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OfflineMsAngelique
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Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do?
    #18887926 - 09/25/13 05:42 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I realized in the middle of the night last night that I made a mistake in following my very first g2g...monotub process.  Mad at myself right now!! :mad2:

OK, so before putting my monotub together 3 days ago...the substrate, WBS and coir/verm/gysum layer on top....I was supposed to resoak the grains one last time for 10-20 mins to rehydrate them.  WELL I forgot to do that part!  So, now my tub is already together and covered/taped.  Is there anything I can do to rectify right now, or once the tape is removed and polyfilled?   

I was thinking "hoping" it might mean that my second flush will probably be way better than my first....if I can get it to the first without that re-soak. 

Thanks! Appreciate any advice.


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OfflineFarmerwhite
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: MsAngelique]
    #18887934 - 09/25/13 05:49 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

My friend as long as your substrate was at the proper level of hydration you will be fine without the soak, it's only beneficial not required. just soak the whole monotub after you pick your first flush:thumbup:


--------------------
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OfflineMush4Brains
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: MsAngelique]
    #18887935 - 09/25/13 05:49 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

People have been growing in tubs successfully for years without soaking their grains.  Don't worry about it.


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OfflineMsAngelique
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: Mush4Brains]
    #18887942 - 09/25/13 05:53 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

You guys just made me feel SO much better!  :dancer:

Thanks!  I will relax!  Have a great day!


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OfflineFarmerwhite
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: MsAngelique]
    #18887950 - 09/25/13 06:00 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Glad to help, you too and good vibes to your tub:mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2:


--------------------
I'm here to learn from the best

Objects only have meaning that you put upon them




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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: Farmerwhite]
    #18888009 - 09/25/13 06:36 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

How thick is your top layer


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OfflinePrinceShroom
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: Mush4Brains]
    #18888010 - 09/25/13 06:36 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

:lmafo:
Seriously????

Quote:

Mush4Brains said:
People have been growing in tubs successfully for years without soaking their grains.  Don't worry about it.



:whathesaid:
Soaking tubs has not been around for that long.


--------------------
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: PrinceShroom]
    #18888011 - 09/25/13 06:37 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

PrinceShroom said:
:lmafo:
Seriously????

Quote:

Mush4Brains said:
People have been growing in tubs successfully for years without soaking their grains.  Don't worry about it.



:whathesaid:
Soaking tubs has not been around for that long.




Soaking tubs has been around forever, soaking grains before you make the tub has not


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey


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OfflinePrinceShroom
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: LiquidGlass]
    #18888018 - 09/25/13 06:43 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Sorry my bad I meant grains not tubs.  You dont soak a tub before or after spawning.  Your moisture should be perfect at that time.


--------------------
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

Need help? Feel free to :pm: me.


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OfflineMADPANTSDOME
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: PrinceShroom]
    #18888398 - 09/25/13 09:07 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah ive never done that sounds risky. I can see where it would be effective but ive had a ton of good grows.


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OfflineMsAngelique
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: LiquidGlass]
    #18888432 - 09/25/13 09:17 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

LiquidGlass said:
How thick is your top layer




My top layer is about half to one inch at the most. Just did enough to fully cover the grain.


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Invisiblecynical bastad
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Registered: 08/17/13
Posts: 175
Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: MsAngelique]
    #18888455 - 09/25/13 09:24 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

If it's a little dry & light, could she inject water w/ a baster of sort's? After spawning, my only one time, i thought things were a bit dry after all the steps before.  So i had no clue how to water the thing...i just injected it every inch or so, squeezing water out and pulling it up and trying to hit as much as i could, w/o drenching it.  It soaked it all up and seemed to go ape shit after that.


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: cynical bastad]
    #18888488 - 09/25/13 09:38 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

How many mL of water can you inject after spawning?
I really cant see it making a difference, your sub most likely already carry 3-4-5 quarts of water.

I see it's posted every now and then, but it just dont make sense in my mind.


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Invisiblebulkgrownoob
Registered: 03/21/11
Posts: 345
Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: spacechildo]
    #18888502 - 09/25/13 09:41 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

My main concern with doing that would be stabbing a piece of grain with the syringe and exposing the inside of it to contams. I'm sure she'll be fine without doing anything at all but worst case a nice mist always helps if there's not enough moisture


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OfflineMastaBlastar
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: bulkgrownoob]
    #18888526 - 09/25/13 09:52 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

cynical bastad said:
If it's a little dry & light, could she inject water w/ a baster of sort's? After spawning, my only one time, i thought things were a bit dry after all the steps before.  So i had no clue how to water the thing...i just injected it every inch or so, squeezing water out and pulling it up and trying to hit as much as i could, w/o drenching it.  It soaked it all up and seemed to go ape shit after that.



Quote:

bulkgrownoob said:
My main concern with doing that would be stabbing a piece of grain with the syringe and exposing the inside of it to contams. I'm sure she'll be fine without doing anything at all but worst case a nice mist always helps if there's not enough moisture



I was wondering that as well.  I have had this same thought, as every time I soak I just seem to span mold.  I was ordering my dehydrator and thought about getting one of those meat injectors and trying some boiling H2O and let it cool in the gun then swab and stick.  I am gonna get a gun and give it a go anyway.  Gonna try one of the ones with a bunch of pins in a 2-4" sq area.


--------------------
Everything I have said, may say, will say, am thinking about saying and/or thinking/typing/dreaming/writing is in all likelyhood made up and has no factual basis in reality whatsoever, and is likely all plagiarized and copy pasted straight from someone else, so get mad at them .  Just a warning


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Invisiblecynical bastad
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Registered: 08/17/13
Posts: 175
Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? *DELETED* [Re: bulkgrownoob]
    #18888546 - 09/25/13 09:56 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by cynical bastad

Reason for deletion: ã…Ž



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OfflineMastaBlastar
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: cynical bastad]
    #18888616 - 09/25/13 10:20 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

cynical bastad said:
Yeah, the amount i injected was 120ml per cake, it seemed to only last a few days before it was dry again and then i just picked it clean...i was in the dark doing any of this.  So once i found out to actually just dunk it, that worked much better, the second flushes were awesome.  :lol: 

I was scared to stab that cake as many times as i did...lol, but i really had no clue how to water it... :lol: I also used distilled water... obviously not right. As i didn't heat the needle either...but colonized sub's are pretty contam resistant eh?  :shrug:



Ya distilled water should be fine, I was saying to boil it just to be safe and since you are stabbing it MIGHT help if you hit some grains.  :shrug:  I just mist with a water bottle rather than dunking so I don't have to take the tubs out of the lab.


--------------------
Everything I have said, may say, will say, am thinking about saying and/or thinking/typing/dreaming/writing is in all likelyhood made up and has no factual basis in reality whatsoever, and is likely all plagiarized and copy pasted straight from someone else, so get mad at them .  Just a warning


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: MastaBlastar]
    #18888691 - 09/25/13 10:43 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Guys and gals,
Don't use distilled water ever to hydrate a substrate and don't inject water.  If it's dry, mist from the top.  If it's super dry during the fruiting stage due to inattention, you can pour water around the edges so it soaks up from the bottom.

It's best to make substrates a bit on the dry side because they colonize faster.  I've tried the 'soak grains' before spawning thing and actually had slower results than from simply following proper procedure.  If your grains are at the correct moisture level(not over-hydrated) and your substrate is moist but not wet, colonization is fastest.  You then mist as required to bring the substrate to its proper moisture content for fruiting. . .after full colonization.
RR


--------------------
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OfflineMastaBlastar
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #18888786 - 09/25/13 11:11 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Guys and gals,
Don't use distilled water ever to hydrate a substrate and don't inject water.  If it's dry, mist from the top.  If it's super dry during the fruiting stage due to inattention, you can pour water around the edges so it soaks up from the bottom.

It's best to make substrates a bit on the dry side because they colonize faster.  I've tried the 'soak grains' before spawning thing and actually had slower results than from simply following proper procedure.  If your grains are at the correct moisture level(not over-hydrated) and your substrate is moist but not wet, colonization is fastest.  You then mist as required to bring the substrate to its proper moisture content for fruiting. . .after full colonization.
RR



Oh wow ok so no distilled water, I was totally told the wrong thing.  And I guess that makes sense about not injecting, I'll just keep with the misting like I have been.  And by distilled water are you meaning tap water (that's what I use) is the bad water, bottled water , or what?  Always been a little confused (and feel dumb for it) about this. 
About the soaking I have to try some soaking vs not soaking experiments, as I have been completely misinformed as to the effectiveness of this.  I thought at first it would be a great place to introduce contaminants but followed advice of more seasoned mycologists.  Maybe that is the source of my mold woes, seems that 25-40% of my tubs mold before first flush and 90-100% after the first flush tho that could be related to my harvesting technique.  Experimenting with coffee and H-lime now to see if I can get better numbers and some second and possibly 3rd (is it really possible?).


--------------------
Everything I have said, may say, will say, am thinking about saying and/or thinking/typing/dreaming/writing is in all likelyhood made up and has no factual basis in reality whatsoever, and is likely all plagiarized and copy pasted straight from someone else, so get mad at them .  Just a warning


Edited by MastaBlastar (09/25/13 11:12 AM)


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #18888941 - 09/25/13 11:54 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

MastaBlastar said:

About the soaking I have to try some soaking vs not soaking experiments, as I have been completely misinformed as to the effectiveness of this.  I thought at first it would be a great place to introduce contaminants but followed advice of more seasoned mycologists.  Maybe that is the source of my mold woes, seems that 25-40% of my tubs mold before first flush and 90-100% after the first flush tho that could be related to my harvesting technique.  Experimenting with coffee and H-lime now to see if I can get better numbers and some second and possibly 3rd (is it really possible?).




Soaking does not ever increase your contam risk if you follow good pasteurization procedures.

My write up regarding it is here.

Many people have had great success, including other TCs (such as Citric who came up with the idea) when dunking grains.  I've done both ways hundreds of times, I never do a tub without dunking the grains first anymore.

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Guys and gals,
Don't use distilled water ever to hydrate a substrate and don't inject water.  If it's dry, mist from the top.  If it's super dry during the fruiting stage due to inattention, you can pour water around the edges so it soaks up from the bottom.

It's best to make substrates a bit on the dry side because they colonize faster.  I've tried the 'soak grains' before spawning thing and actually had slower results than from simply following proper procedure.  If your grains are at the correct moisture level(not over-hydrated) and your substrate is moist but not wet, colonization is fastest.  You then mist as required to bring the substrate to its proper moisture content for fruiting. . .after full colonization.
RR




RR, I am curious as to the species and substrate used for your grain dunk.

When I use cubensis with either coir or hpoo, it speeds everything along and gives me a beautiful, uniform-looking substrate colonization in under a week's time at a 1:2 spawn ratio.

It also worked well for galindoi, but I have yet to try it out with gourmet species.

I even tested a cube isolate by taking one grain of sorghum that was dunked and one that was not and placing them on agar. The dunked grain won :shrug:


Can you go into detail a bit more, RR?


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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You should take a look. :hehehe:


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Invisible36fuckin5
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18889086 - 09/25/13 12:32 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I've tried dunking grains a few times now and notice 0 difference whatsoever. Either way my tub colonizes in under a week and I get the same yield.


--------------------
Redd Foxx said:
If you're offended I don't give a shit and don't come see me no more.

Pat The Bunny said:
A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me.

bodhisatta said:
i recommend common sense and figuring it out.

These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: 36fuckin5]
    #18889096 - 09/25/13 12:35 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Oh yeah, we've talked about it before 36 :wink:

Have you done tests with an isolate yet?

The grain on agar test was really eye opening for me.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:


Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU


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Invisible36fuckin5
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18889116 - 09/25/13 12:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

FrankHorrigan said:
Oh yeah, we've talked about it before 36 :wink:




Yep. Your theory was that because I get jars done in 4-5 days, they don't lose enough moisture to make a soak worth it. I tend to agree.

Quote:

Have you done tests with an isolate yet?




I haven't done an MS test with it, lol. I only use isolates, unless I'm just starting a new strain/species. Then I do a MS grow to find a clone, isolate from there and run it till the wheels fall off.


--------------------
Redd Foxx said:
If you're offended I don't give a shit and don't come see me no more.

Pat The Bunny said:
A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me.

bodhisatta said:
i recommend common sense and figuring it out.

These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: 36fuckin5]
    #18889128 - 09/25/13 12:44 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

36fuckin5 said:
Your theory was that because I get jars done in 4-5 days, they don't lose enough moisture to make a soak worth it. I tend to agree.




This has been the consensus with a couple other old-timers that I have spoken to as well. I bet it's difficult to rehydrate a grain that has barely lost any moisture :lol:

Quote:


I haven't done an MS test with it, lol. I only use isolates, unless I'm just starting a new strain/species. Then I do a MS grow to find a clone, isolate from there and run it till the wheels fall off.




:smilingpuppy:

I like your style.

I keep a "library" of sorts around, I'm trying to find that "perfect" fruiter that is aggressive, prolific, and potent. It's a long road.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:


Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU


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OfflineMastaBlastar
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18889212 - 09/25/13 01:04 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

FrankHorrigan said:
Quote:

MastaBlastar said:

About the soaking I have to try some soaking vs not soaking experiments, as I have been completely misinformed as to the effectiveness of this.  I thought at first it would be a great place to introduce contaminants but followed advice of more seasoned mycologists.  Maybe that is the source of my mold woes, seems that 25-40% of my tubs mold before first flush and 90-100% after the first flush tho that could be related to my harvesting technique.  Experimenting with coffee and H-lime now to see if I can get better numbers and some second and possibly 3rd (is it really possible?).




Soaking does not ever increase your contam risk if you follow good pasteurization procedures.

[




Ok I guess back to square 1 pinning down my contaminate source.  I don't THINK its my pasteurization tech, I follow yours as much to a T as possible, my PC is aluminum where pretty sure the ones you use are steel so i leave it on low heat the whole time, keeping the water temp around 165.  I was looking at your tips and tricks, I see you say rapid cooling is also important, I am not trying to jack the thread but could you elaborate?  I set the bags on a table in front of a fan and mix em up every 15 min or so and that seems to help a lot, are you  saying like an ice bath or something?


--------------------
Everything I have said, may say, will say, am thinking about saying and/or thinking/typing/dreaming/writing is in all likelyhood made up and has no factual basis in reality whatsoever, and is likely all plagiarized and copy pasted straight from someone else, so get mad at them .  Just a warning


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: Forgot to ReSoak My Grains before Monotub...what do do? [Re: MastaBlastar]
    #18889216 - 09/25/13 01:06 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

MastaBlastar said:
Ok I guess back to square 1 pinning down my contaminate source.  I don't THINK its my pasteurization tech, I follow yours as much to a T as possible, my PC is aluminum where pretty sure the ones you use are steel so i leave it on low heat the whole time, keeping the water temp around 165.  I was looking at your tips and tricks, I see you say rapid cooling is also important, I am not trying to jack the thread but could you elaborate?  I set the bags on a table in front of a fan and mix em up every 15 min or so and that seems to help a lot, are you  saying like an ice bath or something?




Let's not jack the thread. I'll send you a :pm: shortly.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:


Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU


Edited by FrankHorrigan (09/25/13 01:18 PM)


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