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Invisiblemaynardjameskeenan
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Posts: 16,391
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18829256 - 09/11/13 06:43 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Shins said:
They have computer programs to read the data old man, this is obviously beyond your generations technological unferstanding.  Search bots can sift through the data and compile things of interest.  A user could also input search parameters to look up particular things.



So?  At some point a human has to read the shit.



correct.
But that is after computer sort it out first.
I would assume they keep a log of every citizen and their electronic activities. If you read the first Snowden leak he going into it in detail about the how they keep data on people.


Edward Snowden has also said:

    “I also had the capability without any warrant to search for, seize, and read your communications.  Anyone’s communications at any time.  That is the power to change people’s fates.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_Awareness_Office#Components_of_TIA_projects_that_continue_to_be_developed


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May you be filled with loving kindness.
May you be well.
May you be peaceful and at ease.
May you be happy.



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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #18829291 - 09/11/13 06:51 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:


Edward Snowden has also said:

    “I also had the capability without any warrant to search for, seize, and read your communications.  Anyone’s communications at any time.  That is the power to change people’s fates.”




Snowden has overstated his power and abilities at the NSA before, and I think he was lying when he said that.

http://news.yahoo.com/5-ways-nsa-leaker-edward-snowdens-story-isnt-115500971.html

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/305409-house-intel-chiefs-snowden-lying


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DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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Invisiblemaynardjameskeenan
The white stipes
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: BoldAsLove]
    #18829294 - 09/11/13 06:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

BoldAsLove said:
I don't see why Israel wouldn't be able to do the same.



With Americas citizens private data?








He is a pretty good copy and paste from the reddit post;



"Thanks to Snowden, we now know the NSA:

    Had James Clapper lie under oath to us - on camera - to Congress to hide the domestic spying programs Occured in March.
   
    .

    Warrantlessly accesses records of every phone call that routes through the US thousands of times a day.
   

    Steals your private data from every major web company (Facebook, Google, Apple, Microsoft, et al) via PRISM
    and pays them millions for it August.
   

    Pays major US telecommunications providers (AT&T, Verizon, et al) between $278,000,000-$394,000,000 annually to provide secret access to  all US fiber and cellular networks (in violation of the 4th amendment).
   

    Intentionally weakened the encryption standards we rely on, put backdoors into critical software, and break the crypto on our private communications
   

    NSA employees use these powers to spy on their US citizen lovers via LOVEINT, and only get caught if they self-confess. Though this is a felony, none were ever been charged with a crime.
   

    Lied to us again just ten days ago, claiming they never perform economic espionage (whoops!) before a new leak revealed that they do all the time.
   

    Made over fifteen thousand false certifications to the secret FISA court, leading a judge to rule they "frequently and systemically violated" court orders in a manner "directly contrary to the sworn attestations of several executive branch officials," that 90% of their searches were unlawful, and that they "repeatedly misled the court."
   

    Has programs that collect data on US Supreme Court Justices and elected officials, and they secretly provide it to Israel regulated only by an honor system."


--------------------
May you be filled with loving kindness.
May you be well.
May you be peaceful and at ease.
May you be happy.



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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #18829307 - 09/11/13 06:54 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

maynardjameskeenan said:
Quote:

BoldAsLove said:
I don't see why Israel wouldn't be able to do the same.



With Americas citizens private data?





Yes. I believe that they have access to the raw data and they have the same, or at least similar, capabilities of analysis as the NSA. I don't see why they wouldn't be able to analyze the data in the same manner.


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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Invisiblemaynardjameskeenan
The white stipes
Male

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Registered: 11/11/10
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: BoldAsLove]
    #18829338 - 09/11/13 07:01 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

BoldAsLove said:
Quote:


Edward Snowden has also said:

    “I also had the capability without any warrant to search for, seize, and read your communications.  Anyone’s communications at any time.  That is the power to change people’s fates.”




Snowden has overstated his power and abilities at the NSA before, and I think he was lying when he said that.

http://news.yahoo.com/5-ways-nsa-leaker-edward-snowdens-story-isnt-115500971.html

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/305409-house-intel-chiefs-snowden-lying



I have a hard time trusting anything coming from NSA Director or any congressmen.

Maybe Snowden is untrustworthy, I don't know who to believe anymore but I don't think him "2. He reportedly left his home on May 1" or "1. Snowden overstated his salary" makes him an untrustworthy source of information. If he was a liar no one would make a fuss about what he says.


--------------------
May you be filled with loving kindness.
May you be well.
May you be peaceful and at ease.
May you be happy.



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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #18829452 - 09/11/13 07:21 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

What do you think of "3. Snowden didn't have the 'authority' to wiretap anybody" or "4.He might not have had the ability to do so, either?" I think the fact that he lies about other things damages his credibility, and I see absolutely no reason to believe him when he makes boastful claims regarding his position at the NSA.

People are making a fuss about what he says because it's exciting. People make fusses about ridiculous things all the time. It's not a testament to his credibility.


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: BoldAsLove]
    #18829469 - 09/11/13 07:25 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

And do what with it?  At some point a human has to read it and, if actionable, a judge has to allow it. I've said this over and over again. You need to conduct your life as if you are under subpoena  and constant surveillance.


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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18829492 - 09/11/13 07:29 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

And do what with it?  At some point a human has to read it and, if actionable, a judge has to allow it.




I don't know what they plan to do with it. It just seemed that you were arguing they didn't have the ability to handle the data when you said "What do you suppose anybody could do with the entire trove of private data of everybody?  The sheer volume would bury them." I think they definitely have the ability to pick out interesting bits of information. What they do with it is anyone's guess.

Quote:

I've said this over and over again. You need to conduct your life as if you are under subpoena  and constant surveillance.




Where's the fun in that? :wink:


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: BoldAsLove]
    #18829580 - 09/11/13 07:49 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Fun?  Hell it's big fun fucking with them.  I fuck with the IRS all the time and they're much nastier than anybody else


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OfflineVeil of Maya
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Registered: 05/28/13
Posts: 93
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18838595 - 09/13/13 08:23 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Shins said:
They have computer programs to read the data old man, this is obviously beyond your generations technological unferstanding.  Search bots can sift through the data and compile things of interest.  A user could also input search parameters to look up particular things.



So?  At some point a human has to read the shit.




I think zappis is just too ignorant to understand the fact that our future generations will be enslaved in a nation without a constitution. You clearly have no idea how serious this or you just want to stir something up because you are blinded by what you've been told.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: Veil of Maya]
    #18838866 - 09/13/13 09:16 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I have lived my entire life as if I was on camera.  They have always had the ability to get a court order to expose everything you write.  They do not give a fuck what you have to say otherwise.  Your best defense is that you are boring.


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InvisibleShins
Fun guy
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Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18839419 - 09/13/13 11:40 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I think zappa panders to the elite online cuz he's scared of them.


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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Offlineviktor
psychotechnician
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Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: Shins]
    #18839569 - 09/14/13 12:14 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
I think zappa panders to the elite online cuz he's scared of them.




It's a kind of Stockholm Syndrome. Abuse someone badly enough and they will come to love the abuser and accept abuse as a natural part of life.

He appears to be a terrified individual to me. Obedient, cowed, broken. Licking the boots that have stomped his spirit down.

Once you realise that people are abusive because they're scared they become much less repulsive. I think he just needs a hug, myself.


--------------------
"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: viktor]
    #18839884 - 09/14/13 02:31 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

Shins said:
I think zappa panders to the elite online cuz he's scared of them.




It's a kind of Stockholm Syndrome. Abuse someone badly enough and they will come to love the abuser and accept abuse as a natural part of life.

He appears to be a terrified individual to me. Obedient, cowed, broken. Licking the boots that have stomped his spirit down.

Once you realise that people are abusive because they're scared they become much less repulsive. I think he just needs a hug, myself.




For someone who lives in N. Zealand what on earth do you know how the American government is and how things are done here, sure I think the spying is despicable, but it is legal, instead people bitch and cry instead of trying to effect change, and also, quit throwing out strawman's to zappa, you don't know him or his life.


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Offlineviktor
psychotechnician
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Registered: 11/03/10
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Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #18840138 - 09/14/13 05:37 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Not strawmen but psychoanalysis.

I've worked with abuse victims in clinical settings. They all talk like him - life is hard, must dominate and control, compassion is for the weak blah blah blah.

It's shit and I'm saying it openly. It's the mark of a man beaten into his shell. I have nothing but pity.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."


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InvisibleBoldAsLove
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Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: viktor] * 1
    #18840937 - 09/14/13 12:14 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I've got a great idea guys, let's not discuss the content of this thread at all, let's all just bash (or psychoanalyze if thats what you want to call it) zappa :rolleyes:


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: BoldAsLove] * 2
    #18841172 - 09/14/13 01:48 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Psychoanalyze me?  They don't have the insight or intelligence to begin to understand me much less interpret me.

You have to have suffered some kind of abuse in order to have Stockholm syndrome.  I'm living large.  Here's the deal.  I always assumed I was being watched.  You all should, too.  Anything you put in writing can be subpoenaed and it only takes on jackass judge to grant a search warrant.  Assume all judges are jackasses.  It has often been said that a grand jury would indict a ham sandwich.  Act accordingly.


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InvisibleDeadHearts

Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,827
Loc: MICHIGAN
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18842613 - 09/14/13 09:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

[/


Edited by DeadHearts (09/14/13 09:45 PM)


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OfflineVeil of Maya
Stranger

Registered: 05/28/13
Posts: 93
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: DeadHearts]
    #18844927 - 09/15/13 03:02 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

guys were getting off topic, yeah we know zappis can't think for himself but the fact of the matter is that this is what's happening right now. Is the word change a fairy tale in this situation?


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Invisiblemaynardjameskeenan
The white stipes
Male

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Registered: 11/11/10
Posts: 16,391
Loc: 'Merica
Re: NSA shares raw intelligence including Americans' data with Israel [Re: Veil of Maya]
    #18844997 - 09/15/13 03:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Word change a fairy tale.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Swartz

The game is rigged. The people have lost.
"If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever."
-George Orwell


--------------------
May you be filled with loving kindness.
May you be well.
May you be peaceful and at ease.
May you be happy.



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