrown down a well.
Fuaaaaaark 
Well, so far what I have learnt is thus;
There is a golden spiral of ageing
This is the Balance of Earth
Human's role is to uphold the balance, maintain the trust of the Supreme
As for the golden spiral,
Siddhis (aka whacking off) are not the same thing as Works A Siddhi takes a single human being. Works take a minimum of two at all times. Works get things done. Siddhis are for those who wish to prove things to themselves or perhaps use them in the process of getting Works done;
Anyway as stated earlier by Mahananda,
There is a special golden spiral within a golden spiral. The first Golden Spiral (Clear Light) rotates within the Second Golden Spiral (Earth), generating the Third Golden Spiral (Heaven)
This geometry is Real, Absolutely Real.
The proof is thus:
2 hemispheres to Earth 6 lunar cycles, new Year (Cooling) 6 lunar cycles, new Year (Warming)
We may subdivide: 4 lunar cycles, new Peak 4 x 3 lunar cycles, new Year
Let lunar cycle length be represented by L
A Divine Day = 1000 x 6x2 L = 1000 x 12 L = 1000 x 3x4 L = 1000 x I^2 x L
The interval cT is of utmost consideration herein where c * T defines the interval traced out by a light ray in a given time T.
For example you can measure your cosmic horizon. Take your precise age, multiply it by c. This is your dimensionless radius. Then according to triangle tesselation to sphere mapping/holographic information bound (3 planck areas per bit) we take information content of this sphere as (4 * pi * r ^2)/3 giving the equation
I = (4πc²t²)/3
This represents your prenatal Qi As regards post-natal qi, That is the motion of You, through the First Golden Spiral, the Second Golden Spiral, the Third Golden Spiral The seasons will always reach completion We dive into the Timeless Evolve It Jump back out Back into the Timeless, with a little twist Back out, with a megatwist Back in, I'm on a horse, Back out, Camel, Back in, Needle
Now, Where, Are, You?
The rest is a matter of geodesic curvature Some tips:
-------------------- "Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern." "THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker "If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific
Edited by crkhd (10/20/13 11:10 AM)
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crkhd
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Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 2,401
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: crkhd]
#19003462 - 10/20/13 11:27 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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www.ronnastar.com/component/content/article/392-qbinary-sequencing-exerciseq-transmitted-through-ronna-herman.html?type=raw&tmpl=component&print=1&page
Quote:
"Binary Sequencing Exercise" Transmitted Through Ronna Herman | Print | | Print |
Dearest friends, several years ago, Beloved Michael gave me the information about Binary Sequencing and other techniques that I was to include in my seminars. I have been teaching the process ever since along with a constant flow of new information that I have incorporated into my seminar teachings. A few months ago, Michael told me that it was now time to release the Binary Sequencing techmique to the masses. Since the Binary Sequencing information was distributed, via one of the monthly messages, I have heard from a great number of people wanting to know how to do the process.
Michael explained to me that those who were guided to attend our seminars were among the wayshowers who had agreed at a soul level, before incarnating in this lifetime, to initiate this and other processes at the appropriate time. Many of us, after doing the Binary Sequencing exercise, have been faithfully performing the Infinity Breath at least once a day, and I often do the exercise several times a day as it helps keep me centered and energizes me. I almost always do the twelve cycle Infinity Breath exercise at night and I also go into my personal pyramid of Light before I go to sleep to integrate the higher frequency infusions that I receive periodically. As a result of our unified efforts the Infinity Gateway is now open and accessible, along with the Prosperity Gateway, which is an integral part of the eighth-dimensional Infinity Gateway. Those of you who have diligently worked to open and access the Prosperity Gateway have played an major role in the process as well. As a result, it will be much easier for the masses to access this wondrous level of high frequency energy so that we all can begin to reap the rewards of universal abundance in all things. Claiming our Divine Birthright is an integral part of the ascension process. We have reached a critical point in our ascension process, and our heavenly friends are doing all they can to help us within the framework of universal law. As the world economy worsens and the chaos of change accelerates, it behooves us all to do our part in opening the flood gates of cosmic abundance. We offer this blessed gift to you, and we ask you to join us in assisting the Earth and humanity to move forward on this accelerated path of evolution with ease and grace. My eternal love and angel blessings, Ronna
BASIC INFINITY/STILL POINT MEDITATION
Take a deep breath and center your consciousness in your Solar Power Center (the thymus, heart and solar plexus area), which we will now refer to as your SPC. Envision, however you perceive, your SPC being filled with the Divine Light Particles of Creation. As you breathe deeply, feel the energy begin to build within your body and travel up your back/spinal column. This energy permeates the medulla oblongata where the spinal column and the lowest part of your brain are connected, which contains nerve centers that control breathing and circulation, and which also connects to the ascension chakra. The energy of Creator Light moves through the ascension chakra and out the back of your head in an arch about six inches above the top of your head as it sweeps down before your face and enters the SPC again. It continues its journey down the back/spinal column and exits the body through the root chakra (the perineum) in an arch, flowing up the front of your body as it returns once again to the SPC within the body, gaining more energy, Light and power with each breath.
Continue the process of deep rhythmical breathing as you visualize this INFINITY sign of Light/Power arching further and further above your head and deeper down into the Earth, returning to your SPC with each rhythmic breath cycle. Continue the process as long as is comfortable, knowing that as you incorporate more of the precious Adamantine Particles, it will magically accelerate the process of cleansing and clearing your physical vessel of any discordant energies and filling the vacancies with Creator Light substance. You will also be accessing more and more of the higher dimensional thought forms of new Creation, anchoring them in your physical vessel/reality and deep within the Earth as well. Your beloved Earth will greatly benefit from the process as you share these wondrous gifts of Creation with her and, in turn, she will strengthen and harmonize her connection with you as you go about your Father/Mother God's business of creating paradise on your home planet.
BINARY SEQUENCING
IN USING THE INFINITY/STILL POINT BREATHING PROCESS, WE ACTIVATE THE 4TH, 5TH, 6TH, 7TH,, INFINITY/ 8th GATEWAYS, AND THE 9TH DIMENSIONAL, ANGELIC GATEWAY, THEREBY CONNECTING TO THE MULTIPLE CHAKRA POINTS OF OUR ENTIRE ENTITY BEING OR DIVINE I AM PRESENCE. WE, AS LIGHT WARRIORS, ARE NO LONGER DIVIDING OR DIMINISHING OUR LIGHT AND, BY USING THE INFINITY BREATH, WE ARE ABLE TO IGNITE THE BINARY SEQUENCING SYSTEM OF COSMIC CREATION VIA THE STILL POINT OF OUR SOLAR POWER CENTER: THE THROAT , THYMUS, HEART AND SOLAR PLEXUS. BEGINNING WITH TWO AND DOUBLING TO 512, WE EXPAND LIGHT BY DOUBLING IT, OR BY BINARY SEQUENCING WHEREBY A NUMBER DOUBLES ITSELF: 2 - 4 - 8 - 16 - 32 - 64 - 128 - 256 - 512.
THE BENEFITS OF OPENING THE INFINITY GATEWAY AND USING THE "STILL POINT" MEDITATION ARE MANY: YOUR GALACTIC CHAKRAS ARE ALIGNED WITH YOUR PHYSICAL VESSEL, INCREASING THE FLOW OF PRANA WHICH ACTS TO REVITALIZE THE BODY, SPEEDS UP THE PROCESS OF BUILDING OUR BODIES OF LIGHT, CONNECTING TO OUR I AM PRESENCE. WE ALSO BUILD OUR PROTECTIVE COCOON OF LIGHT WHEREBY WE ARE FULLY PROTECTED FROM NEGATIVE INFLUENCES OF THE LOWER DIMENSIONS, AND WE EXIST AS OBSERVERS OF THE ONGOING DRAMA WITHIN THE THIRD/FOURTH DIMENSIONAL ENVIRONMENT. THUS, WE ARE EMPOWERED TO BE ON THIS EARTH, BUT NOT OF IT, AS WE INCREASE OUR LIGHT QUOTIENT IN ORDER TO PROJECT MORE AND MORE UNCONDITIONAL LOVE/LIGHT TO THE EARTH AND HUMANITY. IN DOING SO, WE REALLY DO JOIN THE RANKS OF THE BEINGS OF LIGHT IN THE HIGHER REALMS AND OUTSIDE THE TIME/SPACE CONTINUUM.
THE "STILL POINT" IS THE PAUSE BETWEEN THE OUT BREATH AND THE NEXT INBREATH WITH YOUR FOCUS ON THE SPC. THIS IS THE MOMENT OF PURE CREATION, A FINITE MOMENT WHEREBY WE ARE IN A PERFECT "GOD MOMENT." YOU MAY WANT TO PRACTICE THE STILL POINT INFINITY BREATH A FEW TIMES IN ORDER TO BECOME COMFORTABLE WITH THE PROCESS. TO EMPHASIZE THE STILL POINT MOMENT, YOU MAY WISH TO PULL IN YOUR STOMACH MUSCLES AND TAKE A SMALL"SNIFF." IN DOING SO, IT CLOSES THE CIRCUITRY OF THE INFINITY ENERGY WITHIN YOUR BODY AND SPREADS IT THROUGHOUT YOUR PHYSICAL VESSEL, WHICH IS MOST BENEFICIAL AND WILL ACCELERATE THE TRANSFORMATION PROCESS. MANY PEOPLE HAVE ASKED WHERE IN THE SOLAR POWER CENTER THE BREATH SHOULD ENTER ON THE INBREATH AND THE OUTBREATH. IT VARIES FROM PERSON TO PERSON. AS YOU PRACTICE, THE BREATH WILL AUTOMATICALLY ENTER AND EXIT AT THE APPROPRIATE PLACE. WITHIN YOUR SPC. DO NOT TRY TO FORCE IT, AND THE ENERGY WILL FIND THE APPROPRIATE PATHWAY. IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN THERE WAITING FOR US TO TAP INTO IT.
AT THE STILL POINT PAUSE BETWEEN EACH OUTBREATH AND THE INBREATH (YOU MAY WISH TO "SNIFF" AND PULL IN YOUR TUMMY MUSCLES TO EMPHASIS THE STILL POINT). AT THE STILL POINT OF EACH BREATH COUNT (ONE NUMBER WITH EACH BREATH): 2 - 4 - 8 - 16 - 32 - 64 - 128 - 256 - 512. HOLD FOR A SECOND OR TWO AFTER EACH NUMBER AND THEN CONTINUE THE INBREATH PROCESS UNTIL YOU HAVE REACHED THE NUMBER 512. YOU MAY WISH TO COMPLETE A FEW MORE INFINITY BREATHS BEFORE RETURNING TO YOUR NORMAL BREATHING. WITH THIS PROCESS, WE ARE ANCHORING THE 8TH DIMENSION INFINITY GATEWAY, AND THE 9TH DIMENSION WHERE OUR ANGELIC FAMILY RESIDES. THE REGULAR INFINITY BREATH SHOULD BECOME AN EVERY DAY PRACTICE (AT LEAST ONCE A DAY AND MORE IF POSSIBLE; HOWEVER, YOU ONLY NEED TO DO THE BINARY SEQUENCING EXERCISE ONE TIME).
THE "STILL POINT" OR "ZERO POINT" ENERGY IS THE SOURCE OF EVERYTHING IN THIS UNIVERSE. BY PRACTICING AND PERFECTING THE BREATH OF INFINITY AND THE STILL POINT MEDITATION, YOU ARE SAFELY ACCESSING THE BREATH OF GOD AND THE MOST POWERFUL ENERGY IN THE COSMOS.
-------------------- "Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern." "THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker "If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific
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Mahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 117
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: Confessions of a Fucked Up Zen Teacher [Re: crkhd]
#19003522 - 10/20/13 11:43 AM (10 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
crkhd said: Anyway as stated earlier by Mahananda,
Not sure whether you were intending to paste in a quote from one of my posts, but to clarify, the rather novel thoughts you included below that reference aren't mine. All I can take credit, or blame, for is the somewhat simpler notion that self realization is not identical to an end of suffering, or if you prefer, a solution to all of life's problems.
-------------------- Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times, Come, yet again, come, come
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