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Offlineclam_dude
stranger in astrange land

Registered: 09/10/03
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Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics?
    #18824968 - 09/10/13 07:46 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Do you guys and gals have negative views of atheists and skeptics?  As an atheist myself, I feel atheism is often misunderstood.  There is a misconception that "atheists say there is no god".  Is this something that gets passed around in the "spiritual" community?

In addition, do you think that non- "spiritual" people, and people without "faith" are missing something?  Is there something in the compassion, empathy, or creativity departments that we are lacking?  If so, what is it?


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"I would like to thank god for making me an atheist" - Ricky Gervais


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825026 - 09/10/13 07:56 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Atheism is hugely misunderstood by christian fools, not to put all Christians in one boat. I respect atheists, as I used to be one myself. But that was before I tried mushrooms and other psychedelics :wink:


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InvisibleFuturesight
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Registered: 01/19/13
Posts: 1,188
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #18825052 - 09/10/13 08:01 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I am a agnostic who enjoys the occult and esoteric. also believe in love peace, and orgiastic sexuality. I will burn in hell if it's real, but the way I see it, no human will ever know the truth BEFORE they die.


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Offlineziggity
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude] * 1
    #18825078 - 09/10/13 08:07 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I don't necessarily believe in the God which the bible or WESTERN religions conveys but I surely do believe in a god. I believe in Hindu and Buddhists views of how God is merely a representation of ourselves. We are all god in some way shape or form....

Take my complex theory of the universe: All that exists is -1, 0, 1. (0) is an instant in time which everything derives from. (0) is simply the "Darkness where all is and ever will be" if you've experienced it through psychedelics. So with (0), our instant of perception we move on. Let's say a simple analogy such as an apple is presented in front of us. The minute we perceive the apple, we have now moved to (1) on the -1, 0, 1 scale. We calculate all the variables of the object and place it into the (1) position. But the minute we perceive, we create an antithesis of "what if it wasn't there or what if it was green or what if it was bigger?" This moves (-1) into the picture so we now have a full understanding of the object to be perceived. (0) is the void in which a point in time can be identified and (1)/(-1) is simply the THESIS and ANTITHESIS in human consciousness. That is completely verifiable if you've ever learned about Hegel in philosophy. So obviously we can use this scale for simple points in time or we can keep adding the scale. We already have (-1, 0, 1) but yet now a dog enters our perception? Well, we know that everything derives from the "Darkness" (0) but yet (-1,1) are already taken. Well now we present the dog representing (2) on the scale and obviously we will create an antithesis of (-2). So as you can see this would ever expand to INFINITY! (INFINITY, -2, -1, 0, 1, 2, INFINITY).

God is simply an idea. He's not a man or woman or child or whatever we try to define in terms of human consciousness. He is simply the "darkness which everything derives from". He is all that exists and ever will exist. Forget your "religion" of atheism and come back to your roots. WE as constructs of this scale, cannot and shall not be able to perceive "the darkness which everything derives from" because that's what we are trying to achieve. You realize the only difference between us and a computer is that the computer is purposely constructed to not create an ANTITHESIS. all that exists in BINARY is 0's and 1's. Well that's why a computer can't necessarily think for itself because the creator has simply limited it's capacity of being able to create the antithesis of (-1). So yes, I am proposing that this is all just a computer program... But i would never consider that a religion because religion is simply a band of followers who have "faith" that their answers are right. Well, i simply have FAITH IN MYSELF that the actions I take are going to be the right ones for me...

Thank you


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Offlineclam_dude
stranger in astrange land

Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 1,717
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #18825476 - 09/10/13 09:33 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

rbalzer said:
Atheism is hugely misunderstood by christian fools, not to put all Christians in one boat. I respect atheists, as I used to be one myself. But that was before I tried mushrooms and other psychedelics :wink:




I too have tried mushrooms and lsd, and this never made me believe in any sort of god.  Wouldn't you think that if psychedelics are required in order to have these beliefs, that this is cause to be skeptical of these beliefs? I mean, did god decide to reveal himself to those who take brain altering drugs?


--------------------
"I would like to thank god for making me an atheist" - Ricky Gervais


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InvisibleFuturesight
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825536 - 09/10/13 09:47 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Apparetly yes :laugh2: All the christians will brn forever because they don't do drugs.


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Offlineclam_dude
stranger in astrange land

Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 1,717
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: ziggity]
    #18825550 - 09/10/13 09:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

ziggity said:
God is simply an idea. He's not a man or woman or child or whatever we try to define in terms of human consciousness. He is simply the "darkness which everything derives from". He is all that exists and ever will exist.




Everything you wrote is pretty incoherent.  I'm not really sure where to start.  You just gave three different definitions of god in four consecutive sentences.  "Darkness from which everything derives"...what does that mean? What do you mean by "darkness" in this context?   

"All that exists and ever will exist"?  Well I believe in what exists.  So I guess I believe in god too right?

And of course "god is an idea"... well I believe in ideas too.  I even believe in ideas or concepts of god.  There are as many concepts of god as there are people who believe in it.  I also have a concept of the tooth fairy.  I guess that makes it real too.

Quote:

Forget your "religion" of atheism



This is why I'm giving you such a hard time.  Religion implies belief in some sort of supernatural entity, and/or appeal to authority or doctrine.  Atheism is just a lack of belief in god, nothing else. 

After reading your post, I have no idea what your concept of god is, as you defined it so broadly.  I'm sure you are aware of this, and did it intentionally as to render your god undeniable.  When someone tells me that "god is everything," I interpret this person to be an atheist who for some reason wants to claim a belief in god.  If god is just "everything" or an "idea," why not just use the words "everything" and "idea"?

So until you give me a more specific definition of god, you're an atheist. Welcome to the club :cheers:


--------------------
"I would like to thank god for making me an atheist" - Ricky Gervais


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Offlineclam_dude
stranger in astrange land

Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 1,717
Loc: twilight zone
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825553 - 09/10/13 09:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Also, you didn't answer my original question.


--------------------
"I would like to thank god for making me an atheist" - Ricky Gervais


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Invisibleteknix
π“‚€βŸπ“…’π“π“…ƒπ“Š°π“‰‘ 𓁼𓆗⨻
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Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 11,953
Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825592 - 09/10/13 10:00 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

clam_dude said:
Do you guys and gals have negative views of atheists and skeptics?  As an atheist myself, I feel atheism is often misunderstood.  There is a misconception that "atheists say there is no god".  Is this something that gets passed around in the "spiritual" community?

In addition, do you think that non- "spiritual" people, and people without "faith" are missing something?  Is there something in the compassion, empathy, or creativity departments that we are lacking?  If so, what is it?




Nah, I try to be open minded to people regardless of their beliefs, even if their logic is seemingly irrational.

:tongue:


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Invisibleteknix
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Registered: 09/16/08
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825600 - 09/10/13 10:01 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Do you view theist or more particularly Christians negatively?

(I mean, there could be a bias there that would make you look down on them, being atheist.)

Amirite?


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InvisibleClockCode
A Lonely Hypha


Registered: 11/12/12
Posts: 546
Loc: The Highest Desert
Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825621 - 09/10/13 10:06 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I only view atheists negatively when they begin to attack other peoples religious beliefs.  I quit Christianity because of that shit man, just let sleeping dogs lie.  If somebody chooses to hold a conviction in an Abrahamic deity, that is just as valid as your lack of belief.  There isn't a "right answer" to living life, whether it be empirical evidence or speculative reasoning.

Quote:

clam_dude said:
So until you give me a more specific definition of god, you're an atheist. Welcome to the club :cheers:




I'm one of those people who call "god" everything (I prefer the term sacred, everything is sacred), and I certainly don't shy from calling myself atheist.  Though I find religious paradigms as fascinating as empirical ones, and certainly don't think such ideas to be purely detrimental.  Words can mean many things, if calling myself an atheist gives somebody a somewhat valid perspective then so be it.  Pantheist is another word I've used, if I'm feeling a bit more...  :shroomer: 

Though I think one misconception this can lead to is what exactly an atheist is, to which there isn't a good answer.  One can meet a hedonist who also happens to not believe in a deity, and many would link the concepts of atheism and hedonism together.  Or they see a Richard Dawkins video and think every atheist is a vehement, arrogant evolutionary biologist.  There's a lot of traits people seem to believe are inherent to atheism that are in fact not.  There is no "doctrine", there is no "agenda".  And naturally none of this is directed at you, I'm just pretty stoned and rambling.

Ultimately whether or not I view somebody positively is if their life choices bring them happiness, and whether or not that impinges upon another's pursuit of it.  Spread misery and I'll be a miserable person around you. 


--------------------
Psilovibing


Edited by ClockCode (09/10/13 10:08 PM)


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Offlineclam_dude
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Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 1,717
Loc: twilight zone
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: teknix]
    #18825647 - 09/10/13 10:13 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

teknix said:
Do you view theist or more particularly Christians negatively?

(I mean, there could be a bias there that would make you look down on them, being atheist.)

Amirite?




I don't view them negatively as individuals, simply for being theists or "christian."  I am aware that people who call themselves "christian" have hugely varying views.  Many christians are basically pantheists who go to church a couple times a year.  But I do have a problem with literal interpretations of the bible. 

I think most religious people are victims of indoctrination as children, and don't know any better.  Only a minority of christians (or religious people) actually do harm because of their beliefs.  However, the moderates unwittingly help to shield the dangerous beliefs of religious fanatics by making it socially acceptable to believe any crazy nonsense one wants.


--------------------
"I would like to thank god for making me an atheist" - Ricky Gervais


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Offlineclam_dude
stranger in astrange land

Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 1,717
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: ClockCode]
    #18825700 - 09/10/13 10:27 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

ClockCode said:
I only view atheists negatively when they begin to attack other peoples religious beliefs.  I quit Christianity because of that shit man, just let sleeping dogs lie.  If somebody chooses to hold a conviction in an Abrahamic deity, that is just as valid as your lack of belief.  There isn't a "right answer" to living life, whether it be empirical evidence or speculative reasoning.




But just to be clear, you really mean that you view that particular person negatively, not atheists as a whole - as being atheist is not analogous to attacking people's religious beliefs, correct?  I happen to think there is a time and place for attacking religious beliefs.  Maybe if someone just lost a love one, it's not the time to attack their beliefs.  But you must agree that when people use their religion as a reason to oppress others, it's appropriate to attack their religious convictions.  So there is a grey area between those two examples.  And because I see religion as more of a problem then you do, we probably just stand at different places in that grey area.


--------------------
"I would like to thank god for making me an atheist" - Ricky Gervais


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InvisibleClockCode
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Registered: 11/12/12
Posts: 546
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825732 - 09/10/13 10:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

clam_dude said:
Quote:

ClockCode said:
I only view atheists negatively when they begin to attack other peoples religious beliefs.  I quit Christianity because of that shit man, just let sleeping dogs lie.  If somebody chooses to hold a conviction in an Abrahamic deity, that is just as valid as your lack of belief.  There isn't a "right answer" to living life, whether it be empirical evidence or speculative reasoning.




But just to be clear, you really mean that you view that particular person negatively, not atheists as a whole - as being atheist is not analogous to attacking people's religious beliefs, correct?  I happen to think there is a time and place for attacking religious beliefs.  Maybe if someone just lost a love one, it's not the time to attack their beliefs.  But you must agree that when people use their religion as a reason to oppress others, it's appropriate to attack their religious convictions.  So there is a grey area between those two examples.  And because I see religion as more of a problem then you do, we probably just stand at different places in that grey area.




I'd no more judge atheists as a whole than I would Christians or liberals or Mongols.  I'm the kind of person who likes to look at details, I don't feel comfortable making decisions otherwise.  I don't make a lot of decisions.

There's a difference between attacking and debating in my opinion.  Debate is what I think you mean here, though I haven't seem many traditional christians that are up to the task.

And no it's not okay to oppress others with religion, that's where I draw the line.  Like I said, once it begins to impinge upon somebody else it's wrong.  I actually cannot stand organized religion at all, I used to be a Christian and jumped that ship.  The idea of somebody preaching to me is abhorrent.  I am much more in favor of personal beliefs and experiences.  I'm not above siding against either party.


--------------------
Psilovibing


Edited by ClockCode (09/10/13 10:40 PM)


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Invisiblecez
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18825915 - 09/10/13 11:33 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I don't care what an atheist or anyone believes.
Its their choice.

I don't think they're missing anything either.
Spirituality is a mindset imo and it doesn't have to be considered spiritual.


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InvisibleHobozen
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: clam_dude]
    #18826025 - 09/11/13 12:29 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

clam_dude said:
Do you guys and gals have negative views of atheists and skeptics?  As an atheist myself, I feel atheism is often misunderstood.  There is a misconception that "atheists say there is no god".  Is this something that gets passed around in the "spiritual" community?

In addition, do you think that non- "spiritual" people, and people without "faith" are missing something?  Is there something in the compassion, empathy, or creativity departments that we are lacking?  If so, what is it?




Both parties who label themselves as such will never come to an agreement, for as long as they continue to categorize themselves and others as such, at least.  Seems pretty simple.


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Offlinecircastes
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: Hobozen] * 1
    #18826194 - 09/11/13 01:25 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

An atheist is just God being wonderfully ironic.


--------------------
My solitude...
My shield...
My armour...

TESTED
WITH
FULL
FORCE


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OfflineConnection
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: circastes]
    #18826325 - 09/11/13 02:35 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

circastes said:
An atheist is just God being wonderfully ironic.




lol.


--------------------
Life is an expression of countless endless words that are true for you and the universe and all the time it will come to your mind life and spirit of humanity and your life you are truly grateful to be alive you are the great one of this universe you are wise and truly endless in your nature...


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: circastes]
    #18826332 - 09/11/13 02:39 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I can get annoyed with atheists when they behave extremely arrogantly and confrontationally. I think what gets on my nerves about them, is how they claim to hold logic and reason in such high regard, and then make all kinds of logical errors in their attack on religion.

I have never seen an atheist attack religion in the way I understand it, they always attack their own (mis)understanding of religion but they refuse to consider that there might be another way of looking at things which they have not considered.

I used to be an arrogant atheist myself until I was humbled by the realization that I didn't actually know anything about reality and just assuming materialism should be the default view, was utterly absurd. Most atheists will defend materialism to the death however, making just as many assumptions as religious people.

Atheists tend to think that everyone should see things like them, as if their point of view is the only possible valid way of looking at things and if you dont share it, you must be stupid or delusional.

The irony lies in how similar their ways of thinking are to the religious fundamentalists whom they think they are so different from. Atheists generally fall into a cult of worship of the human intellect.  Because of their habit of only looking outwards and not considering themselves as part of the equation, they tend to not see it that way but instead believe they are following the only valid way of knowing anything, a process they call the scientific method. But the scientific method is not a thing in itself, it is a process for gaining knowledge. Could a rock use the scientific method to find out about the world? Of course not, it requires an intellect to perform. SO the scientific method is really nothing more than a function of the human intellect.

Atheists then, put all their faith in the human intellect. They then attempt to justify this decision with the human intellect. The hilarious irony here is the fact that this is no different from Christians justifying the Bible with the Bible. If there was another means of knowing available to human beings beyond the intellect, then you would never be able to prove or disprove that with the intellect.  Will atheists ever realize this?



Edited by Deviate (09/11/13 02:50 AM)


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InvisiblePocketLady
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Re: Do you guys have negative views of atheists and skeptics? [Re: Deviate]
    #18826633 - 09/11/13 06:13 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

People are free to believe whatever they want to believe. 

Personally I'm not religious but neither am I an atheist.  My idea of "God" is similar to Ziggity.  God is everything, and God is nothing.  In fact God is probably more nothing than everything.  You cannot define God.  I like the way Eckhart Tolle puts it - God is the space in which everything exists.


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Love is from the infinite, and will remain until eternity.
The seeker of love escapes the chains of birth and death.
Tomorrow, when resurrection comes,
The heart that is not in love will fail the test.

~ Rumi



The day we start giving Love instead of seeking Love, we will have re-written our whole destiny.
~ Swami Chinmayanada Saraswatir


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