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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: 1234go]
    #18874963 - 09/22/13 07:41 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

That doesn't make it sacred imo.  I prefer not to place value judgments on the unknown.  :shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleRas Rising
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I'm a teapot


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Registered: 07/13/13
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: 1234go]
    #18875217 - 09/22/13 09:46 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

1234go said:
Quote:

Rasliam said:
Surely i am not the only one who sees fishing as a negative and harmful sport.




I'm with ya, dude. :wink:


Quote:

Rockhound said:
few life forms are aware of their own mortality.




All life is sacred, the complexity of an organisms make up doesn't make them any less important.




Life indeed is very sacred. Another one for the side of life!:thumbup:


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:bliss:To be altruistic and humble, to spread love and positivity where ever I go.*:bliss: 

*Does not include the Romp 
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InvisibleRas Rising
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: Icelander]
    #18875225 - 09/22/13 09:48 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
That doesn't make it sacred imo.  I prefer not to place value judgments on the unknown.  :shrug:




Perhaps not sacred, but i think it allows for it to stand somewhere in regards to respect and our adherence to it as a source of great mystery's.


--------------------
:bliss:To be altruistic and humble, to spread love and positivity where ever I go.*:bliss: 

*Does not include the Romp 
:inlove3::sunny::shroomeryhead::feelsshroomyman::shroomeryhead::sunny::inlove3:
Test Kits? SurRealitys gocchu'!


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Invisible1234go
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: Ras Rising]
    #18878181 - 09/22/13 09:56 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

You're surely welcome to an opinion. But unknown? It's been practiced belief of civilizations for millennia. I didn't come up with this one night in my room or anything. :shrug:


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: 1234go]
    #18878756 - 09/23/13 12:26 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Fishing is a sport to me. I am a horrible fisherman and can count the number of fish ive caught on one hand, but i see no harm whatsoever in it.



I think you are projecting complexities only a human mind could come up with onto a very simple animal. Its a dog eat dog world. You best believe if you were lost, hungry, and weak in an environment you are not suited for, a predator would just as quick turn you into a meal.


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OfflineInfiniteToker
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: elax420]
    #18879342 - 09/23/13 06:04 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

OP did you know that there are dolphins that "push" fish into shallow water for the local villagers to harvest?  The dolphins are then rewarded by the villagers with some of the catch. Been going on for centuries.    Everything is food. Everything is connected and death is not an end. 


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"I'm chilling in a room with a view, there's always room for improvement; so i grab my coat and go and prove it"-Method Man


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Invisible1234go
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: InfiniteToker]
    #18880132 - 09/23/13 11:10 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

SHROOMHUNTSMAN said:
OP did you know that there are dolphins that "push" fish into shallow water for the local villagers to harvest?  The dolphins are then rewarded by the villagers with some of the catch. Been going on for centuries.   

Everything is food. Everything is connected and death is not an end.




Very very true, good point. I'd like to state that when it comes to survival and staying alive, my comments about "cruel fishing" go straight out the window.
I am specifically referring to game sport fishing for trophies and whatnot.


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Offlinestanski
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: 1234go]
    #18883023 - 09/23/13 11:39 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I take the stance that any fishing that is done purely for sport and not for sustenance is definitely morally iffy. Throwing back small, uninjured fish is one thing, but it just seems pointless to me to catch a huge fish that could provide a wonderful meal and throw it back. Killing it quickly, showing appreciation and respect for its life, and cooking it to the best of your abilities seems perfectly reasonable for species that are in abundance if you are already eating meat regularly.


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OfflineInfiniteToker
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: 1234go]
    #18883530 - 09/24/13 05:16 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Fair enough I still disagree with you but to each their own.


--------------------
 

"I'm chilling in a room with a view, there's always room for improvement; so i grab my coat and go and prove it"-Method Man


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: InfiniteToker]
    #18884391 - 09/24/13 10:54 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I think hunting shrooms is a cruel sport.

Think of all those innocent, lovely, fungi you injure, maim, and kill for you own hedonistic pleasures.:lol:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: 1234go]
    #18884710 - 09/24/13 12:25 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

1234go said:
You're surely welcome to an opinion. But unknown? It's been practiced belief of civilizations for millennia. I didn't come up with this one night in my room or anything. :shrug:





Yes it's all a big unknown ultimately.  Just because people believed the world was flat did not make that belief correct. Christians believe there is a god, Buddhists do not.  Who is the one who knows?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlineshortpork
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: Ras Rising]
    #19028085 - 10/24/13 08:21 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

People feel killng animals to survive isnt ok but to be a vegitarian your killing many plants. Just a different form of life. Its all alive, plants are aware of their surroundings.


--------------------
It's all a lie. Everything's alive.


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OfflineJordy
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: shortpork]
    #19029447 - 10/25/13 02:53 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

So OP probably has an issue with the pictures that I have posted of billfish that have been tagged and released.

I've had this conversation too many times to sit here and type a long-winded rebuttal, but I have made vegans understand why I tag and release billfish and be OK with it. If you want to let fish go back, there are many ways you can minimize the harm that is done to the fish.


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OfflineChuckfinely
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Registered: 06/27/13
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: Jordy]
    #19060707 - 10/30/13 10:14 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Personally I don't see anything wrong with hunting/fishing as long as you intend to eat/use what you kill, and take every effort you can to make it as quick and painless as you could.


I wold never shoot a deer/bird/squirrel/etc unless I was certain that I was going to drop it. No leg/lower body shots for me.

Wen you catch a fish, you really should either toss it in a bucket of water to be killed all at once if you want more then a couple, or kill it quickly on the spot.


If something was about to eat you..would you rather have it just chop your head off real quick, or would you rather it maim you a little then let you flop around and suffocate?


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OfflineJordy
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: Chuckfinely] * 1
    #19076423 - 11/02/13 06:16 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

OK guys, here is my .02 since I do catch and release of what many would consider trophy fish. If you want to know more about why we do it, read on. This could be a TL;DR for many.

I primarily chase Marlin for tag and release fishing. There are many reasons for this. Obviously they are highly sought-after by many anglers for their large size, acrobatics, speed and strength - but modern attitudes, techniques and even the fish's design make them an ideal candidate for tag and release fishing.

For those who don't know what 'tagging' is, it is the act of placing a scientific research tag in the back of a fish. This tag has an ID number and information about the fish (length, estimated weight, location of catch etc) are recorded on a corresponding tag card and sent to the department or university that is monitoring the stocks to ensure the future of the fishery. The stress of the fight has not been for nothing. Part of the release process with Marlin is also a short amount of time 'reviving' the fish. By driving the boat forwards slowly and holding the fish by it's bill, water flows over the fish's gills and starts to revive the fish. They always let you know when they are ready to go by shaking their head or biting down on your hand. Having a large handle on their face makes them the most ideal candidate for release.

Big fish are usually breeding fish, so it's especially important to let big fish go. They will be the fish that provide you and your children fish to catch into the future.

Circle hooks have been another blessing to the fishery. When used properly, the hooks only lock into the corner of the jaw. If not used properly, they don't hook up at all and the fish is unharmed. This has been a great improvement to the catch and release fishery as the traditional 'J' hooks would hook up in the gills/internal organs and cause internal damage. A rise in tagging data since circle hooks have become mandatory has shown that bio-masses are getting bigger.

At the end of the day, if we killed every Marlin we caught for food then people would still be crying because of how many tonnes of fish we kill each year so fisherman are damned if they do and damned if they don't. My family has spent nearly half a million dollars on boats, gear, fuel and other costs to go and tag and release Marlin so I can't help but get my back up against the wall sometimes when someone who 'loves animals' tells me I am cruel when I love these fish just as much as they love all animals, just for different reasons. And especially considering how much money we fork out to do what we do, you need to love the fish to let it go.


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Invisiblebootster
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: Jordy]
    #19120940 - 11/11/13 02:39 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

I only shoot deer in the head. Almost takes the whole thing off. While some folks say "great shot", the others are casting doubt, "Oh man, that's gross".

I won't change my ways (unless it's a wall hanger).


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Invisibletealeaf
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: bootster]
    #19169289 - 11/21/13 10:24 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

fishing is cruel if you only fish for the sport of it and always release everything you catch, which is fucked up because fish taste delicious. people sound like idiots when they say fish dont feel pain.

there really isnt a way to make fishing a quicker kill for the fish besides diving and spearing the fish. hook and line is part of the battle so be sustainable and eat that meat!


--------------------
:dancingbear:

SonicTitan said:
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Offlinemylfgur
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: tealeaf]
    #19173704 - 11/22/13 05:34 AM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

tealeaf said:
fishing is cruel if you only fish for the sport of it and always release everything you catch, which is fucked up because fish taste delicious. people sound like idiots when they say fish dont feel pain.

there really isnt a way to make fishing a quicker kill for the fish besides diving and spearing the fish. hook and line is part of the battle so be sustainable and eat that meat!



:shrug:
I fish for sport. Often the fish that I catch (usually freshwater bass, largemouth and smallmouth) get superficial wounds and will live out their normal life spans. I do feel pretty bad when I accidentally hook them through the bottom of their mouth and they start to bleed. I would wager that 90% of the large fish I catch make it out unharmed. Bass are such balling predators anyways that a little lip tear doesn't get in the way of their feeding--they can just swallow bluegill whole.

I don't feel that bad when I catch bluegill and accidentally hook their gills. Those ones will probably die. Maybe I feel bad a little, but bluegill are stupid. Consciousness is not a have or have-not kind of thing, it's definitely on a continuum. There are a lot of humans that I don't think are as conscious as other humans, just go look in the Currently Active thread  :pipesmoke:.

I digress. I don't understand those people who think that life is precious, but still eat meat. Is there really much of a difference between shooting and killing some large game like deer to eat it, and going to the store to buy a cow? If anything I'd say I feel better for the deer, at least he didn't life his whole goddamn life in captivity only to meet his end upside down with his throat cut in a meat-packing plant. I don't believe that life is something sacred or something to be cherished. Life is short and cruel and violent. I'll leave you with some lines from a poem:

"But whence came the race of man? I will make a guess.
A change of climate killed the great northern forests,
Forcing manlike apes down from their trees,
They starved up there. They had been secure up there,
But famine is no security: among the withered branches blue famine:
They had to go down to the earth, where green still grew
And small meats might be gleaned. But there the great flesh-eaters,
Tiger and panther and the horrible fumbling bear
and endless wolf-packs made life
A dream of death. Therefore man had those dreams,
And kills out of pure terror. Therefore man walks erect,
Forever alerted: as the bear rises to fight
So man does always. Therefore he invented fire and flint weapons
In his desperate need. Therefore he is cruel and bloody-handed and
quick-witted, having survived
Against all odds. Never blame the man: his hard-pressed
Ancestors formed him: the other anthropoid apes were safe
In the great southern rain-forest and hardly changed
In a million years: but the race of man was made
By shock and agony. Therefore they invented
the song called language
To celebrate their survival and record their deeds.
And therefore the deeds they celebrate --
Achilles raging in the flame of the south,
Baltic Beowulf like a fog-blinded sea-bear
Prowling the blasted fenland
in the bleak twilight to the black water --
Are cruel and bloody. Epic, drama, and history,
Jesus and Judas, Jenghiz, Julius Ceasar, no great poem
Without the blood-splash. They are a little lower than the angels,
as someone said. -- Blood-snuffing rats:
But never blame them: a wound was made in the brain
When life became too hard, and has never healed.
It is there that they learned
trembling religion and blood-sacrifice,
It is there that they learned
to butcher beasts and slaughter men,
And hate the world: the great religions of love and kindness
May conceal that, not change it. They are not primary but reactions
Against the hate: as the eye after feeding on a red sunfall
Will see green suns."

Robinson Jeffers


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Invisibletealeaf
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: mylfgur]
    #19175503 - 11/22/13 04:22 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Hey I'm all for fishing and do so myself, all I think is that its fucked up if all you do is catch and release. Would be the same thing as going out with an air rifle and wounding animals that you would never take home to eat.

Only in this day and age is that fucked up, the way we are consuming natural resources is leaving little for the future and polluting the earth enough to prevent future growth. Roosevelt was hunting elephants in Africa and I'm pretty sure they cut back on that.

I aint no tree hugger but I LOVE the outdoors and simply like seeing it being preserved, its usually the people that don't genuinely go outdoors except for "sport" that fuck things up........


Quote:

I don't feel that bad when I catch bluegill and accidentally hook their gills. Those ones will probably die. Maybe I feel bad a little, but bluegill are stupid. Consciousness is not a have or have-not kind of thing, it's definitely on a continuum. There are a lot of humans that I don't think are as conscious as other humans, just go look in the




wait.......you throw back blue gills that you catch..............those things are freaking delicious....and very stupid


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Offlinemylfgur
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Re: Fishing is a cruel sport/hobby, [Re: tealeaf]
    #19175520 - 11/22/13 04:29 PM (10 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

tealeaf said:

wait.......you throw back blue gills that you catch..............those things are freaking delicious....and very stupid




They are delicious, and very stupid. Their utter stupidity is one major reason why I don't care much if they die or not. I don't always catch bluegills of legal size, especially when I fish at natural ponds on gamelands. At these natural ponds, there are so many bluegill that it is ridiculous, and many of them are very small--perfect bite-size for a bass to have a real feeding frenzy all day long.

I do practice catch-and-release a lot. Some days the big bluegill and crappie just aren't biting, so I'll go for bass. If it's a good day for big bluegill I will put them on a stringer and hope to take them home and eat them, but if I only end up with a handful of bluegill of legal size, I'll just let them go. There's no use killing and fileting up those few fish just for a few bites of fish nuggets. I won't take any small bass that I catch (under 24 inches), and I don't much care for the taste and texture of bass anyways.


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