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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Substrate Question
#18833275 - 09/12/13 04:51 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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I'm doing research into making better substrate. My research suggests a few things to be better for shrooms. So I wanted to know if anyone has heard of these in substrate.
Dehydrated Fruit
Seeds (Like apple or watermelon)
Cheese
Chocolate
Nuts
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ba87
Stranger

Registered: 09/06/13
Posts: 37
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
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I'm an inexperienced grower, but I've read quite a bit of material.
I have never come across any mention of those being used in a substrate.
If you have material supporting their use, why not do a miniaturized version and see how it turns out? If you do, please post the results. I'm intrigued.
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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Re: Substrate Question [Re: ba87]
#18833313 - 09/12/13 04:59 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
ba87 said: I'm an inexperienced grower, but I've read quite a bit of material.
I have never come across any mention of those being used in a substrate.
If you have material supporting their use, why not do a miniaturized version and see how it turns out? If you do, please post the results. I'm intrigued.
Thank you, and I will one day. It'll be called "The Goblin Kings Kake" and I still haven't started to grow. I'm still saving and when you can't find a job and have mental problems, it takes a while.
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Sagescruffy
CH



Registered: 10/30/09
Posts: 2,011
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 7 months, 5 days
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Dude I don't think you have mental problems, but I do think that those materials would fail unless you were in a completely sterile environment.
-------------------- Love.  
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kinkaku
I AM THE LAW!!!!




Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1,322
Loc: Россия
Last seen: 8 years, 1 month
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someone here posted a substrate patent in the gourmet section one of the ingredients was milk it must have worked for it to be patented.
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Shahal Rainrix
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Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Re: Substrate Question [Re: kinkaku]
#18833356 - 09/12/13 05:12 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
kinkaku said: someone here posted a substrate patent in the gourmet section one of the ingredients was milk it must have worked for it to be patented.
Thanks for mentioning that, it did help. Milk isn't on my list. But it would be if its nutrients were higher.
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Shahal Rainrix
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Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Quote:
Sagescruffy said: Dude I don't think you have mental problems, but I do think that those materials would fail unless you were in a completely sterile environment.
Wouldn't a pressure cooker take care of that as well as a sterile closet?
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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Sagescruffy
CH



Registered: 10/30/09
Posts: 2,011
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 7 months, 5 days
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The pressure cooker could sterilize everything, but the moment any seals for your substrates are opened or broken, contams would get in and easily enjoy a nice sterilized substrate. So the environment for sterilized substrates needs to be sterile itself. A "sterile closet" would be hard to accomplish. A sterile room would have to be sealed and one would have to devise a way to enter the room without bringing in contaminates. I don't work in a sterile room with sterile substrates, so I'm only going off what I understand about the use of sterile substrates.
-------------------- Love.  
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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Quote:
Sagescruffy said: The pressure cooker could sterilize everything, but the moment any seals for your substrates are opened or broken, contams would get in and easily enjoy a nice sterilized substrate. So the environment for sterilized substrates needs to be sterile itself. A "sterile closet" would be hard to accomplish. A sterile room would have to be sealed and one would have to devise a way to enter the room without bringing in contaminates. I don't work in a sterile room with sterile substrates, so I'm only going off what I understand about the use of sterile substrates.
Easy enough. It's a walk in with a tile floor. I'm not going to keep other things in there and I could make a decontamination chamber for myself as well as air borns.
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Sagescruffy
CH



Registered: 10/30/09
Posts: 2,011
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 7 months, 5 days
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All right man, I was primarily just trying to illustrate how much effort it would be to work with sterile substrates. I'm only assuming the things you listed in your first post would either need to be sterilized and/or be in a sterile area. Good luck with your endeavors homie!
-------------------- Love.  
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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Quote:
Sagescruffy said: All right man, I was primarily just trying to illustrate how much effort it would be to work with sterile substrates. I'm only assuming the things you listed in your first post would either need to be sterilized and/or be in a sterile area. Good luck with your endeavors homie!
understood, have a nice day.
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kinkaku
I AM THE LAW!!!!




Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1,322
Loc: Россия
Last seen: 8 years, 1 month
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Quote:
Shahal Rainrix said:
Quote:
kinkaku said: someone here posted a substrate patent in the gourmet section one of the ingredients was milk it must have worked for it to be patented.
Thanks for mentioning that, it did help. Milk isn't on my list. But it would be if its nutrients were higher.
i should add that there was a bunch of other ingredients to. I'll find you a link maybe you will find something that tickles your fancy.
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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Re: Substrate Question [Re: kinkaku]
#18836076 - 09/13/13 09:05 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
kinkaku said:
Quote:
Shahal Rainrix said:
Quote:
kinkaku said: someone here posted a substrate patent in the gourmet section one of the ingredients was milk it must have worked for it to be patented.
Thanks for mentioning that, it did help. Milk isn't on my list. But it would be if its nutrients were higher.
i should add that there was a bunch of other ingredients to. I'll find you a link maybe you will find something that tickles your fancy.
I'd like that, thank you
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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OH hey, shalal, I remember when you started a flame fest with a very similar question here.
None of those ingredients will do any good at all.
And here is what everyone said before, which still applies to substrate now even though you are hoping it doesn't:
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
Quote:
Shahal Rainrix said: What I need to know is what shrooms feed on the most so I can make a more powerful substrate. Like if shrooms need carbs, how badly? A list of most needed to least needed would be a big help.
Also, is it possible to feed them with powered and liquid supplements? If that is possible with powers and misters? If I could add those to the substrate when mixing as well as later, topically, could I get a larger or longer lasting flush?
If people would test this for me,I'd be grateful.
NOTE: I am not looking for other peoples substrate blends. I want to make my own with the richest ingredients in order to increase the number of shrooms. This way I can research nutritional values and serving sizes to make my own blend.
The most nutritious substrate is BRF + verm. But you have to keep this sterile until it is fully colonized.
As far as standard (pasteurized) bulk, high nutritional value of the substrate is not going to help much of anything really. Pasteurized bulk substrate is low-nutrient for many reasons.
Highly nutritious substrate will just make everything more likely to contam as well as slowing your colonization and fruiting times significantly.
My 66qt monotubs with a simple substrate (coir/verm) and good genetics will give me 8+ ounce (dry) first flushes any day.
If you are not working with agar (which I don't believe you to be) then the best thing to do for big yields is to get your fruiting conditions dialed in perfectly.
My signature has many links to things I have written that may help you out.
People are just trying to tell you that you should focus less on the substrate.
Now please, calm down before the moderators notice you.
We are just trying to steer you in the right direction. We are a collective of hobby cultivators, not professional mycologists. If you have info to share, please do because it is the same thing we are doing for you 
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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: OH hey, shalal, I remember when you started a flame fest with a very similar question here.
None of those ingredients will do any good at all.
And here is what everyone said before, which still applies to substrate now even though you are hoping it doesn't:
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
Quote:
Shahal Rainrix said: What I need to know is what shrooms feed on the most so I can make a more powerful substrate. Like if shrooms need carbs, how badly? A list of most needed to least needed would be a big help.
Also, is it possible to feed them with powered and liquid supplements? If that is possible with powers and misters? If I could add those to the substrate when mixing as well as later, topically, could I get a larger or longer lasting flush?
If people would test this for me,I'd be grateful.
NOTE: I am not looking for other peoples substrate blends. I want to make my own with the richest ingredients in order to increase the number of shrooms. This way I can research nutritional values and serving sizes to make my own blend.
The most nutritious substrate is BRF + verm. But you have to keep this sterile until it is fully colonized.
As far as standard (pasteurized) bulk, high nutritional value of the substrate is not going to help much of anything really. Pasteurized bulk substrate is low-nutrient for many reasons.
Highly nutritious substrate will just make everything more likely to contam as well as slowing your colonization and fruiting times significantly.
My 66qt monotubs with a simple substrate (coir/verm) and good genetics will give me 8+ ounce (dry) first flushes any day.
If you are not working with agar (which I don't believe you to be) then the best thing to do for big yields is to get your fruiting conditions dialed in perfectly.
My signature has many links to things I have written that may help you out.
People are just trying to tell you that you should focus less on the substrate.
Now please, calm down before the moderators notice you.
We are just trying to steer you in the right direction. We are a collective of hobby cultivators, not professional mycologists. If you have info to share, please do because it is the same thing we are doing for you 
How many people did I flame in this thread?
And it'll work just fine. I don't even have to use food. There are other things out there.
This is what shrooms like in brf, Carbohydrates, Riboflavin, Niacin, Pantothenic Acid, Magnesium, Phosphorus, Sodium, Zinc, Copper, Selenium. So what dosen't make sense about increasing these nutrients?
Fungi feed by absorbing nutrients. But they don't have stomachs, so they have to break it all down into simple particles which are them absorb. I could probably use capsule supplements and virm and it'd work out.
Note: that virm adds no nutrients, it helps spread the fungi and stores existing nutrients. Just because I didn't talk about it above.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Have you grown a single mushroom yet?
Thanks for the little lesson on mycelium feeding, that was good for a laugh.
Verm also does add nutrients, small amounts.
The problem is, you are just way off base with the foundation of your arguments.
You will be getting zero useful answers here, no one is going to go in circles with you about mushrooms and "what they like" in your words.
No one is trying to add milk or dried fruit to their substrates.
We tried explaining it to you before. You just got pissed and FooMan, a moderator, had to step in. You promptly left that thread behind instead of admitting your attitude sucked.
We're busy growing tons of mushrooms and helping others do the same. Go read a textbook
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Shahal Rainrix
Stranger
Registered: 09/07/13
Posts: 49
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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I guess we'll see then.
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Stromrider
This must be the place


Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 20 minutes
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I don't know how many of us have tried to explain this to him. Must have a thick skull or something
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Stromrider
This must be the place


Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,338
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 11 hours, 20 minutes
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Quote:
Shahal Rainrix said: I guess we'll see then.
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