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OfflineGlacius
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1911442 - 09/12/03 11:41 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Ha yeah the Grudge. Try learning it on the guitar. I know the whole thing it took me months to figure out. No tab on the internet is even worthy of it thats for sure. I have extensively reveiwed every tab and I dont think most people have the ability to understand the music. Lateralus is something that can not be defined or understood by anyone. Not even Tool themselves. That album comes from such a higher state of consciousness trying to put it to words is impossible. This is a good idea though I like it but you are bound to get lost. And your all wrong with the time signatures but thats ok your doing a really good job most people wouldnt even get that far!! Anyways the timing for the song is the timing but its not how he plays it. He doesnt play it with the timing for the song. Geeze I cant explain if you dont already know!! I have been playing tool for years and I still cant get the grudge 100% correct. Its not something that you could write music for thats for sure. Their is no language for music like that.

I dont know if you guys ever noticed but durring the begining riff he plays two riffs at once with one guitar. they both fit time timing of the song and they both make each other sound differently. Anyways listen for that most people dont hear it. 46 and two is not a very complicated song as far as guitar goes but the drums make it something worthy of the gods.


--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling

Edited by Glacius (09/12/03 11:44 PM)

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OfflineBlastrid
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Glacius]
    #1911685 - 09/13/03 01:44 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

And your all wrong with the time signatures 




Care to share your interpretations?  I'm sure the majority is in 5/4.

Quote:

Lateralus is something that can not be defined or understood by anyone. Not even Tool themselves. That album comes from such a higher state of consciousness trying to put it to words is impossible.




I agree that it came from a higher state of consciousness, but I disagree that it cannot be understood by anyone, including Tool.  They wrote it, of course they understand it.  It's not like they played once and it spewed forth.  Even if it had 'higher' sources, it was born from human minds.

Quote:

Anyways the timing for the song is the timing but its not how he plays it. He doesnt play it with the timing for the song. 




What does that mean?

Quote:

I dont know if you guys ever noticed but durring the begining riff he plays two riffs at once with one guitar




If you are speaking of the opening few measures, you are speaking of the guitar, and the bass guitar.  The bass guitar is playing a lick that fits, but is actually a higher pitch than the guitar. the guitar lick is the same as the independant riff at :33, then right after that the bass comes in with its opening lick. Since I've heard this so many times live, I know for sure that it is played by one guitar, and one bass.  Even tho maynard plays guitar sometimes, this is not one of those songs.

Thanks for your input into further dissection!  :smile: 


--------------------
Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.

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OfflineGlacius
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1911949 - 09/13/03 03:51 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

No I didnt mean there is two guitars. I mean it sounds like two guitars but there are only one.  Anyways I dont know what I mean I have spent so many countless hours listening to Tool and I still dont know how to explain it. And you must realize that when you are a creative musician half to all of the stuff you come up with you dont understand.
I bet you ask Adam how he comes up with the shit you will probably get an " I dunno it just sorta comes i guess I cant explain it"??

  The grudge is played in a very off-beat manner. Have you played much tool??  The grudge has its main beginning riff " dada dada da dadada". Thats how I explain it anyways ha LOL :lol: fuck music as a language!! Anyways at the same time he strums the d and e strings, while hammering on and off of the second fret on the bottom d string. This creates two different rythms in the same riff. One goes as he strums. The other is more complicasted becuase of the hammer ons and pulloffs. This creats a very interesting effect with the riff. You cant hear it all at the same time. You can only hear one or the other. It does not fit together!!!!  but it does!! Its like when you look at a three dimentional box with only lines not filled in. You can see it in two different ways, but only percieve each one at a time!! A lot of tools music is like this. 


--------------------
addicted to reason
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I cannot see outside but its calling

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OfflineBlastrid
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Glacius]
    #1911977 - 09/13/03 04:20 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

I think I understand what you're trying to say, But from what I know of Tool, they are very precise. Which leads me to believe that every note is wholely intentional, and planned.
hehe music is a language, in fact, standard notation is the written form of it.
I have played much Tool, and I've seen them play live a few different times, and everything was clockwork.
The grudge is off-beat, in a 4/4 manner. We are so used to common time, The grudge seems very awkward, but it fits, and it makes sense theoretically. You just have to put the pieces together.

To be a creative musician, and to have successful output in your instrument, you must understand the capabilities, at least, of the instrument. You don't have to understand abs. everything about music theory, experimental usage... etc.. But such a tight unit as Tool is, rhythm, esp is so important, and so precisely planned and coordinated.

To write a rhythm and song based around the Fibonacci Sequence is such a task, but then to write another song that the musicians themselves can't understand? I really don't think so.

Maybe Adam doesn't know where it came from, but I'm sure he knows what he's playing.

hehe and my interpretation of the opening lick:
"tri-pl-et-da tri-pl-et-da...." da being the downbeat. which puts it in 4/4


--------------------
Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.

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OfflineGlacius
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1911985 - 09/13/03 04:29 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

You guys are really smart I love talking to people about tool. You guys are the ones with the type of minds that can understand the music!! Anways raise your hand if you play tool!! I play guitar and can play almost every song on lateralus and Aenima!! So I want to start by getting into the song schism. Now lets open up our CD players children and insert Lateralus!! Be carfull not to damage the CD!! Pretend your playing that stupid kid game Operation!! Now that we have succesfully iserted the tool CD without too much trouble lets move on :lol:

  Ok lets go to song five and let it play. Once we get to the great 14th fret to 17th fret to 14th frett to 19th frett to 12th fret to 14 frett to 10th frett to 12th frett 10th 12th 14th frett ect ect we want to play really close attention!! Listen in the background for noises and effects. You will find that there are things there that you cannot hear sometimes and things that you can. Depending on your perceptual state you will hear different things. I would like to comment on how well this part is done. For those who dont play guitar its the part with all the trippy little bells going in the background. Anyway lets talk about some of the different sounds we can hear in the background. Is thier any voices?? Listen carfully you might hear shit you never thought was there!! Anyways after liseninning to this several times it will feel like your head is going to explode trying to perceive everything at once. Now that we have achieved this level of understanding we can begin by trying to hear everything at once. This will be difficult but you can do it and it makes the music way better. The more you listen to it the better and more complete you will hear it.  I have been doing this for a long time and still mis out a few parts sometimes. If you guys go "Oh hes stupid how can he not hear it all at once" Then your not hearing whats there!! So comment on some shit that you hear and we can talk about it!!

  Anyway I want to explain something about the guitar in this part. For those of you who play the guitar and cant get the right sound for this part I cant help.

  Ok so I am assuming you guys know the riff for this part.  So you know after he plays the riff four times you will hear an effect that the guitar has that makes an accending decending sort of sound with the guitar.A wanging sort of noise I dont know how one would describe it. You must be a guitar player to understand this anyways. The first four times he plays are fully light Palm Muted.
    For those of you who dont have a diggital effects processor I have deviced a way to make that trippy acending decending noise. They're are two things you can do. Number one is the easiest way:When you hit the first note hit it with all your might without the palm mute and heavily palm the open A string you hit afterwards. Repeat this with all the notes you play on the D string. With the right feel and timeing and trippy sounds on your amp you can get this to sound almost exactly the same an Adam does with a lot less hassle of programming you proccessor and all that complicated shit. The second way can sound more correct but it is really difficult to to perfectly.

    You want to, for the first note, slide from  12th to 14th without a palm mute vigorously and rapidly giving it a sort of POP feel. Then voilently palm mute with the open D you would play. Then for the next slide from14th to 17th in the same manner. Then slide back to 14th and then from 14th to 19th ETC Continue to do this with the rest of the riff. It does change a does some trippy shit but thats to complicated to get into right now!!

  Now for u really expereinced gutiar players I have some helpful hints to make it sound more like Adam does. 
First of all when I say violently Palm Mute I dont mean a heavy palm mute I mean you have to slap on a light PM. For those who dont understand you wont be able to do it anyways.

it sounds better if while you are doing all this you can keep a very light palm mute on the A string the whole time. For certain parts anyways he is always changing how heavy he palm mute the shit and If I keep disecting this it will just take to long.


Anyways I really hoped this helps some of the guitar players out there that have had trouble reproducing the sounds from this part of the song on they're guitar. Feel free to ask if your unclear I am pretty good at changing the way I explain things for people that learn differently!!


--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling

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OfflineGlacius
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1911988 - 09/13/03 04:33 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)



Well thats not true about the understanding part. No matter how well everything is planned out its still a boggle to the creators mind. I have been writting compositions since I was 8 and I still dont understand any of it!!!!!


--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling

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OfflineGlacius
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1911992 - 09/13/03 04:35 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

"The grudge is off-beat, in a 4/4 manner. We are so used to common time, The grudge seems very awkward, but it fits, and it makes sense theoretically. You just have to put the pieces together"

Well of coarse it makes perfect sense theoretically but thats not what I am trying to say. I dont think words can explain what I am trying to say. Music can though :smile: HAHAHA



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OfflineGlacius
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1912001 - 09/13/03 04:52 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

"I think I understand what you're trying to say, But from what I know of Tool, they are very precise. Which leads me to believe that every note is wholely intentional, and planned."
Yes it is an important thing to realize just how precice tool is I agree totally. They are based a lot on the rythm aspect of it and they're composition I find has a very strange effect on the listener you know what I mean. It almost puts you into a trance. By not understanding the music I am not reffering the fact that they dont know what they are doing. Of coarse they do, and they do also understand the music. I mean to understand where it is coming from. One can not tap into a musical mind, even if it is they're own and decifer the creative process in which they formulate they're music so my appologies I did not explain myself very well. I havent been bakes for a while so please understand.hahahaha I mean more that they dont understand how they create it. I create stuff all the time and it just flows like a river. In order to compose anything out of what I create I must peice through it very carfully and compose it from all the jumbbled up brilliant music comming out. I beleive they must have the same method. I mean who can write music that is perfect the very first time it comes out of them?? Maybe Motzart but I think he is the only one!! I think they must sit around all fucked up and have shit coming out of them faster than they can analize or understand. The music that they present is the best they can do at understanding what they really created. You know what Im trying to say??
Music is so fucked up. When you create it what you put on a cd is not what you create. It is bits and peices that you logically put together to make some sort of structual basis for in the physical reality. Music is so complicated in the mind of a musician that he must only take the stuff that can be played with a physical means. Anything else cannot be portraid becuase it is either too complicated or there is nothing that can make it.


I love your little timing thing its better than mine!!


--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling

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InvisibleMiddlemanM

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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1912037 - 09/13/03 06:17 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

there is so much i could say but i'll go w/ the numbers,
please listen to the Grudge while reading this post...

intro in 5/4: 1234(5) / 1234(5) / 1234(5) /1234(5) *33

Guitar changes to 4/4 w/ Vox intro: 112 334 5 6 778 . = 11 syllables X4 verses.
"wear the grudge like a crown, negativity..."
while Bass and Drums continue in 5/4 for a measure of polyrhythmic bliss.
the sigs match because they are in different tempos...

then the spiral kick drum 10 count.

then 5/4 Bass riff: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
then a Tom comes in @ bar 3 in 4/4: 112 334 5566 788.
then Guitar comes in @ measure 2 in 4/4: 112 334 . etc.

then the four verses w/ 7 syllables "clutch it like a corner stone..."
w/ G doing the 4/4 112 334 5 6 778
and D in a sweet 5/4.

then the four verses w/ 4 syllables "Saturn ascends..."

i'm running out of time, but i have noticed two secrets to TOOL's sound,
the rotation of rhythmic patterns among the musicians,
and the use of different time signatures in complimentary tempos.


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OfflineBlastrid
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Middleman]
    #1912931 - 09/13/03 02:28 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Soundmind,

I'm pretty sure I understand your explanation, but in the opening lick, couldn't the first 3 counts of yours be taken as triplets and then it is in 4/4? so therefore, 2 groups of 'triplet-quarter' would equal a measure, and more of a consistent tempo with the rest of the song?

Different time sig's with complimentary tempos is fucking brilliant. Imagine how much time one would need to perfect Changing Tempos and Time Signatures...

Tho I do not understand what "112 334 5566 788" means...

Glacius,

Do you know much Music Theory? maybe it would be easier to understand you if you spoke in times and notes rather than '14th fret' on a string, which one you didn't say... Tho I know where the 14th fret is, It is easier to comprehend notes and values than where on the guitar.
I'd rather focus on just one song at a time, but for Schism, there are 2 guitars for some parts, because Maynard plays guitar for this song Live. For the opening lick, that is Bass. and for the 'breakdown' the distorted sound that comes in half way to harmonize, is also bass.
Maybe the 'descending sound' you speak of is around 2:17? that is just a slide down the fretboard.
And I'm pretty sure by studing Adam's hands live, and him being an experienced guitar player, he isn't playing up by the 14th-19th fret.
One, it is unnecessary to play up there, unless you are playing a high register
and two, the main riff can be played in the first 7 frets on the A and d strings.


--------------------
Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1913135 - 09/13/03 03:30 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Blastrid said:
Imagine how much time one would need to perfect Changing Tempos and Time Signatures...




It isn't all that difficult, I have never found. I never think in terms of what time signature or tempo I am in when I am coming up with ideas. A lot naturally fall in 4/4 time, but I have come acrossed some that were in pretty bizarre timings..

Having say a four bar riff in 4/4 time at say 130 bpm and then switching to a 7/8 two barr riff at 150 bpm might be difficult when you are constantly counting the beat and so forth, when you naturally rely on doing so to keep time..

Myself, though, I have never counted time when learning or playing. I only made sure that I was keeping my half notes twice as long as my quarter notes, my sixteenth notes half as short as my eighth notes, etc. I always concentrated more on the "feel" of what I was playing, and now, I basically keep perfect time..

Playing the riffs in the example I gave above wouldn't be so hard as long as you knew how it was suspossed to sound and made it that way. If you know how to play it, then it isn't any trouble switching between time signatures. It is only "playing this riff here and playing this riff here.. "

Anyways, I am having trouble explaining this, I guess, but I just don't find it that difficult.. I just know that this riff is played like this and with this feel, and this one is like this, whether or not when you put the riffs into an organization, they end up being in different time signatures..

Quote:


One, it is unnecessary to play up there, unless you are playing a high register
and two, the main riff can be played in the first 7 frets on the A and d strings.




I remember reading something Tony Iommi said about a certain riff he played.. possibly the Iron Man riff or something.. anyways, everyone tabbed out or played the riff low on the neck, on higher strings, while he had always played it higher up on the neck, like around the 12th fret. He explained that doing so gave it more of the tone that he was looking for in the riff..

I am not saying that with this particular riff, Adam is playing it up there, especially if you have seen him play it lower down on the neck. What I am saying is that guitarists play how they want to play, where they want to play.. Music has a lot of rules built up on how it is to be made, but music can still be made ignoring all of these rules and it can sound good.. There is a free will involving music just as there is with us ourselves..
Peace.



--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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InvisibleMiddlemanM

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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1913217 - 09/13/03 03:56 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

i don't see how you count 2 triplets in the intro,
i hear it as 1234 (rest) 1234 (rest) how do you get 6 from 5?

if you are counting fours in the intro, you are counting the bars.

()=rest

wear-the-grudge..........like-a-crown.............ne...........ga..............ti-vi-ty.
...1.....1.......2.......(2)...3.....3......4.....(4).....5...(5)....6...... (6).....7....7....8.


Danny taps a variation of that pattern on a Tom Like so:

1...1...2....(2)....3...3...4....(4)....5...5...6...6........7...7...8..(8).

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OfflineBlastrid
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Middleman]
    #1913436 - 09/13/03 05:55 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Fireworks, Yeah I write stuff by feel All the time, such as you. And much of it is in different time signatures. You're right, that isn't all that difficult. But what I mean, is having one time sig at a certain tempo and then overlaying a different time signature at a different tempo... Not necessarily a polyrhythm, but they meet up at different key times, not always starting and finishing on beat 1- like this:
1..2..3..4..1
1...2...3...1

Soundmind

This is what I hear:

triplet D......triplet D......triplet D......triplet D.....
1.......2......3........4......1.......2......3.......4.....

where triplet is an eighth note triplet and the D is the note D at quarter note value. I think it is something that can be understood and notated in multiple ways.

as far as the rhythm for the verse, yeah I see how you count that, makes sense.
So right when the vox come in, do you hear that the bass riff, it might be just the echo, but it seems so contrary, so unfitting, yet they end up at the same time. I think this is what you were talking about Soundmind, different time sigs with different tempos. Because usually for a compound rhythm, a 4/4 riff would play 5 times to meet up with a 5/4 riff playing 4 times, thus both playing 20 beats. But this is more of a polyrhythm, 4/4 and 5/4 playing at once, 4 bars a piece, matching up at 1 with the kickdrum subdivision bars.


--------------------
Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.

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OfflineMurex
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1913473 - 09/13/03 06:09 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Holy shit that's a cool idea- Making a 5/4 meeting up with a 4/4! I gotta go make some muzak now.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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InvisibleMiddlemanM

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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1914333 - 09/13/03 11:52 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

:brushing up on music theory:

Edited by soundmind (09/13/03 11:57 PM)

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OfflineBlastrid
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Middleman]
    #1914706 - 09/14/03 04:02 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

hehehe I love this shit


--------------------
Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Blastrid]
    #1914755 - 09/14/03 04:45 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, keeping two different ryhthms going would be pretty complicated, especially for a drummer (like keeping one rhythm on the toms swaying back and forth, while a different rhythm on the bass drums and snare or something). It would be a bit easier if it was say the bass doing the 5/4 riff up agansit the guitar doing the 4/4 thing..

Unfortunately, Guitar Pro doesn't let me put one meter up agansit another of a different length... What I could do, however, is just have the one riff that isn't in 4/4 or the main time signature overlapping the time signatures, or whatever..

Check this out. This is a post I made awhile back, which includes tabs of a bass riff in 46 and 2. The riff has seven sixteenth notes before it begins to repeat. What happens is that the first one beat is never the same note in the riff, and they actually put in a rest in places so it doesn't spiral out of control...

I was going to take the riff in Guitar Pro and remove the riff, and just repeat the riff to see if it ever matched back up, but I grew lazy and gave up... who thinks it will?

Anyways, it is now time to quote John Paul Jones, bassist of Led Zeppelin acclaim, from a column he did in Bass Guitar magazine:

Quote:


I then came up with this bridge riff (the song is Black Dog), which is in E. This riff is rather tricky sounding, as it's built from a repeated phrase that's four and a half beats long. Each time the phrase is repeated it's rhythmically displaced by half a beat. Notice how the E note, which falls neatly on beat one on the first time it is played, falls on second eighth-note of beat one on the second time around, on beat two the third time, and on the second eighth-note of beat two the fourth time. This technique of repeating an odd-length phrase in an even time signature such as 4/4 is known as an hemiola and is a very effective compositional tool. When this riff is played agansit Bonzo's [drummer John Bonham] half-time backbeat and doubled an octave higher on guitar, the result was a very powerful and catchy-sounding "stomp groove". It seems that quite a few bands have picked up on this concept.




So, yeah. Check out this site for a column Steve Vai wrote about polyrhythms, as well..
Peace.



--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Offlineplexus
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: fireworks_god]
    #1915490 - 09/14/03 01:13 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

keeping 2 differnt rythms inst complicated... not at all... even gorillaz did it on the song 5/4... the parts eventually match up to each other... all you have to do to match up any 2 rythmic patterns is find the greatest common factor of the two...

if a 5 count beat were to be played 4 times, there would be 20 beats
so youd have to play a 4 count beat 5 times to make up the 20 beats
like this

-1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5]
-1-2- -3-4]1- -2-3- -4]1-2- -3-4] -1-2-3- -4]1- -2-3-4]

some of my band's songs us a 7 count beat with a 5 count rythm
you would need 35 beats to synch up the cylcles into one... like

-1-2- -3-4-5 -6-7] -1-2-3 -4-5 -6-7]-1 -2-3- -4-5-6 -7]....
-1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5] -1-....

....-1-2- -3-4- -5-6- -7]1-2- -3-4- -5-6-7]
....-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5] -1-2- -3-4-5]

these kind of patterns arent about counting... theyre about feeling the rhythm... ive become so used to the 5/4, 7/4, and 3/4 beats that theyre feel as common as any 4/4 beat... im working on a song now thats 9/8ths... thats hard for me, but in time ill be able to feel it like a 4/4 beat... download "vital transformation" by the mahavishnu orchestra for a great example of a 9/8 signature... hard as hell... its fucking dire... john mclaughlin and his mahavishnu orchestra will always be the reigning masters of off-beat time signatures... check them out




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that there, thats not me. :noway:
i go where i please. :yesnod:
im not here.:shake:
this isnt happening.:nonono:

Edited by plexus (09/14/03 01:24 PM)

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OfflineBlastrid
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Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: fireworks_god]
    #1915618 - 09/14/03 02:04 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

hemiolas are the shit...
there's vertical and horizontal- Mendelssohn used it quite a bit, sort of his trademark.

Vertical is a 3 against 2 in multiple voices, like 3 in the oboe or guitar or somethin, and 2 in the cellos or drums.
Horizontal is more like what Plexus talks about:
1.2.3.1.2.3.1
1.2.1.2.1.2.1

Any other theoretical thoughts on the Grudge? Maybe we should move to lyrical content/overall feeling/specific role in album?


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Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.

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InvisibleIn(di)go
People of the sun.
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Registered: 10/29/00
Posts: 8,157
Loc: Cologne, Germany
Re: dissection of TOOL [Re: Murex]
    #2301840 - 02/04/04 05:11 PM (20 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Eulogy: Superficially, it seems to be about jezus. But underneath, it's about...........something else? Maybe more than one thing. I think this one was ment to just be mysterious, just for the sake of it.



i think its about the ego... go read the lyrics and look at them as if its someone speaking to its own, dead ego... damn that made so much sense to me when i heard that theory... it was like beeing born anew :cool:

and by the way i think this is great idea... but its gonna be really tough... actually i think its gonna be impossible to grasp the whole depth of it, but what makes me smile is that ill definitely understand when im dead... hopefolly sooner, but well... i suggest you guys read "the flower of life" by drunvalo melchizedek, cuz ever since aenima tool has had countless references to the wisdom in that book...

Quote:

46&2: The song has to do with the shadow (Jungian term for the subcontious evil of our inner self) and genes- See the Faq for more details on this. 'I'm down. Digging through. My old muscles. Looking for a clue.' and 'I've been crawling on my belly. Clearing out what could've been. I've been wallowing in my own confused. And insecure delusions. For a piece to cross me over. Or a word to guide me in.' Suggests a confused struggle inside himself- looking for a clue.



i got this from the flower of life... right now the human beeing has 44 & 2 chromosomes... the & 2 beeing the x and y which determine our sex... as our planet ascends to the next dimensions we will evolute as well... obviously our soul is changing day by day and so is our body... but by the time we reach the 5th dimension our body will have 46 & 2 chromosomes... in the flower of life this state is called "christ conciousness" the next step in our evolutionary ladder... this is the reason maynard says "46 and 2 is just ahead of me" ...

i hope i could be of help... keep up the good work, guys!


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