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Deviate
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Yogi1]
#18864223 - 09/19/13 06:03 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yogi1 said: Dont be real offended, its just that you can do as much good helping Catholic brainwashed kids as you can helping drug addicts by becoming a DEA officer.
I wasn't offended until you made that stupid comment. How is teaching kids good values in any way like becoming a DEA officer? You know what, nevermind. I didn't make this thread to ask whether or not I should do this, I asked for imput on how to go about it. If you don't have any, then I would appreciate it you would kindly keep your mouth shut. Why is everyone so judgemental?
Quote:
I think you could help shape perceptions by giving multiple perspectives of the same limited dogma, but I wouldnt think that its a job worth doing.
I think its funny how on this SPIRITUALITY and MYSTICISM forum, no one sees any value in teaching children good values, or how to pray or the goodness of God.
I thought that this forum was made specifically for people who felt it was alright to believe in such things. I'm not saying you must agree with me to post here, but I did think that the idea behind this forum was to create a place where it was alright to be religious, where it was alright to believe in mysticism and where you wouldn't have to deal with endless hostility for expressing those views.
Edited by Deviate (09/19/13 06:28 PM)
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Yogi1
Squatchin
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Deviate]
#18864324 - 09/19/13 06:20 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Dont forget to teach them about a talking snake and that there is a man in the sky that created the universe in 6 days and rested on the sabbath.... also sex is bad before marriage and its sinful to use protection, despite how much debt you may accrue and whether or not that may affect clothing and feeding said children.

Teach them that.
Also gay people are going to hell. The old testiment also teaches that unfinned seafood is sinful and dressing in clothing made of more than one material is sinful...
Is the old testiment part of their belief system because I would love to post some leviticus and scripture on the subject of slavery...
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Deviate
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Yogi1]
#18864377 - 09/19/13 06:34 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yogi1 said: Dont forget to teach them about a talking snake and that there is a man in the sky that created the universe in 6 days and rested on the sabbath.... also sex is bad before marriage and its sinful to use protection, despite how much debt you may accrue and whether or not that may affect clothing and feeding said children.

Teach them that.
Also gay people are going to hell. The old testiment also teaches that unfinned seafood is sinful and dressing in clothing made of more than one material is sinful...
Is the old testiment part of their belief system because I would love to post some leviticus and scripture on the subject of slavery...
Ok I get the message. You are hostile to religion. The thing is, does it look I made this thread to debate the merits of religion?
Edited by Deviate (09/19/13 06:35 PM)
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Yogi1
Squatchin
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Kinko]
#18864380 - 09/19/13 06:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kinko said:
Quote:
Deviate said: I am very excited about this opportunity and the chance to share what I have learned about the spiritual path with a small group of young souls.
I believe that there is a lot I can teach these kids if I can figure out a way to present the information in such a way that it is absorbable to them. I made many mistakes in my own life that resulted in great suffering, so if I could save just one of these youngsters from going through what I have had to go through, my time will be well spent. The main thing that I want to convey is that our culture has a general misunderstanding of the causes of happiness and trying to obtain happiness without understanding its causes, leads to at best dissatisfaction and at worst unrelenting unbearable suffering.
The main advantage of the church is that it teaches an alternative path to follow in life, an alternative guide to finding happiness that differs considerably from the ideas so prevalent in our culture which associates happiness with wealth, power, prestige, luxury and sensual pleasure, all of which pass away. This was the missing link in my life. I was happy as a child, at peace with myself while out in nature, exploring plants and animals and observing life in all its manifestations. It was only once I absorbed the mindset of my culture, that I became miserable. Jesus Christ came to bare witness to the truth, so that we could learn the truth and the truth could set us free.
So anyway, I am looking for advice on how best to teach these kids. Feel free to post whatever kind of advice you like, whether it be general advice or suggestions on specific things or activities/games to play with the kids in order to make things more fun and interesting for them or ways to keep them engaged.
Bare in mind that I am not allowed to teach them anything contrary to the teachings of the Catholic Church.
hopefully some of the kids will know better than to believe anything coming out of your mouth.

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Yogi1
Squatchin
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Deviate]
#18864390 - 09/19/13 06:38 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said:
Quote:
Yogi1 said: Dont forget to teach them about a talking snake and that there is a man in the sky that created the universe in 6 days and rested on the sabbath.... also sex is bad before marriage and its sinful to use protection, despite how much debt you may accrue and whether or not that may affect clothing and feeding said children.

Teach them that.
Also gay people are going to hell. The old testiment also teaches that unfinned seafood is sinful and dressing in clothing made of more than one material is sinful...
Is the old testiment part of their belief system because I would love to post some leviticus and scripture on the subject of slavery...
Ok I get the message. You are hostile to religion. The thing is, does it look I made this thread to debate the merits of religion?
I gave you a legit idea for how to potentially actually make a difference. I'm hostile toward people being hostile toward me. Be hostile again and I'll start posting the parts of the bible christians like to skip over when indoctrinating children like god turning someone into salt for looking backwards.
--------------------
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Deviate
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Yogi1]
#18864404 - 09/19/13 06:40 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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I guess the idea of having a forum where it's alright to believe in spiritual and mystical things is a lost cause. Maybe we should change this to be called the atheists and skeptics lounge.
Since you all know so much better than me what children should be learning, why dont you tell me what value system they should be raised with. What if any education should they be given regarding spirituality and mysticism? What if their parents specifically want their children to be taught the ancient wisdom from a particular culture, how to pray and things like that?
Please explain your value system in which it is wrong to teach these things. It's very easy to tear other peoples ideas down, it's a lot harder to present a coherent alternative for how everything should be run.
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Deviate
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Yogi1]
#18864415 - 09/19/13 06:42 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yogi1 said:
Quote:
Deviate said:
Quote:
Yogi1 said: Dont forget to teach them about a talking snake and that there is a man in the sky that created the universe in 6 days and rested on the sabbath.... also sex is bad before marriage and its sinful to use protection, despite how much debt you may accrue and whether or not that may affect clothing and feeding said children.

Teach them that.
Also gay people are going to hell. The old testiment also teaches that unfinned seafood is sinful and dressing in clothing made of more than one material is sinful...
Is the old testiment part of their belief system because I would love to post some leviticus and scripture on the subject of slavery...
Ok I get the message. You are hostile to religion. The thing is, does it look I made this thread to debate the merits of religion?
I gave you a legit idea for how to potentially actually make a difference. I'm hostile toward people being hostile toward me. Be hostile again and I'll start posting the parts of the bible christians like to skip over when indoctrinating children like god turning someone into salt for looking backwards.
No, you told me it wasn't even worth doing.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: PocketLady]
#18864589 - 09/19/13 07:14 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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It's absolute madness, and it seems the ground rules vary massively depending on the educational establishment. The situation in non-denominational schools in the UK is that the teacher should refrain from imposing their own religious and political views on students.
One cannot push these things in the US public school system either, but he's talking about a Catholic parochial school where Catholic parents produce Catholic children, and school them accordingly. Hey, everybody has to be something, and if an individual wants to throw off the religion of their parents, or their secular humanism, agnosticism, or atheism in order to Awaken from whatever programming they had been subjected to, they will. I was positively influenced by two Catholic families as a young reformed Jewish kid, and took baptism in the church that both families attended. I went on to study in a Methodist seminary, and it was years and years until I rediscovered some value to Judaism via Kabbalah. I still light candles on the Sabbath, although I am not ruled by the Sabbath like an extremist Orthodox Jew, but I remain master of it as the biblical Jesus taught. Nevertheless, I am a heretic to mainstream Christians, and an apostate to mainstream Jews, so I am not waving any religious banners here. I have practiced and studied Hindu and Buddhist Yogas since 1973, and remain an esotericist of no particular stripe. People see what they see. Some note my sir name and send me a Hannukah card. Others read other stuff in me and send me a Christmas card. The nicest thing I can receive is a hit of acid.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Spacerific
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
#18864615 - 09/19/13 07:19 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Show this video in class, and try to intelligently discuss it.
I don't doubt the kids' ability to discuss it intelligently, I doubt this ability of anybody that's put there to "teach religion".
-------------------- Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.
For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it. - Matthew 13:16
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Deviate]
#18864661 - 09/19/13 07:27 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said:
Quote:
eve69 said:
Quote:
Deviate said: I am very excited about this opportunity and the chance to share what I have learned about the spiritual path with a small group of young souls.
I believe that there is a lot I can teach these kids if I can figure out a way to present the information in such a way that it is absorbable to them. I made many mistakes in my own life that resulted in great suffering, so if I could save just one of these youngsters from going through what I have had to go through, my time will be well spent. The main thing that I want to convey is that our culture has a general misunderstanding of the causes of happiness and trying to obtain happiness without understanding its causes, leads to at best dissatisfaction and at worst unrelenting unbearable suffering.
The main advantage of the church is that it teaches an alternative path to follow in life, an alternative guide to finding happiness that differs considerably from the ideas so prevalent in our culture which associates happiness with wealth, power, prestige, luxury and sensual pleasure, all of which pass away. This was the missing link in my life. I was happy as a child, at peace with myself while out in nature, exploring plants and animals and observing life in all its manifestations. It was only once I absorbed the mindset of my culture, that I became miserable. Jesus Christ came to bare witness to the truth, so that we could learn the truth and the truth could set us free.
So anyway, I am looking for advice on how best to teach these kids. Feel free to post whatever kind of advice you like, whether it be general advice or suggestions on specific things or activities/games to play with the kids in order to make things more fun and interesting for them or ways to keep them engaged.
Bare in mind that I am not allowed to teach them anything contrary to the teachings of the Catholic Church.
No offense but I feel sorry for them.
Why? Because they are in religious education or because I am their teacher? If the latter, I question why you think they would be better off with someone else, who would probably be a lot less likely to be willing to even listen to the opinions of non catholics not to mention the fact that you barely know me and have no means by which to judge my teaching ability.
Therefore, it seems to me that although you attempted to disguise your intent with the phrase "no offense" your comment was meant to do nothing other than to offend.
Why because you're one of the most fucking hard headed know it all linear thinking motherfuckers at S&M
-------------------- ...or something
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Deviate]
#18864774 - 09/19/13 07:48 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said: I guess the idea of having a forum where it's alright to believe in spiritual and mystical things is a lost cause. Maybe we should change this to be called the atheists and skeptics lounge.
Since you all know so much better than me what children should be learning, why dont you tell me what value system they should be raised with. What if any education should they be given regarding spirituality and mysticism? What if their parents specifically want their children to be taught the ancient wisdom from a particular culture, how to pray and things like that?
Please explain your value system in which it is wrong to teach these things. It's very easy to tear other peoples ideas down, it's a lot harder to present a coherent alternative for how everything should be run.
Humanitarianism
You can say and believe any fucking thing you want but there only one truth I know
there aren't religions, there are people.
Religions forget that, and then you have a bunch of fools all acting like they're defending God. Fucking big -as if.-
God doesn't need you or anyone else to act all fucking holy.
But holier than any religious person is someone who really cares from deep within, and who is willing to go the distance for others.
It's the small things. The small things. Don't teach a bunch of specious shit and then not give the poor boy a ride home (AND NOT ON YOUR LAP)
-------------------- ...or something
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Deviate
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: eve69]
#18865500 - 09/19/13 10:29 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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And I apologize if I was hostile to you. It was nothing personal, I did mean to direct my comments at you really. I was just expressing my frustration with this forum, because I thought it was supposed to be a place where a person could express spiritual beliefs without having them being attacked, scruitinized and made fun of all day.
It's not that I am afraid of being challenged, (although it that were the case I dont see why it would change anything) but the truth is I have spent countless hours of my time debating spiritual topics with sceptics, atheists and agnostics and I eventually grew tired of it. If atheists had their way, I would be on the interet 24/7 defending spiritual beliefs. There is absolutely no limit to the ways in which a belief system can be attacked and to expect me to have to justify an entire belief system in every single thread is absolutely absurd.
Why not just ignore the atheists? well I could do that if it didn't seem like every single response was from an atheist. So yogi when you make comments like gay people are going to hell (even though the church doesn't teach that) all you're doing is repeating things I have before ad nauseam already. Quote:
eve69 said:
Quote:
Deviate said:
Quote:
eve69 said:
Quote:
Deviate said: I am very excited about this opportunity and the chance to share what I have learned about the spiritual path with a small group of young souls.
I believe that there is a lot I can teach these kids if I can figure out a way to present the information in such a way that it is absorbable to them. I made many mistakes in my own life that resulted in great suffering, so if I could save just one of these youngsters from going through what I have had to go through, my time will be well spent. The main thing that I want to convey is that our culture has a general misunderstanding of the causes of happiness and trying to obtain happiness without understanding its causes, leads to at best dissatisfaction and at worst unrelenting unbearable suffering.
The main advantage of the church is that it teaches an alternative path to follow in life, an alternative guide to finding happiness that differs considerably from the ideas so prevalent in our culture which associates happiness with wealth, power, prestige, luxury and sensual pleasure, all of which pass away. This was the missing link in my life. I was happy as a child, at peace with myself while out in nature, exploring plants and animals and observing life in all its manifestations. It was only once I absorbed the mindset of my culture, that I became miserable. Jesus Christ came to bare witness to the truth, so that we could learn the truth and the truth could set us free.
So anyway, I am looking for advice on how best to teach these kids. Feel free to post whatever kind of advice you like, whether it be general advice or suggestions on specific things or activities/games to play with the kids in order to make things more fun and interesting for them or ways to keep them engaged.
Bare in mind that I am not allowed to teach them anything contrary to the teachings of the Catholic Church.
No offense but I feel sorry for them.
Why? Because they are in religious education or because I am their teacher? If the latter, I question why you think they would be better off with someone else, who would probably be a lot less likely to be willing to even listen to the opinions of non catholics not to mention the fact that you barely know me and have no means by which to judge my teaching ability.
Therefore, it seems to me that although you attempted to disguise your intent with the phrase "no offense" your comment was meant to do nothing other than to offend.
Why because you're one of the most fucking hard headed know it all linear thinking motherfuckers at S&M
Yes I'm hard headed, it has its pluses and minuses.
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Kickle
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Deviate]
#18865532 - 09/19/13 10:38 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said: I think its funny how on this SPIRITUALITY and MYSTICISM forum, no one sees any value in teaching children good values, or how to pray or the goodness of God.
I thought that this forum was made specifically for people who felt it was alright to believe in such things. I'm not saying you must agree with me to post here, but I did think that the idea behind this forum was to create a place where it was alright to be religious, where it was alright to believe in mysticism and where you wouldn't have to deal with endless hostility for expressing those views.
I take spirituality and mysticism quite seriously. Maybe too seriously. When I think of these things I picture someone who wants to go beyond the everyday. And that's why I'm generally VERY lenient with what is posted so long as it fits the s&m theme. I figure any drama is utterly every day. People bicker over ideas in every corner of life I have ever seen. And I find it for the most part terribly boring and not woth investing anything in to. Not to mention futile to try and stop. There is no moderator, who through banning, has then been able to stop banning or locking threads.
Id much rather see posters in this forum who don't get shaken up by the everyday drama of differing views. And not just because it makes my job easier. But because of what it suggests about their emotional stability in some very positive ways. IMO one of the few signs of a functioning spiritual life. I do however understand that all of us have limits and someone should be able to step in when it starts becoming too personal or just flat out tiresome and we are no longer aside from but rather entangled in negativity. I do get that. Any time I sense myself heading that way I try to walk away because there is no fall back for a mod.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that this forum is here for you. And I try to encourage an environment that doesn't overly coddle but if you need a hand its here. I don't read every thread but I do check moderator notifications. If you feel posts are out of hand or even off-topic, hit the whistle and it will get looked at. Without that, I let the waves of the forum be waves. And I trust the posters here to ride those waves in a spiritual way to the best of their abilities.
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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fivepointer
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Deviate]
#18866229 - 09/20/13 04:56 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said: Bare in mind that I am not allowed to teach them anything contrary to the teachings of the Catholic Church.
How do you reconcile Catholic teachings that are opposed to scripture? Scripture warns not to follow the traditions of men, but the Word of God.
Catholic teachings opposed to scripture: Mary is sinless (Bible declares the only sinless one is Jesus) Assumption of Mary (Nowhere to be found in scripture) Forbidding to marry (Priests are forbidden to marry. Bible states elders should be married.) Abstaining from meats on certain days (All foods are to be enjoyed with thankfulness) Priests can forgive sin (Absurd) Purgatory (Not in scripture at all) Salvation by cooperative merit (Sinners have no merits, Jesus only saves sinners, those without merits) Sacramentalism- The Mass (Not in scripture, no church's actions can ever forgive a sin.) Baptismal regeneration (Not in scripture, no church's actions can ever forgive a sin.)
I could go on and on, but you get my point.
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eve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--



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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: fivepointer]
#18866242 - 09/20/13 05:10 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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This thread apparently is about Deviate wanting better advice about teaching children about rabbits with horns, pigs that can fly, and unicorns.
Deviate you've been at Shroomery for ten fucking years. Ignorance is no excuse. Don't get huffy. If you wanted pure Christian discourse you would go to Hipforums Christian Sanctuary.
You don't actually want discourse, you want people to -ooooo and aaaaa- about your great compassionate ability to raise new youths (into the same old fucking cognitive dissonance).
What you do will be no different from serving food in a cafeteria. You will be told emphatically what to do and nothing any creative - mystical - or spiritual type here says is going to make a shred of use.
I could go on - but you have deadf ears. I have seen it over and over with you. You don't discourse with people of different beliefs. You roll over them in your ultra compassionate Christian self-righteousness, and then play the woe is me guilt card.
That's why I said what I said. You will be a great tool for the machine - anything else - I am not sensing it.
-------------------- ...or something
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i like cow poo
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Yogi1]
#18866266 - 09/20/13 05:33 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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wow thats fucked up. every experience with the catholic church has been horrible. fuck that biggotry infested religion.
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Spacerific
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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: i like cow poo]
#18866589 - 09/20/13 08:24 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Teach them that drugs and premarital sex are bad and to never come to Shroomery 
They will of course see through your bullshit, but yeah play the part as if it matters
-------------------- Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.
For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it. - Matthew 13:16
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Spacerific] 1
#18868094 - 09/20/13 02:54 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Obviously you want him to get fired immediately. Moreover, you should doubt the ability of 10 year olds to watch a show like that because (1) most would be more interested in making fun of the man's accent, (2) a majority would be bored within 2 minutes, owing to simple but adult vocabulary, and (3) many would not understand, or if they did, there would be those who were traumatized. Lastly, a teacher cannot show any materials to kids that are not officially sanctioned by whomever is responsible for curriculum. You cannot discuss atheism with 10 year old children without their parents' consent either, and given that the whole trip is set within a Catholic school, why would you even consider this a viable option? You are utterly out of touch with reality, unless you are trying to be humorous, but I find no humor in teaching atheism since it's just the belief system of a materialist. Who needs to inculcate kids with crass materialism? That's just as grotesque as catechism IMO.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest


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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
#18868394 - 09/20/13 04:04 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Why can't you have an an open discussion with kids about atheism and all religions? Teaching them what those from both sides claim?
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: I volunteered to teach religious education to fifth graders [Re: Grapefruit]
#18868710 - 09/20/13 05:17 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Cause we're humans.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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