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Invisibletribesman
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A Rumination On Reincarnation.
    #18907795 - 09/29/13 04:29 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

How does the mechanism of rebirth work;
Is it between unlinked entities based on
Karma, or directly through bloodlines as
Claimed by George.Hunt-Williamson (aka-Michael d' Obrenovic)?


--------------------
" No permanence is ours; we are a wave
That flows to fit whatever form it finds:
Through night or day, cathedral or the cave
We pass forever, craving form that binds."

~ Hermann Hesse, The Glass Bead Game


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InvisibleLazarus.Long
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman]
    #18907972 - 09/29/13 05:13 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

All bloodlines lead back to the one, thus there is truly only one original bloodline.

On an interesting side note, if you are one to believe in the bloodline theory.

The current 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso, has stated that he will not be reborn in the People's Republic of China, since he now resides in exile and does not wish his next incarnation to become a puppet of the PRC in the ongoing occupation of Tibet.

I believe he has stated his next incarnation, may or may not happen, and that if it does, he may or may not come back as a Tibetan, so imagine the next spiritual leader and practical leader of Tibetan and much of Buddhism, may happen to return as a red haired Irishman, or African, it is all a grab bag now :smile:

If you have ever heard the infectious laugh of Tenzin Gyatso, I personally think he simply enjoys making statements like that, to flummox and confuse the PRC, since they will no doubt attempt to say they have found the next incarnation of the Dalai Lama first, preempting the tradition of the High Lamas of the Gelugpa tradition and the Tibetan government to find his reincarnation.

food for thought.


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Invisibleteknix
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Lazarus.Long]
    #18908041 - 09/29/13 05:33 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)



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OnlineKickleM
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: teknix]
    #18909331 - 09/29/13 10:32 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

:ilold:


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain


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OfflineChuckfinely
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: teknix]
    #18915353 - 10/01/13 10:02 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

teknix said:






The only thing cooler than this gif would be if he could actually do that :imafirinmahlazer:


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Invisiblelessismore
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #18915400 - 10/01/13 10:13 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Dunno, but got reinserted into my body

definitely not the person I used to be , but that's only good I think :wink:

sacrifice your old self, build a new self :wink:

when the time comes you might get another chance on this earth if you really wish so I think
don't think there are rules that you must never go here again

I believe in karma and that all is one soul (live for the good of others and yourself)
karma is just hard to observe, but it makes much sense I think
one soul is easier to notice

the family I know I feel like I've known for a long time, even the family I met I hadn't known before, my uncle is exactly like myself in every way lol - but first met him recently

don't think there are any coincidences..

but if you have kids you might reincarnate perhaps :wink:
almost a sure way to reincarnate ?:wink: but dunno

its funny how much we look like our parents sometimes, even if we deny it


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Invisiblelessismore
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: lessismore]
    #18915463 - 10/01/13 10:29 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

making others happy makes yourself happy, that's karma that is easily observable

not caring about others/the earth makes yourself miserable sooner or later, karma too

tried both :wink:


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman] * 1
    #18916298 - 10/01/13 01:40 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

i think it could go any way, you could have been an animal, you could have looked very similar to your current individuality, you could have been a lot like your dad...so yes basically I attribute it to Karma, but I also attribute bloodlines to karma so I do not see it as an either/or situation.


--------------------
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drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18917052 - 10/01/13 04:18 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Do you think just as some people can recall past lives,
or even glimpse future ones; that it is plausible to be
able to shift our conscious presence back and forth along
These blood/life lines?


--------------------
" No permanence is ours; we are a wave
That flows to fit whatever form it finds:
Through night or day, cathedral or the cave
We pass forever, craving form that binds."

~ Hermann Hesse, The Glass Bead Game


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman]
    #18917125 - 10/01/13 04:33 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

i do believe it is possible to remember past lives...in the same way that one can learn more about present life karma.  how it happens im not sure, but it would probably be in a purely pragmatic way...

for instance, you might have a vision of a past life, and it would explain so many things about the present life, that for you it would be inherently acceptable. i've never had a vision or dream like that however.

but i am pretty sure past lives make sense, if nothing else because certain aspects of our own lives have causes that stretch from before our birth, and may go beyond our death as well. if you are purely a materialist you might attribute this all to biology and sociology, but if you have any knowledge of the spirit/soul then you might see that it makes good sense to think that it's coming from within us as well as outside of us.


--------------------
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drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18917270 - 10/01/13 05:01 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I suppose it has to do with whether our lives are predetermined, and so free will, or are we independent entities that carry karmic baggage. I am interested in the physicality of consciousness and how it could energize one ego after another. For it is the ego imo that creates the sense of separate individuals living out their life choices. Does the raw awareness behind the ego not permeate all life? I have too many related questions and I'm not sure I'm able to put them all down here with any degree
of coherency, for this I apologise


--------------------
" No permanence is ours; we are a wave
That flows to fit whatever form it finds:
Through night or day, cathedral or the cave
We pass forever, craving form that binds."

~ Hermann Hesse, The Glass Bead Game


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman]
    #18918354 - 10/01/13 09:08 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

tribesman said:
Does the raw awareness behind the ego not permeate all life?




i believe it does, and also think this suggests translocation of soul, or 'life after life' basically.


--------------------
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drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18919533 - 10/02/13 03:16 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

and what about other living things?  or do you think humans special?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18919547 - 10/02/13 03:29 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)



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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18921786 - 10/02/13 03:06 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
and what about other living things?  or do you think humans special?




no way...just different species. we are kind of unique it seems but I don't think we are intrinsically different. Animals have souls okay? :lol:


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drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18922417 - 10/02/13 04:53 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

bacteria too? How about viruses?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18922449 - 10/02/13 05:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

The soul could be a shadow cast by the ego on our awareness. :shrug: just sayin'


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18923972 - 10/02/13 11:31 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
bacteria too? How about viruses?




thats practically pure life. i see a larger intelligence in the universe...you could call that the mind of god.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18924239 - 10/03/13 01:41 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

How about answering the question?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineYogi1
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18924585 - 10/03/13 05:39 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
How about answering the question?




:woooaaahhh:

I like to think we're like serotonin. We are born into the world with a rush of vitality, take our effect on the organism of the planet and eachother, and then separate back into the planet and recycle our energy and matter.


--------------------


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Yogi1]
    #18924660 - 10/03/13 06:19 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Going back to my earlier comment where I posited that the soul is no more
than a shadow cast over awareness by the ego. If I can elaborate on this a
little; life is the organisation, animation and sustenance of inanimate matter,
to maintain and stave off collapse and entropy.

The life force that endeavours to accomplish this isn't inherently aware/conscious,
though natural intelligence is a quality that seems apparent;

http://www.realitysandwich.com/psilocybin_natural_intelligence

...and awareness/consciousness is an emergent property of living organisms.

Now if this life force permeates all life throughout space and time, and ego
is a property of the brain, and of physicality; it could be inferred that organisms
with conscious qualities act as nodes of data/memory, and what is experienced
by past life proponents is the linking of one node with another through the web of ubiquitous life force.


Edited by tribesman (10/03/13 06:31 AM)


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18925451 - 10/03/13 11:41 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
How about answering the question?




...i did. life=soul basically. it's pretty simple. bacteria and viruses could only have a life within an 'oversoul' because clearly as individuals they aren't very conscious. Although yeah even at that level they could still have the most rudimentary sensory experience imaginable...why not?


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18925546 - 10/03/13 12:02 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

why not?

why?

I see no evidence for a soul either way. All I see is life and a struggle for individual survival and procreation. :shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (10/03/13 12:15 PM)


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #18925621 - 10/03/13 12:21 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

what about interpersonal connections, and love, which certainly seems to serve a purpose beyond survival.

for survival, lust would be enough. but love brings humans together in completely mysterious ways, often times for reasons that have nothing to do with survival and procreation.


--------------------
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drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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Invisiblelessismore
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18926771 - 10/03/13 05:14 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Love is the soul

Thoughts/desires/emotions are not who we are, but we often think we are


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: lessismore]
    #18927167 - 10/03/13 06:29 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Why does love always come up as the unifying element of
The universe? I don't see it much in nature; only
Really in humans, that is if you can really define it
As love; ' Diliges absolutam '. All else that is apparent
Is instinctive and survival/mating related.


--------------------
" No permanence is ours; we are a wave
That flows to fit whatever form it finds:
Through night or day, cathedral or the cave
We pass forever, craving form that binds."

~ Hermann Hesse, The Glass Bead Game


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman]
    #18927376 - 10/03/13 07:00 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Don't even see it that much in humans except as lip service. 

Just because someone says "the soul is love" or whatever doesn't really mean much in reality.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18927540 - 10/03/13 07:24 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

g00ru said:
what about interpersonal connections, and love, which certainly seems to serve a purpose beyond survival.

for survival, lust would be enough. but love brings humans together in completely mysterious ways, often times for reasons that have nothing to do with survival and procreation.





I think not.  Bonds and cooperation were real necessities for mans survival.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: Icelander]
    #18932438 - 10/04/13 06:04 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Don't even see it that much in humans except as lip service. 

Just because someone says "the soul is love" or whatever doesn't really mean much in reality.




People should just be honest and call it what it is; attachment dependency. :lol:


--------------------
" No permanence is ours; we are a wave
That flows to fit whatever form it finds:
Through night or day, cathedral or the cave
We pass forever, craving form that binds."

~ Hermann Hesse, The Glass Bead Game


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman]
    #18932441 - 10/04/13 06:05 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

tribesman said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
Don't even see it that much in humans except as lip service. 

Just because someone says "the soul is love" or whatever doesn't really mean much in reality.




People should just be honest and call it what it is; attachment dependency. :lol:




LOOK AT THAT


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18932528 - 10/04/13 06:20 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Which?


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: tribesman]
    #18932571 - 10/04/13 06:29 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

when this thread started you wanted to ruminate on reincarnation, it seems that rumination has come to a close and you now assume that believers in multiple lives are somehow doing it out of a need for emotional comfort, rather than a search for truth. and i'm like, pointin it out at ya >.<


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drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18932621 - 10/04/13 06:41 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Not come too close; the thread just took a turn towards the concept of love, which to me is an ambiguous descriptor that is too often used as a ubiquitous blanket to drape over the gaps in spiritual/existential perceptions. I don't think love, or the human concept of love need come into it. I am interested in the mechanism of rebirth, if it be a reality, and the role played by physicality in the logistics of memory between one apparently isolated organism and another.


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Invisibletribesman
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Re: A Rumination On Reincarnation. [Re: g00ru]
    #18936245 - 10/05/13 02:03 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

This is an interesting interview with Dr.Paul Ekman,
on the Dalai Lama, reincarnation, and physicality.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7H4-PKAxa-U


Edited by tribesman (10/05/13 02:20 PM)


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