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Konyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: Can-i-bus]
#18896623 - 09/26/13 11:20 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Can-i-bus said:
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itchmynipple said:
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ToiletDuk said: IME, smoking a doob is quite soothing and, to be honest, I generally feel better. But some may be different. BTW, tell me, what hereditary disease is going to be "released" by marijuana use?
bipolar, schizophrenia, psychosis..
You have to be predisposed to those conditions for cannabis to bring them out...You don't just get schizophrenia from smoking pot. If that were true then we'd have schizophrenics everywhere
false, it's as enviromental as it is what your saying its 50/50
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dark3st
Stranger

Registered: 08/02/13
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: Konyap]
#18896680 - 09/26/13 11:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Nature vs nurture yoyo
-------------------- Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this. OFINTQWGVGAKGCYKBUBX free dark P. Tampanensis prints to ODD members.
no stamps atm FREE SEEDS for ODD WCA members ONLY I have these seeds: Orange, red, and yellow sweet peppers, Purple poppies, White Habanero, Yellow Thai, Bolivian rainbow peppers, milk thistle, red chilly pepper, HBWR.
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Konyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: dark3st]
#18896702 - 09/26/13 11:40 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I open my mind then slowly but surely I open my mouth
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itchmynipple
;)

Registered: 05/28/12
Posts: 1,660
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: Konyap]
#18897006 - 09/27/13 01:03 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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looks like i was right
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PsychoReactive
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Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 2,562
Loc: Cocalero
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: itchmynipple]
#18897111 - 09/27/13 01:38 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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USA has all sorts of syndromes for all sorts of gullable people. It makes big bucks for pharmaceutical industry. Wake up.
Cannabis promotes health, both mentally and physically. Don't listen to garbage being spewn by some money hungry prostitute Pharma backed "scientist" study.
Edited by PsychoReactive (09/27/13 01:39 AM)
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itchmynipple
;)

Registered: 05/28/12
Posts: 1,660
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: PsychoReactive]
#18897201 - 09/27/13 02:08 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
PsychoReactive said: USA has all sorts of syndromes for all sorts of gullable people. It makes big bucks for pharmaceutical industry. Wake up.
Cannabis promotes health, both mentally and physically. Don't listen to garbage being spewn by some money hungry prostitute Pharma backed "scientist" study.
cannabis promotes mental and physical health? okay man... for real its not 'good' for everyone, its not good for most people actually unless there completely recreational and limit there intake then its not bad, but not good.
last time i checked weed slowed me down in all areas of life. killed my motivation, made my actual strength decrease. mentally and physically.
All of my friends, all, who smoke weed regularly- admit weed has slowed them down, whether it be school, sports,in the gym, hanging out, hittin on girls, there attention span drops,thats because there addicted and causing plastic-like changes in there brain, someone go Google brain scans regarding marijuana for me :p -
Smoking weed for injuries is the most bogus thing i've ever heard, and you will not see any professional athlete doing this for a reason. ive had more serious injuries then you can count fingers. ive had surgeries too and weed has only Slowed down my rehabilitation and limited my progress immensely. unless you've got athritis, i still dont see weed helping that much besides being a pain distractor at times.
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PsychedelicScience
Peace Seeker



Registered: 06/10/12
Posts: 523
Loc: Astral Realm.
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: itchmynipple]
#18897308 - 09/27/13 03:03 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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itchmynipple said:
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dark3st said: :fuckpalm:
Have you seen the sample size for that dumbass study that determined that a illness? Fucken A
Lol, so you agree its an illness brought on by marijuana?
What? Dude marijuana does not bring on any illnesses just stop it already whats up with the hate for weed?
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DebuteMachine

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 6,457
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: PsychedelicScience]
#18897400 - 09/27/13 04:09 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Hey man, seriously you have to link an article. This is the news board not a discussion board for your thoughts and opinions.
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itchmynipple
;)

Registered: 05/28/12
Posts: 1,660
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: DebuteMachine]
#18898061 - 09/27/13 10:23 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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DebuteMachine said: Hey man, seriously you have to link an article. This is the news board not a discussion board for your thoughts and opinions.
Why should i have to, there are studies and sources everywhere on brain scans and such. go do it yourself if you really want to know. you Will find it. im spewing truth's ive seen with my eyes. i could care less if you dont want to believe me its not my loss when your smoking j's everyday till 40 wondering why your life revolves around it more than your family.
for you to say cannabis has no negative impact on health, is like saying its not mentally addicting. It is addicting. do you not believe it is?
im addicted to weed - its beyond hard to quit when your smokin it like cigarette more.
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Edited by itchmynipple (09/27/13 10:25 AM)
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shivas.wisdom
בּ



Registered: 02/19/09
Posts: 13,462
Loc: Turtle Island
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: itchmynipple]
#18898122 - 09/27/13 10:45 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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itchmynipple said: im spewing truth's ive seen with my eyes.
hey bru, i'm sorry your marijuana experience was so shitty--but in the world of academic research, what we have here is called anecdotal evidence and it has no relevance beyond that 
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i could care less if you dont want to believe me its not my loss when your smoking j's everyday till 40 wondering why your life revolves around it more than your family.
for you to say cannabis has no negative impact on health, is like saying its not mentally addicting. It is addicting. do you not believe it is?
and i could care less for your shitty attempts to show the negative impact on health caused by cannabis--as i stated earlier, as have many other individuals in this thread, the study in question DOES NOT STATE THAT CANNABIS IS HARMLESS
what was the conclusion?
Quote:
our findings suggest that marijuana use has little measurable effect on self-reported health or healthcare utilization in adults using drugs identified in a primary care clinic
In case you really have smoked yourself silly, what this sentence means is the vast majority of marijuana users (heavy or light) will not feel sicker (thus, the lack of change amongst self-reporting) nor will they feel the need to seek healthcare at a rate different from the general population. Note the use of 'little measurable effect', rather than 'no measurable effect'? This means that a small amount of marijuana users will demonstrate a change in health, but this number is too small to be statistically relevant.
Quit your nitpicking for the most obscure medical conditions that may be exasperated by cannabis--which most users will never experience--in your attempt to invalidate this article and validate your own opinion.
Some people also get bad reactions when eating peanuts--but damn it all if you think that will make me eat less peanuts--know why? because I don't have that reaction
final note: i am not of the opinion that cannabis is completely harmless--i don't think any of the posters in this thread are of that opinion--i just think you are a know it all who appears to know nothing--realize that subjective experiences are not always objective truths
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badchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,373
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: shivas.wisdom]
#18898217 - 09/27/13 11:19 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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From a cursory review, the main issues with the study were:
- Perhaps the biggest drawback to the study was the fact they only assessed drug users. They then compared drug users that used MJ versus ones that didn't. They should have compared to a better control group.
- they only assessed "health care use" for a 3 month period. So they found "no negative effects" over a 3 month period.
- Only 169 of the 589 subjects were "daily users". So if you smoked once in the past three months, you were included in the study.
- subjects averaged 41 years old. You might not expect people this young to use healthcare services anyway.
- They used pretty shitty ways to measure "health outcomes", including the EuroQOl and emergency dept. visits.
And so for these reasons, I might wipe my ass with the study, but wouldn't look further into it.
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
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shivas.wisdom
בּ



Registered: 02/19/09
Posts: 13,462
Loc: Turtle Island
Last seen: 7 hours, 3 minutes
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: badchad]
#18898311 - 09/27/13 11:41 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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it's definitely not the best study ever--but i'll take it for what it's worth
i just have a few comments on your review:
"Perhaps the biggest drawback to the study was the fact they only assessed drug users. They then compared drug users that used MJ versus ones that didn't. They should have compared to a better control group." From my understanding of the article, the intent of the study was to determine any detectable association between frequency of marijuana use and health, or healthcare utilization. The comparison was made between daily marijuana users and less than daily marijuana users--use of any other drug would mean disqualification from the study. A non-drug using control group would be necessary for a study comparing the effect of marijuana use on health in general, but as already stated, this study was looking at the effect frequency of use has on health.
"Only 169 of the 589 subjects were "daily users". So if you smoked once in the past three months, you were included in the study." But they still made a distinction between daily smokers and less than daily smokers--as I already stated, comparison between these two groups was the focus of the study.
"subjects averaged 41 years old. You might not expect people this young to use healthcare services anyway." Are you suggesting we slide the average age to a point where people are so old we already expect them to be sick? Where is the value in a study with 75 years old as the average age? It seems to me that 41 is a fairly decent average age for a study of marijuana users--and I'm sure they will still use healthcare services should they fall sick.
"They used pretty shitty ways to measure "health outcomes", including the EuroQOl and emergency dept. visits." The emergency dept. visits were being used to determine 'utilization of healthcare services'.
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badchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,373
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: shivas.wisdom]
#18898422 - 09/27/13 12:10 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
shivas.wisdom said: it's definitely not the best study ever--but i'll take it for what it's worth
i just have a few comments on your review:
"Perhaps the biggest drawback to the study was the fact they only assessed drug users. They then compared drug users that used MJ versus ones that didn't. They should have compared to a better control group." From my understanding of the article, the intent of the study was to determine any detectable association between frequency of marijuana use and health, or healthcare utilization. The comparison was made between daily marijuana users and less than daily marijuana users--use of any other drug would mean disqualification from the study. A non-drug using control group would be necessary for a study comparing the effect of marijuana use on health in general, but as already stated, this study was looking at the effect frequency of use has on health.
You had to be a drug user (self-reported use) to gain entry into the study. The study title is: "No Detectable Association Between Frequency of Marijuana Use and Health or Healthcare Utilization Among Primary Care Patients Who Screen Positive for Drug Use."
You're correct on the purpose of the study, but don't we really want to compare the effects of MJ use vs. non-use?
Quote:
shivas.wisdom said:
"Only 169 of the 589 subjects were "daily users". So if you smoked once in the past three months, you were included in the study."
But they still made a distinction between daily smokers and less than daily smokers--as I already stated, comparison between these two groups was the focus of the study.
You're correct that the study examined daily vs. non-daily MJ users, but there is a lot of "wiggle room" there. For example, you could have BOTH someone that smokes MJ 5 of 7 days per week, AND someone that smoked once a month in the "non-daily" group.
Quote:
shivas.wisdom said: "subjects averaged 41 years old. You might not expect people this young to use healthcare services anyway." Are you suggesting we slide the average age to a point where people are so old we already expect them to be sick? Where is the value in a study with 75 years old as the average age? It seems to me that 41 is a fairly decent average age for a study of marijuana users--and I'm sure they will still use healthcare services should they fall sick.
No. I'm suggesting that any health effects observed from MJ are small, and likely build up over time. For example, regular use might make you get a chest cold two times a year more than a non-smoker. Over a lifetime, multiplied by millions of people, this might be viewed as a significant health care utilization effect.
Again, I think what we really want to know, is if we legalize MJ today, and have an 18 year old use MJ for life, what is that gonna cost us, so we know the consequences of legalization long-term.
Quote:
shivas.wisdom said: "They used pretty shitty ways to measure "health outcomes", including the EuroQOl and emergency dept. visits." The emergency dept. visits were being used to determine 'utilization of healthcare services'.
Same as my previous comment. ER use seems like a relatively "extreme" endpoint (although they included others). A poly-drug using, alcoholic junkie probably doesn't use the ER very often in any given three month period. You'd have to see a pretty extreme outcome measure to detect this. I speculate the effects of MJ are subtle, so we need a very precise endpoint to capture them.
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
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shivas.wisdom
בּ



Registered: 02/19/09
Posts: 13,462
Loc: Turtle Island
Last seen: 7 hours, 3 minutes
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: badchad]
#18898488 - 09/27/13 12:30 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
You had to be a drug user (self-reported use) to gain entry into the study. The study title is: "No Detectable Association Between Frequency of Marijuana Use and Health or Healthcare Utilization Among Primary Care Patients Who Screen Positive for Drug Use." You're correct on the purpose of the study, but don't we really want to compare the effects of MJ use vs. non-use?
I think that would be a very useful study as well, but I feel that studying the effect frequency has on marijuana users is also something we should want to do--though I agree, even within this study, a non-drug using control group would have benefits.
Quote:
You're correct that the study examined daily vs. non-daily MJ users, but there is a lot of "wiggle room" there. For example, you could have BOTH someone that smokes MJ 5 of 7 days per week, AND someone that smoked once a month in the "non-daily" group.
I'm not sure where exactly the cutoff point would have been--the study itselfs mentions putting 'almost daily' use in the same group as 'daily', though in essence what you say remains true.
Quote:
No. I'm suggesting that any health effects observed from MJ are small, and likely build up over time. For example, regular use might make you get a chest cold two times a year more than a non-smoker. Over a lifetime, multiplied by millions of people, this might be viewed as a significant health care utilization effect. Again, I think what we really want to know, is if we legalize MJ today, and have an 18 year old use MJ for life, what is that gonna cost us, so we know the consequences of legalization long-term.
I think this would call for a long term study, rather than a shift in average age of participants. I still think ~40 is a good average age for a study like this, though.
Quote:
Same as my previous comment. ER use seems like a relatively "extreme" endpoint (although they included others). A poly-drug using, alcoholic junkie probably doesn't use the ER very often in any given three month period. You'd have to see a pretty extreme outcome measure to detect this. I speculate the effects of MJ are subtle, so we need a very precise endpoint to capture them.
I don't know, maybe the situation is different in the US--but up in Canada many people use the ER for common things--fever, stomach ache, bumps and scrapes, etc etc--it's a huge problem actually--but it does show that people don't only go to ER's for extreme symptoms--or, people have widely varying concepts of extreme symptom.
On the whole though, I agree with you in that the study could have been made stronger--perhaps the tenuous results from this will inspire another.
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Le_Canard
The Duk Abides


Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: badchad]
#18898537 - 09/27/13 12:41 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Well, while cannabis does have its down side, it's still a rather innocuous drug. It won't kill you, it won't give you cancer, it won't cause you to hurt someone (usually), and it certainly won't have you deathly ill if you're suddenly deprived of it after being habituated to it.
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dark3st
Stranger

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 3,332
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: Le_Canard]
#18898558 - 09/27/13 12:47 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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The only negative effect (downplaying) is it being illegal!
-------------------- Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this. OFINTQWGVGAKGCYKBUBX free dark P. Tampanensis prints to ODD members.
no stamps atm FREE SEEDS for ODD WCA members ONLY I have these seeds: Orange, red, and yellow sweet peppers, Purple poppies, White Habanero, Yellow Thai, Bolivian rainbow peppers, milk thistle, red chilly pepper, HBWR.
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Le_Canard
The Duk Abides


Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: dark3st]
#18898588 - 09/27/13 12:55 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yes, there's that too. But that will change, methinks.
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dark3st
Stranger

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 3,332
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Re: Study: Cannabis Consumption Has No Negative Effect on Health [Re: Le_Canard]
#18898607 - 09/27/13 01:00 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Me thinks me hopes me correct
-------------------- Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this. OFINTQWGVGAKGCYKBUBX free dark P. Tampanensis prints to ODD members.
no stamps atm FREE SEEDS for ODD WCA members ONLY I have these seeds: Orange, red, and yellow sweet peppers, Purple poppies, White Habanero, Yellow Thai, Bolivian rainbow peppers, milk thistle, red chilly pepper, HBWR.
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