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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Snake Salvation * 2
    #18872519 - 09/21/13 02:38 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

There is a new TV show about geniuses in Appalachia handling poisonous snakes because of some obscure verse in a fictional book. I was going to discuss the 'you die if you get bit and lose your faith' and 'Jesus loves you more for doing dangerous stuff' premises. But as I am done bashing Christians and calling them nutters, I won't. So some mod might just as well go ahead and lock this thread.



Note the preacher's missing arm amputated after severe damage from venom. This guy is a quick study and really, really dedicated to his imaginary friend.


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion] * 1
    #18872855 - 09/21/13 04:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I hear it only works if you plug them


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion] * 1
    #18873704 - 09/21/13 08:24 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

An intelligent looking bunch are they not?:braindamage:

When they amputate his head he'll be getting somewhere.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Icelander]
    #18873743 - 09/21/13 08:33 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Where, oh where, is PT, our resident Appalachian?


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #18889013 - 09/25/13 12:12 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Mark 16:18 - They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

With all that healing power, why not start a hospital instead?

Does anyone here doubt that I could come up with a concoction that they could drink and not survive? :evil: Usually they go for diluted arsenic, but nothing as lethal as potassium cyanide. Hell, I would settle for them drinking a bottle of Drano (lye) -and I would become a convert.


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Edited by OrgoneConclusion (09/25/13 12:37 PM)


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InvisibleRaven Gnosis
𝔰𝔢𝔯𝔭𝔢𝔫𝔱𝔦𝔠𝔦𝔡𝔞
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #18889084 - 09/25/13 12:32 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Making and watching them drink this concoction would be for... for science, right? :uhoh:
:devil:


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Raven Gnosis] * 1
    #18889118 - 09/25/13 12:43 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Of course. Just, for once, want to see someone do what they claim.

Wiki: An estimated 7,000 to 8,000 people are bitten by venomous snakes in the United States each year, with approximately five deaths.

That is a 0.00066 chance of dying - even without the miracle power of Jesus; so while very painful to get bit, rarely fatal. That is why I propose something that is usually 99.99% fatal if they truly want to demonstrate the Holy Spirit.

Just trying to help with their PR. :shrug:


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Offlinemy3rdeye
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Raven Gnosis]
    #18889155 - 09/25/13 12:50 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I have seen a few docs on these nuts. I have a problem with when you cover your kids in snakes and say it's in God's hands. If its just an adult I say it is Darwin's theory at work.




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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: my3rdeye]
    #18889188 - 09/25/13 12:56 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

If they were serious, they would handle nothing but taipan snakes, not wimpy rattlesnakes. There are no known survivors before the advent of anti-venom and all people bitten die without treatment.

Of course, they would need a steady influx of new members regularly.


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InvisiblePenelope_Tree
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #18890934 - 09/25/13 07:55 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

We ain't got no damned taipan snakes out here, boy. This is America! Seems like you might needa go-ta wunna 'em devil-killing ceremonies, if'n you're thinkin' the commies gots better snakes 'an we do.


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Penelope_Tree]
    #18890944 - 09/25/13 07:58 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Shoot dang


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18890964 - 09/25/13 08:03 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Did you know PT could hit a bulls-eye with a knife at 20 feet? She ain't no joke!


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InvisiblePenelope_Tree
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #18891005 - 09/25/13 08:17 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, I am practically Bear Grylls. :manvsfish:


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Penelope_Tree]
    #18891026 - 09/25/13 08:22 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I can hardly wait to go on one of your noodling tours. :cool:


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Offlinecrumblebum
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #18891167 - 09/25/13 08:58 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Also from Appalachia. Not ashamed. I live literally in the woods. There are bugs in my kitchen that just live there.

But on to those nutters: yeah, what kind of crazy jerks would do something potentially dangerous just to induce an altered state of consciousness? Right guys? Right? What kind of lunatics would engage in potentially illegal activity just to alter the chemical makeup of their brains to have what they believe are divine experiences? Huh? What freaks!

Note to internet: we still need a sarcasm font.


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: crumblebum]
    #18891179 - 09/25/13 09:01 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

crumblebum said:
Also from Appalachia. Not ashamed. I live literally in the woods. There are bugs in my kitchen that just live there.

But on to those nutters: yeah, what kind of crazy jerks would do something potentially dangerous just to induce an altered state of consciousness? Right guys? Right? What kind of lunatics would engage in potentially illegal activity just to alter the chemical makeup of their brains to have what they believe are divine experiences? Huh? What freaks!

Note to internet: we still need a sarcasm font.




You're comparing someone handling snakes to a drug? And assuming that drug users are interested in 'divine experiences'? And assuming that those snake handlers are attempting to alter their chemistry?

:curbyourenthusiasm:

A drug user is seeking a high, when a rattle snake injects hemotoxic venom in you there is no upside


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: crumblebum]
    #18891182 - 09/25/13 09:02 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Well at least you're not from Kentucky. :thumbup:


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinecrumblebum
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Icelander]
    #18891271 - 09/25/13 09:22 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I wasn't talking about getting bit in particular. The experience itself is bound to induce a high. The danger, the community, etc. You can get high on situations. Anyone who's ever been in a church while hymns are collectively sung knows why it's done. Most religious rituals exist because when they are performed in context and for the right crowd, they produce a high. Being in the middle of a 100 people singing the same song in different tunes produces an experience, like drum circles and shit. The people in that picture are getting high on pre-existing brain chemicals because the situation is inducing them. There's a feeling of "divinity" that come along with many hallucinogenics and religious rituals/experiences.

I'm assuming that some drug users are seeking a divine experience. And while they don't know it, those snake handlers ARE attempting to alter their brain chemistry. Not by getting bit but by NOT getting bit.


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InvisiblePenelope_Tree
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18891301 - 09/25/13 09:28 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Pffft, he's got a point. Both alter their brain chemistry for a predetermined goal. Plus, that preacher prob got super points with God for sacrificing his arm. :sadyes:


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Penelope_Tree]
    #18891430 - 09/25/13 09:57 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Penelope_Tree said:
Both alter their brain chemistry for a predetermined goal.




Differences:

Drug use does not revolve around religion, with its manifest aspects of proselytizing, delusion and brainwashing.

A snake bite is much more dangerous and painful than say marijuana or LSD.


Its all the same though right? Getting high by your own choice vs self-mutilation for the cause of a delusion one was likely pressured into through some form or another. On topic, should we close down all the mental institutions since any subjective delusion is now objectively sane?


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Offlinecrumblebum
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18891615 - 09/25/13 10:22 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Repertoire89 said:
Quote:

Penelope_Tree said:
Both alter their brain chemistry for a predetermined goal.




Differences:

Drug use does not revolve around religion, with its manifest aspects of proselytizing, delusion and brainwashing.

A snake bite is much more dangerous and painful than say marijuana or LSD.


Its all the same though right? Getting high by your own choice vs self-mutilation for the cause of a delusion one was likely pressured into through some form or another. On topic, should we close down all the mental institutions since any subjective delusion is now objectively sane?




No, the institutions are for people who don't care for their subjective delusions. We should rescind any and all mental hygiene laws that force people into said institutions if they're happy with their delusions.

Back on topic, the alteration of brain chemistry doesn't come from the bites, everyone jump off that. The bite just hurts and sucks. The change in brain chem comes from being in a large group and doing something dangerous. Riding a motorcycle very fast, rock climbing, owning cats, all these things carry massive, often fatal risks, and produce the same "high" as snake handling. That's why many religions DO use drugs for spiritual purposes.


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: crumblebum]
    #18891653 - 09/25/13 10:27 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

crumblebum said:
Quote:

Repertoire89 said:
Quote:

Penelope_Tree said:
Both alter their brain chemistry for a predetermined goal.




Differences:

Drug use does not revolve around religion, with its manifest aspects of proselytizing, delusion and brainwashing.

A snake bite is much more dangerous and painful than say marijuana or LSD.


Its all the same though right? Getting high by your own choice vs self-mutilation for the cause of a delusion one was likely pressured into through some form or another. On topic, should we close down all the mental institutions since any subjective delusion is now objectively sane?




No, the institutions are for people who don't care for their subjective delusions. We should rescind any and all mental hygiene laws that force people into said institutions if they're happy with their delusions.




So a schizophrenic paranoid man who frequently stalks or attacks people, should be treated where?



Quote:


Back on topic, the alteration of brain chemistry doesn't come from the bites, everyone jump off that. The bite just hurts and sucks. The change in brain chem comes from being in a large group and doing something dangerous. Riding a motorcycle very fast, rock climbing, owning cats, all these things carry massive, often fatal risks, and produce the same "high" as snake handling. That's why many religions DO use drugs for spiritual purposes.




What is your point in this? This doesn't confront these points:

Drug use does not revolve around religion, with its manifest aspects of proselytizing, delusion and brainwashing.

A snake bite is much more dangerous and painful than say marijuana or LSD.


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Offlinecrumblebum
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18891686 - 09/25/13 10:31 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Repertoire89 said:


Drug use does not revolve around religion, with its manifest aspects of proselytizing, delusion and brainwashing.

A snake bite is much more dangerous and painful than say marijuana or LSD.





1. Sometimes it does. Religions were very likely the first to organize and recognize drug use.

2. AGAIN, it's not about the bite. The bite does not produce anything at all. It's about the experience of handling the snake and NOT getting bit, and being in a group of people who all believe what you believe. The fact that the relative risks are different doesn't matter much. It's worse than the drugs you mentioned, but better than other drugs you didn't mention, like meth, blow, designer drugs, etc.


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: crumblebum]
    #18891714 - 09/25/13 10:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

crumblebum said:
Quote:

Repertoire89 said:


Drug use does not revolve around religion, with its manifest aspects of proselytizing, delusion and brainwashing.

A snake bite is much more dangerous and painful than say marijuana or LSD.





1. Sometimes it does. Religions were very likely the first to organize and recognize drug use.

2. AGAIN, it's not about the bite. The bite does not produce anything at all. It's about the experience of handling the snake and NOT getting bit, and being in a group of people who all believe what you believe. The fact that the relative risks are different doesn't matter much. It's worse than the drugs you mentioned, but better than other drugs you didn't mention, like meth, blow, designer drugs, etc.




"Sometimes" doesn't matter.

A snakebite is safer than cocaine? :lol:
The snakebite is relevant to this thread "snake salvation"


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Offlinecrumblebum
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18891737 - 09/25/13 10:40 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yes, I'd say over time, cocaine use and snake handling are about equivalent danger. Amputations, heart attacks, etc.


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OfflineNetDiver
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: crumblebum]
    #18892098 - 09/26/13 12:15 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Well, cocaine can be used intelligently. Snakes can be handled intelligently too, but if the snake isn't biting you because you're handling it properly, then it's not really a test of faith, is it? It's a test of how good you are at snake handling.


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Offlinecrumblebum
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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: NetDiver]
    #18892149 - 09/26/13 12:28 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

There's a lot of circular logic and obvious dead ends used to justify the practice, granted.


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Re: Snake Salvation [Re: crumblebum]
    #18901362 - 09/28/13 02:29 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Hello everyone! I'm new to the forum and from this glorified state of NC that is home to this tv show, but I'm located eastern NC in the middle of the state I might add, lol.  I just wanted to say something, it may be not addressing the question, it may be, idk? (new to this) - But I actually went to college with an individual that took up snake handling in church and soon converted to Presbyterian, but whoever first said they handle the serpents because of the bible verse in Mark is absolutely correct about that.  Also, it's easier for them to take up serpents because it's their religion, as well as while holding these snakes, i mean you have to imagine if you had a 4 inch thick copperhead rattling in your hands how much dopamine/endorphines would just be cascading through your brain?!?
I mean I'm good with where I stand, but to each his own in that respect I guess.  But the main thing is this practice obviously is located in very remote regions with not too many people around so they are around it and see their parents doing it since birth since they are in the deep Appalachians so they probably look at what we do and think we are crazy as all hell or going to hell for that matter.  Sry the post was so long just wanted to share what the guy I had met that actually did that told me which I felt as very very interesting to learn about. But seems like a great crowd and thanks for allowing me to be a part of this community!


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