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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: morrowasted]
    #18911554 - 09/30/13 02:32 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

If you want to debate with me, yes. I take things seriously, and that means researching them.

I have researched violence, or I assume to have a fairly decent grip on the subject of violence.

I have read the Bible and the Qur'an and I feel that having done so increases my capacity to debate the religions they spawned significantly.

Whatever works for you.

Watching this video does not take very much time compared to reading a book.

I feel that I have put up for a decent position which no one has managed to properly challenge yet, so no I don't feel the need to watch this video. Unless you have a specific time in the video you find relevant to my stance which is literally answering the question:

What is the most violent century in human history?


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18911601 - 09/30/13 02:41 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
violence is almost always sad

Yet you laugh it off with silliness, unless you honestly believe in past-life's.

but that doesn't change the fact that it the amount of violence as a percentage of the population has decreased. anecdotes don't change that fact.

In total per capita for the past century you may be right but please provide quality source and what periods you have in mind.

I think you're wrong if we base this on specific war-times in the past century. 4-5% of human population on earth was killed during WW2, Mao did his fair share, WW1 as well, Second Sino-Japanese War. There has been so many ultra-violent wars in the past century I doubt you will find the same violence of large scale in previous centuries, even per capita.

There's no doubt the past century is the most violent in history looking at the total victims of war regardless of capita. It's literally the most violent period in human history.




No it isn't.  You are far less lilely to be a victim of violence now than at any other time in history.  Get over it.
Quote:


Quote:

liquidlounge said:
Actually the thread started out with a video of Steven pinker discussing the decline of violence in modern times.  The video that you did not watch.  Nor did you bother to read the article, which was all about per capita and not absolute number.

What the thread began with is irrelevant in regards to our correspondence and my question directed towards you which you answered.

You just about doubled the percent for WW2 but that's OK.  You brought in per capita when you used percent.

That was another metric, as you hopefully understand now, I used three different metrics in which the following is what I have based our debate on:




You may have based the debate on it after you got your ass handed to you but I didn't and neither did Pinker.  It's a ridiculous metric and no thinking person would use it.  I have pointed out the fallacy quite clearly.
Quote:



Quote:

liquidlounge said:
There's no doubt the past century is the most violent in history looking at the total victims of war regardless of capita. It's literally the most violent period in human history.



As to another point, WW2 was 70 years ago.  That is not today.  Mao is not today and Stalin is not today.  They are the past, not the present.  By far most of the people alive then are dead now, certainly all of the leaders.

We're debating the past century , or the past 100 years contra other centuries - are we not?




No we are not.  As I pointed out you were asking about this century, which began 13 years ago.  And frankly it is ridiculous to argue absolute numbers, as I have pointed out numerous times, for any period.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18911608 - 09/30/13 02:42 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
If you want to debate with me, yes. I take things seriously, and that means researching them.

I have researched violence, or I assume to have a fairly decent grip on the subject of violence.

I have read the Bible and the Qur'an and I feel that having done so increases my capacity to debate the religions they spawned significantly.

Whatever works for you.

Watching this video does not take very much time compared to reading a book.

I feel that I have put up for a decent position which no one has managed to properly challenge yet, so no I don't feel the need to watch this video. Unless you have a specific time in the video you find relevant to my stance which is literally answering the question:

What is the most violent century in human history?




It isn't this one and it isn't the twentieth


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Offlinemorrowasted
Worldwide Stepper
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Registered: 10/30/09
Posts: 31,377
Loc: House of Mirrors
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Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18911611 - 09/30/13 02:43 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Liquid: The video challenges your position. We don't feel the need to transcribe it.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: morrowasted]
    #18911620 - 09/30/13 02:44 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Reply to fail.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18911705 - 09/30/13 03:10 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

No it isn't.  You are far less lilely to be a victim of violence now than at any other time in history.  Get over it.

Sure, I never disagreed with this.

Fact is the last 100 years has been the most violent on Earth ever.

Do I need to bring in the dictionary again?

You may have based the debate on it after you got your ass handed to you but I didn't and neither did Pinker.  It's a ridiculous metric and no thinking person would use it.  I have pointed out the fallacy quite clearly.

Terrible argumentation - reminds me of high school.

No we are not.  As I pointed out you were asking about this century, which began 13 years ago.

I meant the past century but mixed up in that specific post, as previously mentioned here. All along I have directed my question and statements towards the past century or 100 years apart from that one post i expressed myself incorrectly.

And frankly it is ridiculous to argue absolute numbers, as I have pointed out numerous times, for any period.

This is the question you answered, I find it weird you answer something you find ridiculous debating.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18911728 - 09/30/13 03:15 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

It isn't this one and it isn't the twentieth

The numbers, black on white prove I am right. 1900 -> 2000 is overrepresented in amount of casualties and this means it literally is the most violent century. Wikipedia is legitimate on such subject, view sources at the bottom if you disagree.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18911744 - 09/30/13 03:20 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
violence is almost always sad

Yet you laugh it off with silliness, unless you honestly believe in past-life's.

but that doesn't change the fact that it the amount of violence as a percentage of the population has decreased. anecdotes don't change that fact.

In total per capita for the past century you may be right but please provide quality source and what periods you have in mind.

I think you're wrong if we base this on specific war-times in the past century. 4-5% of human population on earth was killed during WW2, Mao did his fair share, WW1 as well, Second Sino-Japanese War. There has been so many ultra-violent wars in the past century I doubt you will find the same violence of large scale in previous centuries, even per capita.

There's no doubt the past century is the most violent in history looking at the total victims of war regardless of capita. It's literally the most violent period in human history.



Quote:

liquidlounge said:
No it isn't.  You are far less lilely to be a victim of violence now than at any other time in history.  Get over it.

Sure, I never disagreed with this.

Fact is the last 100 years has been the most violent on Earth ever.

Do I need to bring in the dictionary again?




Your dictionary will not help you.  If you are less likely to die from violence now then the last hundred years have not been the most violent in history.  Like I said earlier, if every single person in AD 1 was murdered by your ridiculous metric it would still be less violent than the 20th century.  You are becoming an absurdist.
Quote:



You may have based the debate on it after you got your ass handed to you but I didn't and neither did Pinker.  It's a ridiculous metric and no thinking person would use it.  I have pointed out the fallacy quite clearly.

Terrible argumentation - reminds me of high school.




The fact is I have pointed out the ridiculousness of your metric several times and you continue to ignore it.  Reminds me of high school except not in the debate class.  More like the gym.
Quote:



No we are not.  As I pointed out you were asking about this century, which began 13 years ago.

I meant the past century but mixed up in that specific post, as previously mentioned here. All along I have directed my question and statements towards the past century or 100 years apart from that one post i expressed myself incorrectly.

And frankly it is ridiculous to argue absolute numbers, as I have pointed out numerous times, for any period.

This is the question you answered, I find it weird you answer something you find ridiculous debating.




I am not debating.  I am educating.  As was Pinker.  You, on the other hand, are doing neither.  You are being nonsensical to save face.  And I am being a total asshole by not letting you get away wit reams and reams of bullshit.  Pat Metheny my ass.  How pompous can you be?


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: morrowasted]
    #18911749 - 09/30/13 03:21 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
Liquid: The video challenges your position. We don't feel the need to transcribe it.



The video might take a stance on most violent per capita, but not most violent period on Earth. Unless it mentions this century or modern period as the most violent. If the people directly claim another century is more violent than this one they're wrong and need to improve their English language.


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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18911765 - 09/30/13 03:25 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Isn't it just a matter of context?


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rahz

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"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18911807 - 09/30/13 03:33 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
Quote:

morrowasted said:
Liquid: The video challenges your position. We don't feel the need to transcribe it.



The video might take a stance on most violent per capita, but not most violent period on Earth. Unless it mentions this century or modern period as the most violent. If the people directly claim another century is more violent than this one they're wrong and need to improve their English language.




No, you are going to have to improve your reasoning skills.  The only thing that matters is per capita, as I have clearly proven with my AD1 vs 1940 analogy.  You're starting to drool on yourself now.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18916389 - 10/01/13 02:05 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Your dictionary will not help you.

Any major dictionary will support my position.

If you are less likely to die from violence now then the last hundred years have not been the most violent in history.  Like I said earlier, if every single person in AD 1 was murdered by your ridiculous metric it would still be less violent than the 20th century.  You are becoming an absurdist.

I base my positions literally, you do not.

I am not debating.  I am educating.  As was Pinker.  You, on the other hand, are doing neither.  You are being nonsensical to save face.  And I am being a total asshole by not letting you get away wit reams and reams of bullshit.  Pat Metheny my ass.  How pompous can you be?

If you can't agree most violent century means total amount of victims of violence per century we have nothing more to talk about. You're not corresponding literally but instead create your own definitions.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18916395 - 10/01/13 02:07 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

No, you are going to have to improve your reasoning skills.  The only thing that matters is per capita, as I have clearly proven with my AD1 vs 1940 analogy.  You're starting to drool on yourself now.

You have not demonstrated the fact of most violent century meaning per capita and not amount of victims because it's not reality.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
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Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18916465 - 10/01/13 02:24 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
Your dictionary will not help you.

Any major dictionary will support my position.

If you are less likely to die from violence now then the last hundred years have not been the most violent in history.  Like I said earlier, if every single person in AD 1 was murdered by your ridiculous metric it would still be less violent than the 20th century.  You are becoming an absurdist.

I base my positions literally, you do not.




Per capita is all that matters
Quote:



I am not debating.  I am educating.  As was Pinker.  You, on the other hand, are doing neither.  You are being nonsensical to save face.  And I am being a total asshole by not letting you get away wit reams and reams of bullshit.  Pat Metheny my ass.  How pompous can you be?

If you can't agree most violent century means total amount of victims of violence per century we have nothing more to talk about. You're not corresponding literally but instead create your own definitions.




I can't agree with that.  I have pointed out repeatedly how asinine it is


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
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Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18916471 - 10/01/13 02:25 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
No, you are going to have to improve your reasoning skills.  The only thing that matters is per capita, as I have clearly proven with my AD1 vs 1940 analogy.  You're starting to drool on yourself now.

You have not demonstrated the fact of most violent century meaning per capita and not amount of victims because it's not reality.



I'm sorry for you.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18916485 - 10/01/13 02:27 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Per capita is all that matters

Not according to the dictionary.

I can't agree with that.  I have pointed out repeatedly how asinine it is

Not according to the dictionary.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18916508 - 10/01/13 02:32 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I'm sorry for you.

For dealing with this? Yes you're right so far IMO.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
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Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18916812 - 10/01/13 03:25 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
I'm sorry for you.

For dealing with this? Yes you're right so far IMO.




I'm going to ask this quite clearly

In AD 1 there were approximately 200 million people on the planet if every one of them was murdered, (except two) would that be a less violent century than one on which there are 6 billion people but 250 million are murdered?  In the first instance you have a 100% assurance of being murdered.  In the second you have approximately a 4% chance of being murdered.  Which century is more violent?


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18916953 - 10/01/13 03:58 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Which century is more violent?

As per definition, the century with 6 billion people.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Ted Talks: The surprising decline in violence. [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18917599 - 10/01/13 06:18 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
Which century is more violent?

As per definition, the century with 6 billion people.



:rofl2:


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