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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: dark3st]
    #18963577 - 10/11/13 11:43 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Nuclear fission alone can't replace fossil fuel.  Fusion could if they could get it to work, but we're probably decades away from a working reactor, and another decade or two before we can build them for commercial use.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18963590 - 10/11/13 11:46 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

solar/wind should be able to sluggishly bridge the gap between fossil fuels and fusion reactors.


Or we could just stop being pussies and build nuclear plants again.


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #18963594 - 10/11/13 11:47 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

What about cold fusion? Is that a possbility at all? Or has that been dubunked? It doesnt look like a hoax at all?


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Offlinedark3st
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: topdog82]
    #18963610 - 10/11/13 11:50 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

They also have to trust the people with the nuclear reactors as well.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18963687 - 10/11/13 12:07 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Oil will run out before coal and natural gas, so you will still have electricity for a good while.  What you wont have is fuel to power cars, trucks or planes.  That will have a huge impact.  Additionally, you won't have fuel to run farm machinery to produce food. 

So less food will be grown, and none of it can get to market.  Information is about the only thing that will be able to travel long distances, and only until the infrastructure starts to break down and there is no fuel for the trucks to get out to fix it.

If, by some miracle, electric vehicles become practical by that time, maybe you can hold on for a bit longer, but with that much more load on the electrical power generation, you're going to burn through the coal much, much faster.

On second thought, scratch what I said above.  There will be no vehicles to take the coal to the coal fired plants.  They'll shut down too.

Yep...you're fucked.




We can make oil from coal and we can run cars on gas.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18963699 - 10/11/13 12:09 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Nuclear fission alone can't replace fossil fuel.  Fusion could if they could get it to work, but we're probably decades away from a working reactor, and another decade or two before we can build them for commercial use.



Fission is problematic for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is that it is also finite.

We have a few decades to get fusion and I think we could do it if we got dedicated enough.  The problem is we are wasting billions of dollars on inadequate stopgaps and nor concentrating on what is the ONLY long range solution.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: topdog82]
    #18963709 - 10/11/13 12:11 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

topdog82 said:
What about cold fusion? Is that a possbility at all? Or has that been dubunked? It doesnt look like a hoax at all?



Total crap.  Fleishman and Pons are a disgrace.  I didn't even have to look up their names I remember it so well.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18963725 - 10/11/13 12:16 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

That's not going to be able to produce the quantities that would be needed.  You could make enough for certain critical needs, but it uses a lot of coal and it isn't a very efficient process.  It would just mean running out of coal far sooner than we would.

It could buy us a few decades though, if we're on the verge of fusion or some other energy source.

It would also require a huge infrastructure of coal liquefaction plants to produce even enough to fuel trucking and essential services.  These plants would be expensive to build and would become largely obsolete in a relatively short time.  That would make the price of the fuel very high.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18963731 - 10/11/13 12:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
We have a few decades to get fusion and I think we could do it if we got dedicated enough.  The problem is we are wasting billions of dollars on inadequate stopgaps and nor concentrating on what is the ONLY long range solution.



Fission reactors can't solve the problems alone, though.  In order for fission reactors to replace fossil fuels, we're going to need to develop an electrical storage system that is light and practical enough to give adequate range at a reasonable cost.  At this point, batteries are not enough for medium range cars, and they aren't even close to light enough for an electric passenger plane to be feasible.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18964489 - 10/11/13 03:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

A severe energy shortage would force much lighter vehicles. The current situation is that cars must be overbuilt in order for its occupants to stand any chance of surviving a collision with the much heavier vehicles they must share the road with. Otherwise there is no real need to transport a single 150-200 lb human in a vehicle weighing thousands of pounds. Cutting down weight would reduce the amount of energy needed to get up to speed (some of which gets wasted in braking even with regenerative systems) or to climb hills, and cutting down the size and surface area would reduce drag losses.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: psi]
    #18964584 - 10/11/13 03:42 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I'll keep driving an H1.  Screw the environment...I'll get my use out of it.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18964873 - 10/11/13 05:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Perhaps you will, but once fuel gets expensive enough fewer people will be able to afford to drive much in big heavy vehicles.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: psi]
    #18964878 - 10/11/13 05:04 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I'll just convert it to electric motors, anyway.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18964897 - 10/11/13 05:09 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

That's not as much fun. You should put in a big old steam engine and fuel it with old growth redwoods or baby pandas or something.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: Enlil]
    #18965372 - 10/11/13 07:19 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
We have a few decades to get fusion and I think we could do it if we got dedicated enough.  The problem is we are wasting billions of dollars on inadequate stopgaps and nor concentrating on what is the ONLY long range solution.



Fission reactors can't solve the problems alone, though.  In order for fission reactors to replace fossil fuels, we're going to need to develop an electrical storage system that is light and practical enough to give adequate range at a reasonable cost.  At this point, batteries are not enough for medium range cars, and they aren't even close to light enough for an electric passenger plane to be feasible.



I said fusion.  I already acknowledged that fission is problematic.


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InvisibleClockCode
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18965413 - 10/11/13 07:34 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

The two most miserable people in the site debating something they know nothing about, this was a great read.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: ClockCode]
    #18965476 - 10/11/13 07:49 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

ORLY?


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Global warming doesn't exist? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18973187 - 10/13/13 05:35 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
We have a few decades to get fusion and I think we could do it if we got dedicated enough.  The problem is we are wasting billions of dollars on inadequate stopgaps and nor concentrating on what is the ONLY long range solution.



Fission reactors can't solve the problems alone, though.  In order for fission reactors to replace fossil fuels, we're going to need to develop an electrical storage system that is light and practical enough to give adequate range at a reasonable cost.  At this point, batteries are not enough for medium range cars, and they aren't even close to light enough for an electric passenger plane to be feasible.



I said fusion.  I already acknowledged that fission is problematic.



Fusion or fission, the same problem exists.  Unless we find a way to store electricity, neither can replace fossil fuels to power cars, trains and planes.


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