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Offlinenicechrisman
Interdimensional space wizard
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Registered: 11/07/03
Posts: 33,241
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: Patlal] * 1
    #18912581 - 09/30/13 06:48 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Posted today by Rick Steves

"The last wealthy nation in the First World without some kind of national health care is about to get a watered down version of what other nations just assume is the mark of a successful and developed society. And the vested interests — big medicine, insurance companies, and the politicians they employ — are screaming like mad and spending a fortune to stop it. Ads and campaigns of confusion are not directed at my state, but at poorer and less educated states where affordable health care is needed most and people are easiest to frighten and manipulate. (In my state, libraries can direct people to information to understand the new law. In many states, librarians are actually forbidden to provide this service.)

It’s amazing to me that in our great nation, about a fifth of the citizens are unable to afford health insurance, need to go to the emergency room for routine medical needs, and are terrorized by the specter of one serious accident or sickness wiping out their family financially. And, just as amazing, half of our country thinks that’s OK and is fighting mad about the possibility of change. Even more perplexing, many of the people who think this is the best America can afford are the very people who need help the most.

Someone recently asked me, “As a businessman and an employer, what do you think of Obamacare?” My response was that, as a businessman, I don’t think of it at all. I employ 80 people. I imagine my health-care costs might go up a bit. But this is a community issue. My response to Obamacare is as an American who wants to be proud of my country. It is an embarrassment that so many Americans are brutalized by health-care costs. Europeans and Canadians — who spend far less per person on health care, like their care, and have options for rich people to get all the private VIP service they like — marvel at how so much of America is hell-bent on maintaining our status quo.

We’re living through a tsunami of desperate media and political action to help us avoid relatively modest progress in national health care. Think of the toll Presidents Clinton took back in the 1990s and Obama is taking today by standing up to the torrent of media and political flack. Think of the patrons and allegiances of the politicians who fight against affordable health care. Follow the money. What motivates the talking heads, the commercial news services, and the politicians who are working overtime to convince us this is a bad thing? They are captives of the industries (who advertise and donate) that will take a hit when poor and struggling Americans have access to affordable health care.

Those opposed to Obamacare have a powerful and well-funded voice. I believe it’s the slickest marketing initiative money can buy. Those who need the Affordable Care Act don’t have these special interests speaking out in their favor. Study the issue carefully. Ask yourself what motivates the loudest voices pulling out all the stops to shape your opinion: compassion or greed?"


--------------------
"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
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Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18912582 - 09/30/13 06:49 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
You think I don't know anything about the US.




You make it quite clear that you know far less about it than you think you do.




I've been slacking off lately. I'm at least a month behind with US politics. I've been busy.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #18912588 - 09/30/13 06:50 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Your link refers to a CNN poll. 

Today's CNN poll:
38% favor
57% oppose
4% don't give a fuck.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2013/images/09/30/rel10a.pdf


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisiblespock
journeyman
Registered: 08/26/03
Posts: 1,165
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18912589 - 09/30/13 06:50 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/09/16/usa-today-pew-poll-health-care-law-opposition/2817169/






That poll is the result of 1506 people responding weeks ago.
C'mon, Man.

Peace
Spock


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Offlinerew736
Your local stranger
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Registered: 12/17/12
Posts: 1,145
Loc: New York, United States Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: spock]
    #18912617 - 09/30/13 06:56 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

It is almost irrelevent at this point. The bill passed the House, and will either get shut down by the Senate or vetoed... Thus, the government WILL shutdown tommorrow...

3 or 4 Bills have already been shut down by the Senate and if by some miracle, it did pass, Obama said bluntly he would veto it...


--------------------
My trade list
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seekaytea said:
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Wiccan_Seeker said:
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"I want to know if they are active and magic or not. And if they are not active, can i pick them before they are active and then they will become active or do they have to grow till they activate?"


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Offlinerew736
Your local stranger
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Registered: 12/17/12
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: rew736]
    #18912630 - 09/30/13 06:59 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)



--------------------
My trade list
malicom said:
"Banana's emit radiation. In fact banannas are the standard in detecting solar radiation. The radiation read from a bananna tells scientists how active the sun was during the growing season. Make sure to steer clear of bananas too."
seekaytea said:
"I need to stop spending all my money on plants and take up a cheaper hobby, like heroin."
Wiccan_Seeker said:
"Your knowledge on male-on-male rape and willingness to engage in fantasy regarding the matter is commendable."
eminemvs.slimshady said:
"I want to know if they are active and magic or not. And if they are not active, can i pick them before they are active and then they will become active or do they have to grow till they activate?"


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Invisible4runner
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Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 15,406
Loc: State of Jefferson
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18912640 - 09/30/13 07:01 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
False.

The private sector made it expensive cause they are out for profit.




Bullshit. Medical care here is so expensive because of:
1. Lawsuits.
2. High cost of college.
3. Lawsuits.
4. The absurd regulatory hurdles that cause it to take years to get new meds/techniques approved.
5. Lawsuits.
6. Government subsidies. Subsidize something and people will want more of it.
7. Lawsuits.
8. Ridiculous wages paid to administrators.
9. Insurance costs to the companies that develop meds & machines.

Before you weigh in again with something so foolish you might look into the profit margins of insurance companies and hospitals.





Don't forget the high cost of insurance medical billing that doctors offices have.


Quote:

Have an unfortunate encounter with a parrot? ICD-10 has not one but nine codes to categorize parrot-related injuries (“W61.01” refers to being “bitten by a parrot” while W61.02 denotes being “struck by a parrot.”)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/post/parrot-injuries-and-other-tales-from-the-annals-of-medical-billing/2012/02/17/gIQAHUa0JR_blog.html





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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: rew736]
    #18912647 - 09/30/13 07:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

So does Congress.

So do a great many.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineKonyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18913033 - 09/30/13 08:21 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Only a druggie would complain about their health history being digitized.

Who the heck wants a surplus of babies running around? You'd have to be living with your parents still to be able to take care of one 30% of the time.


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Onlinekoods
Ribbit
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Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,050
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: Konyap]
    #18913050 - 09/30/13 08:30 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)



--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisibleCyclohexylamine
Turn on, Tune in, Drop out
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Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 14,327
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: koods]
    #18913086 - 09/30/13 08:40 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:





Yeah pretty much.


--------------------
Yes this is tymo - I just changed my name

Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to awake from that dream? How would you know the difference between that dream world and the real world?


There is NOTHING better than feeling that warm dissociative fuzz creeping up your body from IM K
Something abut that anaesthetic rush... :inlove:

Qualitative Research Chemical Effects and Experiences
The Wonderful World of Methoxetamine
The 3-Meo-PCP Chapters, Part One


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #18913090 - 09/30/13 08:41 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

anunnakian said:


And Mitt Romney.



No, it was the press.  There was nothing wrong with Mitt Romney.




Yeah, writing off half the country had no effect on people's opinions of him.


  He was saying he would never get the bum vote.  He was right.
Quote:



Nor did "corporations are people, my friend."




Who do you think owns corporations?  Zombies?  And the whole corporations as people is a legal fiction that exists solely so that they can be sued in court.  The ignorance on this matter astounds me.
Quote:

Nor did pandering to the religious right by distancing himself from gay rights and doing a complete 180 on healthcare.


  Homo rights were a total non factor and Obama was foresquare with Romney.  Until he "evolved".
Quote:

Nor did him being a billionaire.  And he didn't do a 180 on health care.  Accepting it in Massachusetts is not the same as forcing it on the whole country.




He isn't a billionaire.
Quote:



Make no mistake: the people dont think Obama is the messiah, they just knew he was a much better option than Romney.




They were quite wrong, as events have proven.  Unless you're a titty sucking bum.  Titty sucking bums love Obama, as well they should.  Sadly it isn't his personal tit being drained
Quote:









That's what Obama stands for.  Taking my money and giving it to bums.


--------------------


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Onlinekoods
Ribbit
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Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,050
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18913155 - 09/30/13 08:55 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Who do you think owns corporations?  Zombies?  And the whole corporations as people is a legal fiction that exists solely so that they can be sued in court.  The ignorance on this matter astounds me.





Sorry, mate. You got that wrong.  The context of that phrase in the last election refered to the Citizens United decision, where the court ruled that corporations have the same first ammendment right as people to make campaign contributions.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: koods]
    #18913158 - 09/30/13 08:56 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:





Are you trying to argue that giving useless shitheads everything they need will somehow make them less likely to become fictitious meth cooks?


--------------------


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: koods]
    #18913183 - 09/30/13 09:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

Who do you think owns corporations?  Zombies?  And the whole corporations as people is a legal fiction that exists solely so that they can be sued in court.  The ignorance on this matter astounds me.





Sorry, mate. You got that wrong.  The context of that phrase in the last election refered to the Citizens United decision, where the court ruled that corporations have the same first ammendment right as people to make campaign contributions.




It well predates that, mate.  The concept of corporate personhood dates back 200 years.  Romney was right and so was Citizens United.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood

If you have a problem with any large organization making political statements then you must shut down the media and forbid unions from donating.  Why is one large group more equal than another, Napolean?


--------------------


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Onlinekoods
Ribbit
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Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18913227 - 09/30/13 09:12 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I know the concept of corporate personhood. Corporations are People in the last election was a direct reference to the Cititzens United decision.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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Invisiblerackem
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Registered: 11/27/09
Posts: 14,024
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18913235 - 09/30/13 09:15 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

this may be off topic a little bit but doesnt anybody think that the government just wants a piece of the big health care industry as a form of a way to make more money?

at the end of the day government doesnt care if you have health care or not, they want the opportunity to make more money.


thats how i see obamacare, under the roof of the 'affordable health care act'

and i dont think our government should have a hand in it at all.


--------------------


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OfflineKonyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18913260 - 09/30/13 09:21 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

koods said:





Are you trying to argue that giving useless shitheads everything they need will somehow make them less likely to become fictitious meth cooks?




Rather the heart medication then the open heart surgery/death.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: koods]
    #18913261 - 09/30/13 09:22 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
I know the concept of corporate personhood. Corporations are People in the last election was a direct reference to the Cititzens United decision.



Yeah.  So?  That was an essential element of the decision.  Or didn't you know that?


--------------------


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OfflineKonyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: What's this thing I've been hearing about the US government shutting down? [Re: rackem]
    #18913265 - 09/30/13 09:23 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

rackem said:
this may be off topic a little bit but doesnt anybody think that the government just wants a piece of the big health care industry as a form of a way to make more money?

at the end of the day government doesnt care if you have health care or not, they want the opportunity to make more money.


thats how i see obamacare, under the roof of the 'affordable health care act'

and i dont think our government should have a hand in it at all.




Think of it as the goverment takingn account for the debt caused by people who can't pay for their healthcare and the unchecked cost of hospitalization in general.:shrug:


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